# Bad Boot



## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Please help...My computer starts to load and hangs on the searching for boot record... I've changed the BIOS settings around a few times to see if that helps but it doesn't, I've restarted, I've unplugged.nothing works. The boot record for IDE-0 says okay but it seems to be looking for something else as well. The red light is on so there is a problem with the hard drive. Also the boot message flips to the Win98 logo screen and hangs there. I've tried to use the command prompt to check the registry and/or use scandisk and the screen comes up but it just won't do anything. I don't have a start-up disk either. Do I have to put a Win98 disk in again and try to reload that. How? HELP! Anyone know what the problem is? Hurry, I'm desperate


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Hi Madakatude, welcome to TSG.

Can you give us some history behind the computer? Has it worked in the past? Did this just happen one day? Any new hardware, anyone inside the computer prior to you checking for problems?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Thanks for responding. No recent history. Right before this happened the system went through scandisk and found bad sectors. They were automatically fixed. Couple of days later, won't boot. I didn't hget any new hardware. But I did realize a few day ago that my zip drive cord was not in all the way. I hadn't used it in weeks. But I used it that night and it seemed to work find. Prior to that I deleted a lot of old software to free up some space. Just games and crap though and I kept any shared files.


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

I'd try disconnecting the zip again. Just connect the hard drive and be sure it's connected tightly........you might have to pop into the bios setup to be sure the drive is still listed there correctly...make sure bios is set to boot from the hard drive first.....for now........


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I took the zip out and tried that. Nothing! The system does boot to the hardrive and gives me an okay then hangs. I just downloaded a stratup disk from worm so I'll try that when I get home. One other thing..when I tried to defrag at the c prompt it said something like you must have windows to run this command??? But the computer hangs on the windows logo too. Got any idea what that's about?


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Try typing:

cd windows
then defrag


Since it's hanging on the logo, I'd pull out any add in cards too, except the video of course.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I'll try the cd suggestion but going inside the computer to remove stuff is a bit out of my league. Will defrag fix the problem? also is there a commad that will show what the exact error is or force the system to restore or fix itself. I can only work in the safe mode command prompt because the regular one hangs.


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

And you can't get into safe mode either? 

Not sure if defrag will fix the problem....but certainly worth a try.

If the hard drive light is staying on, that is a concern though....please double check the connections. Also take a look at the boot order in the bios setup. Be sure it's not trying to boot to something that doesn't exist.......like the zip drive......


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Aca,

Can you give me instructions or direct me to a site to find out how to change my operating system. I have a laptop with NT and I wast to change that to Windows. I need some instuctions for dummies becuase I don't want to screw the laptop up.


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

What version of windows will you be putting on it? Does the laptop have a floppy and cdrom? If so, can they both be used at the same time? The version of windows that you are thinking of installing, you have a full install cd? Upgrade? Restore cd? How are we going to get there from here?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I'm going to start with Win98. I have a floppy and CDROM and yes they can be used simultaneously. I have the full version of Windows. How are we going to get from here??? Don't understand.


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Just wanted to be sure how we need to kill the computer 

Here's a step by step that should get you thru it :

http://www.hexff.com/win98_install.html


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Hope you're signed on later tonight when I try to resolve that other problem. See you then and thanks.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Is there a way in safe mode command prompt to get the computer to look for a virus? I can't get in the regular command prompt or regular safe mode.


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

I'm not a virus girl, but this is what Rog and the virus pros recommend. I couldn't get it to work on a laptop I was working on (for someone else) but, then again, I had this vision of format c: in my dreams......   as a punishment, of course 

http://www.f-prot.com/download/

In the evenings, I'm usually hit and miss, I'll check email later for notifications as I usually do......but then it's off to take my kittie swimming......Most often I'm on during stock market hours....but there's other folks out there who are following this thread as well......so don't fret......I'll be sure to check on you in the a.m. --- if not sooner  Have a good one!


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

After days of trying to figure out why my computer hangs at the Win 98 logo I think I'm finally on to something. I got a registry configuation error message. I can't do a restore because I can't get ti the command prompt it hangs. I can only get into safe mode command prompt??? The start disk doesn't work wither. All roads end with error reading drive c: I tried to load files like himem nope. Error reading drive c: If I can't use the command prompt and I can't get into safe mode what else is there to do?

When I look at the dir for C: I get all these tmp files and then halfway through error abort, retry etc.

What else can I do?????

Much thanks to ACA for getting me this far!


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## bandit429 (Feb 12, 2002)

Try the safe mode command and at the C: prompt type

Scanreg/Restore 

From the list choose the date that your PC was working good
see if that will work

Editted: I just reread your post I guess you already tried that.
There are some dos virus removal tools, have you already removed the virus? Do you know which one it is?


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## colman77 (Jun 19, 2002)

If you're getting an "error reading drive C:" while using a win98 boot disk it sounds like your problem extends farther than your registry... Make sure you've got an up-to-date uncorrupted boot disk


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## bandit429 (Feb 12, 2002)

Your right ,,,, new power cards on an outdated motherboard can cause that problem too ecspecially video


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I have an uncorrupted boot disk? Is this a virus. I think I previously removed bad sectors during a defrag and now I have a whole? Just my 2cent though. Guessing. What else can I do. How can I locate a virus in dos mode?


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## bandit429 (Feb 12, 2002)

I flat don't know but I'm sure somebody here does,,,just hang in there,,


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## bandit429 (Feb 12, 2002)

What was the last thing you did before you started having trouble? Did you install or uninstall or update a virus program?
Do you download music? Do you get your email through outlook express? We need more detail,,as complete as you can make it. If you suspected you have a virus,,,why do you suspect that,did you notice a strange file or program. If you have more Ram that you could swap out try that. Bad connections can cause problems.
with the power cord removed and one hand on the frame of the tower check all the wiring and boards,,,make sure all are firmly seated into place,,,a faulty connection can cause all sorts of errors to be reported


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Heres the update:

I have the hard drive as 1st boot and the floppy (boot disk) as secondary. They both say okay but still hangs at the windows screen. I have located Himem, config & autoexec so I know that they are there. The last thing I remember is that I defragged and the computer found about 10 bad sectors. I think I I had them deleted but Im not sure. I cant get into safe mode.

Heres what Im experiencing:

When I try to run scandisk from command prompt or command prompt safe mode I get an error that scandisk cannot examine drive c:

When I try to run scanreg/restore, I get the five cab choices to choose from but once I choose the system hangs on checking system files..

When I try to run scanreg/fix, I get a message that says not enough of some kind of memory and that I should check for Himem.sys on the c drive or the boot disk or write in a device= line in config.sys. Himem is on the c drive and the boot disk. When I try to add the line using edit config.sys it opens I type the command and get a data error reading drive c.

When I type dir, it starts to list then stops and gives me the abort, retry or fail. It wont list the contents of the entire directory. Also, files and directories that I know are there I cannot see or access.

When I try to defrag I get a message that says this function requires Windows 98?

I looked up the tmp files and that also stopped and gave me the abort, retry or fail option.

I tried to overwrite the Himem, config & autoexec from a floppy but there is another data error reading drive c. 

I checked fdisk and Im really not sure what Im looking at but I know I only have one hard drive. Im unfamiliar with this function so thats that. 

Okay, obviously all reloads lead to the data error reading drive c. Could the bad sectors found on the system during the defrag have caused this. Prior to the defrag I deleted a bunch of software. Nothing major just games &stuff because I was running out of space on my drive. But I still had some. I really shouldnt be having any memory problems. I have a P3 with 9G. I hope thats right! 

I need to know how to restore c:. Tonight I will try to reinstall windows but.I think windows is there and for some reason I just cant access it because of the problem with the c drive. HELP!


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Ok, I merged your threads, sit tight for awhile till I get caught up......

did you try defrag from the windows directory?

at the prompt type:

cd windows
then type defrag
and hit enter


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## indigowindow (Oct 25, 2001)

M -

what happens when you boot from the floppy and type *C:* ?


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

> _Originally posted by Madakatude:_
> *
> When I look at the dir for C: I get all these tmp files and then halfway through error abort, retry etc.
> 
> ...


This really concerns me.......I am afraid the hard drive may be on it's last leg.......


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## kilowatt1 (Oct 27, 2001)

Try this. Go into the BIOS setup and change the boot sequence so that it boots to the floppy first. Save changes and exit. Put the win98 boot disk in the floppy drive and restart the computer. It should boot to the boot disk. Choose start computer without CDRom support. When you get to the A:\> prompt , type

SYS C: and press enter. After a few seconds a "system transferred" message should appear. Remove the floppy disk and Ctrl-Alt-Delete to restart the computer.

If this doesn't work the next option is to reboot with the startup disk as before and this time at the A:\> prompt type

fdisk /mbr and press enter. When it finishes remove the floppy and reboot.


Kilowatt


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

ACA 

I wrote that tmp thing incorrectly. What I meant to say is that when I look at the dir for *.tmp files it list some and then gets stuck. The other scenerio was just dir for c: which does list valid files and dir just not all of them. It gets stuck. Also, I need to defrag the way you said. I didn't do that.

Kilo

I already tried to load from the disk only and it still hangs at the windows logo. I'll try again your way though. Also, can you tell me what fdisk/mbr is suppose to do because I think I did that but I need to refresh my memory. 

Indigo

I can get to the c: prompt but the system says the boot from the floppy and the hardrive are ok but I don't get pass the windows logo. I get to the c prompt by pressing f8.

Does anyone know what the heck I did to cause this!


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## kilowatt1 (Oct 27, 2001)

Fdisk /mbr will recreate or repair the Master Boot Record on the hard drive.

SYS C: will copy the following files to your hard drive:

IO.SYS
MSDOS.SYS
COMMAND.COM


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Does fdisk require himem & memory. I think this is where i got these errors. Also, I tried to copy stuff to c and it just doesn't happen. it finds the file on c because it ask do i want to overwrite but when I typeY it says data error reading drive c. But i will try again. i'm getting desparate.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

My boot disk is for windows 98se which is what I loaned out. How can I find out what version is/was on my computer. I have the full version of windows and windows se. Should I make a windows boot disk or does it matter that I could be using an se boot on a 98 install?


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## bassetman (Jun 7, 2001)

For the most part any Win 98 SE boot disk should be fine. Its pretty generic stuff
to get you running.

You can download on from the Net if you can't get one easily anywhere else.

John


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

My WinSE boot disk says okay but I still never get pass the windows logo screen. What does this mean?

cd windows.. Defrag does not work. te message is "this requires microsoft windows. 

I put my windows 98se cd in and the system does not recognize the CDrom drive. 

I tried the sys c: and fdisk/mbr and this just brought another a prompt????

Does anyone see anything wrong with the following:

Mem Type tot used free
conven 640k 88k 552k
upper 0k 0k 0k
res 384k 384k 0k
exten 31,744k 31,744k 0k

tot mem 32,768k 32,216k 552k
under 1mb 640k 88k 552k

largest executable program size 551k
largest from upper mem block 0

Have i tried everthing!!!!


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

If you have a good boot disk and you're getting to the windows screen, the bios isn't looking to boot from the floppy drive first.

Go there and change it.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I changed it to look to the floppy first and it does. I think the second or third choice is hard drive. Still why can't I get past windows or restore the registry etc.


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Does the floppy light come on? Does it try to read the floppy?

If so, how did you make the floppy disk? Can you get a directory on it, on another machine?

With a good boot disk you should be able to get to an a: prompt.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I dowladed the floppy from the interenet. Bootdisk.com. the floppy light does com on and i can get to the a prompt. The disk has the floowing on it Win98SE.exe ?


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Nope, nope, nope, it's not expanded......how you get to the a: prompt would be a mystery. You should get a non-boot disk error message.

The file from the net, you must download it, save it to the desktop, then double click on it, you'll be prompted for a blank floppy disk....then the files will be expanded to the floppy, then boot with that.


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## bassetman (Jun 7, 2001)

AnaCandy, would it be easier for one of us to just send hime a boot disk?

Bassetman


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Whatever works easiest bm, and I'm gonna come repair your keyboard if you type my name wrong one more time!


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## bassetman (Jun 7, 2001)

Oops!  

On the other hand I would get to meet you and we could have a few beers! 

John


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Okay aca give me a few to follow your directions. Once I get to the c prompt I a: and that's how I get there.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

The disk booted and went straight to the a prompt. Now what. I've done so much I can't remember


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Ok, from the a: prompt, type

sys c:
(space after the second s)
and hit enter

should give you a happy system files transferred message 


Or unable to read c:  or something similar


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Data error reading drive c


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Without popping back thru the whole thread....does the c drive show in the bios?

I'm thinking the hard drive may have gone bye bye.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Where in the BIOS would I see the c drive? Also the dir at c: listed more than usual..i saw a lot of tmp files that look like this FFC305~1 FFC242~3 what are those? It hangs and won't finish listing though.


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

The same area where your boot choices are....various bios setups are different...look around for something you recognize as your cdrom and hard drive. Does it show there correctly?

Also, and I believe I've seen this happen before, if the gray cable isn't secure to the hard drive, you can get partial directory listings.....coulda been a dream  , and I know you don't want to play around inside, but I think you're gonna have to at least have a look........

Another thing to try at the c: prompt

cd windows

does it change?
Can you do a directory from there?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

When I chose load optimal setting it automatically fills in the primary slave and the CD rom shows up as the 2ndary master & slave. Also, I have the 1st boot as IDE-0 and that gives me an ok? Does this prove that there is a hard drive.

I can get to c:windows butwhen i do dir that's where all those funny tmp files with the ~ are? It won't show the entire drive just enough untilit hangs.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Okay i looked inside..that's some scary stuff. the only thing I see that might be out of place is a fat beige "belt" that looks like it may have popped out. I don't know where it goes. There are alot of belts like that in there and they're all plugged in the something except that one. it says cable select on the belt. Now I'm really lost. I'm afraid to stick it in just anywhere.


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

The cdrom shows up as secondary master AND slave? Do you have a cdrom and a burner or dvd per chance?

Does the hard drive say things like how large it is? The name brand -- anything like that?

At the c: prompt, try again by typing

dir /p

then hit the enter key to allow it to scroll further.

I'll get to the belt checking on the next post. Want answers to these questions first.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Yes I have a cd rom and a burner. There is no name or make etc it just says CD rom. I noticed that the belt says master on it with some other numbers. But I hardly move the tower around how could it have come out. is it possible that it supposed to be unattached.


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Let's not worry about the belt, it's probably attached to one end of the hard drive and then continues onto the motherboard. Sometimes there is a secondary attachment where you can put another drive.

What about getting a directory with the /p ?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Despite thefact that istill can't get on..I'm making progress with your help.

dir/p works. It lists a bunch of dir but won't list all. Also, I ran some features of this techworm program and one was a complete virus scan. It check every single dir & file so I know that they are there becuase I saw them.

Also, I ran a scandisk from techworm and the message was to frr up some files? I found the CD Rom also, the Win boot disk gives it another drive letter. (I'm sure everyone knew that but me.) I did a mem check and everything came up okay. Now what?


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Try sys c: again from the a: prompt.......


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

data error reading drive c


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

What brand hard drive is it?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Clone


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

A clone hard drive? 

Look in the bios setup to see if it says something like Maxtor, WD, etc.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Ohhhh. Okay. I'll do that tonight and you'll see a response tomorrow


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Samsung...I hope that's what you're looking for. Are you running out of ideas for me. Is it time for me to shell out some cash to have someone look at this?


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Oh, I'm not running out of ideas......it's pretty much down to the final countdown.....hard drive failure, or about......

Wanted you to download the hard drive utility from the manufacturer to test the drive.....

I would try to link it for you, but I'm having a bad internet connection tonight...


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## bandit429 (Feb 12, 2002)

(Quote)

samsung Diagnostic Programe

This program is used to diagnose the disk when the Samsung hard disk is suspected to have failures. It is strongly recommended to back up your data before using this program!

1.Precaution

This program runs in DOS mode only. 
Please back up your data before proceeding.

Here is the link I think Acacandy is describing,,,,,click below

http://samsungelectronics.com/hdd/support/utilities/utilities_02.html


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Thanks bandit.....that's the one.......


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Okay..how do I back up information from DOS mode -and- if I can't access anything will a back up work???? What if it doesn't.


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

I think we're getting down to the point where you're going to have to make some value decisions. How important is the information? How much are you willing to pay to have it retrieved? We can't get to windows, we can't 'talk' to the c: drive to write system files to it......


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Can you tell me how I can back up the data on c: that I have access to..such as the dir I keep all my stuff in I can access. If I can get that stuff I don't mind losing the rest. I have everthing and I can just reinstall.


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Are you sure you can access that directory? If so, get a bunch of floppies out........OR another possibility, I know you're afraid of the inside, any chance on pulling the drive and trying to copy files to another hard drive in another computer?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Yes...let's define access. I see the files and in most cases I can go further into the dir. Such as C:windows\temp or c:mydocuments. Now, do I copy using C:mydoc~/letter a:? Does this mean I have access. I know that I can not copy anthing to C: but I am not sure I can copy from c:?????? The error was "data error reading drive c:

Also, as for going inside the computer. As for going inside and copying. Iwouldn't know where to begin. And yes I am am afraid to do that. I have three laptops and if that means going inside the laptop. No Can Do????


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

I don't go inside laptops either, last time, I had parts leftover  It still doesn't work  

Find a regular short file in my documents.....let's try to copy it from c: to a:

You want to get to the directory first by typing:

cd c:\mydocu~1 and press enter

does the directory change?

If so, type dir /p and keep hitting the enter key, does it appear to make it thru the entire directory?

If so, find a short file for a test, say test.doc (obviously whatever your file is called)

then type

copy test.doc a:
and hit enter
does it copy or do you get a read error?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I can't do this until I get home. I'm at work. Just in case I can't copy should I go ahead and run the samsung diagnostic?


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Yes, I believe so. 

I've run other hard drive diagnostic programs on drives and haven't lost any data....(knock on wood) so I don't think it'll put you in any worse shape than you are right now.

If you have any hardware/computer friends around, I think it'd be time to call in a favor........


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Hi Madakatude,










Just to clear up your query about the files with '~' (tilde)
in them. If you look at the above, you can see the full file
name on the right, and on the left is the dos name.
Dos will 'truncate' file names down to 8 characters, the last
two being the tilde and a number. The number increments if the
filename repeats on the first 6 characters.

I have added a folder 'housekeepers' so you can see exactly
how dos deals with the filename.

When using Dos to copy or whatever, use the Dos filename.

Best of luck with it,
John


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Hi Madakatude, & AcaCandy,

Copying on to floppies using dos is time consuming and error-prone.
I have done plenty of it, and i dont recommend it.
Unless there is something that you feel you must save,
then you had better hope it fits on to 1.4 Mb cos fiddling with
splitters and so on is not much fun.

You say you have other laptops?
Do you have a 'laplink' connector?
If you do have one there is a dos program called 'interlnk'
which can be used to transfer stuff between PCs using dos.

You seem to be un-afraid of dos, so maybe you could do some
tidying up, that is, deleting of temp files, and maybe the *.chk
files, which i think scandisk puts there in case you need to know
whats been done, those FCC ones as there are so many, might be
some kind of file checking notes, i dont recognise them at all.

You might get scandisk to run after a bit of a tidy up,
if so, you could try again to run 'win',
Just a long shot here ... do you have the cabs on board?
it might be worth trying a re install from the cab file,
if scandisk will finish of course.

Try 'chkdsk' too.

See what AcaCandy says first.
Best of luck with it,
John


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Aca

The samsung diagnostic doesn't work. the error message is "error in exe file"????Can't fingure that one out? Also, i am able to copy anything as long as it fits, but John is right..it's time consuming. Anyway, i tried something else. I went in Win98 and tried to run setup.exe, it goes through scanning the registry and comes up with a message that there are too many files in Windows and that I should delete some of them or install windows on a different drive. So I emptied c/temp int files and all other*.tmp file from c:. There is alot of stuff in temp that I am not sure I should delete. So everythime I deleted I tried setup again. Then I started getting a message that setup requires 7,340,032 of space available on the c drive. What do you think.


John,

As you can see, i think cleaning up is the answer too. However, other than temp I don't know what to clean up. i can delete some of the programs I'v installed? Ca you tell me the command to delete an entire directory. Too many files to do 1 by 1. So far I am unable to delete dir just files in them individually. Also, I cannot see the full file name o the Right, just the dos name appears on the left. I don't have la laplink is it worth geting. Is the DOS program free? When you say do I have the cabs on board I'm assuming those are cab files for win98. Yes the win98 file is full of cabs.


HELP


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I have a file in c: that is named system.1st the size is 7,745,568. Is this normal


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Hi Madakatude,

i am pleased to hear from you again.
dont delete anything you're not sure of yet.
i have a feeling AcaCandy will be along soon,

John

ps: i take it you are still working in dos on this PC ?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Okay..Ill have a beer and wait for the lady. I'll check back in 30.


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Hi Madakatude,

You must be getting a fair grasp of dos by now.
You say you have deleted all the *.tmp files from C:
actually there is unlikely to be very many in C:

If you put
dir/s
thats an instruction to look through all of the
folders and sub folders for a specified file.

Fortunately you can use * (wildcard) as part of your
specified file. So to find any more *.tmp files that
may be scattered about you could put:

dir/s *.tmp

that will probably return quite a bunch.

Also after using any dos commands, it shows the
size of your HD, and whats left free.
could you put that please cos i cant remember
what it was.

Regards, John

ps:dont dissapear yet, i'd like to get a grip on whats happening


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

john,

I tried your command. I got an error that said "data error reading drive c??? Also, after a command I never see what is free. how do i get to that. mem works but I don't really know what I'm looking at.


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

OK.

just put any instruction that works alright, such as
dir
and see if there is entries below when its done.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

dir works everywhere. It just stops midway and gives me an error retry, abort, fail then back to the c prompt. The tmp files I deleted were in c/windows and it took about an hour.


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

i forgot about the file names,
i went back to dos proper,
and yes i dont have the filenames on the right either.
I have been using a dos window in 98.

i have a feeling there is a command to include the full
file name, and i am looking for it. Havent found it yet.

Also how long have you set your 'check messages' ?
Mines on 2 mins, yours seems longer!

You are lucky that you have the cabs on board,
that will save you some time and trouble.
I think you will also need to know some key numbers,
if you need to install, with any luck you wont lose any
of the stuff on your PC.

Just read your last post,
"it took about an hour"

about an hour for you to do it one at a time,
or,
about an hour for it (dos) to do it

John


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

Well, kiddies........not sure where to go from here.....

My best guess is to get off the drive whatever you feel is important.......and whatever you can.

that's my story, and I'm stickin' to it


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Hi AcaCandy,

it bothers me that dos doesnt do the usual display

John


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Ck messages is not the problem. It's me leaving the room in b/t posting. It took an hour to delete with one command. The red light was on and it stays on so I left it. After an hour I got the c prompt back.. Check for the files and thry're gon.




PS To all those who want me to keep this post going..I will as long as the experts keep helping me. Sorry, but I can't answer you all individually


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Maybe theres some kind of ceiling on the number of folders


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

OK.

right. i'm trying to get my head round this.
you checked for the files and they were gone.

Right.

Could you describe what you did to check that please?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I restated the computer and went back to c/windows/temp & temp int files & they said o files and s dir. Prior to deleting there was a list (pages and pages of tmp files. Doesn't that mean they're gone?


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

yes that would mean they are gone.
I am still unsure if your dos system is ok or not.

so i guess you got to the C: prompt,
and then put
cd windows
and then put
cd temp
and then put
dir

and got 0 files

yes??

if so, you should also have got a "bytes free"
line under that.

is that what you did?
was there no such line?

also did you try dir/s/p *.tmp ?

(the p lets you do a page at a time)


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Yes all is true. However the reason Ican't get the frre space line is because it never shows me the full dir. Example the dir contains 100 lines maybe it will opnly show 75 even if I use /p. Once it get to line 75 I get 

data error eading drive c
abort, retry, fail?

i choose a and back to the c prompt


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Hi Madakatude,

When dos was written,
MEM (memory) referred to the ram,
they called hard drives 'storage' i think.

So that's your ram.

still thinking about this, john


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Hi Madakatude,

have a look through this, its only short,

http://forums.techguy.org/showthread.php?threadid=92662

John


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Did you read the full post in order to see everything that was done already? If it helps I can delte some programs that I am able to reload. In the meantime, how can i see how much space is on c: there must be a command.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Okay. i did not delete everything in c/windows/temp. Only the tmp files. Should i delete everything in there? I am looking now for those other deletable ext. Question if the size of tmp is 0 how can it free space? I guess 0 means less than 1B not 0 right


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

have you just looked into temp, windows??

could you describe the screen as best you can?


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

anything like this?
but with no filename on the right.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I don't have a c:temp. 

In c:temp/windows..I see lots of .exe, bmp, and ini.. It will only display 376 files @ 141,462,748 bytes, 42 dir. Is this what you're saying is free space? If so sorry i was looking for something that actually said free.

example of what i see:

drvspace inf 1,121 04-23-99 10:22p
charmap 17,990 04-23-99 10:22p
etc...
376 file(s) 141,462,748 bytes
42 dir (s)

Data Error Reading Drive C
Abort, Retry, fail?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I do not have a line under bytes that shows what's free and yes no filenames


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Hi Madakatude,

i wouldnt do any of these, yet anyway.
(`*.*), (_*.*), (*.000). 

It bothers me that your DIR instruction takes so long.

***************************

just seen your last post.
yes, i havent just looked through, i had a good look.
***************************

next post,
there is a command that will empty your temporary file in c, windows, temp

i will find it in a min


John


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Your last post was #100...ROCK ON!

anyway.I don't understand what you mean by why the DIR instruction takes so long?


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

OK.

you have to be at this point:

C:\WINDOWS\TEMP>_

then you put DEL *.*
(notice the space after del)

Then come back and say what you got.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

C:\Windows\Temp>Del *.*
All files in directory will be deleted!
Are you sure (Y/N)? Y

Waiting, red light is on.....9:12pm


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

well your dos seems to be working ...

that may leave some folders in the temp,
but we are more interested in the line below,

the free space.
there should be two lines,
one is in bytes,
and one is in megabytes.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

9:17pm

Data Error Reading Drive C
abort, R... F...?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

One I abort

39 files.......19,668,593 bytes
53 dir(s)......

That's it!


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Mmm...

could you type 'CHKDSK' please?

and see what you get?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Curious..

Temp contains lots of dir that looklike this
tempo~1 aak
tempo~1 aad etc

With all types of letter aaf aaq etc


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

At the C: prompt, that is.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

chkdsk = Bad command or filename


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

yes, they will all have to go.

im thinking that theres too many files for something.
something doesnt like all those files.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Maybe if I keep del from temp eventually they will all go...


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

OK.

i dont know if deltree is included on your dos.
some installations are incomplete.

could you go back to
C:\WINDOWS\TEMP>_

and put

deltree

it should come back with:
required parameter missing

ok, waiting...


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Yes everything occured just as you said. What next


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

you are sooo lucky!


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

it looks like we will have to wipe the TEMP
and all thats in it
in one go.

I believe a new one will be made when win runs anyway.
or you can just make another if you wish.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Luck would be...seeing my office toolbar fill in Tell me again why I am lucky and I'm still in DOS?


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

ok i'll tell you

You have the cabs on board.
You have dos 6 or later, maybe incomplete.

Its starting to look recoverable,
UNLESS the HD has gone down.

john


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

My DOS ver is 7.10. I'm going to keep deleting. Could take forever.


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

OK.

time to delete the TEMP.

At the C: prompt,

deltree C:\WINDOWS\TEMP

you should get a 'confirm'
see that it says the directory temp
and go for yes


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

it wont take forever.

well i hope not, i havent got that long!


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Delete directory c/windows/temp and allits subdirectories (Y/N) Y
Deleting c:\windows\temp....9:51pm
Waiting red light is on...

9:52 Data error reading drive C (you know the rest)?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I is deleting though. I see a huge change in the #'s at the bottom. I'm going to do it again


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

is it still there?


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

if you get it to complete its task,
have a look at the notes below
free space etcetera

OOPS, no that wont be there, i just done it on one of mine.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Before I did the DELTREE there were 39 files @10,668,593 now threre are 15 files @ 2,583,243


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

sorry,

where and where?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I can see that this is going to take some serious time.


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

i dont think it will be that long.

can you now get a DIR on c,windows ?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Problems..i had to restart because I couldn't get to C windows. Now I can get to c:windows but the deltree command says bad command or file name??????


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Oh and the temp diris still alive and full


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

what result do you get from 
C:\DIR


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

a partial directory with no free space still and then the data error message


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Okay. I used Del *.* and the red light is on. What ever tree means maybe there are no more?

This command delted all the files. There are still 50 dir there. But it says o bytes now. No free space. Data error at the end????


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I.m trying to delte these dir individually and they won't. Data error


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Tried setup.exe again from win98. here's what i got.

Windows found an error in your system files and was unable to fix the problem. Try deleting some files to free up disk space on your windows drive. If that doesn't work then you will need to install Windows to a new directory.


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

im thinking this is part of why the dos is paying up.
i think theres an upper limit to the number of entries
that the C drive is allowed to have as root directories,
and files.

Be very cautious with deltree.

It should have removed the folders as well.

I would like you to try to remove stuff from the C
if you can.

I think it has too many to handle.
I would like to hear other opinions too if
anyones looking in.

could you have a look at the DIR on C,
maybe with 
DIR/O/P

the O puts it in alphabetical, the P you know


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Isee plenty i can delete. All directories. What is the command to remove a directory?


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

rd (remove directory)

be sure OK?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

It will just be games and stuff I loaded myself for entertainment like AOL


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

the more you can remove from C the better,
but be careful,
just ask if you need to


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

RD only works if the dir is empty. DoI have to go in and *.* the come out and rd. Is this the fastest way


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

'fraid so

that or deltree,
but be careful with deltree


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Got it...But what's up with a directory whose name is . and ..


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

they are the ones that run the system.
they have to be there.
they are like 'templates' for the rest.
they dont use up anything, well not to speak of.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

John,

Can we hook up again tomorrow. This is going to take a long time. There are so many layers here.


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

layers?

arent you using deltree?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

not working. keep saying bad command


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

i see.

how did you get on with
dir/o/p 
on the C:


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

hat command is good b/c it shows me all the dir that I have up front


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

More detail please.

Also try

DIR/O/P/W

the W puts it into wide,
you get more on the screen,
but no details


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Okay. I want to sign off and concentrate on deleting. Any last words on how I'll know when I can stop del.ing?


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

yes.

When you get a sensible result from

C: DIR

with the sensible reports at the bottom,
free space etc.

(use /o/p/w )


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I just meant that the alpha order is good for me. If I'm only going to see half the dir then I want to see the dir's first. That's where the bulk is on C..I never realized how tired one can get looking at a laptop for this length of time


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

just be careful not to deltree something you want.

i know you said its not working,
but i think that as you clear C
it will start working again.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Okay, will you be on tomorrow


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

yeah,
i dont sleep very well so i'm usually about
between 7pm and 5am ( UK time )

John


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Thanks for everthing...i really hope to catch up with you tomorrow. I'm going to keep delting and see where that gets me.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

John,

I've been delteing forever. Somehow..I've got to figure out a way to determine what space is free on C: The cursur still hangs at the end of a command when it's suppose to list the free space? There must be another way to determine this.


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Hi Madakatude,

How are you this evening?
I think i'm going to ask for advice on this.

We know its less than 7 Mb free (i think)
or thereabouts.

John


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Hi,

Yes, that is correct according to win98 setup. What time is it there, it's 2:17pm here in New York


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

is there any way you can see the size,
so you can concentrate on big ones?

so youre in new york.
on the mainland or over the water?


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

I am concentrating on size but I do not see changes in the number of bytes at the end? I am in NYC which ahppens to be an island.


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

I am wondering if Dos could be run from the A:
to do these jobs.

Do you have a set of floppies with Dos?
i think its 3 usually, but the newer Dos7 may be 4 floppies.


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## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Nope...no DOS disk.


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Well i think that it would be a lot quicker to use the A:
to do these jobs of deltree.

however, to run it from A: i think the floppy has to have
command on it, and the dos programs that you want to use
also on the same floppy.

That might mean putting together a floppy with a chosen
set on it.

That might sound awkward, but the time saved might
be worth it. However its not something i have ever done.

All the necessary dos stuff is freely available on line,
but i want to check if thats the way to go.

Are you on dial-up or a faster connection?
If you can download fast, get the full version of dos
on floppies, just cos its so useful.

I am also waiting to hear from an on-line aquaintence
who is much more knowledgeable about this than me.

Or anyone looking in who has a suggestion?


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

I have a set of dos on floppies,
and i have another PC here,
so i am going to see if deltree runs OK from A:

i think it will.

Do you have a few spare floppies?


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

yes, it works OK.
i have just deleted a folder called 'profiles'
along with all its contents, folders and files,
using deltree in dos on the A: drive.

Maybe this is one way to go.
Maybe the dos on your HD is compromised in some way.

As you say, using delete, is dreadfully time consuming
because of all the layers.

Using deltree cuts through that like a knife.

Check and see if any of your 'boot' disks or 'startup'
disks have deltree on them. You never know.


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

OK, Ive had a bit of a think.

Im going to guess that your working PC has 98se, yes?
Im also going to guess that you have a 98se boot disk, yes?

So i suggest you add deltree.exe to the files
on your boot disk,
and then you should be able to use the A: drive on your
laptop to run DELTREE from the A: drive.

This will greatly speed up your deletions.
However you still have to be cautious with deltree,
cos it can cut out big lumps at a time.

Im still waiting for other input on this,
from anyone looking in,
John


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Oh, i forgot to say,
you can find 'Deltree.exe' on your working 98se machine at:
C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND
drag and drop deltree.exe to the floppy using the right
mouse button, choose copy, not move.

Still thinking about your PC,
John


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

I still think it's the hard drive.........


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Hi AcaCandy,

It may well be the Hard Drive as you say,
but is it possible that its developed some bad sectors?

and maybe screwed up its dos?

Im glad someones there anyway!
John


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## ~Candy~ (Jan 27, 2001)

I'd sure like to see the hard drive diagnostics..... 

Not sure I understand your take on dos being screwed up 

Too many error messages reading drive c: for me


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## vijayr (Mar 28, 2002)

Hi,

i read thru your first problem , 
ok there might be a hardware problem, i agree with the others 
but that does not rule out a bad or corrupted .vxd file or bad driver that windows is trying to load,

i have a idea , you can try it ,
pres f8 during boot and you can select the interactive boot option (that is not the displayed option )
with this selection windows prompts you for every file and driver it is trying to load , press 'Y' or 'N' for every file , do not include the files that you think might be causing problems.

try some permutations with the 'Y/N' on the files ....
yoiu might be able to locate the bad or missing file/driver


best of luck
vij


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

He's using the dos on the hard drive
to do operations on the hard drive.

but they arent giving the proper messages after the operation.
and they are taking a long time, and not doing it right.
i'm wondering if his HD may have dodgy bits, and affected the
dos.

If he uses the A: drive to work on the C: drive
that might sort some of it out?

I think earlier in the thread he mentioned this laptop was
lent out?
Maybe it got a knock or got dropped.

Also i think its so full up with stuff that the diagnostics
wont run ........... or did i dream that bit?


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## vijayr (Mar 28, 2002)

Hi,


SORRY guys , 

i just read the first page of the problem , 
and then after posting i realised you all have gone some where else (did'nt see the 7+ pages for 'bad boot')


bye 
vij


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

thats quite alright vijayr,
whats your take on this?


----------



## vijayr (Mar 28, 2002)

Hi john,


sorry , i tried reading pages 7 , 8 but could not get the real nature of his problem,

i understand , he is trying some dos commands which is not giving him expected results, right?

but, why is he doing the dos commands , and for what reasons ? 
what does he really want to do?

please if u dont mind , re-cap me (in-short)


bye
vij


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## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

hi,

re-cap, M's laptop has packed up. He would like it to
run windows, as it did before. He has stuff on the hard drive he would like to keep. I think he said he lent it
out somewhere back in this thread. Now it will run in
dos, but apparently not properly. AcaCandy thinks the
hard drive is shot. I too think that it is damaged, but
i am trying to get M to try to clear enough of it to
get scandisk to run. If it can run.

Madakatude has been deleting stuff with 'del' and with
'rd' but it is very heavy going to make much space.

Deltree seems to have worked for a while, but now its
not working. Why not i have no idea.

So i've suggested trying deltree from the A: drive, so
far i havent heard back yet.

If ive missed out any relevant bits, then hopefully
someone can fill them in.

John


----------



## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

Hello All,

I appreciate everyone's help but I just couldn't take it anymore. I reformatted the hard drive, lost everything. I'm starting all over with the bare minimum. It's taken me days to get everything back the way it was. It was good go though and I sure learned a lot of DOS in the process. This one can be filed in the archives under the twilight zone.

Thanks for everything ACA and John......

PS. This was not a laptop we were working on. I only used my laptop to access the internet. And, more importantly, I am a SHE. Guess I should fill in that profile.

Thanks


----------



## john1 (Nov 25, 2000)

Hi Madakatude,

Im glad you got it sorted,
and i'm still curious about the hard drive,
if its all working ok now,
same hard drive, yes?

How far did you get with your deletions?
Did you get scandisk to run, maybe after you
formatted, were there any bad sectors?

Please let me know cos i am most curious about
what happened.

I didnt realise you were a girl, perhaps the
Xena's ring should have let me know.

Regards, John


----------



## Madakatude (Aug 15, 2002)

John,

Sorry i took so long...vacation. Anyway, I got a new hard drive. My friend couldn't do anything with the old one. All that deleting and scandisk still would,t run. Oh well, I still have the old hard drive. Maybe one day I can hook it up in school and let everyone troubleshoot.

Thans for all your help.


----------

