# furnace trouble



## love2everyone (Dec 7, 2008)

stopped coming on

using the fan on option at the thermostat the fan will come on

The LED indicator is on and the sheet lists this as normal functioning.

I did notice that i have a dirty filter

all power is on 

thanks,
eric


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## AKAJohnDoe (Jun 6, 2007)

Thermocouple and/or themostat are the likely culprits


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## Drabdr (Nov 26, 2007)

Is this furnace gas or electric?


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## love2everyone (Dec 7, 2008)

natural gas furnace


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## Drabdr (Nov 26, 2007)

Is there a pilot burner lit? As AKAJohnDoe mentioned, the thermocouple could be dirty, and not picking up the pilot flame. I know we discussed this not too long ago. I tried to find the thread for you, but did not locate it. 

1. Is the pilot light on? If the pilot light is not on, follow the instructions for the unit to determine how to get it lit. (A real duh moment here... but I'm sure you're gas is on to the furnace).

2. Is the pilot light on, but the main gas is not on? If so, either the flame sensor is not picking up the pilot light, or the thermostat is not allowing the main valve to come on. If the valve is on/off, you should be able to hear (or feel) the main valve when you turn up the thermostat. You'll want to assure the thermocouple is clean. I used to use really mild emory cloth to clean it off, or purchase a new sensor.


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## AKAJohnDoe (Jun 6, 2007)

Either it is not signalling (thermocouple) or the signal is being dropped (thermostat).

Or, if your furnace is 20-30 years old, all bets are off.

You do have a monoxide detector (or two or three) that work around the house, right?


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## love2everyone (Dec 7, 2008)

yes I have a carbon monoxide detector, he furnace isn't is 15 years old. 

I don't understand, if it isn't running why I could hear or feel anything from the valve.

I'm trying to take the thermostat off the wall so as to bypass, to see if stat is the problem.


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## Drabdr (Nov 26, 2007)

Can you see or tell if the pilot light is lit?


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## love2everyone (Dec 7, 2008)

also the fan and ac unit do function when i set the thermostat to auto and on the cold side.

however maybe this still means either the thermostat or thermocouple


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## love2everyone (Dec 7, 2008)

not sure how to check the pilot, i don't have the manuals for this unit. 

unit says that the pilot automatically lights and not to attempt to light it

it is lennox brand and says that heat exchanger and ignition board were replaced in 1998


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## love2everyone (Dec 7, 2008)

how do i bypass the thermostat to check if stat is the problem. I have green, blue, red, and white wires.


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## love2everyone (Dec 7, 2008)

so after a very rude technician visit for $70 service call charge, it was just the thermostat. He tried to blame me for trying to fix it myself saying those thermostats do usually go bad and I took the wrong screws off. I think he just doesn't want people trying to fix it themselves.

Are you kidding me it was and ancient mercury thermostat and the screws he said I took the wrong ones off would easily go back together. I should have told him more of what i thought, but I'm too nice.


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## AKAJohnDoe (Jun 6, 2007)

Thermostats are not too difficult. But you got off cheap at $70 in any case. I have replaced many over the years, the most recent is a fancy one with multiple timers for adjusting the temperature at multiple times on multiple days. Cool down when not at home and all that. Other than simple wiring and keeping it level there's not much to it.


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## love2everyone (Dec 7, 2008)

actually the $70 was just for him to connect the two wires and bypass the thermostat showing that the furnace then worked. 

$70 service call. 

After his disrespectfulness, and due to my continued attempts to solve problems like this myself I told him i would replace the thermostat myself. 

For anyone that wants to know in my case it was the red and white wire that he connected to allow the furnace to turn on bypassing the thermostat.

If i had know this i would have not called him.


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## Drabdr (Nov 26, 2007)

love2everyone said:


> actually the $70 was just for him to connect the two wires and bypass the thermostat showing that the furnace then worked.
> 
> $70 service call.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry I was not able to help. I think we probably could have figured out which wires they were by how they were placed on the thermostat. AKAJohnDoe deserves some kudos, as he/she was on the right track initially with that one. Cuing off that notion, that's where I wanted to see if the main valve was clicking on or not.

Off-topic: There is no reason under the sun to put up with rude service. I would call the company and objectively tell them of the situation. Many times it's hard for owner/management to know of employees actions out in the field, unless someone let's them know. FWIW.. like was stated, you got off pretty cheap for $70.00.


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## wacor (Feb 22, 2005)

$70 is cheap. You won't get one of my men to step in the door for that and then it is $20 per quarter hour after.

FYI.......Coming from a very service related business I can tell you that do it your selfers usually cause more problems than they solve. That does not excuse rude behavior but when people start taking things apart they need to know what they are doing. The worst is when somebody takes something apart and then does not tell you. It can make a simple diagnosis to a difficult one sometimes.


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## Drabdr (Nov 26, 2007)

wacor said:


> FYI.......Coming from a very service related business I can tell you that do it your selfers usually cause more problems than they solve. That does not excuse rude behavior but when people start taking things apart they need to know what they are doing. The worst is when somebody takes something apart and then does not tell you. It can make a simple diagnosis to a difficult one sometimes.


Actually, that's an excellent point, and a good one to have in a Do it yourself forum. 

There is a bit of a gamble when you "dive in" to try to fix something that you are not an expert with. If you don't fix it, you'll have to call a professional. It's to your advantage to be forthright about what you tried to fix, what you changed, etc. ; otherwise, it will take them longer, and they will charge more money.

When I did service, I would go on a call and see something that the wires were crossed on. They would emphatically deny doing anything with it, yet, there is no way it would have worked wired like that.


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## love2everyone (Dec 7, 2008)

so it was more expensive, but he was a lot more polite. and I definately didn't brake the thermostat. And after he left and we were just put two wires together to start the furnace. I put the thermostat back together and there was no problem in doing this. Everything works $350 part and some labor was the bill, which i haven't gotten in the mail yet


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## JohnWill (Oct 19, 2002)

WOW! What was the part that cost $350? A new thermostat can't be anything close to that unless it was gold plated!


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## wacor (Feb 22, 2005)

looks like it was an ignition module based on the title of the post.

taking a look it appears most cost $75-$175 online.

I bet the furnace people are pleased that people can buy online so cheap. It makes a contractor look bad but the contractor is many times not paying much less and then have to mark it up if somebody expects a warranty. Why some things can be sold online at near wholesale prices for some stuff is beyond me.


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## love2everyone (Dec 7, 2008)

yes ignition module, I guess lenox is more expensive


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## JohnWill (Oct 19, 2002)

Ignition module, not thermostat.  I couldn't believe a thermostat cost anything like that.


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## Drabdr (Nov 26, 2007)

Ok... I'm cornfused. I thought it was a simple thermostat replacement:

http://forums.techguy.org/6324541-post14.html

Then it became $350.00.



love2everyone said:


> so it was more expensive, but he was a lot more polite. and I definately didn't brake the thermostat. And after he left and we were just put two wires together to start the furnace. I put the thermostat back together and there was no problem in doing this. Everything works $350 part and some labor was the bill, which i haven't gotten in the mail yet


Were there two service calls?

No big deal I guess; just kind of wondering what happened.


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## love2everyone (Dec 7, 2008)

yes he had to come out twice. The first timed it worked when he connected wires at the thermostat. However that was just displaying the intermittant use that allowed us to use it for four days until the ignition module which he ordered after the second visit. No charge for the second visit. and still no bill for the repair and part.


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## Drabdr (Nov 26, 2007)

love2everyone said:


> yes he had to come out twice. The first timed it worked when he connected wires at the thermostat. However that was just displaying the intermittant use that allowed us to use it for four days until the ignition module which he ordered after the second visit. No charge for the second visit. and still no bill for the repair and part.


Ok. Thank you very much for taking the time to follow-up on your thread. Hope to see you around in the other forums. Have a very Merry Christmas.


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## Frank4d (Sep 10, 2006)

love2everyone said:


> yes he had to come out twice. The first timed it worked when he connected wires at the thermostat. However that was just displaying the intermittant use that allowed us to use it for four days until the ignition module which he ordered after the second visit. No charge for the second visit. and still no bill for the repair and part.


It won't help you this time, but the next time you suspect the ignitor... you can replace it yourself. I did so last year and the cost was around $50.

The way I could tell that was if you look at the ignitor when it starts... dim orange (bad) isn't hot enough to light the furnace. A good ignitor will glow very-very bright (almost white).


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