# Solved: Such thing as an Ethernet switch that doesn't need power? Question about ethernet run



## AhrenBa (Jul 21, 2005)

Hello,

I have an ethernet cable run in my house. What I need to figure out is if there is such thing an ethernet switch that does not require a power source. (or something that can get this situation resolved)

*Here is my situation:*
I have a cable ran to my basement, and have a bedroom directly above the basement that needs an ethernet run. It is not possible for me to run a completely new cable from the original starting point, so I was somehow hoping to use the cable going to the basement, put a head on it, put it into a switch/hub/splitter and run a cable out of it to the room directly above, and use the other cable coming out to stay in the basement.

Is there something that can do this for me? Is there a better way to do so? What would you suggest? Thanks!

*UPDATE:* Please refer to post #4 for more details.


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## Frank4d (Sep 10, 2006)

Ethernet switches and routers all require power, so no power won't work.

Please describe your connection in the basement in better detail (what is connected and how, including any modem/routers/switches ), and in the bedroom above (what is connected and how).

I suspect you may be able to connect downstairs and upstairs, but details are sketchy.


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## invalidusername (Apr 29, 2007)

AhrenBa said:


> What I need to figure out is if there is such thing an ethernet switch that does not require a power source.


So, you mean in the basement there is no ac power? and you want to run a cable from the bedroom to the basement and bring power on that cable from the bedroom to the basement, then put a switch in the basement and power it up off the bedroom cable, and use the original cable to extended ethernet to the bedroom via switch in the basement? Is that what you want to do?

I can not fully undrestand where the problem is and why you want a switch that does not require power. Please explanin more.

If my assumption above is correct, you can use a product like below to power a switch in the basement and also extend the ethrenet, or you can simply extend the cable (by using male-female RJ45 connectors in the basement to connect the original cable to the cable going to the bedroom) if the TOTALl length it is not going to be over 300')

http://www.dlink.com/products/?sec=0&pid=332


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## AhrenBa (Jul 21, 2005)

Thank you for the responses. I will try to explain in more detail.

Ok, I have a central location where all my ethernet cables meet (where the router and modem will be). From here I wired a cable to each room that I originally planned to use the connection in. One of these runs being directly to my unfinished basement (the basement does not have drywall yet, but the rest of the house's walls are closed up). Directly above the basement is the room I now need to run a cable to.

Here is what I was thinking of doing: 
1. Put a head on the cable running to the basement.
2. Add a splitter of some sort.
3. Now, insert basement cable into splitter.
4. Coming out from splitter: One new cable that will stay in the basement for a wall jack, and then one cable that will be pushed through the floor to the above room.

I hope that makes more sense. My problem is that all the walls in my house are finished, and therefore running a completely new cable from the "meeting point" is practically impossible/not cost effective. Since the basement is the only room with no finished walls, and is directly below the room of interest, I was planning to "share" this cable, so to speak.

What is the best way about doing this?


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## invalidusername (Apr 29, 2007)

Do you need ethernet service in the basement? Is the ac power in the basement? I do not recommend passively splitting ethernet signal.

If there is ac power in the basement, you can put another switch there


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## AhrenBa (Jul 21, 2005)

invalidusername said:


> Do you need ethernet service in the basement? Is the ac power in the basement? I do not recommend passively splitting ethernet signal.


Yes, I plan to place a computer in the basement, and I will need a connection there.

As far as the power goes: There is AC power in the basement, but I am reluctant to do so, because I am unsure how it will all turn out once the walls are closed up. What I mean by this is I would like to be doing the "splitting" behind the walls, and am unsure whether a powered solution would be best sitting behind a wall.

What do you think looks like the best solution?


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## invalidusername (Apr 29, 2007)

AhrenBa said:


> Yes, I plan to place a computer in the basement, and I will need a connection there. ?


Ethernet only requires 2 pairs, cat5 cable has 4 pairs.

At where the swith is, I would wire two ethenet connections to the switch for the cable that goes to the basement, each using 2 pairs. One set would follow the standard ethernt wiring connections. The ohter set will use the unsed 2 pairs, non-standard wiring in cat5.

I would install a junction box in the basement for the orginal cable that is coming from the switch with 2 separate ethenet signals.

I would go to Homedepo or anyother store that sells ethernet parts.

I would buy a cover plate for the box with two square holes in it.

These holes are for RJ45 jacks that clips into the holes.

I would wire the cable coming from the swith to two separte RJ45 jacks such that each jack has its own ethernet signal that is coming from the switch.

One jack will be used for the computer in the basement

The other jack wil lbe used for the cable that comes from the bedroom

If you want you can splice the two pairs of of the cable coming from the switch to cable that goes to the bedroom using male-female connector on those two pairs. The other 2 pairs (standard) will connect to the RJ45 jack for the basement computer. I do not recommend that, because trouble shooting will be difficult.

Or, put two junction boxes in the baement, with single hole cover plate. Then splice the main cable such that one junction box is the standard ethernet wiring for the basement compute, the other junction box is the non-standard wiring for the cable that comes form the bedroom

Do you get the idea? Use the un-used pairs in cat5 cable that goes to the basement for an additional ethernet connection from the swithc.

I will look for the links for the part that I am talking about


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## invalidusername (Apr 29, 2007)

Here is the RJ 45 connector for the cover plate

http://shop4.outpost.com/product/4062992?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG
You can very easily wire 2 pairs to this. Make sure get the type that comes with the small wiring t

here is the cover plate with single hole

http://shop4.outpost.com/product/2750323?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG


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## AhrenBa (Jul 21, 2005)

Thank you very much for your help, invalidusername. Let me see if I have this right.

1. At the location where the router/switch is at (cable meeting spot), I should wire two jacks that will be coming from the same cable (the cable that goes to the basement).
2. In the basement, I should put in a junction box, and do the same thing (wire two jacks) to this end of the basement cable.
3. Use one jack for the basement computer, and the other jack will lead to the bedroom above.

Is that correct? I have one question though. You said that I should wire two jacks in the basement (one staying in basement, and the other goes to the bedroom). Since the jacks will be on the outside of the wall, how will the cable run to the bedroom above? Wouldn't it make more sense to keep the wiring for that inside the junction box, instead of having an external cable.

Thank you very much for your help though.

Oh, and on an unrelated note, I have another question. If a router has a 4 port 100MB BASE-T ports and someone would need to add more ports, what would be the best way to do this? Would you run a patch cable (or regular) from the router switch to another, external (separate) switch? If so, in this case, would the speed be decreased since the new switch is only connected to the router via one cable that maxes out at 100MB/s? What I am asking is since using one cable to connect the new switch, would this mean all the new ports in the switch will have to divide the speed available on that one cable? I hope this makes sense.


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## invalidusername (Apr 29, 2007)

AhrenBa said:


> Let me see if I have this right.
> 
> 1. At the location where the router/switch is at (cable meeting spot), I should wire two jacks that will be coming from the same cable (the cable that goes to the basement).
> 2. In the basement, I should put in a junction box, and do the same thing (wire two jacks) to this end of the basement cable.
> ...


This is correct. You need to keep track of the wire collors that you use for each ethernet signal so that you can connect them to each RJ45 female connectors properly.



AhrenBa said:


> I have one question though. You said that I should wire two jacks in the basement (one staying in basement, and the other goes to the bedroom). Since the jacks will be on the outside of the wall, how will the cable run to the bedroom above? Wouldn't it make more sense to keep the wiring for that inside the junction box, instead of having an external cable.


Yes, you can keep that connection insdie the junction box, provided that there is enough room to teminate each set into an RJ45 connector (male or female as needed).

This is what I would do:

Instal two junction boxes in the basement near each other:

One junction box has two square holes on the face-plate for two RJ45 clip-ons female connector. You terminate the cable coming from the swith into this. This box now provides two separate ethernet signals. One goes to the computer in the basement

The other junction box will have a single square hole on the face plate for the RJ45 female clip-on connector. This will terminate the cable coming form the bedroom.

You now use a short RJ45-to-RJ45 male-male jumper to connect the second RJ45 in the box with two jacks to the jack in the box going to the bedroom.

This will make it nice and clean. It will make trouble shooting much easier. I will not recommend splicing cable inside the wall that is going to be covered by sheet rock./QUOTE]



AhrenBa said:


> Oh, and on an unrelated note, I have another question. If a router has a 4 port 100MB BASE-T ports and someone would need to add more ports, what would be the best way to do this? Would you run a patch cable (or regular) from the router switch to another, external (separate) switch? If so, in this case, would the speed be decreased since the new switch is only connected to the router via one cable that maxes out at 100MB/s? What I am asking is since using one cable to connect the new switch, would this mean all the new ports in the switch will have to divide the speed available on that one cable? I hope this makes sense.


I woudl add the switch as you decribed. Speed will remain 100 MB/s between ports. That is the nice thing about switch. Now, if everybody on that system wants to go on internet and play heavy duty games or purchase hif-def movies at the same time, the speed for internet has be shared, and things will be very slow for internet use. On the switch side, nothing to worry about. Your bottle neck is your DSL or cable modem which is far less than 100 MB/s.


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## AhrenBa (Jul 21, 2005)

> This will make it nice and clean. It will make trouble shooting much easier. I will not recommend splicing cable inside the wall that is going to be covered by sheet rock.


Ah! I understand now. That makes perfect sense. Thanks for the suggestion.



> I woudl add the switch as you decribed. Speed will remain 100 MB/s between ports. That is the nice thing about switch. Now, if everybody on that system wants to go on internt, the speed for internet has be shared, and thing will slow down on internet side. On the switch side, nothing to worry about. Your bottle neck is your DSL or cable modem which is far less than 100 MB/s.


I understand that internet speed will always be shared, but about the network speed, I am a bit fuzzy. The internet speed slowdown is inevitable, and is not due to the setup I am describing, correct?

So if I were to do this, would I use one patch cable to connect the switch to the router, and then plug all my cables into the new, external, switch? If so, I think I understand it. What would happen if a couple computers would be plugged into the router's switch and the others into the new switch? Also, what if for some reason, I eventually decided to use a switch in the basement location where the cable running to the basement would get plugged into the switch, and then the one from the bedroom would plug in also. Would there be any slowdown here? According to what I believe, I think the answer would be no, correct?
*
I am sorry for all the questions, but you are doing an awesome job answering them! This is my last question and I hope I am not getting annoying!  Thank you so much for your help!*


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## invalidusername (Apr 29, 2007)

Yes, you can buy a switch with 8 ports and do as you decribed. Or, get a switch with 4 ports, and use one port from the router to feed that.

If you put a switch in the basement, then one of the signals coming from the main switch will connect to the second switch in the basement, and then other computers can connect to that switch. Again, speed at each port will be 100 MB/s. Now if you have several computers on the second switch and they all want to download a huge file at the same time from the computer on the main switch, then there is only one link (at 100 MB/s) between two switches and things will get slow in here because they have to share that one link.

Don't worry about questions. We all come here to learn and have our questions answred, if not, there won't be any need for this Forum.

Now, I want to remmend this tool and connectors for making your cables. Homedepot has them:

http://www.smarthome.com/89210.html

http://www.smarthome.com/89201.html


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## AhrenBa (Jul 21, 2005)

Thank you so much for your help! You have been a tremendous resource of knowledge!

I know understand all those questions I asked!

I realize I said that the previous question was my last, but I thought of one very small one, just so that I could have the knowledge.

How do giant corporations with thousands of computers run a network of switches, etc. without the slowdown described with the situation of having computer(s) on the second switch access a file on the main switch? What do they use to prevent the slowdown, because don't they have to link together the multiple switches via single cables?

Thank you, and this _really _is the last one!


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## invalidusername (Apr 29, 2007)

Now, regarding your project:

On all RJ45 jacks, make the pin-out wiring standard. Even if the cable pairs coming to it were non-standard colors, make the connections to the RJ45 jacks pins standard. That way, you can use standard RJ45 cables without any problems.

Computer networks (LAN) they get slowed down too. Network managers constantly monitor traffic on the network. When there is slow down, they take measures. They create more LAN segments and reduce the number of computers on the segments.

They increase the capacity of the link. In your example, you can use muntiple links to connect to segments together to add to the speed and reduce congestions.

They add to the number of servers, create immage sites and route traffic accordingley. 

The bottom line, all networks can get congested such as the one your are designing. The network manger has to analyze and decide what to do to minimze degredations. This is exaclty why hubs got replaced with switches.


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