# New Foxfire Browser



## plschwartz

Version 1.o of Foxfire has been released and can be downloaded www.mozilla.com "foxfire preview release" 
It has a nice clean interface and seems to work well. Some security holes are said to have been fixed


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## shadowcat

:up: The only difference I've noticed is the lack of themes. I always like to customize my icons


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## Bryan

Security holes? I thought FoxFire was impenetrable? Isn't that why people switch from IE?


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## 700mb80min

> impenetrable


 ...got a source for that theory .


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## Big-K

Bryan said:


> Security holes? I thought FoxFire was impenetrable? Isn't that why people switch from IE?


Thats two time i've seen you being sarcastic against that type of thing...

I'm thinking i'll probably download it. Even if I only recently got 9.3.


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## Telstar

Big-K said:


> I'm thinking i'll probably download it. Even if I only recently got 9.3.


Hi *Big-K*,
I had Firefox 0.8 for quite a while. Two weeks ago I upgraded to 0.9.3.
So far, so good!

Couple of days ago, after reading about the release of 1.0PR, I decided to upgrade to 1.0PR.
For me, a big mistake.

My favorite Theme had not yet been upgraded to a version compatible with 1.0PR. Plus, many extensions had not been upgraded as well (e.g. QuickNotes, Googlebar (whuut! No Googlebar??....lol), BB Code, Windows Update, IE View, Firesomething, ChromEdit).....none of these were available for 1.0PR.

So, be sure it's for you before you decide to go ahead with 1.0PR.

Make sure you have access to 0.9.3.exe so you can go back to it (as I did) if 1.0PR does not work for you.

I like the Firefox Browser very much. But, many of the Extensions and Themes' authors/developers don't have their products updated to be compatible with Firefox 1.0PR.
0.9.3 is working fine for me right now.

Good Luck!

Telstar


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## Bryan

> Thats two time i've seen you being sarcastic against that type of thing..


Yea so what's your point? Is sarcasm only allowed when you use it against Microsoft?

All of the talk about Firefox and how perfect it is, just wondering about the validity of what I'm hearing now. When Microsoft has security holes and fixes them they're called arrogant and uncaring but when Firefox has holes and fixes them they're called geniuses. LOL

Anyway, I really don't want to further debate this but I'm going to say this and that's it for this subject .....

I'm not upset over this, I just get sooooo tired of hearing negative things about MS as if they can't do anything right when in fact they do a hell of alot of things right and if they didn't, we wouldn't even be here posting on this website. It just gets old since I don't think any of the stuff holds water and is mostly sour grapes.

I'm a programmer of twenty plus years and I use Micosoft products and find them to be very well written and as reliable as any software programs can be. Most of the arguments I see have to do with the fact that people don't seem to understand that we live in a Capitalist society and as such, Microsoft has played the game better than any other one has, period. Anyone can write software and market it, so I suggest anyone wanting to do so, have at it and stop whining about how good of a jobl MS has done in crushing it's completion. That's what happens in a Capitalist society, it happens everyday in America it's a doggy dog world and nothing is fair. You don't help your competitors create and maintain good products, you compete and do all you can to make sure your product is the best and your competitors don't pass you.

There now I feel much better ...


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## Rollin' Rog

On another note, I decided to give Foxfire a gander. For a quick download alternative browser I can't complain.

But it can't hold a candle to Opera 7 for convenience and utility.


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## Gibble

Bryan said:


> I'm a programmer of twenty plus years and I use Micosoft products and find them to be very well written and as reliable as any software programs can be. Most of the arguments I see have to do with the fact that people don't seem to understand that we live in a Capitalist society and as such, Microsoft has played the game better than any other one has, period. Anyone can write software and market it, so I suggest anyone wanting to do so, have at it and stop whining about how good of a jobl MS has done in crushing it's completion. That's what happens in a Capitalist society, it happens everyday in America it's a doggy dog world and nothing is fair. You don't help your competitors create and maintain good products, you compete and do all you can to make sure your product is the best and your competitors don't pass you.
> 
> There now I feel much better ...


And as a programmer I'm sick of programming with their half completed and ill thought out object models. And am utterly sick to death of fixing glitches in them with stupid workarounds.


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## brite750

I've edited this post to remove the comments >> they may be appropriate for the Civilized Debate forum, but not here as they have nothing to do with Firefox or its alternatives.

Brite, please don't post off topic or respond to this here. You can PM me if you have complaints. (RR)


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## Skivvywaver

I downloaded it to see what all the fuss is about. It is all about nothing as far as I am concerned. Firefox lets more ads through than my patched up IE via ZAP and PopUpCop.

It is no faster and really doesn't show pages as well or in as much detail. I have been infected using IE, but not since I learned to patch it up. I have a few sites that I know that are guaranteed to have some scum on them that I use to test my browser.

Bryan, I saw a few weeks back that if anyone knew of any sites you would maybe want to check them out. I'll check them to make sure they are still up and send you some links via PM.

It is all in what you prefer I guess. I'll continue with IE, and will continue with SP1 on my machine for awhile. I think there is no need to hand Microsoft the job of security on my computer. I think I can deal with it on my own.


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## Big-K

^Try downloading the adblocker extension. You can choose the ads to block, and if a new one comes in you can tell it to block it.


And Bryan, looks to me like you are upset. What we do is just joke harmlessly, you seem to be doing a full-out offense. I realize it takes alot of work.


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## brendandonhu

Bryan-theres a reason MS gets yelled at for their security patches and mozilla gets praised. So far, Mozilla/Firefox holes have been fixed within days, if not hours of the first discovery of a _potential_ security hole. With IE, there usually isn't a fix for days or even weeks after the hole has been exploited and there are viruses in the wild taking advantage of the hole. Its also been quite common for MS patches to be crappy workarounds for the real problem without even fixing the security hole, or even causing new problems.

And for everyone else, its Firefox not Foxfire


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## Bryan

Brendan, comparing the speed that Firefox with their one browser and (how many users?) respond to problems with Microsoft and their hundreds of millions of users with millions of different configs is like comparing apples to oranges. If MS fixes it quickly and misses something and screws up millions of peoples systems their idiots, if they fix it and take their time, their idiots ... they can't win ... I just wish people would step back and realize the enormity of what MS is up against when they "fix" software that's running in every part of the globe. Do you at all realize what it takes to do that and get it even close to right the first time? I'd just love to see some of the people that complain about MS walk a day in their shoes and try to fix the problems without destroying millions of PC's ...

BigK, not really upset and I didn't mean to single out your post, it just happened to be there. Sorry if I offended you. I've just been around this site for 6 years now and the griping at MS gets to me sometimes. I think it's very underserved to say the least. I work with their software day in and day out and it works just fine for me and I'm not a casual user by any means.

And trust me if and when Firefox becomes a big boy on the block, they'll be everyone's whipping boys, too.


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## brendandonhu

Surely Microsoft has millions more users and tech support requests to respond to but I don't see how thats relevent to fixing security problems. They've got millions of people running the exact same program; theres still just that one hole to fix. As far as different configurations, thats much more complex for firefox. IE runs on Windows and Mac. Firefox can run on just about any OS on any architecture. And they don't have the advantage of having their competitor's source code.


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## Bryan

Not sure how to explain it to you but it does matter immensely. Do you program on any systems that support alot of users using alot of applications that are all intregrated? If so, then you know you can "fix" one problem but create another if you don't go about it in the right fashion. I don't care how simple the fix appears to be, it needs to be tested and tested and tested. And then tested again if you want to do it the right way. I can't tell you how many times I've seen programmers rush in and "fix" a few lines without thinking it thoroughly through causing other things to fail with their "fix".

As far as source code, why should MS give away their source code that they developed?


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## brendandonhu

I mess things up daily writing tiny scripts that only I use 
But why is it that Firefox updates/fixes don't break things or cause problems while IE updates do? Firefox has relatively small marketshare but its still a very large userbase with a huge variety of configurations.


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## Bryan

You answered your own question when you mentioned market share .... They're not even in the ball park and you'll see when and if they are, they'll screw up, too. No software is totally without bugs or security holes. Just wait til millions of people start dedicating their lives to finding weaknesses in their code. You'll see how easily people find them.

Anyway, I'm going to get back to what I really enjoy here which is helping others with their problems. I try to stay out of these types of discussions and just help with problems but every once in a while I let myself get distracted.


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## southernlady

Open source supports creativity. Maybe if the code was available, hackers wouldn't be so bound and determined to focus JUST on M$ then. As it is, that's exactly where virus writers and hackers prefer to focus their attempts and so the open source world is safer. And notice I said safER not safe. Liz


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## brendandonhu

Not sure if you still read this thread Bryan, but more market share != more security exploits. Look at web servers. Apache is by far the most popular, yet all the viruses target Microsoft IIS.


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## Big-K

It's true that the biggest and most popular are usually the ones ridiculed. Kazaa is the P2P program that gets the most heat because they had the largets user base, etc. If firefox were to become what IE has become(impossible, unless Mozilla starts making an OS themselves or gets a contract to automatically install it in the biggest OS around), then it would no longer be an alternative browser, the other would. It would be the most hacked and least secure, and most hated. Everything comes with a price.


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## GoJoAGoGo

Telstar said:


> Hi *Big-K*,
> I had Firefox 0.8 for quite a while. Two weeks ago I upgraded to 0.9.3.
> So far, so good!
> 
> Couple of days ago, after reading about the release of 1.0PR, I decided to upgrade to 1.0PR.
> For me, a big mistake.
> 
> My favorite Theme had not yet been upgraded to a version compatible with 1.0PR. Plus, many extensions had not been upgraded as well (e.g. QuickNotes, Googlebar (whuut! No Googlebar??....lol), BB Code, Windows Update, IE View, Firesomething, ChromEdit).....none of these were available for 1.0PR.
> 
> So, be sure it's for you before you decide to go ahead with 1.0PR.
> 
> Make sure you have access to 0.9.3.exe so you can go back to it (as I did) if 1.0PR does not work for you.
> 
> I like the Firefox Browser very much. But, many of the Extensions and Themes' authors/developers don't have their products updated to be compatible with Firefox 1.0PR.
> 0.9.3 is working fine for me right now.
> 
> Good Luck!
> 
> Telstar


Follow the link in my Post #5 for all compatible extensions for Firefox 1.0 PR:
http://forums.techguy.org/t274481.html


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## TOF

Here is a web site where you can get both extensions and themes for the new browser.


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## brendandonhu

Big-K said:


> It would be the most hacked and least secure, and most hated. Everything comes with a price.


How pessimistic...can you give an example or two of where thats happened before?

And the Kazaa thing, maybe they are ridiculed because its loaded with spyware and advertising crap that slows down your computer and is hard to remove? That would be my guess.


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## Big-K

Lesse, Dell, Microsoft(media player, IE, etc.), Wal-Mart, Rap Music, etc. All of those have become so big that lots of people publicly hate them. If firefox was the big browser, my guess is that people who are hate big companies would start accusing them of things and they would be the next IE.


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## Skivvywaver

I agree that if ANY other browser become the big boy the security holes that ARE in them would be exploited. Nobody really takes aim at them because of the small user base. 
Lets say I am a hacker/virus writer and I want my work to be widely effective and publicized. I am NOT going to go after a SMALL percentage of PCs. I am going to hit where it will do the most damage for sure. Alternative browsers just aren't targeted.

It would be like 9-11 happening in the countryside. Imagine 4 cessnas hitting barns in rural Pennsylvania instead of airliners hitting twin towers and the pentagon. No real damage except for some dead terrorists and a few cows. (sorry Bessie)
The shock of 9-11 was airliners full of innocent people hitting buildings full of innocent people. 
If mozilla/firefox, netscape, opera etc. get enough market share Mr. Haxor will get on the case.
I don't have anything against alternative browsers. I just think there is just way too much hype about nothing. If they were targeted they would have problems.


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## Big-K

Bryan said:


> Along these same lines, I was having a conversation with a programmer friend of mine who is into security and hacks for a company for a living. Basically the company pays him to try and defeat their new products. He laughed hysterically when I mentioned Firefox because he said it's a piece of cake to hack into because he has access to the source code. He predicted that they would eventually have to secure their source or they would be doomed for obvious reasons. He mentioned that the only reason they've survived with open source up to know is because the real hackers don't find it even worth their time to hack it because there's such a small user base, what good would it do them. Plus alot are anti MS so they like hacking MS products and basically leave Mozilla alone as a deference to them. I guess we'll see.
> 
> Anyway, I applaud the people at Mozilla and wish them luck with it, I just wish some of the users of their software would just use their products, enjoy them and stop all of the undeserved MS bashing that you hear day and day out. The bashing just gets real old, real fast .... Mozilla software, like ANY software by any company, is no exception to the rule when it comes to bugs and holes. It's just a mtter of time before someone exposes the flaws that exist in any code.


From the thread 'Flawless Firefox'


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## lvken7

I'm not upset over this, I just get sooooo tired of hearing negative things about MS as if they can't do anything right when in fact they do a hell of alot of things right

*Name ONE!*


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## lvken7

Name ONE!


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## ~Candy~

Not sure if you are just being irritating by posting twice or what? 

How about the $3 cash dividend this quarter?


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## linskyjack

LOL---Candy knows whats important!


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## ~Candy~

Watch the stock price drop $3 next week


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## vanillacoke

Bryan said:


> Not sure how to explain it to you but it does matter immensely. Do you program on any systems that support alot of users using alot of applications that are all intregrated? If so, then you know you can "fix" one problem but create another if you don't go about it in the right fashion. I don't care how simple the fix appears to be, it needs to be tested and tested and tested. And then tested again if you want to do it the right way. I can't tell you how many times I've seen programmers rush in and "fix" a few lines without thinking it thoroughly through causing other things to fail with their "fix".
> 
> As far as source code, why should MS give away their source code that they developed?


Yeah leave Microsoft alone! Microsoft is still the BEST and Mozilla is just a wanna-be loser!! They don't own the majority of the market share, Microsoft does and they still are very innovative in their efforts too, unlike Mozilla who copied a lot of their browser technology in their release of Firefox, call that Innovative, I think not! Copied the Save Password, Copied the toolbar images for the buttons, back, forward, Refresh, Home and stop. Copied unsafe download prompting, yeah that's going to make them the leader, NOT!

They have security holes too and the hackers will find them, just cause they haven't, doesn't mean they won't then we'll see what you Microsoft haters have to say then? Oh its OK then, yeah right!


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## southernlady

> Microsoft is still the BEST


 ~SNORT~

One of my favorite extensions is tinyurl, it CAN NOT be added to IE, it CAN be added to Firefox, Mozilla, and other java enabled browsers. In order to use tinyurl, I have to open a second window (which, btw, is also something I don't have to do with Firefox, I can open a another TAB) and copy the url from one window to the other.

Now, Firefox 1.0 hasn't caught up with me yet, so I uninstalled it and dropped back to 1.0PR JUST because I enjoy tinyurl and use it SO much.

IE doesn't do tabbed browsing, they don't even know what it is apparently, takes up MUCH less room. And if you'vve never tried it, how in the heck do you know what you're missing.

As far as the toolbars, weren't those developed by yahoo and google and NOT Microsoft??? And just ALLOWED by Microsoft to be a part of IE????? And I seem to remember that IE copied alot of NETSCAPE and since Netscape actually is Mozilla, whose copying whom???? Liz


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## KeithKman

I have been using IE for a few years...downloaded Firefox 1.0 a few days ago and like it a lot more.

In racing, we have a saying, "Different strokes, for different folks."


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## lvken7

vanillacoke - Yeah leave Microsoft alone!

*I will leave MSoft alone as soon as they let me UNINSTALL Internet Explorer.*
Microsoft is still the BEST and Mozilla is just a wanna-be loser!!

*WRONG!!!!! Mozilla is only trying to bring some competition BACK to Software. We should ALL support them.*

They don't own the majority of the market share, Microsoft does

*Sure MSoft has a majority. They got it by becoming a MONOPOLY. We should ALL be supporting ANY of their competitors.*

and they still are very innovative in their efforts too, unlike Mozilla who copied

*Obviously, you are to young to remember that Apple sued MSoft because they STOLE. THAT is where Windows came from.*

a lot of their browser technology in their release of Firefox, call that Innovative, I think not! Copied the Save Password, Copied the toolbar images for the buttons, back, forward, Refresh, Home and stop. Copied unsafe download prompting, yeah that's going to make them the leader, NOT!

They have security holes too and the hackers will find them, just cause they haven't, doesn't mean they won't then we'll see what you Microsoft haters have to say then? Oh its OK then, yeah right.

*You MAY be right! I don't care. I am going to support ANY of MSoft competition, as we ALL should.*


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## GoJoAGoGo

When you delete files while using Mozilla Firefox, where do these files go? They don't end up in the Recycle Bin and I was wondering if they could be recovered if you should delete something in error.


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## kath100

lvken7 said:


> *You MAY be right! I don't care. I am going to support ANY of MSoft competition, as we ALL should.*


Ivken7, which operating system are you using and how does it compare to Microsofts?


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## vanillacoke

southernlady said:


> ~SNORT~
> 
> One of my favorite extensions is tinyurl, it CAN NOT be added to IE, it CAN be added to Firefox, Mozilla, and other java enabled browsers. In order to use tinyurl, I have to open a second window (which, btw, is also something I don't have to do with Firefox, I can open a another TAB) and copy the url from one window to the other.
> 
> Now, Firefox 1.0 hasn't caught up with me yet, so I uninstalled it and dropped back to 1.0PR JUST because I enjoy tinyurl and use it SO much.
> 
> IE doesn't do tabbed browsing, they don't even know what it is apparently, takes up MUCH less room. And if you'vve never tried it, how in the heck do you know what you're missing.
> 
> As far as the toolbars, weren't those developed by yahoo and google and NOT Microsoft??? And just ALLOWED by Microsoft to be a part of IE????? And I seem to remember that IE copied alot of NETSCAPE and since Netscape actually is Mozilla, whose copying whom???? Liz


You really don't know much about computers do you? The toolbars in the browser have nothing to do with Yahoo or Google. I'm not talking about the Yahoo! Companion or Google toolbar! I'm talking about the part of the browser where there is Back, Forward, Stop, Refresh, Home, and Go Button. That is the part of the browser that Mozilla Firefox copied Microsoft. I hope Microsoft sues them too, its very similar and should be a violation of copyright for sure.

Yeah Mozilla is so fast, what a JOKE! I launch Mozilla and had to wait 10 seconds or more compared to microsoft which is WAY faster! It doesn't freeze up nearly as much as Mozilla and you don't have to download all these annoying add-ons too.

The press releases for Mozilla are full of HYPE! I don't care what Forbes says or USA Today or any of them critics, they don't know crap and they aren't IT Professionals like I am.


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## southernlady

> Yeah Mozilla is so fast, what a JOKE! I launch Mozilla and had to wait 10 seconds or more compared to microsoft which is WAY faster! It doesn't freeze up nearly as much as Mozilla and you don't have to download all these annoying add-ons too.


And I don't have to wait for IE to decide to LET me see my home page, I can actually fill in forms with Firefox which I can't do anymore with IE, even withOUT SP2. And yes, I have the setting as low as safely possible but not too low, I have java-enabled, and all the other settings but still NO cigar. IT has decided to protect me and NOTHING *I* can do to stop it. There are forms I would love to fill out but heck, if IE won't let me and Firefox will, guess whose browser *I'M* using? And STILL be protected. And I don't have to patch and patch and patch and patch. Yes, there are different builds but no one says we have to use them. And no one says you HAVE to download the add-ones, THOSE are optional.

Besides, you don't have to pay for Firefox and don't give me a load of hooey about not paying for IE, we ALL did when we bought our O/S!

And maybe I did mix up the types of toolbars, but google and yahoo ARE toolbars as well.

Can IE have THEMES or are you stuck with looking at the same thing day after day after day after day after day...bet it gets boring???

Besides, I wasn't talking Mozilla as far as fast but FIREFOX...I don't do Mozilla or didn't you realize there was a difference? Liz


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## GoJoAGoGo

GoJoAGoGo said:


> When you delete files while using Mozilla Firefox, where do these files go? They don't end up in the Recycle Bin and I was wondering if they could be recovered if you should delete something in error.


Does anyone has any information on this question?

Thanks


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## Stoner

I'm now using both browsers on a regular basis.
This 1.0 version loads faster than my first experience with Firebird.

But I've realy grown attached to the convience of tabbed browsing.
Searches are easier for me in Firefox when I have multiple tabs open. It just seems easier for me to keep track of what I have open. MS would do well to incorporate tabs into IE.

I'm not a MS hater or opensource lover. I just use what ever works best for my needs. 

He he........
I'm still on win98se(internet usage) and have never hated it. It truly works very well for me. Now, my Gateway computer is another thing, LOL!


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## treespirit

Hi Go Jo, I wish I knew the answer to your question and now I would kinda like to know the answer as well, maybe someone out there knows. Hope you get a response.


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## msmith76

I switched from IE to Firefox 1.0 a few days ago and I do like it a lot better. #1 for the tabs, meks swithcing between much easier. I will continue to use it and never go back to IE.

But... to each their own....


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## brendandonhu

vanillacoke said:


> Yeah Mozilla is so fast, what a JOKE! I launch Mozilla and had to wait 10 seconds or more compared to microsoft which is WAY faster! It doesn't freeze up nearly as much as Mozilla and you don't have to download all these annoying add-ons too.


This thread is about Firefox, why are you *****ing about the speed of Mozilla? THey are COMPLETELY DIFFERENT programs. Firefox is a web browser, Mozilla is a whole suite of applications. Of course it takes longer to load. All of the add-ons to Firefox are optional, you don't need to get them if you find them annoying. With Internet Explorer, you need to do WindowsUpdate every week if you don't want to get infested with spyware.


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## chaoticow

Well I just downloaded it and I'll try it out. What do you guys think about its mate, Thunderbird - the alternative to Outlook Express?


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## Davey7549

GoJo
Which files are you specifically speaking of?
Firefox stores little in the way of of files unless specifically instructed to.
See Link for maintenance and usage of stored items if set. 
We were used to IE creating Temp Internet files in bunches of areas including hard to get rid of .dat file. Firefox uses a temp cache on the hard drive which is effectively deleted upon restart.
So what that means is all elements of websites are removed after every restart and refreshed in cache if site is accessed again.

Dave


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## hewee

GoJoAGoGo said:


> Does anyone has any information on this question?
> 
> Thanks





> Quote:
> Originally Posted by GoJoAGoGo
> When you delete files while using Mozilla Firefox, where do these files go? They don't end up in the Recycle Bin and I was wondering if they could be recovered if you should delete something in error.
> 
> Does anyone has any information on this question?


You would need something like Norton unerase if your talking about the cache files, cookies, history, bookmarks etc but if you have it setup to track all the cache files it will fill up norton protect really fast. 
On my PC norton protect does show files from netscape but not the cache. I have used unerase to recover cookies etc too. I alway make a folder and recover to it so I can check out the recover file first.


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## brendandonhu

I think hes talking about deleting files while using Firefox to browse yuor hard drive.


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## Davey7549

Brendan
Do you mean using the open file function in the file menu up top? If so my interface brings up recycle been when delete is selected.

Dave


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## KeithKman

Been using Firefox for a few weeks. I like it a lot more than IE.


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## mplacki

> You really don't know much about computers do you? The toolbars in the browser have nothing to do with Yahoo or Google. I'm not talking about the Yahoo! Companion or Google toolbar! I'm talking about the part of the browser where there is Back, Forward, Stop, Refresh, Home, and Go Button. That is the part of the browser that Mozilla Firefox copied Microsoft. I hope Microsoft sues them too, its very similar and should be a violation of copyright for sure.
> 
> The press releases for Mozilla are full of HYPE! I don't care what Forbes says or USA Today or any of them critics, they don't know crap and they aren't IT Professionals like I am.


IT Professional? I'm sorry to say this but you sound like a 12 year old.

The toolbars in Firefox were specifically designed to be similar to IE, so that former IE users feel more comfortable with the setup. Once you get used to them, you have the option to change them to any available theme you like (although I like the stock appearance just fine).

As far as IT Professionals knowing everything, perhaps it would interest you to know that the IT guys here at the University of Michigan have installed either Mozilla or Firefox on every single computer. That's more than 60,000 Windows, Linux, Sun, and Mac workstations and servers. Considering that there was no automated, centralized install at the time, don't you think maybe they had a good reason for going to all the effort? An IT Pro like you should be able to understand their choice and the reasons behind it, right?


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## GoJoAGoGo

I went to a ftp link to download some antivirus signatures from eTrust. Firefox displays the page in a HTML format and IE displays the page like a folder full of WinZip file icons. Check out this link with both IE and Firefox then you'll know what I'm talking about:
ftp://ftp.ca.com/pub/myeTrust/autodownload/sigs


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## oblivious69

Big-K said:


> Along these same lines, I was having a conversation with a programmer friend of mine who is into security and hacks for a company for a living. Basically the company pays him to try and defeat their new products. He laughed hysterically when I mentioned Firefox because he said it's a piece of cake to hack into because he has access to the source code. He predicted that they would eventually have to secure their source or they would be doomed for obvious reasons.


I think your friend just totally missed the point of open source then. Open source depends on everyone seeing the code to make it better. Its better to have 200 eyes looking at the code than 50 at MS. What do you think is better: MS coming up with a security algorithm that 50 people have ever seen, or a Firefox algorithm that absolutely anyone can see and try to break? The Firefox algorithm might have holes, but it will be exposed and fixed. But its far more likely that the MS code has big holes that only a few people have seen....till some idiot decides to spread a worm using it.

BTW, all the SSL algorithms on the browsers that people use to do shopping, logging onto bank sites, etc, are very well published and scrutinized algorithms. Security by obscurity is not a good solution for security.


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## Gibble

chaoticow said:


> Well I just downloaded it and I'll try it out. What do you guys think about its mate, Thunderbird - the alternative to Outlook Express?


I like it


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## dutch0101

plschwartz said:


> Version 1.o of Foxfire has been released and can be downloaded www.mozilla.com "foxfire preview release"
> It has a nice clean interface and seems to work well. Some security holes are said to have been fixed


The beginning gives birth to the end and the end gives birth to the beginning.
d.b.coffee


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## desuhu

Speaking of browsers, I've been having trouble with my IE lately. When I click on it, it doesn't want to connect and then I'll get that box asking if I want to send an error report to Microsoft. I have Wildblue as my ISP, so would this be an internet connection problem, or an IE problem? I ran my anti-virus and didn't find any infections. I also run my adaware and my spybot about every day or so.


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## brite750

desuhu said:


> Speaking of browsers, I've been having trouble with my IE lately. When I click on it, it doesn't want to connect and then I'll get that box asking if I want to send an error report to Microsoft. I have Wildblue as my ISP, so would this be an internet connection problem, or an IE problem? I ran my anti-virus and didn't find any infections. I also run my adaware and my spybot about every day or so.


actually i had that same problem, it seems to be a virus/trojan/hijacker etc. ran AVG, Adaware and SB search & destroy and it found some junk, it seems to be ok now.


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## desuhu

Actually, I wish it had been that simple for me! After running Norton, Adaware and Spybot, it still was running very sluggish and the sound was thready. So, I took it to the shop, and they told me my operating system was corrupt and had to take everything off and re-load everything. Of course, that wipes out all your email addresses, favorites and URL addresses. I hate it! He also told me that possibly some of my programs were incompatable with each other! I have a little problem with that one, I mean, give me a break, aren't you supposed to be able to download programs and use them? I guess if you use your computer, it's going to get corrupt, right?


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## brite750

desuhu said:


> Actually, I wish it had been that simple for me! After running Norton, Adaware and Spybot, it still was running very sluggish and the sound was thready. So, I took it to the shop, and they told me my operating system was corrupt and had to take everything off and re-load everything. Of course, that wipes out all your email addresses, favorites and URL addresses. I hate it! He also told me that possibly some of my programs were incompatable with each other! I have a little problem with that one, I mean, give me a break, aren't you supposed to be able to download programs and use them? I guess if you use your computer, it's going to get corrupt, right?


well you have to ask yourself how did the OS get corrupted, thats like saying he died because he stopped breathing, its likely the corruption was caused by a virus/hijacker etc., after all isnt that what they do? Make sure you back stuff up from now on, your favories and the like, because yeah thats a pain in the rearend.


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## ~Candy~

Shops always take the easy way out. Format c:, reinstall OS.


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## desuhu

The only problem is, I ran my Norton and it didn't find any viruses or worms. Can you be infected without Norton detecting it? If your anti-viral program can't detect or stop the viruses/worms, then there's not much you can do about these problems.


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## brite750

desuhu said:


> The only problem is, I ran my Norton and it didn't find any viruses or worms. Can you be infected without Norton detecting it? If your anti-viral program can't detect or stop the viruses/worms, then there's not much you can do about these problems.


you will find that no one AV program can find and detect all viri, Norton is not the best as many of us have found out the hard way. I have had less problems with free AVG than I did with Norton


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## ferrija1

Norton's anti-virus engine is fine, it's just a bloated app.


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## lotuseclat79

In case any of you do not yet know - Firefox is now at release 2.0.0.11.

-- Tom


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## ferrija1

Yeah, this is a 3 year old thread.


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## j-mcallister

i'm using the beta software atm. i like it seems like it'll very gd


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