# common sense: stop using Internet Explorer



## codecfears (Aug 30, 2004)

CERT.org warns all to cease using Internet Explorer. Many large security firms insist on the same.

I'll lend you (all) some extra common sense:

http://switch2firefox.com
http://getfirefox.com

Mozilla Firefox is a community authored, open source project. Yes, that means you get free stuff. Sure, Internet Explorer is free too, though more in the sense of 'free headache'.

Currently Firefox 0.9.3 is a little under a six meg download, and it can import ALL your IE settings, preferences, favorites, cookies, formdata, etc. Why wouldn't you switch? There really isn't a good reason not to.

Put an end to spyware-, adware-, and malware being surreptitiously installed. Say goodbye to popups YOU don't authorize. Embrace the power of tabbed browsing

just look at all the awesome extensions* you could be using right now:

http://www.extensionsmirror.nl/index.php?showtopic=284 (old list)

http://www.extensionsmirror.nl/index.php?showforum=2 (alphabetical: new)

* little widgets that either modify existing features or add new features.


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## Katzy (Nov 9, 2003)

I couldn't agree more.

Except that I prefer "Opera", or, if I want speed, "K-Meleon".


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## aarhus2004 (Jan 10, 2004)

I couldn't agree less. But I would be in total agreement with this:

Internet Explorer isn't the only option as far as browsers are concerned. By all means explore the alternatives. Avoid the rhetoric which would have you believe one browser is vastly superior to another; rather make your decision based on your own experience and exploration of all which is on offer. The decision is, after all, yours. If, as many of us do, you need some help in how to make a decision surely it makes sense, when so many opinions are to be had, to bear in mind a very simple thought - how did I come to this point of wondering if I should change my browser.


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## Ol Sarge (Jul 21, 2002)

I've always used IE, and it's never given me any grief. I've taken a look at several of the others just for familiarization, and have found all to be lacking in one area or another and rejected all. Thanks for the info, but I'll stick with what works best for me.


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## Deke40 (Jun 27, 2002)

July 2004

Microsoft: 81.19

Other browsers: 18.81

Who do you think the hackjackers, virus and trojan perpetrators are going to direct their resources at. Not the 18.81% but the 81.9%. IE has lost almost 10% of their users since December. You can bet as this number goes down the efforts of the same people that are attacking IE will start will be directed more towards other browsers.


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## I Fix 4 U (Jul 19, 2004)

firefox is the best thing brought to the web.


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## christie37 (Sep 5, 2004)

I've always like netscape as my browser but have to use internet explorer for online game sites like pogo.com..I wished I could use another browser for my games do you know of any that are compatible for games online like that? Only problem I've had with internet explorer of late is when I upgraded to ie 6 now it wont let me click on links so guess I will have to go back to ie 5..New here to this forum so hope I put this in right one..thanks


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## Guyzer (Jul 3, 2004)

Firefox works fine in Pogo. A surprise I just discovered is that since I started using Firefox ( about 2 weeks ago ) I haven't seen any spyware issues uncovered when I run Spybot and AdAware. They keep telling me my sys. is clean. Use to get piles using IE. Anyone else experience this?


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## MightyQueenC (Jul 7, 2004)

Wimpy369 said:


> Firefox works fine in Pogo. A surprise I just discovered is that since I started using Firefox ( about 2 weeks ago ) I haven't seen any spyware issues uncovered when I run Spybot and AdAware. They keep telling me my sys. is clean. Use to get piles using IE. Anyone else experience this?


Same here, Wimpy...for 3 weeks, now.
Glad you posted this tho...I was beginning to think adaware and spybot were not doing their jobs! LOL

Carolyn


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## brendandonhu (Jul 8, 2002)

Deke said:


> You can bet as this number goes down the efforts of the same people that are attacking IE will start will be directed more towards other browsers.


Sorry Deke, but the evidence just doesn't support that argument. Look at webservers, for example. Apache is by far the most popular one. However, all the script kiddies and virus writers go after Microsoft IIS, even though Apache is much more popular.


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## GoJoAGoGo (Dec 26, 2002)

aarhus2004 said:


> I couldn't agree less. But I would be in total agreement with this:
> 
> Internet Explorer isn't the only option as far as browsers are concerned. By all means explore the alternatives. Avoid the rhetoric which would have you believe one browser is vastly superior to another; rather make your decision based on your own experience and exploration of all which is on offer. The decision is, after all, yours. If, as many of us do, you need some help in how to make a decision surely it makes sense, when so many opinions are to be had, to bear in mind a very simple thought - how did I come to this point of wondering if I should change my browser.


Ben:

Based on your nightmare experience of removing IE6 and then trying several times to reinstall IE6 again and again with nothing but failures, I could see where you came to this point of wondering if you should change your browser.

It's not just the security holes that make IE inferior, but it's situations like you had of Microsoft glitches that have me using Mozilla Firebird as my default browser and only using IE when certain websites only support IE.


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## I Fix 4 U (Jul 19, 2004)

GoJoAGoGo said:


> have me using Mozilla Firebird as my default browser and only using IE when certain websites only support IE.


note1- if you are using firebird than you are outdated, the new project name is firefox so please download it.

note2- Firefox can handle IE websites, also some source code may be added to allow it to be fully functional. sometimes though, it may be able to use the site, but the people that run the site have a special contract with microsoft that will disallow other browsers to use it by using code.

Another browser (linux browser) called konqeurer has a "seem as browser option" and u can select from various browsers and their versions. That is an open source browser, along with firefox, eventually you can bet someday they will add the feature to firefox if there is enough demand.

The joy of opensource.


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## GoJoAGoGo (Dec 26, 2002)

iXneonXi said:


> note1- if you are using firebird than you are outdated, the new project name is firefox so please download it.
> 
> note2- Firefox can handle IE websites, also some source code may be added to allow it to be fully functional. sometimes though, it may be able to use the site, but the people that run the site have a special contract with microsoft that will disallow other browsers to use it by using code.


Yeah, I have Firebird 0.7 and enjoy it. I'm aware of Firefox 0.9.3 and I'm waiting for Mozilla to finish their Beta releases and iron out the bugs before I use Firefox. My understanding they were suppose to release the non Beta version Firefox 1.0 last month but that didn't happen. So I'll just hang in there for now and continue with Firebird 0.7.


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## brendandonhu (Jul 8, 2002)

iXneonXi said:


> but the people that run the site have a special contract with microsoft that will disallow other browsers to use it by using code.


I'm sorry but thats a total conspiracy theory. As much as I hate Microsoft, they aren't giving webmasters kickbacks to make their websites IE-only.


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## Big-K (Nov 22, 2003)

I just dont see why web designers go through the trouble to make certain websites IE only. All it does is decrease traffic.


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## I Fix 4 U (Jul 19, 2004)

its a contract, ms prolly /pays/ them. also, site by microsoft, eg msn only work for IE because thats how microsoft makes them. 
I recommend to every web designer this, "People please, just follow the W3C standard and do us all a favor."


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## brendandonhu (Jul 8, 2002)

Geez with the conspiracy theories, xeneon. View Source on an IE-only site and see what it is that makes it IE-only. 99.9% of the time its because the designer is lazy and used proprietary html tags or javascript instead of doing things the proper way. You can't post that MS is paying webmasters to break the competition without posting some proof to back up the claim.


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## I Fix 4 U (Jul 19, 2004)

find, i'll look over website source and use my w3c validator and my html book next weekend. didnt mean to start a fuss.


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## brendandonhu (Jul 8, 2002)

No fuss, I'm just wondering who told you that MS is paying people to make their sites IE only


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## I Fix 4 U (Jul 19, 2004)

on w3c there is a validator that will check for w3c compliance, it will note if there are invalid netscape, opera, or IE tags or code. If one site has an overly amount of IE tags you can tell somethings up. Wouldn't you rather *not* restrict your site, i mean cmon then more people can go there. Who would do that, only if they had a good reason ($$)


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## brendandonhu (Jul 8, 2002)

IE-only tags are the easy way out for the webmaster. ex. its much easier to write than to use a proper script for scrolling text. Also, many people use FrontPage and similar programs to generate their web pages, and those programs do not produce proper code. You still haven't shown any proof that MS pays people to make badly written web pages.


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## I Fix 4 U (Jul 19, 2004)

i also asked for you to wait till next week b/c i'm not gonna this weekend.


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## EasyNow1 (Jul 22, 2004)

i am using i/e 6.0, how do i safely switch over firefox and then back to i/e if needed?

does anyone have goof proof directions - thanks


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## EasyNow1 (Jul 22, 2004)

or maybe i will stay with i/e since i know it goes everywhere and firefox can t, umn??

never had any problems with i / e - c ya


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## GoJoAGoGo (Dec 26, 2002)

EasyNow1 said:


> i am using i/e 6.0, how do i safely switch over firefox and then back to i/e if needed?
> 
> does anyone have goof proof directions - thanks


You can safely have more than one browser in your system the same time and can actually use both of them at the same time. I use Mozilla Firebird as my default browser and only use IE when certain websites only support IE.

So just go ahead and download and install Firefox and you should not have any problems using both IE and Firefox at will.

Hope that helps...


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## Tranquility (Sep 5, 2004)

iXneonXi said:


> its a contract, ms prolly /pays/ them. also, site by microsoft, eg msn only work for IE because thats how microsoft makes them.
> I recommend to every web designer this, "People please, just follow the W3C standard and do us all a favor."


Well the MSN.com website is working perfectly in Opera.


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## I Fix 4 U (Jul 19, 2004)

in netscape mozilla and firefox (almost the same browser) when i go to zone it says best viewd with IE6 and then it doesnt work. zone.com wont work so then i have 2 use IE


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## Tranquility (Sep 5, 2004)

Most IE only websites do work with Opera. To get around the annoying warnings you can make Opera identify as IE6. For example, the MSDN subscriber downloads section said to use IE to browse the website, if you just make Opera identify as IE you don't get the warning.


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## Big-K (Nov 22, 2003)

I use firefox on my personal comp, this one though(family) uses IE. The firefox one went to msn fine when I tried, although it looked different(for example, it didnt have the flashing article, a good thing actually).


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## Maritimesea (Sep 9, 2004)

I just started using Firefox past couple of weeks and I must say I like it better than the version I tried out a year or so ago. I applied the "Pinball" theme and it's now one sharp looking little browser. Plus I used IE Eradicator and my system is now vastly faster than it was before. Also like Big-K alluded to you can load firefox up with stuff like Flash plugins and such, or not. I had Opera a couple years ago, and considered getting it before I went with firefox but forty bucks for a browser?What's up with that?

A microsoft conspiracy to make the majority of websites IE exclusive in terms of compatibility by paying webmasters. Sounds like that might be too petty for Bill. But a general business strategy that promotes the widespread proliferation of IE and windows OS is just good business sense in my opinion. Don't hate the player, hate the game. If all the truly intelligent people out there applied their intelligence to improving Linux so that it could compete with windows in terms of ease of usability instead of attacking microsofts' products with these complicated pieces of malicous code we wouldn't have to complain so much about microsofts' monopoly cause there wouldn't be one. But, as long as people just complain and malign windows without putting out a viable alternative I remain unconvinced as to their true motivations.


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## Big-K (Nov 22, 2003)

MSN.com on Mozilla Firefox


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## Big-K (Nov 22, 2003)

I havnt used good ol adblocker on it yet though, then again I never use msn either. That was just for proving a point.

Zone looks fine too, although i didnt play anything.


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## GoJoAGoGo (Dec 26, 2002)

Staying with the Mozilla vs IE with using msn.com, I noticed the biggest difference is with MSN/Hotmail accounts. Mozilla provides you with a lot less email tools for writing a message than IE does. I'll post the IE Hotmail jpg here and the Mozilla Hotmail jpg in the next post.


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## GoJoAGoGo (Dec 26, 2002)

Here's Mozilla and you'll notice a lot of the email tools aren't available. :down:


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## Big-K (Nov 22, 2003)

Didnt notice that one, then again it doesnt really matter for me, I dont format emails(I think its pointless).

It could also be the fact that your using firebird not firefox


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## I Fix 4 U (Jul 19, 2004)

yah firebird is old version of firefox. i'm about to apply the pinball theme b/c it looked rad. ps i'll look into the conspiracy but i now have a feeling its just b/c ie tags bring ease of use but lack of w3c compatability. if thats the case just send petitions to mozilla developers to add ie tag support.


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## Big-K (Nov 22, 2003)

They probably wouldnt do it, if they're proprietry tags then it would be illegal, would it not?


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## I Fix 4 U (Jul 19, 2004)

i think it would be a laughing matter for the supreme court... this is gpl software we are dealing with. all they would have to do is say courtesy of microsoft internet explorer inside the source. besides ive seen many gpl programs use proprietary code.


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## brendandonhu (Jul 8, 2002)

GoJoAGoGo - those pictures don't compare what IE provides vs. what Mozilla provides. Thats simply what MSN provides on their website. They chose not to make it Mozilla compatible.

And no, there is no law that says you can't use proprietary HTML tags. Mozilla however would have no interest in copying IE-only tags. Mozilla/Firefox are supposed to be standards compliant browsers.

iXneonXi - Have you even read the GPL or Internet Explorer's license? Even if we had code for IE (which we don't) it would break both licenses to use IE code in a GPL project.


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## I Fix 4 U (Jul 19, 2004)

lol i read the preamble.the things like 3 pages long... i never read ie's license. 
but don't many gpl programs use other programs code... i think that captive ntfs uses windows drivers and i know wine uses parts of windows components. does that make them illegal?

so theres no law, but its against the licenses...

you really studied this matter didnt u


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## Big-K (Nov 22, 2003)

alright alright...


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## jillian2 (Sep 11, 2004)

I do have another browser beside IE. It is MSN 9. I like it and want to keep it, but would like to have another that is not Microsoft. I have tried Netscape, Firefox , Mozilla, and Opera. I just did not like any of these. So what is left for me ?

Jillian


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## brendandonhu (Jul 8, 2002)

iXneonXi said:


> lol i read the preamble.the things like 3 pages long... i never read ie's license.
> but don't many gpl programs use other programs code... i think that captive ntfs uses windows drivers and i know wine uses parts of windows components. does that make them illegal?
> 
> so theres no law, but its against the licenses...
> ...


Contract Law applies to licenses. There have been lawsuits about Linux's use of NTFS already. WINE does not use any Windows source code or components, its just a compatibility layer.


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## I Fix 4 U (Jul 19, 2004)

well i hope linux's side and gnu win instead of MS.


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## brendandonhu (Jul 8, 2002)

I am pretty sure Microsoft has retracted the threats they made about that 
I did a quick search and didn't find any outstanding anywas.


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## Big-K (Nov 22, 2003)

jillian2 said:


> I do have another browser beside IE. It is MSN 9. I like it and want to keep it, but would like to have another that is not Microsoft. I have tried Netscape, Firefox , Mozilla, and Opera. I just did not like any of these. So what is left for me ?
> 
> Jillian


www.avantbrowser.com/


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## jillian2 (Sep 11, 2004)

Thanks Big-K I will try it. I think I did quite a while back. Seems like I uninstalled it because it looked too much like IE. Can't remember it's been so long ago. I will try it and see.

thank you,
Jillian


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## Yankee Rose (Jul 14, 1999)

This is quite an interesting thread. Lots of people willing to try new things (browsers) and with lots of luck. Lots of useful information in this thread, too, for those searching for something better. 

I've noticed the trend in bashing Microsoft's IE, too, here at TSG as well as other sites. Yet many of these detractors STILL use Windows. 

I suppose what makes me scratch my head is why so many of these people are unwilling to try other operating systems as well. Obviously, they tried new browsers and realized how inferior IE is. I'm wondering when they'll try OS X or Linux and realize the same thing -- how inferior Microsoft is. I do realize that it isn't quite as easy to try a new OS (from a financial aspect, at least where X is concerned). But rarely have I found a user who has tried another OS and not liked it. 

This is just a thought that occurred to me as I was reading this thread. I certainly don't want to stir up a heated debate or anything.  BTW - I use Safari.


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## brendandonhu (Jul 8, 2002)

Agreed - I'm posting this using Konqueror on Linux right now.


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