# RAID 1 SET UP WITH SSD AND 2 X SATA HD's



## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

Hi all

I am going to buy a new desktop barebones and want the new Win 8.1 OS to install on an SSD 120GB so that I get faster boot-ups. Together with the SSD I want to include two SATA 3 HD's connected in RAID 1

1] Just not sure *how* or* if* RAID 1 will actually work with three drives as above. Will all three drives work together, for RAID 1, or would I have to ditch the SSD and only have two SATA 3 HD's ?

2] I have experienced two HD corruptions already and one Windows OS corruption on two previous PC's. I am looking for long term drive and data and OS stability Will a new RAID 1 set up cause my data and OS to perform with greater stability as I tend to hang on to PC's and HD's for a long time before upgrading?

thanks


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## Noyb (May 25, 2005)

Why not just use a Raid JBOD configuration ???
I haven't added a SSD to my W7 JBOD stack yet


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

Have not got a clue what JBOD is and RAID 1 seems complicated enough for someone who hasn't used it before.

I will stick with RAID 1 answers for now - but thanks for the idea at least


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## Noyb (May 25, 2005)

JBOD = (*J*ust a *B*unch *O*f *D*iscs) .. Click on the link above.
Raid 1 is a lot more complicated .. error prone


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## lunarlander (Sep 22, 2007)

From what I've read RAID 1 means 2 Hard drives set to mirror. Don't think you can fit the SSD into the picture.


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

lunarlander said:


> From what I've read RAID 1 means 2 Hard drives set to mirror. Don't think you can fit the SSD into the picture.


You may be right - they have to be a similar memory size also, I'm told. May have to leave the SSD out of the equation.


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

Noyb said:


> JBOD = (*J*ust a *B*unch *O*f *D*iscs) .. Click on the link above.
> Raid 1 is a lot more complicated .. error prone


I have read your link but only partly the wiser

How is JBOD simpler and less error prone and would I be able to work in all three drives with it?

Is JBOD like backup memory or more like RAID 1 ( a mechanical mirrored drive)?


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## Noyb (May 25, 2005)

speedyzap said:


> How is JBOD simpler and less error prone and would I be able to work in all three drives with it?


All the JBOD HDDs are independent of each other and do not necessarily have to be in the computer.
They are not RAID dependent on each other .. *I'm in control*

I do NOT like W7 and hate W8 .... My XP computer has a SSD ....
I can boot from the system in any internal HDD.
The external is an enclosure, I can physically relocate the HDD if I want.

Basically, the X,Y, & Z partitons are duplicates of each other ...
But the X partition may have newer Stuff in it (temporarily) .. 
And is used for scratch disc purposes in programs like Photoshop.

The backup operating systems in the HDDs have some differences .. I do not want them "Mirrored"


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

So how do I set up JBOD on my desktop?


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## Noyb (May 25, 2005)

Just links (Shortcuts) to the other Drives (HDDs) ....
They're not much different than a folder.
See them on the left of my attachment above ... X, Y & Z


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## crjdriver (Jan 2, 2001)

To answer your question, yes you can setup raid and not have the ssd as part of the raid array.

Next raid of any type is NOT a backup plan. Some types of raid ie raid 1, 5, 01 are hard drive redundant; other types ie raid0 is not even hard drive redundant. There is no protection from accidental file deletion, virus/malware, etc. Every error is mirrored.

If you really really must have raid, then purchase a real raid controller and not the onboard raid. With onboard raid, what happens when your mb fails and that board is no longer available??? Your raid array [and data files] are most likely gone. Sometimes if the new mb is of the same chipset family, you can usually access the raid array. Different chipset and no guarantees at all. With a real raid controller, no problem. Install a new board, install windows and the driver for your raid controller, connect drives and done.

There is a reason why a quality raid controller costs hundreds of $ and the mb controller is included with your board; performance and reliability.


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

Never thought about the MB failing - another thing to worry about. I though every HD with OS is tuned only to the original MB?

I note there is a product called Macrium Reflect - would this software be an alternative? (you can get it free download).

How does this compare to JBOD and RAID controller?

Would JBOD or Macrium handle a failed MB?

What does a RAID controller cost?


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## crjdriver (Jan 2, 2001)

IMO a MUCH better way to backup is to use imaging software. Yes, macrium would be ok, acronis true image would be better. Make at least 1 image per week and store these on a second or third hd. Keep at least 2~3images deleting the older ones.

I only used macrium a few times so I cannot tell you how well it works with bare metal restore. I can tell you acronis will restore to bare metal ie new drive. 


> What does a RAID controller cost?


You can get a cheap one for $100 or so and quality ones with their own processor and memory can cost $4~500.


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## crjdriver (Jan 2, 2001)

One other thing. No backup is worth anything until you validate your ability to restore the backup. I see many many threads were someone "made a backup" now cannot restore or is having problems restoring the backup. It should be easy and only a few min to do a restore. Yesterday I did a restore on my linux server; took all of 5min to boot with the acronis boot disk and restore. Done.


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

which is the better backup software macrium or acronis to use over the next couple of years?

Could I still copy my SATA 3 HD and SSD (with OS for faster bootup) with either acronis or macrium - in other words would both the SSD and HD copy on request simultaneously and incrementally?


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## Noyb (May 25, 2005)

Depends on how you use them.
To get the all the features of Acronis .. You have to pay extra for Macrium .. So the cost may be about the same.
Support may be the deciding factor, But I've never used Macrium ??
Personally, I do not do any scheduling or even have Acronis installed and could use the free Macrium ...
But I'm using an older Acronis


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

Noyb said:


> Depends on how you use them.
> To get the all the features of Acronis .. You have to pay extra for Macrium.
> Personally, I do not do any scheduling and could use the free Macrium
> But I'm using an older Acronis


either one woud do by the sound of it

thanks Noyb


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## crjdriver (Jan 2, 2001)

Noyb said:


> Depends on how you use them.
> To get the all the features of Acronis .. You have to pay extra for Macrium .. So the cost may be about the same.
> Support may be the deciding factor, But I've never used Macrium ??
> Personally, I do not do any scheduling or even have Acronis installed and could use the free Macrium ...
> But I'm using an older Acronis


I do the same thing; boot with an acronis boot disk to do all imaging, restoring, cloning, etc. I do not like all of the bloat that the new versions install on your system.


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## Noyb (May 25, 2005)

How many gigs of personal data do you think you might acquire in a few years ???
And where is this data stored _(in your operating system)_ ???
This may determine how you want to configure your system and your Imaging procedures


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

Noyb said:


> How many gigs of personal data do you think you might acquire in a few years ???
> And where is this data stored _(in your operating system)_ ???
> This may determine how you want to configure your system and your Imaging procedures


Most likely in the OS for me because its easier, so no doubt a good imaging software.

If I get Macrium - should I ditch the SSD as the OS boot up disc and just stay with the normal sata3 HD for the OS? Will that make it simpler than an SSD and a HD?


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## prunejuice (Apr 3, 2002)

With Acronis you can restore individual files and folders, as well as entire partitions and drive images.
Something to consider.


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## Noyb (May 25, 2005)

If my Data was in my OS at about 700gig ... There's no way I'd attempt to Image my OS ... Or install a SSD

It's also a whole lot easier to Save or Restore Files/Folders using Copy n Paste _(or Drag n Drop)_ ...
Than fire up Acronis and work with a huge compressed backup Image.

I just replaced one of these HDDs in about an hour by Cloning it.
I'd hate to think how long it would take by recovering from a Backup Image.
The only partition I Image is my small OS

*How many gigs of personal data do you think you might acquire in a few years ???*


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

Noyb said:


> If my Data was in my OS at about 700gig ... There's no way I'd attempt to Image my OS ... Or install a SSD [/B]


Why not, you must have good reasons?


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

prunejuice said:


> With Acronis you can restore individual files and folders, as well as entire partitions and drive images.
> Something to consider.


Have you tried Macrium because it got good rating from this site: http://download.cnet.com/Macrium-Reflect/3000-2242_4-10604924.html


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## crjdriver (Jan 2, 2001)

Macrium is ok for basic stuff. I used it a while ago and it would not clone drives nor would it restore to a raid array [later versions may do this] Basic image/restore is ok. If you want to do more than just create an image and restore to the same drive, then you need acronis. If the above is all you need, then macrium would be ok.

Remember NO backup is worth anything until you validate your ability to actually restore the backup.


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## Noyb (May 25, 2005)

speedyzap said:


> Why not, you must have good reasons?


An image file size would be about 60-70% of the partition(s) occupied space .....
Imaging would be a waste to just backup Data when Copy n Paste would be a lot faster, more efficient and the data can be retrieved without Macrium or Acronis.

IMHO ... Imagining is only good for backing up and restoring a *functional operating system*.
The smaller the OS is .. The better.
I can restore my _(small)_ OS in less time than you can read one recovery DVD ...
If my data was in my OS .. It would take many hours to backup or recover to/from an Image.


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## Noyb (May 25, 2005)

crjdriver said:


> Remember NO backup is worth anything until you validate your ability to actually restore the backup.


And here's another reason to have JBOD .. _(If you have a lot of Data stored)_
I almost never backup a working OS ... (in Disc 0) .. You never know what it's collected or how corrupted it's got.

The system in Disc 1 is my last Fresh Install, mostly updated _(as of about a year ago)_
My last system Image backup is my last fresh install, updated in Disc 1 - Updated when I last recovered disc 0.
When I need to recover .. *I physically swap drives 0<>1*... update the system in the new Disc 0 ... 
then when I'm sure my new system does not have a problem ... I make a Backup Image of it .. And recover Disc 1.

So .. The system in Disc 1 is a Fresh Install, mostly updated ..* Is validated from my backup Image and ready for the next time.*
My data partitions are twins (or Triplicates) of each other .. By the system partitions are _(or may be)_ different
Nothing tunes up system or fixes what may ail it better than a fresh install of the system.
I can do all this in only a few minutes and never touch my data.

And it's all *crjdrivers* fault ... He's the one who told about Acronis a few years ago


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## crjdriver (Jan 2, 2001)

Yes, acronis has a LOT of uses. When I do a build for someone [or even me] I will make an image of the system drive after windows is activated and all drivers are installed. This image is saved as "Clean install" [I know very original]

If at some point a clean install is needed or desired, it takes all of 5min to boot with the acronis boot disk/flash and restore the image. Clean install with drivers and activation done. Subsequent images are saved with the date as the file name. This makes it easy to find the latest image.


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

Sounds like acronis is the way to go

Some knocked acronis because they clamed it could NOT make a boot disc - but it appears they either had an older version or they were wrong

acronis is free for 1 month I think - how much does it cost after 1 month?

Is the paid for version the same or better than the free trial?


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## Noyb (May 25, 2005)

If you use Western Digital HDDs .. It's Free
The Trial Version does not have all the features .. Might as well Buy It @ $49


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

I will have WD black HD's on my new desktop in next 3-4 weeks, but my existing old IDE HD on Win XP is Seagate. Will acronis do the old IDE Seagate?


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## speedyzap (Feb 26, 2006)

I guess the best way to verify that an acronis or macrium clone is actually error free (100% working duplicate) is to boot up on the clone copy once in every while - would that be right?

If so, that would mean changing the boot order in BIOS would it not (if both HD's were internal - inside the case)?

I suppose one could take out the original drive and install the clone in its place, also to test?


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