# Installing HD - what do I save?



## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Installing HD - what's needed besides start-up before I put the new (more space) in and take out the old.


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## brushmaster1 (Jun 15, 2002)

Why take out the old drive? Just ADD the new drive for even MORE space....


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## AbvAvgUser (Oct 3, 2002)

What do you want to know Rusti? Your question is not clear. Please clarify.


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

I don't know that much about how things hook up..I can replace something and hook it back up the way the old one was. If I put in my new HD in addition, I don't know how to hook up the ribbons. The slave and master thing I guess?
My original question was..(if I am going to replace HD) what do I need to start up a new HD? I know you have to have a start-up disk but is there anything else I would need to get going with a new hard disk? Thanks, Rusti


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

To set up another HD *in addition to* the first one:

Simply plug it into a available slot and set one to master and one to slave. Format the second (new) HD. The new drive should have come with full instructions. If it didn't simply visit their web site. It's really very easy. The hardest part will be to find a place to _physically_ mount the second drive.

To *replace* the original HD with another:

We're assuming it's the same style of HD (SCSI, EIDE, SATA, ETC.) simply plug it into the same plug, set it to master, and format it. Again, it should have come with instructions for this.

Hope this helps. If you provide us with the drive make/model we can direct you to the proper web site for install instructions


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## AbvAvgUser (Oct 3, 2002)

I think it will be easier if you get a tech support guy to do it. It is not very easy thing to do if you have not done it earlier or haven't even seen it someone do it.

It is better to spend a bit rather than take rish with something as delicate as hard disk. Forget about the money, I wouldn't touch it if I didn't know it. Loads of data is at stake.


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## raybro (Apr 27, 2003)

If the old drive is still functioning OK, you have a lot of options. If it's not then your options are severely limited.

On the assumption your old drive is still functional and all you need is more space, you may want to consider installing your new drive temporarily as primary slave ad using the utility software which comes with new drives to simply copy your old drive to your new one. Then you can make the new drive master and the old one slave and use the old one for backups or storage of whatever you want.

Let us know what the situation is and someone will give you instructions on how to get to where you want to go.

If your old drive is not functional, then you are pretty much limited to creating a new partition, formatting and doing a clean install of Windows.

As far as a boot disk is concerned... I recommend This site. Download the file to your desktop, insert a formatted floppy into your floppy drive and double click the downloaded file. This will create a boot floppy for you.


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

...oh almost forgot...

Once you get the new drive running you'll want to partition it so that you don't waste any space from the new drive. The easiest and best way to do this is with a program called Partition Commander. You can find them HERE. It is much better than Partition Magic and now it even includes a free copy of _System Commander_ (for using more than one operating system on your computer at one time) and _Copy Commander_ (for transferring all the contents from one drive to another, automatically). I've used them all and this is by far the best Partitioning software out there so far. Enjoy


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Thanks all of you that replied, I am really impressed. I admit I didn't read ALL the instructions..it doesn't make sense to replace since my old one is fine, I just need more space. I got a Maxtor 160GB ATA/EIDE. If I can't physically install the HD then I will take it to a tech person - but all the screws, ribbon, & installation software came with it, so I want to try first. I am a grandma on a limited budget, just trying to keep up with the young'uns. I enjoy taking things apart and fixing them myself if I can. Thanks for the web sites, I appreciate the help. I will give all of your suggestions a try. Rusti 
Rusti.


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

Hey what a coincidence, I bought a 160 Gig hard drive last night too  You can see it HERE. It had the fastest access time (_it retrieves your files faster_) and it was at a great price so I couldn't resist.

I for one am very impressed by the way that you are willing to tackle installing your own hard drive yourself. If you let someone else do it then you will never learn, and besides, it really is very easy to do 

I'll see if I can dig up some install info for you from Maxtors site.


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

Here ya go.

Clickity-Click


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

I would recommend installing the new HD as a second drive. It's easier and faster than installing it as a replacement. IF you install as a replacement you pretty much have to start from scratch and re-install everything starting with windows. Getting all the drivers in can be a little tricky and VERY time consuming.

As was said earlier, the hardest part of installing it as a second drive may be finding the place to put it.

When you open your computer make sure everything is unplugged from the power line then touch the metal frame to discharge any static electricity. You will see several flat gray ribbon cables. Most likely 3 of them. One for the floppy drive. One for your existing hard drive and one for your CD-Rom and/or burner.

You will see that the gray ribbon cables have two connectors at the device end. The connectors are generally color coded. Blue is the motherboard (main circuit board) end. The other end is Black and this is your Primary or Master connection. About 6" back is a Gray connector that is for the Secondary or Slave connection.

Find your current hard drive.
Check to see if the second (Gray) connector is unused.
Find a place to mount the new HD that is close enough to the original that the Gray connector that is 6" back will reach. (hardest part)

Before mounting the new HD move the little plastic jumper block to the pins for the slave position. Check the top of the drive and/or your documentation to determine which pins to jumper for the slave setting.

Mount the drive with the screws provided. If you can't get all 4 screws to line up, using one on each side is fine. Make sure the screws are tight but not overly tight. When running the HD will have a little vibration and loose screws will become much looser over time and may completely fall out.

There is no "right side up" as far as the HD is concerned. The only concern would be to keep the circuit board side from getting too close to any other metal. 

Attach the Gray connector from the existing ribbon cable. The RED stripe indicates pin 1 and is closest to the power connection. The connectors are "keyed" and should only go in one way.

Next attach the power from a spare power pigtail.

Double check all connections. Also check all the existing connections to see that none were accidentally knocked off during the install process. 

Put the cover back on the PC, reconnect anything that was disconnected and power up.

Check back and we will take you thru the next step of formatting the drive and getting it ready to use.


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Wow folks, thanks for all the technical info and suggestions. I will print it all out and start on my project tomorrow. I have three places the HD can go..(I also have a Zip drive) On top of the old one which would be a pretty close fit, or way up on top of my cd/burner (then I don't know if the ribbons would be long enough), or under the current HD, (but then I would have to go buy another metal box to put it in). I hate decisions.
What do y'all think?


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

> _Originally posted by NiteHawk:_
> *I would recommend installing the new HD as a second drive *


I kind of disagree on this one. Since the new drive probably has better specs, I would make the new drive the master and the old drive as the slave


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Holy cow..I guess I better read ~all~ the instructions and check out the websites that you'all suggested. I don't know if the slave/master thing has to do with the ribbon hook-up or something you do with software applications after?
Rusti


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

PS - How critical is (when installing) "keeping the circuit board side from getting too close to any other metal" Like less than 
a 1/4? That's where my choice location would be. rk


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

> _Originally posted by Rusti:_
> *PS - How critical is (when installing) "keeping the circuit board side from getting too close to any other metal" Like less than a 1/4? *


The main hard drive is usually set as the master, and the second drive would become the slave. You set it with little "jumpers" provided by the hard drive company, or by setting a switch. Check the instructions and it will clearly show you how to set them. The master hard drive would also have the operating system on it also. The only reason why you don't want the circuit board touching anything else is because if it does touch something else then it would short out and ruin it. 1/4 inch should be fine.


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Thank you Wet Chicken..I sure hope I can get stuff in the right place, and can write back regarding progress and probably a few more problems or questions, without having to go use a friends pc to do it. rk Thanks again..


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Wet Chicken:_
> *I kind of disagree on this one. Since the new drive probably has better specs, I would make the new drive the master and the old drive as the slave  *


Normally, for the more experienced user, I would agree with placing the new HD as the first (Master) drive and re-installing windows, all device drivers, and all programs from scratch. However, based on Rusti's comments, I was trying to keep it as low risk, simple, and straight forward as possible.


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

Actually, come to think of it, I think her old hard drive might have better specs


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## AbvAvgUser (Oct 3, 2002)

Keep in mind one thing. If you install both the drives together, your drive assignments will change.

I assume you have partitioned the old hard disk into 3 C, D and F and you will keep it as master. After installing the new hard disk as slave following will be your drive assignments.

C in old Hard Disk = New *C:*
D in old Hard Disk = New *E:*
E in old Hard Disk = New *F:*

Primary partition in New Drive = New *D:*
Other partitions in New Drive = New *G:, F:, etc *

That way you *may* even need to re-install softwares. It depends on where they are currently installed. Go ahead and do it yourself, but keep all things in mind and be prepared. My purpose is not to frighten you, but to make you aware of likely scenario.

All the best.


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

> _Originally posted by AbvAvgUser:_
> *C in old Hard Disk = New C:
> D in old Hard Disk = New E:
> E in old Hard Disk = New F:
> *


Don't worry Rusti, Partition Commander will do all of this for you automatically (if you need to). Some other things that I forgot to mention:



* Do not open the ESD bag containing the drive until needed.

* Handle the drive carefully by the edges. Do not touch the exposed printed circuit board or any electronic components.

* Do not press on the top or bottom of the drive.

* Do not cover the drive breather hole.

* Before handling the drive, *discharge any static electricity from yourself and your clothing*. With one hand touch an unpainted metal surface on your computer chassis, then touch the ESD bag with the other hand. Remain in contact with the chassis and the bag for a minimum of two seconds.

* With a 160GB hard drive, you may encounter a BIOS limitation of 137GB. Possible solutions for the 137GB limitation include operating system patches, 3rd party hardware (_ I think Partition Commander will help you with this. I'll let you know for sure in a few days when I install my 160 Gig HD with Partition Commander_ ) or a BIOS upgrade.


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

Again, following the KISS approach, if you install the new HD as a slave, and then create one extended partition and 2 *logical* 80gig slices you avoid all of the above problems in the last two posts with drive lettering and reinstalling.

I'm no stranger to multiple drives and multiple partitions, (I'm running two drives and 9 partitions). I just worked a thread of over 650 posts spanning several weeks where the user set up multipal partitions and re-installed everything from scratch, but again, I'm just trying to keep this simple and straight forward. (Which _I think_ is what Rusti wants)


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

> _Originally posted by NiteHawk:_
> *following the KISS approach*


I always thought that KISS stood for *K*eep *I*t *S*ophisticated *S*illy


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

*K*eep *I*t *S*hort & *S*imple
or the more direct...
*K*eep *I*t *S*hort *S*tupid


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

Actually I already knew that and I was just play'in with ya'


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Hi everybody..Got kinda tied up today, so tomorrow I will get going with installing new HD as slave..and just leave the old one as is being it has no problems. I am not familiar with slices and partitioning, so will let the commander help me out as you suggested. Currently my drives are as follows: A-floppy, C-HD, D-Zip, E-CD. I assume the new HD should be B drive. I printed out you'alls reply's and am now reading (in it's entirety) instructions that came with the new HD. (I already had opened the package but didn't touch anything) I am excited and grateful to you folks that are helping me out..wish me luck, Rusti


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

Usually *B* is reserved for a second floppy drive. Partition Commander will _set/reset_ all of the drives as they should be for you automatically with just a few mouse clicks. Later, when you want to make better use of the space on the new hard drive, you can use Partition Commander to partition it. Until then you will probably be wasting around 10-15 % of the drives space. There is a lot of information about this in the help section of Partition Commander


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Will I get the 10-15% back after I am all set?
What I need all the extra space for is 'video conferencing' or maybe now people use 'video streaming' or something like that.
I have a friend in Colorado - (I am in Texas) - that I chat with using ICQ everyday, and now we both got desktop cameras and mic's and now all we need is to download a whole bunch of software to get started. We already exchange video clips and holy cow..what a lot of space is needed for this stuff. Rusti K


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

> _Originally posted by Rusti:_
> *Will I get the 10-15% back after I am all set?*


You will only get it back after you "partition" it. That program Partition Commander will do all of that for you. All you need to do is to tell it how big the partitions that you want.

Imagine a pie (_your new hard drive_). When you first install it you will have just one big pie and a lot of it will go to waste. Now imagine cutting that pie into 8 or 10 pieces. That (_in computer lingo_) is called *Partitioning*. The smaller your pieces of pie, the more disk space that you will save. I'll probably have the whole alphabet used as my partitions when I get my new 160 Gig hard drive tomorrow 

You can have as many partitions as you want, and again, Partition Commander will automatically do everything for you once you tell it what size the pieces of pie (_partitions_) you want to have 

OK now I'm hungry


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Another coincident..I was just getting ready to make an apple pie..(got too big a bag of em)

You said "When you first install it you will have just one big pie and a lot of it will go to waste." Why am I gonna waste space? And how can I not waste any...and how come you get more space the smaller the slice? Doesn't make sense to me..sorry.
Thanks, Rusti


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

OK now I'm *REALLY* hungry 

All files on FAT and FAT32 partitions are stored in allocation units called *clusters*. Each time you install a new file on your computer it is allocated at least one cluster, resulting in wasted space in clusters containing small files. In other words, if a cluster is 1000 bytes, and your file is only 800 bytes, it will use the whole cluster and waste 200 bytes of space. The size of a partition determines cluster size so the smaller the partition, the smaller the clusters. Larger partitions have larger clusters, and, therefore, more wasted space. Reducing cluster size will therefore help you reclaim wasted space on your hard disk.

Its actually more complicated than that, but I thought I would use NiteHawks K.I.S.S. principle


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

A 'KISS' to all of you..I am learning a lot more than I had anticipated..you are fantastic and although I am 64, I plan to keep learning forever..a challenge is before me but with all your, obviously advanced tech help, I can hardly go wrong...even if something does not go as planned, I know you all will be here to help. Thanks, Rusti


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

To expand on Wet Chicken's cluster size explanation, here is the way it breaks down:

Disk Size Cluster size
< 8gig = 4K
8.1-16gig = 8K
16.1-32gig = 16k
32.1-64gig = 32K
64.1-128gig = 64K

Here is how you lose space. On a small 8 gig HD a 1K file will be alotted 4K of space and 3K will be wasted. On a large HD a 1K file will be allotted 64K and 63K will be wasted.

Granted there are very few 1K files, but most of your temporary files are in the range of 1 to 3K.

To extend this, lets take a 524K file on a large HD (over 64gig). Windows will allot 9 64K clusters. 8 x 64 = 512 so the first 8 clusters are used 100% the 9th cluster holds the extra 12K and 52k is wasted.

The same 524K file on a drive that is say 60gig would be allocated 17 32K clusters. 16 x 32 = 512 so 16 clusters are 100% used and the 17th cluster holds the extra 12K and 20K is wasted.

This unused or wasted space at the end of the last cluster is called *slack*. In theory the files that use only 10% of the last cluster and the ones that use 90% should about balance out so that on average 50% of the last cluster of a file is wasted. Since it's only the *last* cluster that has the wasted space, over all the average HD loses 10% to 20% due to slack.

Think of that pie you are baking. Do you buy a 5 pound bag of flour or a 50 pound bag of flour? Which one will have the most waste in the long run?

Clear as mud??


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

Now before you start thinking that an 8 gig HD is better because it wastes less space, stop and think for a moment. It we partitioned that 160gig into 8gig partitions you would have *20* smaller or *logical* drives. HOLY COW!!! where did I put that file??


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## AbvAvgUser (Oct 3, 2002)

NiteHawk is right. Although you will lose some space in bogger partitions, managing and finding files will be somewhat easier. Too many parrtitions will make it a lot more difficult to trace them. Although you can use the find file utility.

NiteHawk, nice signature. Very useful one


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

What most people do when they have a lot of partitions is to assign them different functions. For example, one partition could be just for your pictures, one for wav files, one for back up e-mail, ETC. and then it's not so bad and much easier to locate all of your files


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

I am a believer in dual HD's and multiple partitions, (my system has 2 HD's and 9 partitions ranging in size from 1 to 20gig) but as I said, there is a point where too many partitions become confusing.

I'm not into video or music downloading, but if I were I would have both larger hard drives and larger partitions. With the size of the video and music files, larger partitions are needed and the slack space is less of a concern. Larger files tend to do better when allotted larger cluster sizes. My large files tend to be Ghost images of the other partitions.  In fact, the next time I re-do my HD I'll make the Ghost partition larger. Right now it has less than 400MB free. I can probably rob Peter to pay Paul and steal about 2-3 gig or so from each of the 4 other partitions on that drive.


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

> _Originally posted by NiteHawk:_
> *there is a point where too many partitions become confusing
> *


6 of one and a half dozen of another  Some people get confused and some organize to fit the purpose. We're not talking about a thousand partitions here, or even a hundred. Most programs today are larger so the cluster sizes can likewise be larger too. For 160 - 200 Gigs ten or twenty partitions should be a good compromise, but again, it depends on if the person gets easily confused, or if they can organize to fit the purpose. A little creativity goes a long way in saving disk space


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

> _Originally posted by AbvAvgUser:_
> *
> NiteHawk, nice signature. Very useful one  *


Thanks. I hope it's useful to people.
I should update two of the links because one of the sites has been under a DDoS attack from the Cool Web Search people of one of their affiliates. (Same thing)

Just shows you how low some of these crapware sites will go when they try to block the good sites that provide the tools to remove their scum.


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

Links for HiJack This and CWShredder have been updated. All links should work now.


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

That CW Shredder saved my butt last week! You have no idea how annoying it is to open up your browser and see it jump to some scumbags site and also reset your home page. Just once I'd like to get my hands on one of those boneheads, but they're so full of slime that I'd have to wear some gloves


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

Running CWShredder never hurts. Just as an FYI there are several variants of CWS that evade detection in HJT.


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Hey guys..don't leave me in the dust. Should I be concerned about HiHack, CWshredder, and HJT. 

I was just trying to see how I should configure stuff..In the diagrams there is a -0- or -1- after each device..what's that for?
Example: Existing System with two ATAPI 
Primary Master, 0: Boot Drive
Primary Slave, 1: Additional Storage Drive (New HD)
Secondary Master, 0: CD-ROM
Secondary Slave, 1: Zip Drive
? Rusti


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

For what you are doing now, you don't need to worry about HiJack This and CWshredder.

As for the 0 and 1 question. Computers start counting at 0. The Primary and secondary here refer to your two EIDE controllers on the motherboard (your two gray data cables)
0 is the first device on that channel and 1 is the second.

Don't let some of the technobabble from Wet Chicken and myself snow you. Most are just side comments. Sorry for the confusion.


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

> _Originally posted by NiteHawk:_
> *Don't let some of the technobabble from Wet Chicken and myself snow you *


So "_that's_" what technobabble is... and here I always thought it was those little styrofoam peanuts that they pack electronic equiptment in 

Rusti you should use those programs to check your computer, but *ONLY* after your hard drive is finished and working. You don't really need to worry about them right now


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Hey..I did it! Thanks to all of you folks. I got the HD in and it now says I have Local Disks C & D. Bad part..It now says my new disk only has 127GB. But as soon as I can tomorrow I am going over you'alls replys and use some of your suggestions. &(websites)
It's kinda like when you get somewhere and people say "well it's about time, which way did you come?" Couldn't tell you fer nothin how I got this far. The CD that came with it mostly did everything automatically - of course it was determined by the choices I made. Until tomorrow..thanks again, Rusti


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

Hey thats great news! I'm installing mine as we speak  When you install Partition Commander it will show you the hard drive (in graphic form) and then you can get the full 160 Gigs. Sometimes the BIOS has a limitation on it, but as you will see there is more than one way to skin a cat


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Wow, I need some more education I guess.
I am still proud that I got my hard drive in and running ok.
But now what do I do? I guess I thought I would see a brand new desktop with neat little handy icons, instead of just a plain ole window with a bunch of stuff I don't know what to do with.
I don't have any credit cards so I can't use the part.commander, but I will check to see if I can download a free one. Do I need an OS on this drive in order to use the Video-conferencing softwares. Thanks, Rusti


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## AbvAvgUser (Oct 3, 2002)

If both the drives are connected at the same time, you don't need a separate OS for it. You can connect as many drives as your hardware permits, but need only one OS. If you have already installed a video-conferencing software, you can straight away start using this new drive.

PS : Don't you feel so very proud when you have done something new successfully  I know it feels great.


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

First - Thanks BrushMaster for: "why take out the old" way back at the beginning when I was just going to switch out the new for the old. 

I think I am expecting everything to just automatically go where I want it to. If I don't have enough space on my old (master) HD does it just go over onto my new slave? Or do I have to specify 'open in D drive'? I haven't loaded any VC software yet.
If I don't have OS in D how can my program work? 
Hope you all don't think these dumb questions are a waste. I really appreciate you taking the time. Rusti


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

PS..I guess I mean to say, I wish my new HD could be an extension to my old one.
Also, how do you put those web pages in, like "to see that go here" and it takes you right to the page.? Thanks, Rusti


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

> _Originally posted by Rusti:_
> *I wish my new HD could be an extension to my old one*


It can = Partition Commander


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

If when you reply to a post you click the "Post Reply" button instead of using the "Quick reply" box at the bottom, you will see a number of option buttons above the reply box. The first one is labeled "http://", if you click that it will ask for a name (here, fun page, more info, whatever you want to call it). when enter the shortcut name and click OK it takes you to a second box that starts with http:// This is where you put in the link for the site, ie: "http://somesite.com" Without the quotes.


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Thanks NiteHawk for taking the time to explain to me.

WetChicken..which partition commander 6 or 8 -or- partition commander pro 6 or 8? Thanks, Rusti


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## AbvAvgUser (Oct 3, 2002)

Rather than waiting for the first drive to get full and then storing data in the second larger one, I would suggest directly save stuff in the larger second partition.

Don't let the drive where windows in installed get full. It will slow down your machine and may even throw error more frequently. Windows needs some elbow room to work properly. So leave enough free space there.


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

> _Originally posted by Rusti:_
> *which partition commander 6 or 8 *


Any version should do the trick for you. They will all do the basic functions of partitioning


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

For quite a while now, this window keeps popping up pretty often. Sometimes it shuts me done, other times I can just delete.

"Explorer has caused an error in KERNEL 32.DLL 
Explorer will now close". 

 Rusti


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

I really didn't want my 2nd hard drive just for storage..I wanted it to be a working drive for programs and stuff, like my original HD. Does that mean I have to install Windows Me on that one too? Thanks, Rusti


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

Couldn't have done it without...brushmaster1, AbvAvgUser, Wet Chicken, raybro, and NiteHawk. I hope to be able to help someone some day. I certainly will recommend this site. Thanks again, Rusti


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## AbvAvgUser (Oct 3, 2002)

, thanks Rusti for your kind words. I don't want to hog any credit as there are other guys here who have helped you more than I did.

Anyway, if you feel, please donate something for this site. Click on the affero link (bottom right) and it will take you to the right place.  All the best.

BTW, you don't need to install WinME on the other drive. But whenever you install new softwares, specify D:\Program Files in place of C:\Program Files (or any other location that your current setup gives you). That will install the software in the new hard drive.


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

It was my privilege and honor to help you Rusti. Please enjoy your new hard drive 

BTW, last week I tried some new partitioning software and it was incredible!!!!!!!!! *4 times faster* than Partition Magic!!! It also had some features that the others didn't offer, like if you delete some files or partitions accidentally from your hard drive, it will get them back for you 

It is called *PartitionExpert* and you can see it HERE !

_It is by far the best software that I have purchased in years _


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

Glad to hear that everything worked out for you. :up:
Always happy to help out.

As a suggestion I would keep windows (no need for a second copy) and your programs on the original C: drive and your data (files you have created with the programs) on the new drive. You said that you plan on doing a lot of video files, the new drive would be a good place to keep the video files.

Good Luck to you and happy computing.


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

Just a quick side note here... have you checked and are you sure that you are getting the full *160* gigs from your hard drive install?


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## AbvAvgUser (Oct 3, 2002)

You can know about it thru My computers and right click > proprties of your new drive.


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

First, what is BTW at the beginning of your replies?

And No, I am not seeing 160GB nohow...

It says Used Space: 15.9 MB
Free Space: 127 GB

What happened to the rest?

 Rusti


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

BTW= By The Way...  

Something is putting a limitation on your hard drive. What operating system are you using ? You might have to buy a controller card to make that hard drive work properly


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

One thought on the missing space. There is both an older and a newer version of *fdisk*. The older version of fdisk had a problems with drives larger than 64 gig. What I _don't know_ is if than meant the raw unpartitioned HD was larger than 64 gig, *or* a partition was larger than 64 gig. I _think_ it refered to making a *partition 64 gig or larger*.

I used to keep a two boot disks, one with each version. But you would always have to double check. Now I use a boot disk that has the newer version and it will partition any size HD without worried about size limitations.

It looks like you created a single partition. The whole drive as one partition. IF that's the case, the fdisk version may be a factor in the missing space.


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## NiteHawk (Mar 9, 2003)

Wet Chicken said that he just bought the same 160gig HD so he would be the one to confirm the after format size.

However there are a couple of other factors to consider, that being that for marketing purposes HD manufactures use base 10 and frequently *round up*. Computers, on the other hand are binary and count using the base 2.

* Base 10*
1 gig = 10 to the 9th power or 10^9
160 gig would be 160 * 10^9

* Base 2*
1*k* = 1024
Let's see how those extra 24 bits add up (or subtract out)
1gig = 1,073,741,824 or 2 to the 30th power or 2^30

*Now the math*
To figure the true size of a HD take the manufactures size in base 10 and divide by by the figure in base 2.

Since we are dealing with a 160gig HD the math would go like this:

160 * 10^9 / 2^30 = 149.0116119384765625 gig
or
149,011,611,938.4765625 bytes
or
just 149 gig (with 11.6 MB in "loose change")

Deceptive advertising or just two different numbering systems? You be the judge.


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

You may need a BIOS upgrade, drive overlay software, or a 3rd party IDE controller with it's _own_ BIOS.

Does the BIOS recognize the HD as 160gb?

If you are using Windows ME then here's a related FAQ from Seagate's website: FAQ

A new BIOS update would also work, but 9 out of 10 times you wont be able to find one, and if you dont know how to install a new BIOS you could very easily mess up your whole computer! If you found a newer BIOS for your machine Im sure we could walk you through the installation, but we would all be pretty nervous while it was being installed  This would be your second to last best solution and if you were also using Win ME then Win ME would _still_ keep you from seeing the full drive space.

A good version of some drive overlay software can be found HERE. However I personally do not recommend going this route, basically because drive overlay software is nothing more than a hack (its a good hack, but _still_ a hack). The only reason why you would ever need it would be because something on your computer is _outdated_. That being the case the most sensible thing to do is to update whatever needs updating, instead of trying to "_get around_" the update with drive overlay software. Because this is a hack it has also been known to mess up peoples computers from time to time. I would use drive overlay software *ONLY* as a last resort! It is also VERY, VERY tricky to remove once you install it.

The best solution is to buy a *new IDE controller card* (_or motherboard_) that has it's own BIOS _built-in_, which would cost you only around 30 bucks and all would be well again


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## Rusti (Feb 27, 2004)

In my Maxtor Installation Guide - in order to access full capacity of my drive over 137GB I need to download a driver or updates according to my motherboard chipset. Is there a way to find out what it is other than physically look inside my pc? 
Or - depending on what chipset, I may have to install a ATA/133 PCI Adapter Card.
What is an IDE Controller you mentioned?
Thanks, Rusti


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## Wet Chicken (Sep 11, 2000)

...sure.... when you first boot up it will be displayed on your screen. It will tell you what BIOS you have, and what version it is. You should also be able to find a new (_or newest_) BIOS at the computer or motherboards web site.

Regarding the controller card.... I bought one, and it did *NOT* help much  This probably has to do with the operating system limitations (Win ME).

Out of 160 gigs, I can only see 149 gigs 

But this is not a problem for me because next week I am building a new super-computer and then I'll see the full 160 gigs


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