# Considering Linux



## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

The hard drive on my XP Home desktop PC went belly up. I bought the PC used, and it did not come with a Windows CD. I have installed a brand new 80GB drive, but now, I do not have an XP disk to reinstall an OS. I went out to buy XP, and I discovered that XP is not available in stores anymore... around here anyway. I can get it online, but then I remembered the Linux OS... which is free.... another option. 

So, I've been reading some about the Linux OS, and the different versions of it. Is this something that a regular person, with a basic understanding of computers can handle?? Some of the stuff I've been reading is making my brain hurt, and I'm concerned that it may be more trouble than it's worth.

All I need it to do, is the basic stuff... web browsing, letter writing, and handling pictures (not video) and music.

I also do some website work using Yahoo/Geocities on the web... would there be any problem working with that... because I would be using Firefox instead of IE, correct??


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> Is this something that a regular person, with a basic understanding of computers can handle??


Yep. 

A lot of people recommend PCLinuxOS and Ubuntu is also popular.

The best thing you can do is download a LiveCD of a distro and boot it on the machine you want to install it on. You can boot directly from the liveCD and take the Linux system for a "test drive", if you will. If you like it, you can install it on your hard drive. Also, booting a liveCD will give you somewhat of an idea of how your system will be supported by Linux. A liveCD won't be exactly like running from a real installation but you can get a general sense of whether Linux will run on the box or not.

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> Yep.
> 
> A lot of people recommend PCLinuxOS and Ubuntu is also popular.
> 
> ...


OK, first dumb question of many... the new hard drive is completely empty... as in no drivers for anything... will the LiveCD run everything??


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> OK, first dumb question of many... the new hard drive is completely empty... as in no drivers for anything... will the LiveCD run everything??


That's not a dumb question at all.  You don't need to have anything on the hard drive to install Linux or run the liveCD. Just as long as the hard drive works and is recognized by the BIOS, at least, the Linux installer will handle the rest.

Obviously, you'll need access to a machine with an Internet connection and a CD burner so you can download the liveCD and burn it to a CD. Once burned to a CD, you boot your target machine from the CD-ROM with the liveCD in the drive and the liveCD will handle the rest. 

You can see screenshots of an Ubuntu liveCD boot session here. That page will discuss doing an actual install but you DO NOT have to do the install to use the liveCD. Just boot the liveCD and fire up the browser and see if you can surf the web. 

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> That's not a dumb question at all.  You don't need to have anything on the hard drive to install Linux or run the liveCD. Just as long as the hard drive works and is recognized by the BIOS, at least, the Linux installer will handle the rest.
> 
> Obviously, you'll need access to a machine with an Internet connection and a CD burner so you can download the liveCD and burn it to a CD. Once burned to a CD, you boot your target machine from the CD-ROM with the liveCD in the drive and the liveCD will handle the rest.
> 
> ...


I have a laptop that I can download/burn with... I'll try it tonight. Do they all have the LiveCD option?? (Dumb question #2).

You mentioned PCLinuxOS and Ubuntu... which is easier?? Yes, I am nervous about this, can you tell?? 

I found this...

http://distrowatch.com/dwres.php?resource=major

I wish the "pros and cons" were in a language that I speak. 

OK, in your opinion, which ONE should I try??


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> I have a laptop that I can download/burn with... I'll try it tonight. Do they all have the LiveCD option?? (Dumb question #2).


Most Linux distros have a liveCD but not all do, so this was a great question. 



> OK, in your opinion, which ONE should I try??


If I were you, I would try BOTH PCLinuxOS and Ubuntu. I would look at the screenshots of the desktops of the distros at Distro Watch and see which desktop strikes your fancy. LiveCDs are free to download, except for the time spent downloading and the blank CD media. 

I've got liveCDs for Ubuntu, Kubuntu (Ubuntu with a different default desktop manager), OpenGEU, ZenWalk, and a few others. I like to try out distros via liveCDs to see what the distro is like. 

ZenWalk is another distro you might want to check out.

The thing is, ANY of these distros will suit your needs of web surfing, e-mail management, digital music management, digital photo management, and office productivity. PCLinuxOS is known for being "easy", especially for newbies coming from a Windows background. For me, Ubuntu installed without any problems.

The BEST thing is by trying the liveCDs, you don't have to commit until you're ready to do so. 

How about this: just to get the ball rolling, download an Ubuntu (or Kubuntu) liveCD. This will get your feet wet in terms of downloading the ISO and burning to CD, etc. Then, boot the liveCD on your laptiop and give it a whirl. If you like it, install it. If you want to try PCLinuxOS out of curiosity, download a liveCD image from the PCLinuxOS website and burn that to a CD and boot that on your laptop.

You might find when you boot the Ubuntu liveCD that something might not work, like a wireless network adapter in the laptop. If this is the case, you know that particular distro might not be the one for you OR you might learn that some extra work would be required to get that adapter working. Another distro might more readily support that wireless adapter.

Download an Ubuntu liveCD image and burn it to a CD and give it a try. 

Peace...


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## InterKnight (Oct 19, 2004)

Hello, trekguy.

I will give you a slight bit of insight into the Ubuntu-way of things (I guess that's what you'd call it), as that is what I use here at home now. 

I used to be in the place where you are now, and I was kind of nervous about making the switch. I am a partially blind computer user, and I got really tired of having to figure out how I could afford to pay nearly $600+ for a screen magnifier for Windows (the company only develops for Microsoft, might I add). I was tired of being a "captive" customer, and so I looked into Linux.

I was in your slight predicament, where I did not know which distribution (distro) to use. I looked at Fedora Core, Debian, PCLinuxOS, and then Ubuntu. This June will be my first full year running solely Ubuntu. I chose it because (for my situation) the community has a LOT of support for people with disabilities. I am using a screen magnifier plugin which is much more smooth and is not AT ALL a memory hog like the Windows applications were...and even more...I did not pay a DIME!

Ubuntu is very user friendly, and they have a very active community of volunteers who are always willing to help over at the Ubuntu Forums. Now, this is not to say that other distros are not good, as I am sure all of them are, but Ubuntu was what met my needs. It comes with OpenOffice (which can open and save to Microsoft Word, PowerPoint, and Excel formats); it uses Firefox as the default Web browser; it uses Pidgin as the default multi-protocol (AIM/Yahoo/ICQ/etc) instant messaging program; and, there is just a plethora of other applications that come with the system that just meet many other needs.

Another thing I love about Ubuntu (and Linux in general) is that of a Package Manager. I used to go out and search Download.com and other sites for freeware programs when I used Windows, but on Ubuntu there is an Add/Remove Programs application that allows you to both add AND remove programs by searching online repositories for programs.

My wife was really leery of Linux at first, but now she loves it.

In about sixteen days, on April 24, 2008, they will be releasing Ubuntu 8.04 "Hardy Heron", which will offer long-term support for its users and will be even more feature-full than the current version (which I am using).

I(n any case, I hope that this has been of a little help to you. I have sen Linux evolve in great bounds over the past few years, and it will only get better and better.

I hope that all works out well for you.

Take care.


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

InterKnight said:


> I chose it because (for my situation) the community has a LOT of support for people with disabilities.


Interesting, I wasn't aware of this. 

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> Most Linux distros have a liveCD but not all do, so this was a great question.
> 
> If I were you, I would try BOTH PCLinuxOS and Ubuntu. I would look at the screenshots of the desktops of the distros at Distro Watch and see which desktop strikes your fancy. LiveCDs are free to download, except for the time spent downloading and the blank CD media.
> 
> ...


I did some reading in the Ubuntu Forums... command line ... code... terminal... yikes. I've never been one to type in commands... I like to use the mouse.  Do you *have* to use the CLI stuff at any point, or can all Linux/Ubuntu operations be done via mouse?? ( #3  )

Downloads are quite large... I'm going to start the Ubuntu download when I'm done here, and let it go overnight. I can't burn anything until tomorrow anyway... it seems that my daughter has "burned" through my entire stack of media.


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

InterKnight said:


> Hello, trekguy.
> 
> I will give you a slight bit of insight into the Ubuntu-way of things (I guess that's what you'd call it), as that is what I use here at home now.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the input. Yep, still a bit nervous about this deal... out of my comfort zone, you know. I'm going to try it. It seems ridiculous to me to have to spend hundreds of dollars for basic software.

So, what happens when the new version arrives? Is it complicated to upgrade? Should I just wait, maybe?


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## RootbeaR (Dec 9, 2006)

LiveCD List:
http://www.frozentech.com/content/livecd.php


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

RootbeaR said:


> LiveCD List:
> http://www.frozentech.com/content/livecd.php


Thanks for the list. How come there's such a big difference in the min/max (699 to 3553mb) for Ubuntu???

And, what's the difference between the primary functions "Desktop" and "OS Replacement"??


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## RootbeaR (Dec 9, 2006)

trekguy said:


> Thanks for the list. How come there's such a big difference in the min/max (699 to 3553mb) for Ubuntu???
> 
> And, what's the difference between the primary functions "Desktop" and "OS Replacement"??


Minimal install or full install. Sometimes you can have the repositories installed as well instead of going to the internet to get packages.

"Desktop" probably doesn't work with laptops. I am not positive, guessing.


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

RootbeaR said:


> Minimal install or full install. Sometimes you can have the repositories installed as well instead of going to the internet to get packages.
> 
> "Desktop" probably doesn't work with laptops. I am not positive, guessing.


Oops, didn't read down far enough.

*Primary Functions:*

*Desktops:* provides a working GUI desktop environment with a collection of desktop programs, such as browsers and text editors. Many also include utilities for other purposes, such as home entertainment, but are only listed here because the additional functions are not their primary focus.

*OS Replacement:* provides an option to transfer the cd to the hard drive, or to install an OS in a different form.


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> I did some reading in the Ubuntu Forums... command line ... code... terminal... yikes. I've never been one to type in commands... I like to use the mouse.  Do you *have* to use the CLI stuff at any point, or can all Linux/Ubuntu operations be done via mouse?? ( #3  )


The Ubuntu install won't require any command line interaction. If you cruise through the Networking forum, you will see PLENTY of Windows users invoking a command prompt to diagnose and fix problems let alone editing the registry. 

The command line is nothing to fear and something you won't have to use very often.



RootbeaR said:


> "Desktop" probably doesn't work with laptops. I am not positive, guessing.


"Desktop" is used to distinguish one form of install from the "server" form of install. The "Desktop" version will work fine on a laptop. 

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> The Ubuntu install won't require any command line interaction. If you cruise through the Networking forum, you will see PLENTY of Windows users invoking a command prompt to diagnose and fix problems let alone editing the registry.





tomdkat said:


> The command line is nothing to fear and something you won't have to use very often.


Yep, I've been helped here a number of times, and have been directed to use some code... I was hoping it was the same sort of deal. :up:

Here's a funny. I started the Ubuntu download last night before I went to bed... woke up this morning to discover that Microsoft had done it's update during the night, which included an automatic restart... thus stopping the Ubuntu download.  Coincidence?? Hmmm??? 

I'm going to pick up some CDs today... any special trick to burning?? I saw somewhere... can't find it right now.... a free burning program that was recommended. Or, can I use whatever's on the laptop right now??


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> Here's a funny. I started the Ubuntu download last night before I went to bed... woke up this morning to discover that Microsoft had done it's update during the night, which included an automatic restart... thus stopping the Ubuntu download.  Coincidence?? Hmmm???


Naw, it's part of Microsoft's GRAND conspiracy! See, the Windows update that got installed will redirect any downloads of Ubuntu CD images to Windows XP images instead. Resistance is futile... 



> I'm going to pick up some CDs today... any special trick to burning?? I saw somewhere... can't find it right now.... a free burning program that was recommended. Or, can I use whatever's on the laptop right now??


The MOST IMPORTANT thing is to burn the ISO image to the CD, not as a file, but to burn the image _itself_ to a CD. Do you have CD burning software installed on the laptop now? If you do, what do you have? You can also check out this howto guide for burning ISO images.

Peace...


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## valis (Sep 24, 2004)

i'm gonna sign up for this thread, as I am planning (eventually) to partition my hd at home and dual-boot it. Reckon this way I can watch and learn.


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> Naw, it's part of Microsoft's GRAND conspiracy! See, the Windows update that got installed will redirect any downloads of Ubuntu CD images to Windows XP images instead. Resistance is futile...
> 
> The MOST IMPORTANT thing is to burn the ISO image to the CD, not as a file, but to burn the image _itself_ to a CD. Do you have CD burning software installed on the laptop now? If you do, what do you have? You can also check out this howto guide for burning ISO images.
> 
> Peace...


Yes! Infra Recorder... that's where I saw that!

The laptop does have burning software... not sure what exactly it has though... I'll check when I get home. (I'm at work right now ... shhhhh) 

Maybe I should use the Infra Recorder anyway??? Or, doesn't it matter, as long as it can burn an image, and not a file. ??


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

valis said:


> i'm gonna sign up for this thread, as I am planning (eventually) to partition my hd at home and dual-boot it. Reckon this way I can watch and learn.


OK valis, you can watch... as long as you don't laugh at my dumb questions!


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> The laptop does have burning software... not sure what exactly it has though... I'll check when I get home. (I'm at work right now ... shhhhh)
> 
> Maybe I should use the Infra Recorder anyway??? Or, doesn't it matter, as long as it can burn an image, and not a file. ??


If you already have CD burning software installed that can burn ISOs, there is no reason to install Infra Recorder. They recommend that software on Windows so they can have ONE application they can use for burning ISOs instead of having to have examples for people using Nero or Easy CD Creator, etc. For some reason, a LOT of people don't get the concept behind burning ISOs.

Peace...


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## valis (Sep 24, 2004)

trekguy said:


> OK valis, you can watch... as long as you don't laugh at my dumb questions!


that's a two way street, partner....

um.....yeah......what's this 'linux' thing I keep hearing about?


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> Naw, it's part of Microsoft's GRAND conspiracy! See, the Windows update that got installed will redirect any downloads of Ubuntu CD images to Windows XP images instead. Resistance is futile...
> 
> The MOST IMPORTANT thing is to burn the ISO image to the CD, not as a file, but to burn the image _itself_ to a CD. Do you have CD burning software installed on the laptop now? If you do, what do you have? You can also check out this howto guide for burning ISO images.
> 
> Peace...


The conspiracy continues... I got home today expecting to see Ubuntu downloaded, and safely residing in the newly created "Linux" folder... only to find a Windows error message stating that "Windows could not complete the download...." 

I'm going to try again now.

And, I have Roxio/Sonic RecordNow burning software. I looked into it, and did not find any reference to ISO... the project options are "Audio", "Data", and "ExactCopy or Backup".

????


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

valis said:


> that's a two way street, partner....
> 
> um.....yeah......what's this 'linux' thing I keep hearing about?


LOL, before my hard drive toasted, I would have said that "Linux" was that character in the Peanuts strip that always had the blanket!


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> And, I have Roxio/Sonic RecordNow burning software. I looked into it, and did not find any reference to ISO... the project options are "Audio", "Data", and "ExactCopy or Backup".


Here are some links for you:

http://onlinepubs.trb.org/onlinepubs/burning_iso.html
http://forums.support.roxio.com/index.php?showtopic=15970
http://www.google.com/search?q=Burn...ls=com.ubuntu:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

Well, it looks like the "Backup" tab is the one I want to burn the ISO.

That is, IF I can ever get the thing to download. 

So far, three attempts, three sources, three failures.

First one made it to 17%, and was interrupted by the Windows Update.

Second one made to 57%... then stopped. 

Third attempt made it to only 10%.


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## valis (Sep 24, 2004)

see, I just don't know what version to download. I've been told fedoracore, ubuntu, redhat; what I want is something that I can get into and tinker with (I work in the IT industry) and therefore want to be able to break it and learn how to fix it......

regardless, I've got a whole linux floor to ask at work, and I don't want to hijack this thread, but I'll definitely be watching and learning. I was actually going to start one of my own, or go bug omega shadow, but as I've got the resources at work to inform me what I need for my wants and desires wrt a dual boot system, I'll be using them to get it installed and learning from here.


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

valis said:


> see, I just don't know what version to download. I've been told fedoracore, ubuntu, redhat; what I want is something that I can get into and tinker with (I work in the IT industry) and therefore want to be able to break it and learn how to fix it......


You can do that with just about any Linux distro. 

RedHat is no longer free and the current free versions are now under the name Fedora. I run Ubuntu at home and I've configured RedHat-based proxy servers at work.

Do this: Get a coin and assign Ubuntu to one side and Fedora Core to the other. Flip the coin and let fate decide. 

Ubuntu also has a server edition you can download, if you wanted to see what a "canned" Linux server can look like.

Peace...


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## valis (Sep 24, 2004)

i think the one I am supposed to get is the fedora core....it's for someone who has never used linux before, but wants to take it apart and tinker with it......regardless, I don't want to hijack the thread, so I'm switching back to lurker mode again.


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## RootbeaR (Dec 9, 2006)

valis said:


> i think the one I am supposed to get is the fedora core....it's for someone who has never used linux before, but wants to take it apart and tinker with it......regardless, I don't want to hijack the thread, so I'm switching back to lurker mode again.


I'm not too keen on Fedora. My biggest beef is their servers take too long to download from.

PCLinuxOS repositories download @ max speed for me, 10 Mb/s, whereas Fedora is a small fraction of that. Makes me feel like I am on dial-up.



trekguy said:


> Well, it looks like the "Backup" tab is the one I want to burn the ISO.
> 
> That is, IF I can ever get the thing to download.
> 
> ...


I downloaded Ubuntu two days ago via torrent. Took 12 1/2 minutes.


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## 1002richards (Jan 29, 2006)

Hi trekguy,
You can get Ubuntu sent to you free on a disc, from here:
https://shipit.ubuntu.com/

Takes a couple of weeks (or up to ten) or so but it's the real deal when it arrives & no more incomplete downloads.

Richard.


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

RootbeaR said:


> I'm not too keen on Fedora. My biggest beef is their servers take too long to download from.
> 
> PCLinuxOS repositories download @ max speed for me, 10 Mb/s, whereas Fedora is a small fraction of that. Makes me feel like I am on dial-up.
> 
> I downloaded Ubuntu two days ago via torrent. *Took 12 1/2 minutes*.


Wow... that must be nice. :up:

After ditching Windows download manager, and installing Free Download Manager, I actually have Ubuntu 7.10 on a disk! It took about 5 hours. I have DSL, but I am rural, and not too close to the main switch... beats dial-up, though. I can get 30-50 Kbs.


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

1002richards said:


> Hi trekguy,
> You can get Ubuntu sent to you free on a disc, from here:
> https://shipit.ubuntu.com/
> 
> ...


Thanks for the link. :up:

Woohoo, I managed to get *Ubuntu 7.10 *on a disk!

And, these distros are on their way.

*Kubuntu 7.10 
PCLinuxOS 2007 
Zenwalk 5
SuSe*

I will be going with one of these 5, so any info, or opinions??

What exactly are the differences between them? Is it just the way they look? Are some easier to learn than others? Will some be better at finding/working with the hardware on my PC?

And, if I choose one, and later want to change, is that a major process??


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

Update:

Tried booting the desktop PC/new hard drive with the Ubuntu liveCD... no go. 

There must be something else wrong, besides the hard drive???

I'm heading over to the Hardware forum, to see if anyone has any ideas.


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

Did you get any error messages? If so, what did you get?

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> Did you get any error messages? If so, what did you get?
> 
> Peace...


I got nothing... zero... the monitor does not even come out of "amber light" mode.

Graphics card? Processor? MB?


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

Ok, the amber light on the monitor means there is no video signal coming from the computer. This means something probably crashed during the boot process. Even though your ISO downloaded, maybe it's bad? Dunno...

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> Ok, the amber light on the monitor means there is no video signal coming from the computer. This means something probably crashed during the boot process. Even though your ISO downloaded, maybe it's bad? Dunno...
> 
> Peace...


I have booted my laptop with the Ubuntu disk I made, so I know the disk will boot. I'm thinking the desktop has a hardware problem other than the hard drive.

I don't know where to start with it, or if it's even worth trying to fix it.

Maybe I should try to build a new one from scratch... I think that might be fun. I have the OS taken care of already!  :up:


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## valis (Sep 24, 2004)

okay, time for my stupid question. downloading fedora core 8.0, will the x-86-64 work on a 32 bit system? I'm assuming so, as the only other options are for apple or 386? I've got a good connection to a mirror site, but want to make sure that the 86-64 will fly on my 32 bit rig......

any more questions, I'll create my own thread.....sorry trekguy......


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

valis said:


> okay, time for my stupid question. downloading fedora core 8.0, will the x-86-64 work on a 32 bit system?


Nope.

Peace...


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> I have booted my laptop with the Ubuntu disk I made, so I know the disk will boot. I'm thinking the desktop has a hardware problem other than the hard drive.
> 
> I don't know where to start with it, or if it's even worth trying to fix it.


Ok, it might not be a hardware "problem" but that the liveCD doesn't like a piece of hardware in your system. I've had intermittent problems in the past with some liveCDs booting on a given machine and others not.

EDIT: What are the hardware specs of the desktop machine?

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> Ok, it might not be a hardware "problem" but that the liveCD doesn't like a piece of hardware in your system. I've had intermittent problems in the past with some liveCDs booting on a given machine and others not.
> 
> EDIT: What are the hardware specs of the desktop machine?
> 
> Peace...


AMD Sempron... 1.2ghz?
M848A V2.1
1536 mb ram
ATI Radeon Force RV6DE-NA3
PS-Austin DR-B300ATX
CD
DVD-RW

I just powered it up again, and this it what happens... power supply comes on...CD light comes and stays on.... hard drive light comes on and stays on.

It does this with or without the Ubuntu LiveCD.

Shouldn't it at least do the POST thing, if the MB is good??

And another interesting thing... I can't power it down by holding the power button down.... I have to switch it off on the back of the box. ?????

BTW, I am writing this from the Firefox browser on my Ubuntu LiveCD on the laptop!!!

I can connect to the internet with a direct connection to my router... but the wireless card will not, for some reason. It shows my network, and provides a place to enter the passphrase, and the lights on the card flash like they should, but it doesn't happen on the screen.

And, how do I make the title bar smaller?? It's like 2 inches wide at the top of the screen.


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> I just powered it up again, and this it what happens... power supply comes on...CD light comes and stays on.... hard drive light comes on and stays on.
> 
> It does this with or without the Ubuntu LiveCD.


Ok, this sounds like a hardware conflict of some kind. Are the CD-ROM drive and the hard drive on the same IDE cable? If so, they are both probably set to cable select or master. Disconnect the hard drive and see if the liveCD boots. Be sure to configure the BIOS to boot from the CD-ROM drive.

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> Ok, this sounds like a hardware conflict of some kind. Are the CD-ROM drive and the hard drive on the same IDE cable? If so, they are both probably set to cable select or master. Disconnect the hard drive and see if the liveCD boots. Be sure to configure the BIOS to boot from the CD-ROM drive.
> 
> Peace...


The new hard drive's jumpers were set the same as the old one.

I disconnected the new drive... still no BIOS.

Is there any way to tell if it's the mobo, or the video card?? With no display, and nothing to go by on the monitor, I'm lost.


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> The new hard drive's jumpers were set the same as the old one.


Unless the new hard drive is the exact same make/model as the old hard drive, the jumper settings being "the same" doesn't necessarily mean those jumper settings are correct. Is the hard drive jumpered as master or cable select?



> I disconnected the new drive... still no BIOS.


Ok, what happens if you disconnect the CD drive?



> Is there any way to tell if it's the mobo, or the video card?? With no display, and nothing to go by on the monitor, I'm lost.


If you have a spare video card laying around, you could certainly try that and see. The golden rule is: "_if it's swappable, swap it_" 

Also, do you hear any beeps or anything when you turn on the machine?

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> Unless the new hard drive is the exact same make/model as the old hard drive, the jumper settings being "the same" doesn't necessarily mean those jumper settings are correct. Is the hard drive jumpered as master or cable select?
> 
> Ok, what happens if you disconnect the CD drive?
> 
> ...


Disconnected all drives, and removed RAM.... no post, no beep, no signal.

The exhaust fan, and the CPU fan "seem" to be running at the same speed, as far as my ear can tell... so would that mean the power supply is OK?


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

Do you get any power lights on the computer case when you turn it on? It sounds like the power supply is supplying power and if the CPU fan is spinning, it's getting power. It could very well be the mobo is toast since you didn't get any beeps when you removed the RAM and turned on the machine. Good call on removing the RAM as part of the test. 

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> Do you get any power lights on the computer case when you turn it on? It sounds like the power supply is supplying power and if the CPU fan is spinning, it's getting power. It could very well be the mobo is toast since you didn't get any beeps when you removed the RAM and turned on the machine. Good call on removing the RAM as part of the test.
> 
> Peace...


I'm looking at a Gigabyte GA-7N400 PRO2 with an Athlon XP 3200. Would it be necessary to upgrade the 300 watt ps to run that? I am also thinking about adding another hard drive, as a backup.


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> I'm looking at a Gigabyte GA-7N400 PRO2 with an Athlon XP 3200. Would it be necessary to upgrade the 300 watt ps to run that?


I wouldn't think so but that's a question better asked of the hardware guys. 

Peace...


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## kickback999 (Apr 14, 2008)

No it wouldent, that should be fine although if you plan on keeping the system on constantly or adding a powerful gfx card or different cd/hd drive then you might want to upgrade the psu.
I think my psu (on a AthlonXP3200) is 350watts.


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

I changed my mind on the parts ( used-Ebay... I know  )... I have put together some stuff from New Egg. It is going to be a Linux box of some flavor or another. Do you see any "Linux-compatability" problems with any of the components??? I just want to be sure the components go together, and that they will work with a Linux OS. Thanks.

Here's what I am looking at:

Mobo: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128056

CPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819103243

PSU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139003

HDD: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136037

RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227296


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## kickback999 (Apr 14, 2008)

I don't see why not. Linux is generally more compatible than Windows with different hardware.
Except wireless cards.


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

LinuxQuestions.org maintains a hardware compatibility list that might be of use to you. 

EDIT: In fact, here is the page on your Gigabyte mobo. 

Peace...


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## oldgeez (Aug 23, 2007)

Trekguy,I have been doing some research into Linux,(being totally ignorant of)and you seem like a very intelligent person,so perhaps this link has already been accessed by you...but just in case you haven't,here is a link very useful for me.
http://www.linux.org/lessons/
Forgive me if you have already used this option...I'm just trying to help.


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> LinuxQuestions.org maintains a hardware compatibility list that might be of use to you.
> 
> EDIT: In fact, here is the page on your Gigabyte mobo.
> 
> Peace...


Changed my mind on the mobo... looking at something a bit newer. This one

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128056

isn't on the list that I could see... is that going to be a problem?


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

oldgeez said:


> Trekguy,I have been doing some research into Linux,(being totally ignorant of)and you seem like a very intelligent person,so perhaps this link has already been accessed by you...but just in case you haven't,here is a link very useful for me.
> http://www.linux.org/lessons/
> Forgive me if you have already used this option...I'm just trying to help.


Thanks for the link. :up:

A lot of it is about the command line stuff... scary.  I'm definitely a GUI person.


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> Changed my mind on the mobo... looking at something a bit newer. This one
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128056
> 
> isn't on the list that I could see... is that going to be a problem?


Keep in mind the list on LinuxQuestions.org isn't intended to be "complete". Of course I don't know for sure if this mobo will have any support issues or not but I would honestly be surprised if it did.

Peace...


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## Fidelista (Jan 17, 2004)

Good to research Linux before installing , I know I should have ! 
I have a old PC and decided to try a dual boot with XP --Ubuntu 8.4.
Partitioned leaving only min room for XP. 
Install went fine and system runs fine --*except *!!!
There is no simple way to connect to internet . 
Its seems that dial-up connections are a big problem .
I was not aware of that , my fault . I wouldnt have imagined a OS that difficult or impossible to use with a dial-up connection. 
I use Firefox with XP , and it is installed again with the Linux OS. 
I cant connect , in spite of trying to configure . 
So much for that machine I guess. 
Let the children use it for games . >f


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

>f, maybe someone here can help you with your dial-up??

Besides the dial-up thing, how do you like Ubuntu?

I think I've decided on Ubuntu, as well.

I'm hoping that GIANT title bar will go away with the actual installation...


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> I'm hoping that GIANT title bar will go away with the actual installation...


You can adjust the size and location of it. 

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> You can adjust the size and location of it.
> 
> Peace...


Even when running the LiveCD... or not until it's installed?

I tried while running the CD... but nothing would change.


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## Fidelista (Jan 17, 2004)

trekguy said:


> >f, maybe someone here can help you with your dial-up??
> 
> Besides the dial-up thing, how do you like Ubuntu?
> 
> ...


As a operating system for what I need -- I like it . 
I think it is well designed , and easy to use . 
Of course I am unable to connect to internet with a modem ....so thats not good . 
That should be warning to those with dial-up !. 
Other than that , its a pleasing system :up:.
I am very disappointed that I cannot use it . >f


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> Even when running the LiveCD... or not until it's installed?
> 
> I tried while running the CD... but nothing would change.


If you right click on the bar at the top of the screen and click "Properties", you should be able to set the size of it in pixels.

Peace...


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

Fidelista said:


> As a operating system for what I need -- I like it .
> I think it is well designed , and easy to use .
> Of course I am unable to connect to internet with a modem ....so thats not good .
> That should be warning to those with dial-up !.
> ...


Well, start a thread on the phone modem support issue and we'll see if we can get it figured out. 

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

More questions... 

Question about the Ubuntu releases. Apparently, a new version is released every six months. So, is it important to upgrade every time the new one comes out? Is this how all Linux distros work? What happens if you just stay put, and don't keep pace with the new releases? I noticed that Hardy Heron is designated as a LTS release... what makes that one different from some others??

So, if you install the new version, all your saved files will be wiped??? You have to back them up beforehand, and then reload??? I think I read somewhere that it's possible to save documents, music, pictures, etc on a different part of the hard drive... then you can keep upgrading the OS without losing stuff. ??? Is that correct??


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> So, is it important to upgrade every time the new one comes out?


It just depends on how current you want to stay. I prefer to stay current but others are still using older, long-term support releases.



> Is this how all Linux distros work?


Nope. It will vary from distro to distro.



> What happens if you just stay put, and don't keep pace with the new releases?


Your system should continue to work as normal.



> I noticed that Hardy Heron is designated as a LTS release... what makes that one different from some others??


The LTS (long term support) releases are releases that will be supported and maintained for 3 years (or some time frame like that). Non-LTS releases won't be supported or maintained for that amount of time. I would suggest installing Ubuntu 7.10 now and upgrade to 8.04 when that comes out in a couple of days. Then, stick with 8.04 until you're ready to migrate to the next LTS release. 



> So, if you install the new version, all your saved files will be wiped???


Nope.



> You have to back them up beforehand, and then reload???


It's always good to backup your data but the upgrade won't destroy anything. I've been through 2 Ubuntu upgrades now, from 6.06 to 7.04 and then to 7.10. I plan on migrating to 8.04 when that comes out.



> I think I read somewhere that it's possible to save documents, music, pictures, etc on a different part of the hard drive... then you can keep upgrading the OS without losing stuff. ??? Is that correct??


Yes, you can save your data in a filesystem that's separate from the OS but the OS upgrade won't touch your data _anyway_, at least not by design.

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> The LTS (long term support) releases are releases that will be supported and maintained for 3 years (or some time frame like that). Non-LTS releases won't be supported or maintained for that amount of time. I would suggest installing Ubuntu 7.10 now and upgrade to 8.04 when that comes out in a couple of days. Then, stick with 8.04 until you're ready to migrate to the next LTS release.
> Peace...


The parts for the new build aren't here yet, so by the time I get it assembled... 8.04 will be available. Do you think it would be better to do a full install of 8.04... or should I still install 7.10.... then upgrade?


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

I would do a full install of 8.04.

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

I downloaded 8.04 overnight.... FDM says it was successful... at 697mb.

But, it is no where to be found. ?? All that is in the "Linux" folder that I created is a torrent file... Ubuntu 8.04-desktop-amd64.iso. That's the right name... but it's only a 28kb file. ????


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## kickback999 (Apr 14, 2008)

Can you right click it in the torrent program and click open location?


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

kickback999 said:


> Can you right click it in the torrent program and click open location?


Ah yes, the torrent *program.* It would be helpful if I had one.  I've never used the torrent thing... didn't even know what it was. The link I found was for a torrent download... I thought that just meant "really fast"...so without a torrent program, I guess that all I got was the pointer file, or something.

I installed Bit Torrent, and downloaded 8.04 again. Wasn't any faster than some other downloads I've done ... 4 hours 24 minutes. It IS odd though... that for the first attempt, Free Download Manager actually showed a 100% download of 697mb in the completed list... never could find any trace of it. 

So, then of course I wanted to run it, and see how it looked. The version I got is for my new build... an AMD-64 system. My laptop is a 686 system... wouldn't work... duh.

 again.

UPS says my parts will be here Monday, so I'll have to wait til then. I'm guessing I may have a few more questions then!


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

Woohoo! I am running 8.04 Live CD on my first build, right now!!

I want to install it as the only OS on this machine, but am a little confused on what it's going to ask me about partitioning.

What should I do at that point??

Keep it simple please.


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

Went ahead and installed... it did it's thing with the partitions. It made a second one called "swap".

I haven't had much time to look around in it... but I have noticed one problem, so far. Java doesn't work. It tells me that I need a plugin, and I install it... but it still doesn't work. Then, it wants to install the needed plugin again... but when I try... it says it's already installed. Yet, Java does not work.

?????


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## kickback999 (Apr 14, 2008)

look for a java how to for ubuntu there should be one on the ubuntu website.


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

kickback999 said:


> look for a java how to for ubuntu there should be one on the ubuntu website.


I've looked there, and other places. I've tried IcedTea, which has worked for others. Sounds like I may have to wait for Java 7 for 64 bit to come out this summer.

I did get Flash working... and Evolution email set up. It appears that everything else is working good. It's still a little un-nerving, though... definitely out of the Windows comfort zone.


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

OK.. weird... this morning, it appears I have Java. The Java test says I have version 1.6.0 from Sun. ???

The little test aninmation works, but it says I do not have the current version available. Also, when I try work on a website at Yahoo/Geocities... it fails, and says "it appears that my browser does not support Java". ???

Booted to a black screen this AM... it was running, I could log in, and get the log in sound, but no picture. I restarted, and it was fine.... what was that??


Now, if I go back to Firefox 2, then I can use the 32 bit JRE stuff, even though my processor is AMD64??? If I select Firefox 2, it will automatically replace FF3B5???


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

Are you running a 32-bit or 64-bit version of Ubuntu?

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> Are you running a 32-bit or 64-bit version of Ubuntu?
> 
> Peace...


64


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

Welcome to the world of 64-bit computing!  A LOT of stuff won't work or can be made to work with some effort. There are efforts to get 64-bit Java and Flash working but they won't work as well as the 32-bit offerings do. My BEST advice to you is to register and ubuntuforums.org and scour the 64-bit Ubuntu users forum for tips, tricks, and answers. 

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> Welcome to the world of 64-bit computing!  A LOT of stuff won't work or can be made to work with some effort. There are efforts to get 64-bit Java and Flash working but they won't work as well as the 32-bit offerings do. My BEST advice to you is to register and ubuntuforums.org and scour the 64-bit Ubuntu users forum for tips, tricks, and answers.
> 
> Peace...


Yep, I'm there. Flash is working just fine, and Java works in some places... just not in Yahoo Page Builder...yet.

So far, I'm likin' the Ubuntu!! I even managed to rescue everything off of the hard drive from the old PC! It's a good day.


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

Just a quick update. Linux Ubuntu Hardy Heron is doin' the job so well! I will admit, I was a little concerned right away when the display quality wasn't what I had expected on my new build.. and I was getting an occasional black screen during login. When I built the PC, I installed Ubuntu only, but was considereding a reinstallation of XP to go along with it. Well, I installed the ATI driver that was available, and the display is perfect, and no more boot/video problems. I have not even thought about putting XP on it since that... I don't need it.

It's kinda funny, when I boot it up, and log in... I still find myself waiting for the OS to get to the point where I can proceed.... thing is, it's ready right away! I'm just so used to waiting for Windows to get there. 

I'm still waiting for Java 64 bit... and Flash movies can be hit or miss, (as they can with Windows, too, I guess).

In a nutshell, I would describe my Linux experience so far as.... clean and quick!


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## Flyingmunkie (Jun 25, 2007)

dont make the mistake i made... i went with backtrack as my first linux distro... its like trying to run before you can walk.... with 2 broken legs. but ubuntu and fedora are nice distros, slackware is fun too.


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## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

trekguy said:


> In a nutshell, I would describe my Linux experience so far as.... clean and quick!


How much time have you spent in a terminal window entering commands?

Peace...


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## trekguy (Nov 17, 2002)

tomdkat said:


> How much time have you spent in a terminal window entering commands?
> 
> Peace...


Not too much. When I was trying to get the Java/IcedTea thing figured out... I ran a few "sudo somethingorothers." 

And, it's working really well right now, so I don't want to mess it up.

:up:


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## Old Bob (Dec 18, 2004)

Tomdcat named the same distros that I would recommend, PClinuxOS & Ubuntu.

I have PClinuxOS 2007 on both my desktop and T-21 Thinkpad notebook.


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