# The Coronavirus - What's Happening Around the World



## Johnny b

I'd like to keep this thread as a chronicle of events and projections, how to address avoidance and how to react if infected.......not a 'scare' or 'hopeless' scenario.

Coronavirus is spreading.

Some current events:

*US prepares for possible coronavirus pandemic, WHO officials say Iran outbreak 'worrisome' *
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/02/21/coronavirus-latest-updates-outbreak.html

I usually shop in the early morning hours during the flu season to avoid crowds.
I am up to date on my flu and pneumonia shots, while they don't address coronavirus, I suspect it helps in avoiding complications with them.

( you all stay well )

Edited by Adminstrator Cookiegal with approval from the thread starter to include a link to the Johns Hopkins University's interractive map which is constantly updated to show the current statistics around the world:

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html

Second edit to add link exclusive to the U.S.:

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/us-map


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## Brigham

I am trying not to catch this new coronavirus a bit more seriously than I have done with some earlier ones. The reason being my age of 85. As I don't believe in an afterlife, I'm hanging on to the one I've got.


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## SeanLaurence

The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) generally suggests that only health care workers who are in close contact with people with influenza wear masks. The CDC doesn't recommend that people in public areas wear masks to protect themselves from influenza.
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/swine-flu/expert-answers/flu-mask/faq-20057878

Just wash your hands and avoid sick people.


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## Johnny b

Some info from The Guardian

* What is coronavirus and what should I do if I have symptoms? *

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ptoms-wuhan-china-how-does-it-spread-covid-19

This stands out:



> We don't yet know how dangerous the new coronavirus is, and we won't know until more data comes in. The mortality rate is around 2% in the epicentre of the outbreak, Hubei province, and less than that elsewhere. For comparison, seasonal flu typically has a mortality rate below 1% and is thought to cause about 400,000 deaths each year globally. Sars had a death rate of more than 10%.
> 
> Should we panic?
> 
> No. The spread of the virus outside China is worrying but not an unexpected development. The WHO has declared the outbreak to be a public health emergency of international concern. The key issues are how transmissible this new coronavirus is between people, and what proportion become severely ill and end up in hospital. Often viruses that spread easily tend to have a milder impact. Generally, the coronavirus appears to be hitting older people hardest, with few cases in children.


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## Johnny b

Just a caution.

I've noticed politically biased commentary being published.
Best to take advice and information that is derived from experts in the fields of medicine and communicable diseases rather than posers.


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## dotty999

I've noticed there's a lot of scaremongering going on


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## Johnny b

Conspiracy theorists adding political commentary, too.


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## Johnny b

The stock market appears in a panic.

The DOW 30 is currently down more than 1,000 points.


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## RT

dotty999 said:


> I've noticed there's a lot of scaremongering going on


I agree, there are some folks around here that won't even go a local Chinese restaurant even though the folks that run them are born American of oriental decent, haven't traveled at all because they work too hard to have time off.

It's kind of silly, unless you travel or live near a major travel city, or otherwise at risk from what is known so far.
It doesn't hurt to be cautious, but IMHO a good portion of the US population would be more in danger of the seasonal flu rather than coronavirus.


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## Johnny b

Some statistics/info so far. Known, tentative and unknown

* Coronavirus Disease 2019 vs. the Flu *
https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/hea...ronavirus/coronavirus-disease-2019-vs-the-flu

* Coronavirus (COVID-19) Mortality Rate *
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/coronavirus-death-rate/

* Coronavirus fatality rates vary wildly depending on age, gender and medical history - some patients fare much worse than others *
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/c...tients-fare-much-worse-than-others-2020-02-26


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## zx10guy




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## Johnny b

I suggest Drew Pinsky be recognized for what he is, a self promotion artist.
Look to recognized health organizations for information.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ve-speculation-about-hillary-clintons-health/

He even has attacked Trump.

https://globalnews.ca/news/2862461/...ld-trump-and-his-supporters-are-mentally-ill/


And there is this:
* Dr. Drew talks potential congressional run against Schiff - but only if he has to *
https://thehill.com/blogs/in-the-kn...ssional-run-against-schiff-but-only-if-he-has

edit:
And there is this: Pinsky's being promoted by Rush Limbaugh
https://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2020/02/28/dr-drew-pinsky-debunks-the-fake-coronavirus-news/
Pinsky:


> We used to point at the way Indiana responded to the opiate and the HIV epidemic as the model for the country. I don't know what they're talking about. The only reason I felt comfortable with Pence as Vice President was I was aware of his track record in Indiana in handling these serious problems, and they handled them better than most states did, almost any other state. So, I don't know what the hell people are talking about. That is fake news.


Consider:
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politi...n-hiv-outbreak-means-for-his-coronavirus-role


> Five years later, Indiana's public health funding ranks 49th out of all 50 U.S. states for public health funding per capita, according to the Trust for America's Health. ( edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trust_for_America's_Health )


Consider Pinsky as Fake News.

imo, he's looking like an attention whore with political ambitions.

Of course Trump wants all quite on the economic front.
With a market in decline, those with large debt loads have a lot to lose.

Of course, the Press needs to be accurate.
Of course the experts need to take the situation seriously.
But for Dr D to emotionally cry out 'Shut up' seems an argument for politically motivated ignorance.


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## Johnny b

Please, keep this thread oriented to the issue of a health problem, not the rants of self promoters like Pinsky or Mike Adams the Health Ranger.


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## zx10guy

It is health oriented. You can't dispute the fact more people die from the flu than COVID19. This is acknowledged fact. Where is the yearly hysteria around the tens of thousands that die from the flu? He has gone on record to say in the video I posted is you don't have to listen to him. Listen to Anthony Fauci. I'd sooner believe him than many of the mass shills that are looking for click bait or to drum up viewer ship. He has better established credentials than many of the alarmists.


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## Johnny b

zx10guy said:


> It is health oriented. You can't dispute the fact more people die from the flu than COVID19. This is acknowledged fact. Where is the yearly hysteria around the tens of thousands that die from the flu? He has gone on record to say in the video I posted is you don't have to listen to him. Listen to Anthony Fauci. I'd sooner believe him than many of the mass shills that are looking for click bait or to drum up viewer ship. He has better established credentials than many of the alarmists.


How about posting links to credible sources that define the issues rather than politically motivated provocateurs?
You seem to argue in that vein, so why post the scare tactic of Pinsky?


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## Johnny b

Anthony Fauci:

*The Trump administration barred a top US disease expert from speaking freely to the public after he warned the coronavirus might be impossible to contain *

https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-anthony-fauci-trump-admin-stops-discussion-2020-2

Anyone thinking there is no political connection to freedom of information about coronavirus hasn't been reading the news.


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## zx10guy

Scare tactic? I think you're the one looking to fear monger people. He's trying to give a dose of reality that people are blowing this way out of proportion. How is that trying to scare people? I don't need to post anything else as what he says in those videos are spot on.

He says people should practice proper hygiene. Wash their hands. How is that fear mongering? How is the total deaths from COVID19 so much more significant than the repeated yearly deaths from the flu? How is tha fear mongering? There is already a vaccine in phase 1 trial being tested in humans. I can tell you as a cancer survivor that I wish drugs would be rushed as fast as this vaccine has been. How is that fear mongering? He states cleary the ultimate authority everyone should be listening to is Anthony Fauci. How is that fear mongering?

You should follow your own advice about keeping this factual around health and put down your own political bias. As it's clear you can't separate your own politics from facts.


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## zx10guy

Ultimately, if there are any concerns, people should be talking to their doctors about this. Not clicking on click bait articles and threads on Internet or media outlets looking to drive up viewership.


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## Johnny b

zx10guy said:


> Scare tactic? I think you're the one looking to fear monger people. He's trying to give a dose of reality that people are blowing this way out of proportion. How is that trying to scare people? I don't need to post anything else as what he says in those videos are spot on.
> 
> He says people should practice proper hygiene. Wash their hands. How is that fear mongering? How is the total deaths from COVID19 so much more significant than the repeated yearly deaths from the flu? How is tha fear mongering? There is already a vaccine in phase 1 trial being tested in humans. I can tell you as a cancer survivor that I wish drugs would be rushed as fast as this vaccine has been. How is that fear mongering? He states cleary the ultimate authority everyone should be listening to is Anthony Fauci. How is that fear mongering?
> 
> You should follow your own advice about keeping this factual around health and put down your own political bias. As it's clear you can't separate your own politics from facts.





> Scare tactic?


Indeed!!!
For political advantage.



> I think you're the one looking to fear monger people.


You can think what ever you please.
But look at what you posted versus what I post and ask of you.
You failed to realize who you presented in videos.
Is that what you want to do?



> How is that trying to scare people?


Rather obvious to me.
It's about steering people's vote in the next election by not trusting recognizable authorities.
You merely presented a political argument whether you realize it or not.



> I don't need to post anything else as what he says in those videos are spot on.


You seem to be proving my point.
'The press should only be disseminating the thought's of Trump.'



> How is that fear mongering?


It's an issue of 'trust'.
He's presenting himself as the source while denying the press to quote other authorities...Fauci seems to be included.



> There is already a vaccine in phase 1 trial being tested in humans.


See what I mean.
You do not seem to understand the process of development of a vaccine and the time it takes from development to trials to actual production.
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/basics/test-approve.html

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/how-long-will-it-take-to-develop-vaccine-for-coronavirus
I've read elsewhere a rush job that goes well could take a minimum of 8 months.



> I can tell you as a cancer survivor that I wish drugs would be rushed as fast as this vaccine has been.


Who wouldn't.
And I can tell you I absolutely will not use my own health issue as an argument in any manner in this thread!
Yours as mine are irrelevant to the issue of a vaccine for the present coronaviris.



> You should follow your own advice about keeping this factual around health and put down your own political bias. As it's clear you can't separate your own politics from facts.


I suggest you reread the BS you first posted and compare it to the rest of this thread.


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## Johnny b

zx10guy said:


> Ultimately, if there are any concerns, people should be talking to their doctors about this. Not clicking on click bait articles and threads on Internet or media outlets looking to drive up viewership.


Indeed.

Include BS videos of politically motivated individuals with medical degrees.


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## Johnny b

I requested this thread be moved to Controversial Topics since politics has entered the thread.


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## zx10guy

More biased drivel from you. Still can't separate your own political biases and would rather sensationalize this as others to make yourself feel you're the authority of credible information.

Here's another source which down plays the hysteria you're putting forth:

https://www.goodmorningamerica.com/wellness/video/coronavirus-now-detected-60-countries-69303385

I'm sure you're going to find some political slant to discredit this.


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## zx10guy

https://www.cbs.com/shows/cbs_this_...ns-of-likely-coronavirus-quarantines-in-u-s-/

I'm sure you'll also find some political bias here too. Especially since the Dr says there's no need to panic.


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## Johnny b

zx10guy said:


> More biased drivel from you. Still can't separate your own political biases and would rather sensationalize this as others to make yourself feel you're the authority of credible information.
> 
> Here's another source which down plays the hysteria you're putting forth:
> 
> https://www.goodmorningamerica.com/wellness/video/coronavirus-now-detected-60-countries-69303385
> 
> I'm sure you're going to find some political slant to discredit this.





> More biased drivel from you.


I sense you are unhappy about something?

About the only comment I can make is no matter how I set my browser security, that video doesn't play 



> Here's another source which down plays the hysteria you're putting forth:


All I can say is, thank you for not posting another Pinsky video 

Trump and the common cold
*Rush Limbaugh on coronavirus: 'The common cold' that's being 'weaponized' against Trump*
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/02/25/limbaugh-coronavirus-trump/



> Just hours after World Health Organization officials said they are preparing for a "potential pandemic" as coronavirus cases increase worldwide, conservative radio host Rush Limbaugh told his listeners Monday that he would try to put the concerning news about the novel virus "in perspective" for them.
> 
> "It looks like the coronavirus is being weaponized as yet another element to bring down Donald Trump," Limbaugh said during his Monday show. "Now, I want to tell you the truth about the coronavirus. … Yeah, I'm dead right on this. The coronavirus is the common cold, folks."


Yeah buddy! 

But thanks for bringing out the political side to a pandemic, ZX10.
Killer colds invade the US, new evidence ofChicomm aggression. 



> I'm sure you're going to find some political slant to discredit this.


Do you live in a cave with out an Internet connection?


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## zx10guy

Yawn. For someone that pretended to make this factual about health only, you're constantly posting up political slanted articles. I've never said anything about Trump, Republicans, or Democrats. You're the one who can't help himself but bring those components in. You've yet to answer how this is worse than the yearly flu deaths that occur. And how is this worse than the other outbreaks such as H1N1, Bird Flu, SARS?

It's obvious you hadn't even viewed any of the videos I've posted. Go on keeping posting as you're reinforcing how much more of your real underlying agenda.

BTW, I have no issues playing those videos. So I would refrain from alluding to my lack of technological prowess when you can't even view a commonly open video.


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## Johnny b

zx10guy said:


> https://www.cbs.com/shows/cbs_this_...ns-of-likely-coronavirus-quarantines-in-u-s-/
> 
> I'm sure you'll also find some political bias here too. Especially since the Dr says there's no need to panic.


For some unknown reason (  )
All I'm seeing is:










I have absolutely no idea what you are trying to express 

Hopefully it didn't damage any young minds.


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## Johnny b

zx10guy said:


> Yawn. For someone that pretended to make this factual about health only, you're constantly posting up political slanted articles. I've never said anything about Trump, Republicans, or Democrats. You're the one who can't help himself but bring those components in. You've yet to answer how this is worse than the yearly flu deaths that occur. And how is this worse than the other outbreaks such as H1N1, Bird Flu, SARS?
> 
> It's obvious you hadn't even viewed any of the videos I've posted. Go on keeping posting as you're reinforcing how much more of your real underlying agenda.
> 
> BTW, I have no issues playing those videos. So I would refrain from alluding to my lack of technological prowess when you can't even view a commonly open video.


You entered the thread with a politically motivated Dr.
I showed the 'why'.

It's obvious you don't understand the political ramifications of blindly posting supposed authoritative commentary.

You admire Fauci but have no qualms about silencing him.

I think you are very confused, ZX.


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## Johnny b

zx10guy said:


> ................
> 
> BTW, I have no issues playing those videos. So I would refrain from alluding to my lack of technological prowess when you can't even view a commonly open video.


I can understand how you'd take that poorly


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## Johnny b

zx10guy said:


> Yawn. For someone that pretended to make this factual about health only, you're constantly posting up political slanted articles. I've never said anything about Trump, Republicans, or Democrats. You're the one who can't help himself but bring those components in. ...................


You sir, are the reason this thread is now in the debate forum.
You brought a political activist into the discussion where there had been no political discussions.

And so you try to 'yawn' away. your intentions.

What are your intentions?
If you want to post some facts about the coronavirus outbreak, please, do so.

If you want to discuss the political aspects of this virus, I've had this thread moved into this forum to do so.

You want to suppress the news media and restrict them to your thoughts, have at it.

Make your case as to why Fauci et al, should be ignored and Trump shills, media whores and the like should be acknowledged.

This thread was supposed to be about "What's Happening Around the World", but I moved it mostly for you.......so let's read about what's happening in your world


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## steppenwolf

Johnny b said:


> Anthony Fauci:
> 
> *The Trump administration barred a top US disease expert from speaking freely to the public after he warned the coronavirus might be impossible to contain *
> 
> https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-anthony-fauci-trump-admin-stops-discussion-2020-2
> 
> Anyone thinking there is no political connection to freedom of information about coronavirus hasn't been reading the news.


we could use some more depressing news for the economy


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## steppenwolf

if trump wins again will you go crazy johnny?


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## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> we could use some more depressing news for the economy


If you haven't been reading of market volatility the last 6-8 months, start watching the financial news sites this coming Monday to see how the Stock market further reacts to coronavirus.
And it's not really about mortality rates, it's about the potential fast spread that temporarily closes business functions and affects services and productivity.

Is the fall over?
Watch and see the coming weeks. 
The market was said to be over due for a large correction ( before the coronavirus outbreak happened ).


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## steppenwolf

thanks i could use some more depressing news


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## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> if trump wins again will you go crazy johnny?


No.
I'm financially well off enough to survive.

Will you go any crazier when either party wins?


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## steppenwolf

internet sites i see say stock up on food and shelves are empty in italy etc

do they talk about all that on the tv for the dumbed down masses ,CNN NBC msnbc?


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## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> thanks i could use some more depressing news


Are you still reading/watching Infowars and Prison Planet?


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## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> internet sites i see say stock up on food and shelves are empty in italy etc
> 
> do they talk about all that on the tv for the dumbed down masses ,CNN NBC msnbc?


I don't watch TV news.

Do you watch it?


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## steppenwolf

Johnny b said:


> No.
> I'm financially well off enough to survive.
> 
> Will you go any crazier when either party wins?


i did vote in primary for tulsi gabbard but if most dems win it will feel like being bossed around in 5th grade or Stalin i think

guess ill vote for trump

democrats are mainly bossy manipulative people and tax too much etc


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## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> i did vote in primary for tulsi gabbard but if most dems win it will feel like being bossed around in 5th grade or Stalin i think
> 
> guess ill vote for trump
> 
> democrats are mainly bossy manipulative people and tax too much etc


I'll take that as a 'Yes'


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## steppenwolf

i listen to some alex jones and i dont have tv except for old channels that play oldies

some CNN is on interent at times


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## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> i listen to some alex jones ............


We knew that


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## Johnny b

A good non political source for information:

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/index.html


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## steppenwolf

is that trumps CDC or obamas or crazy uncle joe biden??

did u vote for biden or bernie?


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## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> is that trumps CDC or obamas or crazy uncle joe biden??
> 
> did u vote for biden or bernie?


Go click on the link and figure it out on your own 

The Ohio primary hasn't happened yet and I'm not a registered Democrat, so you figure it out 
I belong to what used to be considered the Republican Party.
But I'll be going Independent this time around. The GOP seems strange to me with Trumpers, Teaparty and Libertarian extremists and the likes of GYM Jordan the accused assistant wrestling coach that allowed students to be sexually molested, in control.
I just don't relate to it.

And you?
Do you like Jordan?


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## steppenwolf

i dont know who Jordan is that is a weird question


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## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> i dont know who Jordan is that is a weird question


You don't know who Jim Jordan is?
He's a US Congressional Representative.
A past leader of the Freedom Caucus.
You know....the Tea Party extremists in the GOP.
He was big in the support of Trump during the Impeachment proceedings.

Do you like Jim 'gym' Jordan, politically?


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## Wino

I had a neighbor help me with some new furniture recently and next day he came down with diagnosed Flu B. Since I have COPD, just a common cold is a bear, so I was a bit concerned. Contact GP (I've had all my flu and pneumonia shots) and his comment was "unless they live with you, don't worry about it" - I thought he might prescribe one of the prevention meds, but no. Over two weeks ago, so guess I'm good to go. I'm thankful my work doesn't take me out to public places very often and I try to stay away from large gatherings, but still need to buy groceries and meds plus an occasional restaurant. I do take time to use the sani-wipes at and hand sanitizer's on grocery store basket handles, have always washed hands often and try to avoid sick people. I hope COVFEFE-45 is correct and this is blown out of proportion - would be first time he was correct on a subject, unfortunately all for reasons that have nothing to do with reality or science.


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## Johnny b

Since the intended topic has disappeared into politics and TV doctors, back to Pinsky.

Pinsky is basically a TV doctor.
As noted in a link I posted earlier, his TV show 
* Dr. Drew On Call * was cancelled because he diagnosed Hilary Clinton on a radio broadcast.
What was wrong?
He never met with Clinton. 
While doing an on air broadcast, he projected a diagnoses of Clinton after reading Breitbart News. Of course Breitbart being the domain of the likes of Steve Bannon the 'Nationalist', not much about Clinton was true or factual.
You can read about it here:
https://www.mediamatters.org/hillar...rew-apologizes-for-raising-unsubstanti/208063

Transcript of the broadcast:
https://freebeacon.com/politics/dr-drew-gravely-concerned-clintons-health-archaic-treatments/

Here is a link to Snopes displaying the fake medical report Pinsky seems to have referred to:
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/hillary-clinton-medical-records-leaked/

Review the first few minutes of the second video of Pinsky.




When he's calling for news outlets to be censured, his reason is essentially, how can he make a correct diagnoses from them?
Why isn't anyone challenging his logic?
Why isn't he going to the original sources of information to derive conclusions?
Maybe it's because his rant generates greater viewership? 
Maybe it's about politics?
Maybe it's about simply making a buck?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ve-speculation-about-hillary-clintons-health/


> It was Pinksy's second foray into the subject of Hillary Clinton's health, and the first one ended badly, as well. In January, he made reference on-air to Clinton's late return to the stage in a debate and cited a Breitbart News story, attributed to a "strong source," suggesting that it was due to "a flare-up of problems from" a "brain injury." In fact, she had only visited the restroom.




He claims to have worked with Fauci.
Pinsky is not a virologist.
The focus in his 'practice' is mostly about addictions.
And broadcasting on TV about it.
So where is the Fauci linkage.
I found this in relation to HIV/Aids:

* With alarming HIV numbers, doctors debate mandatory testing *
https://wtop.com/news/2012/11/with-alarming-hiv-numbers-doctors-debate-mandatory-testing/

He actually opposed him on the subject of testing.


> "We should make testing for HIV absolutely routine part of medical care," Fauci says. "Seventy two percent of the new infections among young people are attributed to male-to-male sexual conduct, and the stigma in society associated with that makes people want to stay below the radar and not go out and get tested."
> 
> "People between 13 and 65 should be routinely tested when they go to the doctor for any other reason."
> 
> Pinsky disagrees.
> 
> "I am very circumspect about mandatory interventions for medical treatments and screening," he says. "This new data that's come out will be a call to action, I'm sure. So there will be wider-spread screening. *To put a law on medical practice is always a bad idea."* (edit: this will crop up later)


So, who is Pinsky?
Sure, some will claim this is only a scandal rag, but linkage is given to verify claims.

* Sketchy things about Dr. Drew that everyone ignores *
https://www.nickiswift.com/26338/sketchy-things-dr-drew-everyone-ignores/

It becomes clear, he's an opportunistic TV doctor.
And now he's looking to break into politics.

His new angle:
* Dr. Drew Pinsky May Challenge Schiff: People Are Dying Out Here From Homeless Crisis, "I Am Sick Of Political Theater" *
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/v...ss_crisis_i_am_sick_of_political_theater.html

Political theater?
hmmm.
Like in videos or perhaps the bubonic plague?
Scare tactics anyone?

* Dr. Drew Pinsky: Entire Population of California Could Fall Victim To Bubonic Plague Due To Homelessness *
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/v...m_recirculation&spotim_referrer=recirculation

https://www.contagionlive.com/news/...homeless-problem-is-a-public-health-emergency


> People say it's complex; I think it's simple. First thing, I would go out and vaccinate all the homeless with MMR.


Anyone remember his position on legislating medical testing of AIDS?
He disagreed with Fauci and here he is contradicting his own prior position.
He's an opportunist. His arguments are based on convenience of opportunity.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/v...m_recirculation&spotim_referrer=recirculation


> I can't believe I live in a city where -- this is not third-world, this is Medieval. Third-world countries are insulted if they are accused of being like this. No city on earth tolerates on this. The entire population is at risk. And God forbid is measles. This is a population that's suboptimally immunized. If measles gets in, I just have an image of myself on my knees in the gutter tending to people.


Scare tactics anyone 
This is like.......a *'The News should shut the hell up and vote for me'* moment 

* How Many Must Die Before Officials Address California's Homeless Crisis? *
https://drdrew.com/2019/dr-drew-fox...fficials-address-californias-homeless-crisis/

And of course there is a video there of Dr Drew doing his rant.
Fox News and Dr Rant.
What a drama queen. 
Dr Drew obviously does not want you watching any news but his own.

Maybe he should shut the hell up and leave the current coronavirus outbreak to real professionals.

I will say this, Dr Drew's web site does list some cool T-shirts for sale 

https://merchmethod.com/products/dr...Website&utm_medium=DrDrew&utm_campaign=DrDrew

But $30 for a T-shirt? 

Isn't this how Alex and the health ranger started out?
Talking crap and selling stuff? 



> Entire Population of California Could Fall Victim To Bubonic Plague Due To Homelessness


But don't you dare to try reading about it in your favorite news source.


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## Johnny b

zx10guy said:


> ...................There is already a vaccine in phase 1 trial being tested in humans.....................


No!
That is false information.

Dated 2/24/20

* Moderna delivers first experimental coronavirus vaccine for human testing *
https://www.pharmacist.com/article/...xperimental-coronavirus-vaccine-human-testing



> The National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID) in Bethesda, MD, received the first batch of Moderna's coronavirus vaccine. NIAID researchers will use the vaccine to conduct the first human tests to determine if the experimental treatment will help suppress COVID-19 infections.* By the end of April, NIAID anticipates launching a clinical trial of about 20-25 healthy volunteers, *testing whether two doses of the vaccine are safe and result in an immune response likely to protect against infection, says NIAID director Anthony Fauci, MD. Initial results could become available in July or August.


Full story here, but there is a paywall

https://www.wsj.com/articles/drugma...navirus-vaccine-for-human-testing-11582579099

From one of the sources Pinsky probably doesn't want read:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-vaccine-moderna-human-testing/


> The therapeutics and vaccines company said it has shipped vials of the medicine, called mRNA-1273, to the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID) in Bethesda, Maryland. The NIAID expects to begin the clinical trial with 20 to 25 healthy subjects by the end of April to evaluate the vaccine's safety and efficacy against infection, the Wall Street Journal reported. That would mark a three-month period between vaccine design and human testing, with first results becoming available as early as July, according to the report.
> 
> "Going into a Phase One trial within three months of getting the sequence is unquestionably the world indoor record. Nothing has ever gone that fast," said Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of NIAID, according to the WSJ.


https://investors.modernatx.com/new...a-vaccine-against-novel-coronavirus-mrna-1273



> CAMBRIDGE, Mass.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Feb. 24, 2020-- Moderna, Inc., (Nasdaq: MRNA) a clinical stage biotechnology company pioneering messenger RNA (mRNA) therapeutics and vaccines to create a new generation of transformative medicines for patients today announced that it has released the first batch of mRNA-1273, the Company's vaccine against the novel coronavirus, for human use. Vials of mRNA-1273 have been shipped to the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID), a part of the National Institutes of Health (NIH) to be used in the planned Phase 1 study in the U.S.


Shipped is not the same as a human trial


----------



## Johnny b

Wino said:


> I had a neighbor help me with some new furniture recently and next day he came down with diagnosed Flu B. Since I have COPD, just a common cold is a bear, so I was a bit concerned. Contact GP (I've had all my flu and pneumonia shots) and his comment was "unless they live with you, don't worry about it" - I thought he might prescribe one of the prevention meds, but no. Over two weeks ago, so guess I'm good to go. I'm thankful my work doesn't take me out to public places very often and I try to stay away from large gatherings, but still need to buy groceries and meds plus an occasional restaurant. I do take time to use the sani-wipes at and hand sanitizer's on grocery store basket handles, have always washed hands often and try to avoid sick people. I hope COVFEFE-45 is correct and this is blown out of proportion - would be first time he was correct on a subject, unfortunately all for reasons that have nothing to do with reality or science.


I hope all goes well for you, Wayne.

I've avoided the scare mongers from the start, before making this thread.
Common sense goes a long way, imo.
Being aware is definitely important, but like all things, someone will overstate situations and before long there are 'lemmings at the brink' believing the weird.

There is bad information out there.

I wish Pinsky had never been introduced into this thread.
On a closer look, imo, he's running his own con.

One of the worst of fallacies. An appeal to emotion for his own personal gain.
There are 'news' outlets that are hyping the situation.

We've known each other a long time 
Stay well my friend, there are even more/greater interesting times to share in the future


----------



## Johnny b

Trump:

https://edition.cnn.com/asia/live-n...0-intl-hnk/h_cff8c5a607ff3f66be40cc4f1f9257bf


> "We have done an incredible job. We're going to continue," Trump said at an event with attendees of an African-American History Month reception in the Cabinet Room. "It's going to disappear. One day it's like a miracle, it will disappear. And from our shores, you know, it could get worse before it gets better. Could maybe go away. We'll see what happens. Nobody really knows."


Nobody knows. At this point. But we will.

dated 2/28/2020
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/202...d-coronavirus-testing-things-may-soon-improve


> The U. S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), in contrast, has done only 459 tests since the epidemic began. The rollout of a CDC-designed test kit to state and local labs has become a fiasco because it contained a faulty reagent. Labs around the country eager to test more suspected cases-and test them faster-have been unable to do so.


dated 2/29/2020
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/29/health/fda-coronavirus-testing.html


> The agency announced that it would allow hundreds of labs to test for the virus, circumventing the C.D.C.'s centralized testing system and making it likely that cases will be detected faster.


I hope that didn't scare anyone


----------



## Johnny b

Fear stalks the rightwing extremists:

2/28/2020

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/28/business/media/coronavirus-right-wing-media.html


> Mr. Limbaugh, who was awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by Mr. Trump this month, used his radio program this week to link the virus with the Democratic presidential front-runner, Senator Bernie Sanders of Vermont.
> 
> "Just keep in mind where the coronavirus came from," Mr. Limbaugh told listeners. "It came from a country that Bernie Sanders wants to turn the United States into a mirror image of: Communist China." (At a CNN town hall on Monday, Mr. Sanders, who identifies as a democratic socialist, described China as an "authoritarian country, becoming more and more authoritarian," adding that it had "taken more people out of extreme poverty" than any other nation.)


OMG....it's a chicom attack led by Bernie Sanders!!!!!!!!!!

I wonder if Dr Drew approves 

The 'war' rages on:
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/world/coronavirus-maps.html


----------



## Johnny b

https://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2020/02/28/dr-drew-pinsky-debunks-the-fake-coronavirus-news/

What an odd conversation.
Rush:


> "Fear helps make government more powerful - and it keeps them looking like our savior. That's something it helps to remember in situations like this.


What the........
About the claim Bernie was leading a chicom invasion?

Was this Trump approved logic? ( you know what I mean  )

Yes, I see your point, Rush.
So what's this deal with your claim about chicom aggression?
And Bernie leading it?

Can any of that be proven? 
I am shocked and appalled. (  )

Rush:


> That's not what they are saying. What they are saying is believe half of what you hear from the media because there's so much hype here for all kinds of reasons. .......


So ....which half of your chicom claim is hype?
I have an inquiring mind and I want to know!

Rush:


> And we are back, now, on this business of politicizing, I have it right here, in my formerly nicotine stained fingers, Gail Collins in The New York Times two days ago, "Let's Call It Trumpvirus. If You're Feeling Awful, You Know Who To Blame."
> 
> That's how it starts. And they get mad at me for claiming they are politicizing this and seeing an opening for the Democrats? You people in the media are so transparent now, you don't even see it yourselves.


Now I get it, don't pay attention to OpEd articles.

But wait a minute, aren't your comments, Rush, and the drama queen, Dr Rant, only opinions?

So which halves are BS?


----------



## Johnny b

From a news site that Dr Rant probably disapproves .......

* 'Seriously people - STOP BUYING MASKS!': Surgeon general says they won't protect from coronavirus *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...on-general-stop-buying-face-masks/4922614002/



> The surgeon general has a message for people who want to run out and stockpile masks to combat the coronavirus - don't.
> 
> "Seriously people - STOP BUYING MASKS!" Surgeon General Jerome Adams tweeted. "They are NOT effective in preventing general public from catching #Coronavirus, but if healthcare providers can't get them to care for sick patients, it puts them and our communities at risk!"


Maybe Dr Rant frequented Facebook or Twitter one too many times and forgot what a NEWS site looked like?


----------



## Johnny b

* 'We'll get through this': Pence says 'no question' there will be more coronavirus cases, but 'we're ready' *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...s-there-more-cases-but-were-ready/4922246002/



> "There will be more cases. There's no question," Pence said on NBC News' "Meet the Press." But he said "the vast majority of any American that would contract a coronavirus will, will be treated, they will recover."





> "I'll have one of the most renowned experts in infectious diseases literally joining my staff in the West Wing tomorrow. We're going to bring the best scientific minds, experts together," Pence said, "We're going to work every day to, to contain this disease, to treat those that are contracted."


It will be interesting....and telling....if 'do nothing' Pinsky shows up as an authoritative expert in Pence's task force.


----------



## Johnny b

In the mean time.....enjoy


----------



## Johnny b

It doesn't get much more political that this;

I read there was a complaint about Gail Collins' opinion column earlier but didn't read it all.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/26/opinion/coronavirus-trump.html
It's not a news article.
It's an OpEd article. 
And it is very interesting.

Consider this:

*Pence says Trump Jr. 'justified' to claim Democrats hope coronavirus 'kills millions' *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ush-limbaugh-coronavirus-comments/4923560002/



> Vice President Mike Pence on Sunday defended comments from President Trump and his supporters accusing Democrats of politicizing the COVID-19 coronavirus outbreak, including Donald Trump Jr.'s assertion that his father's opponents hope the disease "kills millions" of Americans.





> "Anything that they can use to try to hurt Trump, they will," Trump Jr. told Fox News. "For them to try to take a pandemic and seemingly hope that it comes here and kills millions of people so that they could end Donald Trump's streak of winning is a new level of sickness."
> 
> In response to those quotes, Pence turned the blame on the president's critics and told "Meet the Press" host Chuck Todd, "there's been a lot of irresponsible rhetoric" among Democrats and commentators.
> 
> "Name some names, sir," Todd shot back. "Because this just feels like gas-lighting. Please name some names."
> 
> *Pence pointed to a New York Times column written by Gail Collins that suggested the illness should be called the "Trumpvirus." *


At this point, I decided to read all of Collins ' OpEd piece.

If you read it and look for any suggestion that she is hoping for a health crisis, you'll only find that Trump jr and Pence are not telling the truth.
Collins is commenting on poor choices made, not the hope they fail. 
And she appears to have made some very strong and disturbing comments.
Certainly cynical, overwhelmingly disturbing.

Trump and his minions are fearful of their own actions and looking for someone to blame if health and economy turn sour under their watch.
Obviously, they will argue it's someone else's fault.


----------



## Johnny b

Don't anyone panic, it's just a positive financial news article (  )

* European stocks surge as central banks pledge to tackle coronavirus *
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/euro...s-pledge-to-tackle-coronavirus-084146648.html


----------



## Johnny b

Don't panic with this report either.
It's only about those chicoms led by Bernie Sanders ( ..... )

* Virus Drives China Factories to Record Slump, Dragging on Asia *
https://www.bloombergquint.com/chin...mmed-as-virus-sends-china-s-pmi-to-record-low



> (Bloomberg) -- Asia's manufacturing took a tumble in February under the weight of the rapidly spreading coronavirus, with a severe contraction in activity in China driving down output across the region. China's factory index from IHS Markit dropped to the lowest since the series began in 2004, according to figures released Monday. Reports in South Korea and Japan showed deeper slumps last month,












And that's the way it's going in China.


----------



## Johnny b

OMG! Another exploitive news article featuring fear. 
How long will this deluge of rational thought persist in the mass media?

* Coronavirus and its global sweep stokes fear over facts. Experts say it's unlikely to produce 'apocalyptic scenario' *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-facts-covid-19-spreads-worldwide/4892422002/



> Coronavirus is in the global spotlight, but a secondary character in this unfolding drama threatens to upstage the grim protagonist: fear.


Dr Rantsky....save us all, please.
I have an inquiring mind!!!!
Tell us what to do before those California rats over run the nation at the worst of time....and a whole nation dies from Bubonic Plague.






( And make sure it's approved by the Pence Task Force  )

 ....................

Funny thing.
Some people can't tell the difference between those two links 

( edit: btw, notice the news source hosting the good Dr lol! )


----------



## Johnny b

Real news:

Fauci corrects Trump's claim of a quick vaccine.

* Task force health expert contradicts Trump about coronavirus vaccine timing *
https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/02/politics/donald-trump-coronavirus-vaccine-push-back/index.html

CNN News video


----------



## Johnny b

Ignorance probably creates the greatest of fears.
What Pinsky and minions probably don't want you to read.

This is NOT a fear article, it's factual and what the public needs to know and consider
Read it for content and plan for it rationally.

* Feds strive to speed up coronavirus testing after CDC's slow start: 'The opportunity was missed' *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...dc-testing-kits-slowed-us-results/4930932002/



> Doctors are bracing for a rapid rise in U.S. coronavirus cases this week as state and local public health labs ramp up testing following weeks of delays due to a flawed test by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
> 
> CDC officials said all state and local public health labs and qualified private labs should be able to test by the end of this week. The agency also relaxed its strict testing guidelines.


( A link to a common sense position about school closings
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ine-florida-washington-california/4928377002/

Essentially use common sense and listen to qualified experts )



> The combination of functioning testing kits and robust testing capacity at state and local labs should give pubic health officials and doctors this week a better idea on the scope of the virus's spread in the United States and focus how to marshal limited resources.


With elements like Pinsky promoting censorship of the news, all you'd have to go on are your fears from ignorance and gossip.


----------



## Johnny b

* Fed cuts rates by 50 basis points amid coronavirus concerns*

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/fed-...ints-amid-coronavirus-concerns-150008506.html



> The Federal Reserve cut interest rates by 50 basis points in an impromptu meeting on Tuesday as a response to the coronavirus.
> 
> The Fed said the "fundamentals of the U.S. economy remain strong" but that the coronavirus "poses evolving risks to economic activity."
> 
> U.S. stocks jumped on the news of the rate cut on Tuesday, reversing earlier losses.


( To the best of my google abilities, this article has not yet been approved by Dr Drew, Rush Limbaugh or any member of the GOP ....so stay relaxed and don't panic. ) (  )


----------



## Brigham

One of the interesting facts about our immune system, is that one of the main parts of it, starts off at birth, or before, being very powerful, and as we go through our life, degenerates into just fatty tissue. This is the Thymus gland. By the time we get to middle age, this gland is nothing but fat. This is one of the reasons our bodies get old amd decrepit. I can vouch for that. Anybody interested should google Thymus gland.


----------



## Johnny b

There appears to be a false claim circulating Twitter and Facebook that tests for COVID-19 cost above $3000.
The test itself is actually free.

* How much does a coronavirus test cost? Fact check of COVID-19 medical bills finds that online rumor of a $3,000 charge is false *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-does-not-cost-3000-medical-bills/4949078002/


----------



## Johnny b

zx10guy said:


> https://www.cbs.com/shows/cbs_this_...ns-of-likely-coronavirus-quarantines-in-u-s-/
> 
> I'm sure you'll also find some political bias here too. Especially since the Dr says there's no need to panic.


Out of curiosity, I tried again to view the above link.
Only this morning, I used Palemoon browser with out any added extensions of any kind and all privacy settings set to default.

After several minutes of advertising, a CBS News discussion opened up with a doctor pointing out flaws in the early COVID-19 tests and how they were being rectified.
There was no fear factor, at all.
But at the same time it was critical of how the government handled the situation early on.

This is exactly the type of news broadcast Pinsky was trying to silence, government inefficiency.
'The News should shut up' solves the government's public relations problem with an upcoming election and worries over a stock market downturn. 

The link works. Just not in my Firefox browser.
And I do approve of it.


----------



## Johnny b

Anyone notice a difference of factual 'delivery'?


Dr D again:






Panic anyone......


----------



## Cookiegal

I get a message that the video is not available in my area (Canada) in Firefox and in Internet Explorer I got that initially and then it switched to an option to sign up and get one month free so I'd have to pay to view it. I wouldn't think that would be the case in the U.S. though.


----------



## Johnny b

Some myths and commonsense from the WHO

https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/advice-for-public/myth-busters


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> I get a message that the video is not available in my area (Canada) in Firefox and in Internet Explorer I got that initially and then it switched to an option to sign up and get one month free so I'd have to pay to view it. I wouldn't think that would be the case in the U.S. though.


In my Firefox browser, when the site opened with an error message, immediately below it the right was a very small menu window that led to a help page.
I tried the suggestions for FF, but the results were still the same.
There were other videos towards the bottom of the web page in question. Same problem with them. Wouldn't open. 1001 error.

Palemoon is a version of FF before FF 57. For what ever reason, with only the default browser settings, that web page opened.

Being on a Linux platform, none of the MS browsers are available to me.


----------



## Johnny b

Just a little humor:


----------



## Johnny b

* Coronavirus updates: Italy locks down much of the country's north; US death toll hits 19 *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/nlet...-employee-sxsw-grand-princess-who/4975400002/



> The Italian government, reeling from a one-day jump in coronavirus cases by 1,200, announced early Sunday that the entire Lombardy region, which includes Milan, would be put under lockdown, banning travel into or out of the area of 10 million people, as well as all public activity, including weddings, funerals and the cinema, according to media reports.
> 
> Both The Wall Street Journal and the New York Times reported that the quarantine decree drawn up by the Italian prime minister's office would also cover a number of northern provinces, including the region where Venice is located.


----------



## Johnny b

Time for a little humor


----------



## Johnny b

*The comprehensive Ars Technica guide to the coronavirus *

https://arstechnica.com/science/202...ive-ars-technica-guide-to-the-coronavirus/#h1


----------



## ckc17

Treat 'Advice' like drinking water. Be sure to know where it's coming from before you use it.


----------



## Johnny b

Indeed. :up:

Common sense is important, also.


----------



## Johnny b

Fauci:


----------



## RT

2twenty2 said:


> deleted


While that's about as clever a thing I've seen in a while Mr 2, I have to note one of my friends has contracted lyme, and it was years in the diagnoses.... but he's finally getting better.
And a few reports of cornoV have been reported in my state of TN of all places...

But I still like your pic


----------



## Johnny b

*Democratic lawmakers call on Republicans to apologize for 'bigoted' coronavirus language *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...slam-bigoted-language-republicans/5016354002/


----------



## Johnny b

content removed by moderator...


----------



## 2twenty2

RT said:


> While that's about as clever a thing I've seen in a while Mr 2, I have to note one of my friends has contracted lyme, and it was years in the diagnoses.... but he's finally getting better.
> And a few reports of cornoV have been reported in my state of TN of all places...
> 
> But I still like your pic


I probably shouldn't have posted that.

I meant no disrespect to anyone. I'm glad to hear your friend is getting better. We also have Corona virus in my area. I was out the other day (groceries) and noticed how few others were out and about. There is a coffee shop near by that I frequented every day until about three weeks ago, afraid to go there because of COVID-19. I'm constantly washing and sanitizing my hands.


----------



## Cookiegal

Just an FYI that 2twenty2 reported his own post asking that it be deleted if we find it offensive. We feel that some may not appreciate the humour given the seriousness of the current situation so we have opted to delete it. We also understand that it wasn't posted with any malice or intent to offend anyone.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> Just an FYI that 2twenty2 reported his own post asking that it be deleted if we find it offensive. We feel that some may not appreciate the humour given the seriousness of the current situation so we have opted to delete it. We also understand that it wasn't posted with any malice or intent to offend anyone.


Thank you


----------



## Cookiegal




----------



## Johnny b

I wasn't offended.
Much like the humor of the comic strip, The Far Side.

Sometimes a mildly dark humor does take the edge off of things, especially when those times are stressful.

Shall we say...a nervous laugh 


I can say things seriously and really get a lot of backlash


----------



## Wino

I found it humorous and apropos for subject of this thread. We have nothing to worry about I've been told.


----------



## valis

aaaaand now it's a pandemic officially. Houston just cancelled the rodeo a third of the way through as well....

https://gizmodo.com/who-officially-declares-a-pandemic-decries-alarming-le-1842270014


----------



## Johnny b

That inconsequential virus is about to be declared a national disaster:

https://www.reuters.com/article/hea...for-coronavirus-source-familiar-idUSL1N2B41MN



> WASHINGTON, March 11 (Reuters) - U.S. President Donald Trump is considering a declaring a national disaster to free up funds for the federal government's response to the fast-spreading coronavirus outbreak, a source familiar with the matter said on Wednesday.


Fair question: how bad is this pandemic if Trump is backpedaling this early?


----------



## Johnny b

*70 of 92 coronavirus cases in Massachusetts linked to Biogen employees after biotech firm's Boston meeting *

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/11/health/coronavirus-massachusetts-state-of-emergency/index.html


----------



## Johnny b

*President Trump to deliver Oval Office address on coronavirus pandemic *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...u-s-response-coronavirus-pandemic/5022464002/



> Trump initially said that his remarks would "probably" take place 8 p.m. EDT. He later tweeted that he would be "addressing the Nation this evening" at 9 p.m. EDT.
> 
> Trump declined to say whether he would announce additional travel restrictions or a national emergency. He said there would be economic and health announcements during his statement.


----------



## valis

NBA just suspended the season, and apparently Tom Hanks and his wife have it...getting very real very fast...


----------



## Wino

I'm not looking forward to opening bell manana !!

The idiot spoke tonight with such wisdom.


----------



## valis

Apparently he said something about banning incoming air traffic from Europe?


----------



## Johnny b

Except from the UK.

* Coronavirus: Trump bans travel from Europe to the US but exempts UK *
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...avel-uk-speech-countries-latest-a9396086.html

https://www.usatoday.com/story/trav...ould-know-after-europe-travel-ban/5027638002/


> These countries include Austria, Belgium, Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Malta, Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden and Switzerland.


----------



## Johnny b

Wino said:


> I'm not looking forward to opening bell manana !!
> 
> The idiot spoke tonight with such wisdom.


* Trump address sparks chaos as coronavirus crisis deepens *
https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/12/politics/donald-trump-coronavirus-europe-travel/index.html

Aside from that ^ (  ) a terrible speaking presence and an apparent need for a decongestant made for a poor announcement. imho of course.


----------



## Johnny b

Wino said:


> I'm not looking forward to opening bell manana !!
> 
> The idiot spoke tonight with such wisdom.


Dow Futures this morning 6:30 AM


----------



## Wino

I'm guessing my stock portfolio will fall to >50% drop since the stable genius spoke - it's already at 45%. If it will cause the demise of the gargoyle, I can live with it.

Orange Blob says he hasn't been tested - after seeing excerpts of his putrid fireside chat to the nation, I'd suggest he do so or at least blow his nose before the cameras roll. Speech sounded like an autotron with a bad case of cocaine nose. What a waste of space.

The Fed has few tools to fight this downturn as they've already used most to make the economy look good for the Trumpin Fuhrer and the buzzards are coming home to roost.

EDIT: It's official down 55%.


----------



## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> thanks i could use some more depressing news


Satisfied?


----------



## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> if trump wins again will you go crazy johnny?


No, but I will question the sanity of those that support and vote for him again.


----------



## Couriant

For thoses interested in a real time outlook, here is an interactive map:

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html

Yes this is the real one and not one that fake one...


----------



## Johnny b

Couriant said:


> For thoses interested in a real time outlook, here is an interactive map:
> 
> https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html
> 
> Yes this is the real one and not one that fake one...


Is my link here, the fake one?

https://forums.techguy.org/threads/...-around-the-world.1240672/page-6#post-9682455

If so I'd like it removed.

edit: I've made a formal request the link I posted be removed.


----------



## 2twenty2

Like the NBA the NHL has now suspended games until further notice


----------



## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> Is my link here, the fake one?
> 
> https://forums.techguy.org/threads/...-around-the-world.1240672/page-6#post-9682455
> 
> If so I'd like it removed.
> 
> edit: I've made a formal request the link I posted be removed.


I would say, just to be safe, link to the official site as there will be others that are bad as noted in the link i mentioned on the fake ones. I'm sure arcgis is fine though..


----------



## Johnny b

It wouldn't offend me if that whole post of mine disappeared just to be safe.


----------



## Gr3iz

NASCAR is going to run it's next two races (Atlanta and Miami) with nobody in attendance! Only drivers, minimal crews, NASCAR officials and the media will be allowed in. So far ...


----------



## valis

Johnny b said:


> It wouldn't offend me if that whole post of mine disappeared just to be safe.


I yanked it for you Johnny...thanks for the heads up...


----------



## Johnny b

Thanks Tim.

Better safe than sorry.


----------



## RT

Better safe than sorry I reckon, and this is not a good time to watch movies like Outbreak or Contagion...

Of course I'm nearly out of hand sanitizer and toilet paper, not because of panic, it's been on my list as a matter of replenishing normal daily use supplies...it's the timing of it all.
It was on my list before it became national news.

Just like I just happen to out of bread, milk and eggs before a snow event is fore casted 

I'm going to say now, perhaps contrary to I've said before, that this a concern, because it has killed people... and it has turned into a major economic, political, and health issues that might be best addressed by "nipping it in the bud"

Sooo... it is rather concerning when you learn that a person working at a restaurant nearby tested positive and has been serving who knows how many people.

The saying goes the if *YOU* are the one with the tooth ache, the mysteries of life, the universe and everything mean nothing...

So not sure I had point here that matters, and if I did, it'll be lost by the next page anyway...

Carry on, my wayward friends.


----------



## Johnny b

I vaguely remember Outbreak, but only that Dustin Hoffman and Rene Russo were in it.
Only saw it once, I think on cable TV.

Haven't seen Contagion and probably won't.

I remember watching The Andromeda Strain years ago. 
But after you've seen it once, the suspense is gone. The ending seemed too simplistic.

I remember watching The Last Man on Earth at the drive-ins with several of my high school friends and re-watched it last spring or so. Campy but really lost something over time.

I would like to see the remake with Heston, The Omega Man, again.

I think I have last remake ( that I'm aware of) with Will Smith, I Am Legend somewhere in my DVD collection.
If I find it, I think I'll give it a spin in a day or two.


----------



## Johnny b

Perhaps some good news on the economic front.
Only time will tell.

This morning, at ~5am, DOW Futures are in the positive at +537.


edit: a little after 8am.......up....+1,110


----------



## 2twenty2

Gr3iz said:


> NASCAR is going to run it's next two races (Atlanta and Miami) with nobody in attendance! Only drivers, minimal crews, NASCAR officials and the media will be allowed in. So far ...


Looks like golf will continue also but with nobody in attendance same as NASCAR


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> Is my link here, the fake one?
> 
> https://forums.techguy.org/threads/...-around-the-world.1240672/page-6#post-9682455
> 
> If so I'd like it removed.


It was not fake John. The information displayed at John's Hopkins University is gleaned from the arcgis.com web site. In fact, on the JHU site the graph won't display for me unless I enable arcgis.com in NoScript (Firefox).

Edit: It seems arcgis.com only supplied the background and some icons needed for the interactive map to display. However, the information it contained was the correct information but of course it's best to keep it from the source, JHU. Carry on.


----------



## Cookiegal

Couriant said:


> For thoses interested in a real time outlook, here is an interactive map:


Oddly Canada is not shown there and we have 157 confirmed cases.

Our own Prime Minster's wife has been confirmed infected so they are both in 14-day isolation:

https://globalnews.ca/news/6670203/sophie-gregoire-trudeau-coronavirus-positive/

I do volunteer work at a senior's residence and yesterday I was told that all non-essential visits have been cancelled indefinitely.


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> Oddly Canada is not shown there and we have 157 confirmed cases.
> 
> Our own Prime Minster's wife has been confirmed infected so they are both in 14-day isolation:
> 
> https://globalnews.ca/news/6670203/sophie-gregoire-trudeau-coronavirus-positive/
> 
> I do volunteer work at a senior's residence and yesterday I was told that all non-essential visits have been cancelled indefinitely.


I just checked the Johns Hopkins map.
6 provinces are showing positive cases at the moment.


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> I just checked the Johns Hopkins map.
> 6 provinces are showing positive cases at the moment.


Yes they are showing on the map but what I meant was Canada isn't listed on the left side under the heading "Confirmed cases by Country/Region/Sovereignty".


----------



## Johnny b

That is odd.


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> That is odd.


It's because we're speshul.


----------



## Cookiegal

John,

Do you think it would be a good idea for me to edit the first post in this thread to include that link to JHU for easier reference?


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> John,
> 
> Do you think it would be a good idea for me to edit the first post in this thread to include that link to JHU for easier reference?


That's a good idea.....:up:


----------



## Wino

Cookiegal said:


> It's because we're speshul.


Guess you missed the news this morning - Trump annexed Canada. You are now subject to deportation.


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> That's a good idea.....


I just did that. It will be much easier to refer people to the initial post to find the current statistics there.


----------



## Cookiegal

Wino said:


> Guess you missed the news this morning - Trump annexed Canada. You are now subject to deportation.


That might not be a bad thing. Then maybe we could speak English in Quebec.


----------



## Gr3iz

2twenty2 said:


> Looks like golf will continue also but with nobody in attendance same as NASCAR


Well, I guess we're SOL, knuck. Races are postponed for at least the next two weeks ...


----------



## RT

I now think we'll all be safe as long as we just stay on TSG, and exchange only virtual hand shakes and hugs... for the time being.

Ya don't need to pay $100 for 8 ounces of hand sanitizer on eBay, I'm working on a mix of vodka and green Jello, available for half that price


----------



## Johnny b

N95 masks I've got ( from my allergy days in the past ), hand towels and toilet paper I have enough, but I'm getting low on apples and oranges.
I could use a few more snacks, too.

I'll shop Walmart a little later this morning and report back on what I see.


----------



## Johnny b

Jim Bakker is back in the news.

* Missouri attorney general files suit against 'Jim Bakker Show' over coronavirus 'cure' *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...souri-attorney-general-files-suit/5032998002/



> A spokesperson with the Missouri Attorney General's Office told the News-Leader on Tuesday morning that the office filed suit against "The Jim Bakker Show" operation near Branson.
> 
> Spokesman Chris Nuelle said in an email that the goal of the suit is "to stop (Bakker) from selling that coronavirus 'cure,' " a product known as "silver solution" that was priced at $80 or more on Bakker's show.
> 
> Documents were filed Monday in Stone County, Nuelle said, naming televangelist Jim Bakker and his Morningside Church Productions as defendants.
> 
> "Anyone who has bought 'Silver Solution' from 'The Jim Bakker Show' should know that it cannot cure or treat coronavirus," Attorney General Eric Schmitt's office said in a news release, which referred to the product as a "fake."


Shameful. Despicable.

Alex Jones has been mentioned elsewhere.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...op-selling-fake-coronavirus-cures/5044309002/


----------



## Johnny b

Just got back from Walmart.

Pretty much what I expected.
All toilet paper and paper towels are sold out.
Cleaning supplies still on the shelves, but many popular brands are running low.
Much of the canned goods are running low, several like low sodium completely gone.
No bar soap.
No apple juice.
Plenty of lemonade.

Really good apples and oranges, though. Shelves/bins mostly full.

Only dried beans left were my favorites, Small Reds.


While not crowded at 6:30am, there were more shoppers than usual.


----------



## RT

Johnny b said:


> ~~I'll shop Walmart a little later this morning and report back on what I see.


Umm, with the deepest respect John, you are brave going to mega mart like that, but methinks you might spend some time in the canned bean area,


----------



## Wino

Yesterday noonish went shopping for bagged corn beef, cabbage and taters. Was amazed at the ignorance of the hoarders and the stupidity of those that had filled baskets with food stuffs including perishables (milk, butter, frozen food, ice cream) and then just abandoned them as they got tired waiting in the long lines and just pushed in to a corner/nook and walked away. Arguing over TP and other paper products. Shelves were bare in some areas - water, TP, paper towels. Took me about 45 minutes to check out thru "express" lane 15 items or less - couldn't get into self-checkout. People were all mostly in a snit. Kinda gave me an insight into why Turnip got elected - people are really assholes.

The corned beef, cabbage and potatoes were excellent chased down with Guinness Stout. Hopefully, the sniffling, nose blowing lady before me in line just had a cold. I'd really be pissed getting sick celebrating my heritage.


----------



## Johnny b

RT said:


> Umm, with the deepest respect John, you are brave going to mega mart like that, but methinks you might spend some time in the canned bean area,


Brave, umm..no, not really.
I do wear a mask these days because you just don't know your fellow man and how responsible they are.

Reality....any product sitting on a shelf any where has been touched by human hands.
Even breathed on. An employee situation. Doesn't matter if it's a Walmart or a small convenience store.

Same if you pump your own gasoline at the gas station. Someone else (actually many) have touched that pump handle , and recently 

Common sense, frequently washing your hands will go a long way for good health.
Staying out of crowds is wise.

Only dried beans for me these days. None of that canned 'stuff'.


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> Same if you pump your own gasoline at the gas station. Someone else (actually many) have touched that pump handle , and recently


Our local gas stations started supplying gloves several months ago. I was glad because for me it was more for the smell of gas if you get any on your hands and I would always go in a wash my hands after filling up. Now I don't have to do that.

I hear it was mad yesterday in the groceries. I stayed home. But I did need a few things like apples, bananas, potatoes and eggs so I went very early this morning and got those. There were more people than usual at that hour but it wasn't that busy which was nice.

I always wipe down the cart handles myself so that doesn't change anything.

Once I get home I immediately give my hands a thorough washing and wash my face as well to hopefully remove anything that may have been floating in the air. Then I unpack my groceries and put them away. Then I wash my hands again afterwards.

During all of this time I never touch my face with my hands. Wouldn't you know my nose always starts to run or itch but that's what sleeves and scarves are for.


----------



## Cookiegal

Well Canada finally made it into the list.


----------



## 2twenty2

Wino said:


> Guess you missed the news this morning - Trump annexed Canada. You are now subject to deportation.


----------



## dotty999

Here in the UK there is panic buying everywhere! Empty shelves in most shops, many have sold out of antibacterial hand wash and toilet rolls!


----------



## Wino

dotty999 said:


> Here in the UK there is panic buying everywhere! Empty shelves in most shops, many have sold out of antibacterial hand wash and toilet rolls!


Same stupidity here in USA. Herd mentality and so unnecessary.


----------



## Guyzer

I blame the retailers for a lot of the shopping frenzy because they don't limit the amount a purchaser can get.

I used my phone video 5 minutes before my local Costco opened the other day from my car. 
The lineup to get in was unbelievable. If I said 150 yards long I wouldn't be exaggerating. I'd post it
here but there's quite a bit of foul language and a couple of threats against me. Seems some people
don't like being recorded doing ridiculous stuff. I actually wanted to buy some items other than cleaning
supplies and toilet paper but I wasn't about to stand in line for hours so I drove off.

Lot's of stories regarding bottom feeding scum preying on others stupidity. 
Beside the one in the link below there's another that comes to mind. 
Google " man buys all the thermometers ". I'd post a link to it but once again there's 
written profanity and this is a family site.

Amazon has suspended the account of the bottom feeders in the following link as of yesterday I believe.

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5496733?fb...fih5ixtEr0J21Vb77abOj6rySi0P1kzgWYOUm13UNnxZ8


----------



## Johnny b

*Don't worry-it's still safe to order stuff online during the coronavirus outbreak *
https://www.reviewed.com/home-outdo...=usat&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=collab



> Here's how to keep yourself and your packages germ-free.


----------



## Cookiegal

It should be illegal to scam people by buying up stuff like hand sanitizer and then selling it for $100.00. That is extortion or at least some sort of fraud in my opinion. They should be prosecuted. But this is not new on sites like Amazon. When I shop for stuff that I can't find locally I can often find it there but at 10 or more times the price.

These hoarders are making it more difficult for people who just need a few things like milk, bread and eggs to get them. I buy stuff like toilet paper and paper towels when it's on sale and stock up then so I always have it and there's no need to run out and buy more now.


----------



## Johnny b

I've always stocked up on bargains, so I had no shortages with this coming pandemic.

I'm sort of a 'prepper', but not into the survivalist extremes.

About the only things I need soon are some meds for high blood pressure that I ordered 2 days ago. They're in stock this morning, but the Kroger pharmacy doesn't open until 11 am and if it's crowded, I can skip it for a week or two until shoppers stop panicking.

I have my own well, so water's not a problem and if the power goes out, I also have a portable generator.
As long as Spectrum keeps juicing their cable, I'll even be able to keep posting here at TSG lol!

And I have lots of beans 

An oldie from the past:
Land of Confusion


----------



## Wino

Cookiegal said:


> It should be illegal to scam people by buying up stuff like hand sanitizer and then selling it for $100.00. That is extortion or at least some sort of fraud in my opinion. They should be prosecuted. But this is not new on sites like Amazon. When I shop for stuff that I can't find locally I can often find it there but at 10 or more times the price.
> 
> These hoarders are making it more difficult for people who just need a few things like milk, bread and eggs to get them. *I buy stuff like toilet paper and paper towels when it's on sale and stock up then so I always have it and there's no need to run out and buy more now.*


Exactamundo !! Essentials (TP, paper towels, OTC meds, ammo, dry goods, bottled water, beer, soft drinks, etc) I buy when on sale whether I need or not as it will not go to waste and eventually used. Haven't had to buy TP in months and still good to 'go' for another month or so. On the other hand, you have to give the "hoarders" entrepreneurial spirit credit for knowing how stupid the average American can be (Canadian in your case). I'm not a 'prepper', but have sufficient fresh, frozen, canned and dry goods to get me thru a month or more - done without any planning or thinking about it - just seems normal to me. If power gone for long period, will thaw and smoke meats to extend their life (and mine).

While the flu affects a wider range, it's the gougers that descend after hurricanes, tornadoes, fires, etal that really need prosecution, but this COVID-19 isn't the same IMHO. There is absolutely no reason for what's happening in regards to dry goods and groceries.


----------



## Johnny b

Krogers this morning was busy but no panic buying.

I didn't walk the store, but what I saw of the food isles seemed well stocked.


----------



## valis

hit Target today, no issues except long lines...added about 15 minutes...but no empty shelves...


----------



## Cookiegal

Wino said:


> Haven't had to buy TP in months and still good to 'go' for another month or so


Good one!


----------



## Johnny b

If this news article is correct, the US is going to look horribly immoral and ugly to the rest of the world.

* Trump 'offers large sums' for exclusive access to coronavirus vaccine *
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...s-for-exclusive-access-to-coronavirus-vaccine



> The German government is trying to fight off what it sees as an aggressive takeover bid by the US, the broadsheet Die Welt reports, citing German government circles.
> 
> The US president had offered the Tübingen-based biopharmaceutical company CureVac "large sums of money" to gain exclusive access to their work, wrote Die Welt.
> 
> According to an anonymous source quoted in the newspaper, Trump was doing everything to secure a vaccine against the coronavirus for the US, "but for the US only".


I hope that isn't true.

edit:
Also reporting:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...way-firm-working-coronavirus-vaccine-n1159426


----------



## Couriant

Cookiegal said:


> John,
> 
> Do you think it would be a good idea for me to edit the first post in this thread to include that link to JHU for easier reference?


ARCgis was confirmed to be safe, but it's the same one as JHU


----------



## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> If this news article is correct, the US is going to look horribly immoral and ugly to the rest of the world.
> 
> * Trump 'offers large sums' for exclusive access to coronavirus vaccine *
> https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...s-for-exclusive-access-to-coronavirus-vaccine
> 
> *I hope that isn't true.*
> 
> edit:
> Also reporting:
> 
> https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...way-firm-working-coronavirus-vaccine-n1159426


The problem with this president is that it can very well be true, and I do believe it... considering he was trying to make deals with Germany themselves and was told that he had to make them with the EU... and had to be told so many times before he got it... :/


----------



## Cookiegal

Couriant said:


> ARCgis was confirmed to be safe, but it's the same one as JHU


Yes I was aware of that but thanks for confirming it.


----------



## dotty999

UK panic buying! I always buy anti bacterial hand wash but no doubt that will be in short supply soon. I went to Liverpool today and noted many non Brits were wearing face masks!


----------



## 2twenty2

https://krebsonsecurity.com/2020/03/live-coronavirus-map-used-to-spread-malware/



> Live Coronavirus Map Used to Spread Malware
> 
> Cybercriminals constantly latch on to news items that captivate the public's attention, but usually they do so by sensationalizing the topic or spreading misinformation about it. Recently, however, cybercrooks have started disseminating real-time, accurate information about global infection rates tied to the Coronavirus/COVID-19 pandemic in a bid to infect computers with malicious software.


----------



## dotty999

just chill, what will be will be and I'm gonna just carry on as normal


----------



## Johnny b

With poor leadership in a crisis, comes fear. Overwhelming irrational fear. Not just about the disease or panic buying, now it's a fear for personal safety.

*It's not just toilet paper: People line up to buy guns, ammo over coronavirus concerns *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...eople-line-up-gun-stores-stock-up/5054436002/

Now we have to worry about recent buyers carrying illegally and with out any gun safety training


----------



## Wino

Excerpt from Reuters article:



> "At every turn, President Trump's policy regarding coronavirus has unfolded as if guided by one rule: How can I make this crisis worse?................................................
> 
> More people will get sick because of his presidency than if somebody else were in charge. More people will suffer the financial hardship of sickness because of his presidency than if somebody else were in charge. The medical crisis will arrive faster and last longer than if somebody else were in charge. So, too, the economic crisis. More people will lose their jobs than if somebody else were in charge. More businesses will be pushed into bankruptcy than if somebody else were in charge. More savers will lose more savings than if somebody else were in charge. The damage to America's global leadership will be greater than if somebody else were in charge.
> There is always something malign in Trump's incompetence. He has no care or concern for others; he cannot absorb the trouble and suffering of others as real. He monotones his way through words of love and compassion, but those words plainly have no content or meaning for him. The only thing that is real is his squalid vanity. This virus threatens to pierce that vanity, so he denied it as long as he could. What he refuses to acknowledge cannot be real, can it?
> 
> And even now that he has acknowledged the crisis, he still cannot act, because he does not know what to do. His only goal now is to shove blame onto others. Americans have to face the fact that in the grip of this pandemic, the Oval Office is for all practical purposes as empty as the glazed eyes of the man who spoke from that office tonight."


----------



## Johnny b

The sad part about Trump's condition is that it was evident long before becoming President.


----------



## Cookiegal

2twenty2 said:


> https://krebsonsecurity.com/2020/03/live-coronavirus-map-used-to-spread-malware/


All the more reason not to have Java installed. The exploit can't work without it.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> All the more reason not to have Java installed. The exploit can't work without it.


----------



## Cookiegal

dotty999 said:


> just chill, what will be will be and I'm gonna just carry on as normal


Well here's the thing, to be responsible you can't just carry on as normal, you have to be more careful and distance yourself from others for the recommended two weeks and only go out if it's absolutely essential. This is the new normal for the time being. We all have to do our part to try to contain this even if it means a bit of inconvenience for a couple of weeks.

Maybe it's a good time to get an early start on Spring cleaning or catch up on some reading or binge TV watching.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> Well here's the thing, to be responsible you can't just carry on as normal, you have to be more careful and distance yourself from others for the recommended two weeks and only go out if it's absolutely essential. This is the new normal for the time being. We all have to do our part to try to contain this even if it means a bit of inconvenience for a couple of weeks.
> 
> *Maybe it's a good time to get an early start on Spring cleaning or catch up on some reading or binge TV watching.*


Or hangout here at TSG


----------



## Cookiegal

2twenty2 said:


> Or hangout here at TSG


Of course, that goes without saying. But I can only do so many hours before my eyes burn out of my head.


----------



## Wino

Apparently the investment world not real thrilled with Powell's interest rate cut, kowtowing to the unstable genius. Just used the last of their ammo/tools to combat Twits inability to lead or think coherently without going into negative territory. My stock portfolio down 54% since latest fall. Too late to get out. Can only hope for the best - end of Turnips reign.


----------



## Wino

Finally getting a real close look at this corona virus. Seems the genesis was COVFEFE-45 from 2017 which accounts for it's nasty mutation.


----------



## Johnny b

The Ohio primary has been canceled.


----------



## Snuffleufflegus

It is the same here in eastport,maine.
All the shelves are wiped clean.Mainly toilet paper,hand sanitizer's,lysol,and in other department's, ALL the chicken,most but not all of most other meats,and dry goods.
I actually watched a fight break out between 3 women over the last roll of toilet paper.While one woman had her cart rounded with the toilet paper,the other two (elderly) women had asked her if they could at least have one package.When she refused,fist's starting flying.Needless to say the manager came out and talked the girl into giving the other two women atleast one package.She still left with atleast 10 pckgs that i could see.Crazy!!
I work at a nursing home.We have now closed all doors to the public.They are however trying to make it so all resident's can have facetime with their loved ones so they can stay in contact.
I feel for the elderly as they are not able to get to the stores like the younger ones.By the time they do get there,the shelves are emptied.Seems as the younger people could care less as long as they get theirs. Their only thinking about themselves IMHO. Atleast that's how it looks like.
We only get the necessaties.We didnt raid the stores.We usually buy in bulk also,but there really wasn't anything left to do so.So we made due with what they had.We have enough to atleast last a month.
We don't need meat to survive.However,we have over 150 pullets,plenty of beef in the pasture,laying hens and a couple dozen turkeys.If i need any meat,i will just go out back and harvest something. 
I,ve started some seedling's as spring will be here soon.We usually grow a big garden.Freeze and can most of it.There will be plenty of vegies and more to eat.
The only thing we will really need sooner or later is toilet paper.If it comes down to digging a latrene and using leaves,i will do it..lol..let's hope it does not come to that..lol
Stay safe my friends.


----------



## Johnny b

This morning, 6:30 am, the local Walmart's shelves and coolers were mostly bare. Nothing in the meats department. Most canned vegies gone. Almost no 
pasta.
No fresh fruit other than oranges.
No fresh vegetables at all.

Plenty of beer and chips to go with.

Much of the regulars of the morning shift seemed missing.
Only a couple employees stocking shelves.

A bit of a crowd.


----------



## dotty999

Cookiegal said:


> Well here's the thing, to be responsible you can't just carry on as normal, you have to be more careful and distance yourself from others for the recommended two weeks and only go out if it's absolutely essential. This is the new normal for the time being. We all have to do our part to try to contain this even if it means a bit of inconvenience for a couple of weeks.
> 
> Maybe it's a good time to get an early start on Spring cleaning or catch up on some reading or binge TV watching.


I've decided not to throw caution to the wind and to stay home and await further news


----------



## Cookiegal

dotty999 said:


> I've decided not to throw caution to the wind and to stay home and await further news


I'm glad to hear that!


----------



## Wino

JEEZ!! Luck of the Irish!!

I haven't ventured into the wild since last Friday. Did attend a small birthday party for neighbor across street on Saturday. Just got call from his wife from hospital ER - all the classic flu symptoms. Now it's wait til it shows up at my doorstep. I am always half way there with COPD - achy, cough, shortness of breath, phlegm, but so far no fever, nausea or diarrhea. She has ventured into public domain shopping both Monday and Tuesday since Saturday.

Hard to say what's causing some of this. Pollen counts are very high and all outside covered with yellow pollen dust which has had nose runny, throat raspy and eyes itchy. Self quarantine doesn't help with these environmental conditions.

So far medicinal Tequila seems to work best.


----------



## Cookiegal

Wow! Hopefully she wasn't contagious if she didn't show any signs yet on Saturday. You are definitely high-risk with COPD and should have avoided that party. I hope you don't contract it.

Diarrhea is not a symptom despite the mad rush to buy all of the toilet paper.


----------



## Johnny b

I hope you stay well, Wayne.

I've been reading about some markets setting aside certain hours just for us old folks.


A thing that concerns me....I don't see any of the clerks at the supermarkets where I shop wearing masks. I would think that would be a necessity for people stocking/handling food products, even packaged/canned foods.
I realize there is a shortage of masks, but even a bandanna would be better than nothing.


----------



## Couriant

Remember, masks are only good if you have the virus, not catching it.


----------



## Wino

Cookiegal said:


> Wow! Hopefully she wasn't contagious if she didn't show any signs yet on Saturday. You are definitely high-risk with COPD and should have avoided that party. I hope you don't contract it.
> 
> Diarrhea is not a symptom despite the mad rush to buy all of the toilet paper.


Well, I was well "medicated" !! LOL


----------



## Cookiegal

Wino said:


> Well, I was well "medicated"


Hopefully she was too and you were both sterile at the time.


----------



## Johnny b

Couriant said:


> Remember, masks are only good if you have the virus, not catching it.


If someone starts coughing around you, a mask is definitely better than nothing 
And a N95 rated mask better than a bandanna.
And a N95 medical mask better than the common N95 particulate mask.

I own several boxes of 3M N95 particulate masks from my days in the past suffering from a mold allergy.

I definitely wear one when I go to the market.
It's better than having nothing for protection.


----------



## Gr3iz

I just went out to get my hair cut. Stopped at a dollar store right next door. They had many bare shelves, including in the toy aisle, of all things ... I did score a few boxes of tissues, one of the things I had gone in for, along with a few other items.
Stopped at a supermarket on the way back and they had toilet paper, though I didn't need any. Got two of the last loaves of bread, along with a few other meal-type items.


----------



## dotty999

Masks are being worn by many here which makes me feel uncomfortable. I'm carrying on as normal as I can. I already use antibacterial hand wash but I'm staying home more when I've been used to going out daily


----------



## xceedline

We were advise to work from home. I don't have a stock of mask so I have to make sure to boost my immunity and disinfect whenever I need to go out.


----------



## Johnny b

Just got back from my local Walmart.

Much has been restocked.
Almost all of what I wanted.



Still no paper towels or toilet paper.


----------



## Brigham

Wino said:


> JEEZ!! Luck of the Irish!!
> 
> I haven't ventured into the wild since last Friday. Did attend a small birthday party for neighbor across street on Saturday. Just got call from his wife from hospital ER - all the classic flu symptoms. Now it's wait til it shows up at my doorstep. I am always half way there with COPD - achy, cough, shortness of breath, phlegm, but so far no fever, nausea or diarrhea. She has ventured into public domain shopping both Monday and Tuesday since Saturday.
> 
> Hard to say what's causing some of this. Pollen counts are very high and all outside covered with yellow pollen dust which has had nose runny, throat raspy and eyes itchy. Self quarantine doesn't help with these environmental conditions.
> 
> So far medicinal Tequila seems to work best.


Wino, I hope that you are taking all the precautions you can. Oxygen, bronchodilators, paracetamol etc. You know we can't get along without you.


----------



## Wino

Brigham said:


> Wino, I hope that you are taking all the precautions you can. Oxygen, bronchodilators, paracetamol etc. You know we can't get along without you.


Thanks for the thought. Verily trying to take precautions - still haven't ventured into the wild. Up on all my meds, plenty of Trelegy on hand (and should be getting more from GSK soon under their patient assist program), several boxes of albuterol for nebulizer, 6-8 week supply of TP and paper towels, dog food, booze, dry goods, bottled water and Gatoraide. I stockpile before the need, which is what burns my butt about the hoarders that cause us all to have shortages due to their silly panic buying and lack of foresight. Do need some fresh vegetables, but can get along without until reason returns to grocery stores. I'm guessing there won't be any sales on TP anytime soon. LOL


----------



## Brigham

Wino said:


> Thanks for the thought. Verily trying to take precautions - still haven't ventured into the wild. Up on all my meds, plenty of Trelegy on hand (and should be getting more from GSK soon under their patient assist program), several boxes of albuterol for nebulizer, 6-8 week supply of TP and paper towels, dog food, booze, dry goods, bottled water and Gatoraide. I stockpile before the need, which is what burns my butt about the hoarders that cause us all to have shortages due to their silly panic buying and lack of foresight. Do need some fresh vegetables, but can get along without until reason returns to grocery stores. I'm guessing there won't be any sales on TP anytime soon. LOL


Glad to hear you have all the things you need. Us old'uns have got to look after ourselves.


----------



## steppenwolf

I GOT ODD MEDICAL CONDITIONS AND I GUESS ROTTEN DOCTORS ,i sorta hope i get it and out my misery but maybe not

life isnt always bad i guess


----------



## Gr3iz

I can't say I disagree, but my regret would be if I gave it to my grandkids who live with us ...


----------



## dotty999

My food cupboards are full as is my freezer and I have 27 toilet rolls!


----------



## Johnny b

I've stockpiled beans 

And movies 

Only 27, huh?


----------



## Johnny b

Of interest:

* Purell makers made 'misleading' claims to customers about killing germs, new suit says *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-action-over-misleading-customers/2890969001/



> The U.S. Centers for Disease Control advises using hand sanitizer only when soap and water is unavailable.


* CDC *
https://www.cdc.gov/handwashing/show-me-the-science-hand-sanitizer.html



> Show Me the Science - When & How to Use Hand Sanitizer in Community Settings


----------



## cwwozniak

> Hundreds of GameStop stores around the United States remain open, despite the intensifying coronavirus outbreak and demands from irate employees to close the stores.
> ...
> The company argues it is "essential" because it offers mice and keyboards that could help people work from home.
> ...
> "That's absolutely ridiculous. If someone's trying to work from home, they don't want the $85 Razer keyboard we have or the $60 Razer mouse. Some cheap $20 Microsoft something is going to get them by just fine," said Dustin Carson, 31, a game adviser at a GameStop in Athens, Georgia.


https://wgntv.com/news/gamestop-says-its-an-essential-business-employees-are-outraged/


----------



## steppenwolf

wiki joe on youtube says hand sanitizer is a big scam

id say just soap and water and drying hands works


----------



## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> wiki joe on youtube says hand sanitizer is a big scam
> 
> id say just soap and water and drying hands works


Purell claims are obviously a scam.
And the CDC is a good authority.


----------



## RT

I'm not a fan of fanning my fanny without toilet paper, but am now considering reviewing my botany...
just to recall those leaves in the woods that won't make matters worse if you give a wipe... uh, did a lot of camping in my youth ... 

Thank goodness it's spring and I see patches of lovely green soft moss here and there...


----------



## Johnny b

RT said:


> I'm not a fan of fanning my fanny without toilet paper, but am now considering reviewing my botany...
> just to recall those leaves in the woods that won't make matters worse if you give a wipe... uh, did a lot of camping in my youth ...
> 
> Thank goodness it's spring and I see patches of lovely green soft moss here and there...


Yuck................


----------



## RT

Johnny b said:


> Yuck................


Ya have to have been there, buddy 
Adapt, do... or do not :barefoot:


----------



## dotty999

RT said:


> I'm not a fan of fanning my fanny without toilet paper, but am now considering reviewing my botany...
> just to recall those leaves in the woods that won't make matters worse if you give a wipe... uh, did a lot of camping in my youth ...
> 
> Thank goodness it's spring and I see patches of lovely green soft moss here and there...


Well I'm shocked!! Fanny has a whole different meaning never mentioned here in the UK!


----------



## Couriant

dotty999 said:


> Well I'm shocked!! Fanny has a whole different meaning never mentioned here in the UK!


Always makes me giggle when I see british words used like that  ... like 50 Cent's album Wanksta...

Anyways, hoping everyone is doing good and wishing for a speedy quarantine timeframe so we can get back to work...


----------



## dotty999

wanksta! Oh I say!


----------



## Johnny b

* There's a new symptom of coronavirus, doctors say: Sudden loss of smell or taste *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...navirus-symptoms-loss-smell-taste/2897385001/


----------



## Johnny b

*Thousands turn out for one-day coronavirus testing site in Kakaako *
https://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/2020/03/21/drive-thru-covid-testing-underway-kakaako/


> HONOLULU, Hawaii (HawaiiNewsNow) - Lines of cars quickly formed at the Kakaako Waterfront Park on Saturday as city and health officials opened up a drive-thru coronavirus testing site.
> 
> More than 2,200 people turned out waited in line to get tested.
> 
> The line stretched several blocks from the park onto Ala Moana Boulevard.
> 
> The wait time for some was about two to three hours.
> 
> ....
> 
> Health officials only ended up testing 405 of the more than 2,200 people who showed up. That's because screenings were done first, to determine who was eligible for a test.
> 
> Dr. Miscovich said having a slight scratch in your throat, or having a little runny nose does not qualify you for a test.
> 
> Those eligible included those showing symptoms who have had recent travel; first responders and healthcare industry workers; tourism industry employees; and prison and homeless outreach workers.


----------



## dotty999

Even our royal Prince Charles has now got it!


----------



## Cookiegal

I'm moving this thread back to the Random Discussion forum as it was never intended for debate. It was moved to Controversial Topics when a debate broke out but that was probably a mistake (on my part) as it was never the original purpose, which was to inform the public by providing updates on the situation as it evolves around the world. I've also deleted or edited several posts to remove irrelevant content.

Quoting the thread starter's initial post describing the purpose of the thread:


johnny b said:


> I'd like to keep this thread as a chronicle of events and projections, how to address avoidance and how to react if infected.......not a 'scare' or 'hopeless' scenario.


Therefore, all talk of a hoax has to stop immediately. There is no hoax, the situation is real and alarming. While this site is not and should not be seen as an official source of data on this matter, this particular thread can be a stepping stone to helping people obtain updates on the situation by providing links on where to go for credible information from reliable global sources such as governments, health authorities and other pertinent sources, which are the only sources they should depend on.

In the interest of free expression, if anyone truly believes this is a hoax AND wants to argue/debate the accuracy, credibility or severity of the current situation then you are welcome to start a thread in the Controversial Topics forum along those lines but it certainly has no place in this thread. I will be monitoring this thread, as I have been from the start, and *any posts that don't fit into the criteria stipulated above will simpy be deleted without further notice or explanation*.

I do not expect or welcome any acknowledge of this message here in the thread so it can get back on track as intended. If anyone wishes to discuss the matter further kindly start a Personal Conversation with me.

Thank you for understanding everyone and please heed the directives in your area and stay safe!


----------



## Johnny b

* U.S. passes Italy, China as nation with the most confirmed cases of COVID-19 *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...igh-nation-passes-italy-and-china/2921779001/



> The U.S. surged past China and Italy to become the planet's most infected nation Thursday, a stark milestone in the coronavirus era - and a reminder of its deadly, culture-changing effects on American life.
> 
> The Johns Hopkins University dash board showed the U.S. with 82,404 COVID-19 infections as of 6 p.m., ET, moving past Italy (80,589) and China (81,782). More than 1,100 people have died in the U.S.
> 
> The coronavirus is also taking a growing toll on the U.S. military, and commanders and senior officials are bracing for worse. From nuclear missile fields at home to war zones abroad, from flight lines to ships at sea, the Pentagon is striving to shield vital missions even as it faces urgent calls for help on the civilian front.


----------



## Gr3iz

<sigh> This is one time we don't want to be on top ...


----------



## Wino

I'm amazed anyone would be surprised with this news. Considering the damage done to the CDC and other governmental entities short changed and working well below needed standards and personnel by this inept administrations inactive initial response plus telling the population at large we had nothing to worry about for two months, then lying about their response. There is absolutely nothing to be surprised about results.


----------



## Johnny b

Agreed.

Disturbingly, there seems to be support for Trump's part in this pandemic.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/298313/president-trump-job-approval-rating.aspx


----------



## Wino

Sad, that! We're up to 55 known cases and 4 dead in my city. This does not include the numbers sent to LAFB quarantined travelers.

3/27 - 114 ill / 5 dead late today.


----------



## dotty999

Even though I'm self isolating I'm really worried about the virus and all it entails. How long will it last? What will happen.plenty of questions but fear the possible answers!


----------



## Gr3iz

Don't make yourself sick over it! (No pun intended.) You can be careful. You can do all you can do. You have a lot of control over your own personal environment. But, what will be, will be. Please don't worry about something you cannot control. That's not saying don't be as cautious as you've been, just don't add worry to it ... <virtual, socially distant hug> ;-)


----------



## steppenwolf

"as long as UK people obey their government stay out of the sun,parks and beaches and stay inside and listen to v for Vedant ....... i mean Boris etc theyll maybe survive to get to work for gruel and expensive food and rent"


----------



## RT

dotty999 said:


> Well I'm shocked!! Fanny has a whole different meaning never mentioned here in the UK!


 I know that ...now! !
But I didn't mean to offend you, but I said that on purpose, doncha know?  

Being sort of a hermit anyway, I've been Ok with being a home body, until you're told to remain at home.
You always want to do the opposite...

..so why do I want to get out, when normally I dread it?

Human nature, I reckon.

I watched a documentary on COVID-19, and it painted a grim picture, as expected...it seems to be beyond containment, so slowing the spread is all we can do.


----------



## Johnny b

Everything got shut down just before the Ohio primary.
Dewine took a sensible position and absentee balloting has been extended till April 28.

Went to Walmart yesterday morning.
Lots of good looking fresh vegies and fruits.
But the canned vegie shelves were largely bare.
On a sour note, they'd run out of sanitary wipes for the shopping carts at 7:30 am.
I went back out to my car, got several paper towels from a roll I've always carried in the car, to cover the push cart's handle.
Not seeing many people wearing masks.
I wear one.
Only a couple in the store wore surgical gloves.

It rained really hard this morning.
This got me to thinking.....it's flooding and tornado season.


----------



## Johnny b

Sure enough, the next news article I read was about the weather.

Today:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...forecast-storms-tornadoes-midwest/2930213001/



> AccuWeather said that the severe weather threat may extend as far to the north as central Iowa and southern Wisconsin and as far to the south as northeastern Texas and northwestern Louisiana. Large metro areas of Chicago, St. Louis, Davenport, Iowa, and Little Rock, Arkansas, are among the areas at risk.
> 
> "Storms from northern Missouri and southern Iowa to central Illinois may have the greatest potential for tornadoes," AccuWeather meteorologist Brian Knopick said.


----------



## Cookiegal

I would definitely not risk going to WalMart right now. It's never been my source of food. Last week I made a run to two grocery stores because one doesn't carry something I need but since last Tuesday I will only make an early morning run to one grocery store, get what I need whether it's on sale or not, then head home for a scrub down. You should wash all produce and non-porous packaging in soap and water. I bring my own bags for the produce so I don't have to handle the store ones which you have to lick your fingers and then rub to get them open. No thanks on that. The bags are Brandy's clear poop bags and yes, they are pre-poop.  Brandy said I could use them for this purpose.

I don't even take my purse or my phone with me when I go so there's no risk of them being contaminated. I only take my little card-holder thing that fits in my pocket and holds my driver's license, registration, insurance information, medical card (just in case) and my credit card to pay with. I have a pair of medical gloves and a travel pack of disinfectant wipes in my coat pocket if needed for the cart or if I have to enter a PIN on the key pad. So far I haven't had to do that because some credit card companies have increased the limit that you can purchase so you don't have to enter a PIN which is great.

I wash my hands thoroughly as soon as I walk in the door before even taking my coat off and use my elbows to open the taps then I put away the groceries and wash whatever needs washing then wash my hands thoroughly again more than once. Then I wash my face then I wash my hair and disinfect the tap handles (even though I used my elbows) and door knobs. Then I stay home and only go for short walks which I have to do because of the dog. He gets one longer one early in the morning when nobody's out and about and then one short one after supper because he has to do his business. In between he just goes to piddle in the back yard and it's right back in the house.

This grocery store has installed a sink at the entrance and everyone has to wash their hands as they enter. The carts are disinfected, the clerks are wearing gloves and they have plexiglass installed to protect the cashiers. Yet there are still idiots who won't listen and don't keep the proper distance. It's a shame to have to avoid people like the plague (this is the new plague) but this is our new reality for the time being.

Yesterday I read where someone purposely coughed on all of the produce, meat and other items at a grocery store in Pennsylvania so they had to throw out $35,000 worth of food. It's not known if she has the virus or not but she was tested.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...35k-worth-food-woman-coughed-twisted-n1169401

This is what makes me lose faith in people. And the problem is, it's not just a few people, it's many people. I swear if you have a group of 10 people at least 2 of them are going to be idiots and non-conformists. If I'm in that group I know it's not me so that leaves 2 out of the remaining 9. Not great odds. I realize there is nothing to back up those numbers and this is not a debate thread so this is just my own observations that I've seen in daily life even before this crisis and it makes me very sad.


----------



## valis

There was a doctor who was purposefully coughing on peopleI heard...yeah, as a rule, people suck. I would say Dwight Schrute had the right quote but this is not the time...


----------



## valis

here it is...dude was actually arrested....https://www.wfsb.com/news/uconn-hea...cle_bc4300b4-6fd6-11ea-b6df-af286d167a38.html


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> I would definitely not risk going to WalMart right now. ...................


That's my last trip to Walmart.
I felt very uncomfortable about their commitment to cleanliness from what I saw of their shopping carts.

I toss this out as what I do and there are health risks when not used appropriately.
I've had issues with a mold allergy for the last 25 years.
I've been using an ozone generator to keep the mold level in my home as close to zero as possible.
Ozone also kills virus.
Since the COVID-19 outbreak, I've been using my ozone generator in a closed room where I've been putting freshly bought food purchases, clothing, masks, etc.
I move the generator periodically from room to room.
Especially the kitchen and the bathroom. 
There is a health hazard associated with breathing ozone.
It can damage the lungs, so it has to be used with care and common sense.

It doesn't replace the suggested health care precautions, it's adds an additional tool.

This is a reputable source of information worth reading:
*Ozone therapy: A clinical review *
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3312702/


----------



## steppenwolf

someone sneezes and its newsworthy


----------



## steppenwolf

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/worl...fter-china-lifts-virus-quarantine/ar-BB11PmyA i guess theyre dividing


----------



## Brigham

Johnny b said:


> That's my last trip to Walmart.
> I felt very uncomfortable about their commitment to cleanliness from what I saw of their shopping carts.
> 
> I toss this out as what I do and there are health risks when not used appropriately.
> I've had issues with a mold allergy for the last 25 years.
> I've been using an ozone generator to keep the mold level in my home as close to zero as possible.
> Ozone also kills virus.
> Since the COVID-19 outbreak, I've been using my ozone generator in a closed room where I've been putting freshly bought food purchases, clothing, masks, etc.
> I move the generator periodically from room to room.
> Especially the kitchen and the bathroom.
> There is a health hazard associated with breathing ozone.
> It can damage the lungs, so it has to be used with care and common sense.
> 
> It doesn't replace the suggested health care precautions, it's adds an additional tool.
> 
> This is a reputable source of information worth reading:
> *Ozone therapy: A clinical review *
> https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3312702/


I have just read this, and the effects of ozone mentioned, are too dangerous to contemplate using it. In my opinion.


----------



## dotty999

I've been out for a walk to the chemist then around the block and home


----------



## Johnny b

Brigham said:


> I have just read this, and the effects of ozone mentioned, are too dangerous to contemplate using it. In my opinion.


As I posted, there are potential health hazards if used inappropriately.
It's an issue of lung damage when exposed directly to concentrated ozone.

And contemplation is dependent upon the circumstances of need.
That seems true for many medical procedures.

In the midst of a pandemic, weighing those considerations changes focus.

For sterilizing food and clothing in containment, or a closed room, risk is minor.
But exposing one's self directly becomes problematic for those inexperienced with ozone.


----------



## Johnny b

Preppers:

Common sense goes a long way.

* Who was prepared when coronavirus struck? These folks. Here's what you can learn from them. *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ere-prepared-when-covid-19-struck/2933159001/


----------



## Johnny b

*Experimental coronavirus drug remdesivir to be distributed again after halt a week ago *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ivir-trump-lauded-again-available/2934583001/



> An experimental and unproven coronavirus treatment so popular new requests to use it were halted a week ago due to "overwhelming" demand is once again available to doctors under an expanded access program.
> 
> ..............
> On Saturday, Gilead Sciences CEO Daniel O'Day announced in an open letter that his company was once again making remdesivir available outside of the six ongoing clinical trials investigating whether it is effective as a treatment for COVID-19


----------



## Cookiegal

Steppenwolf,

I warned you about posting arguments in this thread and for failure to heed those directives I've given you an infraction with accompanying temporary ban of 7 days because it's added to previous infractions you had already accumulated.

I suggest you take the time to rethink how you post here and familiarize yourself with the difference between debates and serious discussions.


----------



## Johnny b

* Coronavirus live updates: Anthony Fauci says millions of Americans face infection, 200,000 could die *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...p-cdc-travel-advisory-nypd-deaths/2918869001/



> The U.S. death total has doubled in two days. Dr. Anthony Fauci, who has been a leading voice in the effort to curb the outbreak, says 100,000 to 200,000 Americans could die before the crisis is over.
> 
> The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, citing "extensive community transmission" of COVID-19 in New York, New Jersey and Connecticut late Saturday urged residents to refrain from non-essential travel for 14 days effective immediately. The advisory does not apply to employees of critical infrastructure industries such as trucking, public health professionals, financial services and food supply.
> 
> "Just a little bit of separation can stop a fire from spreading," CDC Director Dr. Robert Redfield said,
> 
> "Mitigate it now, before they start seeing cases in the Emergency Room and in the hospital - once you see those, the virus has been spreading days to weeks," Birx said on NBC's Meet the Press. "This is my call on every mayor to prepare now."





> Trump backs off quarantine proposal
> 
> New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo ripped suggestions by President Donald Trump that he might institute a ban on New Yorkers' travel to other states amid the coronavirus outbreak. "It would be a federal declaration of war on states," Cuomo said. Late Saturday, Trump apparently backed off the idea. He tweeted that "a quarantine will not be necessary" and that he has was opting instead for the CDC's travel advisory.


----------



## valis

good read....https://apple.news/AxwhNr30XQiWDDkWSUTvJFw


----------



## dotty999

I think you have to be brave to read this thread when discussing possible death stats. I admit I'm not that brave and would rather just take each day as it comes without focusing on the negatives and if that seems like I'm burying my head in the sand, so be it


----------



## Johnny b

*Coronavirus live updates: Donald Trump extends guidelines to April 30; US deaths top 2,500; Anthony Fauci says millions face infection *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...p-cdc-travel-advisory-nypd-deaths/2918869001/



> President Donald Trump on Sunday extended the national social-distancing guidelines aimed at fighting the coronavirus pandemic to April 30, a month longer than initially scheduled and well past the Easter goal he had set for "opening up our country.''
> 
> The revamped timeline came on the same day a federal infectious disease official issued an ominous warning as New York state approached 1,000 deaths and U.S. fatalities from the coronavirus pandemic climbed past 2,500.


----------



## Johnny b

dotty999 said:


> I think you have to be brave to read this thread when discussing possible death stats. I admit I'm not that brave and would rather just take each day as it comes without focusing on the negatives and if that seems like I'm burying my head in the sand, so be it


But you are that brave, you have been reading this thread and hopefully some of the knowledge gained (tips) give you an edge to experience the days after this nightmare is over.

This will end, dotty.
Things will be different, and it will take time to adjust.
Survive this and there will come a time when you think, I'm glad to be alive.

Spring is here and I hope you have a yard to enjoy watching it revitalize.
We will too, but it's going to be a longer 'winter' for us.

On a positive note, for us in the US, Trump seems to now realize this is a long term situation and has lengthened the time limit for social distancing.
IMO, this is a powerful tool that will help to save lives at this point.
That's the good 'knowledge' for today.

Stay safe dotty. We need people like you when our 'spring' does arrive.

John


----------



## Johnny b

* FDA greenlights COVID-19 point-of-care test *

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/fda-...9-pointofcare-test-from-abbott-234449283.html



> The U.S. Food and Drug Administration approved emergency use for a portable, fast, swab test for the coronavirus Friday which can provide results in less than 15 minutes.
> 
> The device weighs 6.6 pounds and tests a swab taken from the nose or throat, using a cartridge made by Abbott. The time for a positive result is 5 minutes, and a negative result will return in 13 minutes.
> 
> Abbott will be able to provide 50,000 tests by April 1 and will be able to provide 1 million per month of this test, Moore said.


----------



## dotty999

Johnny b said:


> But you are that brave, you have been reading this thread and hopefully some of the knowledge gained (tips) give you an edge to experience the days after this nightmare is over.
> 
> This will end, dotty.
> Things will be different, and it will take time to adjust.
> Survive this and there will come a time when you think, I'm glad to be alive.
> 
> Spring is here and I hope you have a yard to enjoy watching it revitalize.
> We will too, but it's going to be a longer 'winter' for us.
> 
> On a positive note, for us in the US, Trump seems to now realize this is a long term situation and has lengthened the time limit for social distancing.
> IMO, this is a powerful tool that will help to save lives at this point.
> That's the good 'knowledge' for today.
> 
> Stay safe dotty. We need people like you when our 'spring' does arrive.
> 
> John


I've isolated myself from everyone. I see neighbours are still going out but I'm not taking any chances. I have asthma and that's a good reason for staying home. I do hope things will improve sooner rather than later.

I went to the local shop yesterday and people were still getting too close! No matter how you try to follow the advice, many are ignoring it as though it's not a problem!


----------



## ekim68

Inside the start of the great virus airlift



> A plane from Shanghai arrived at John F. Kennedy International Airport in New York Sunday morning carrying an extraordinary load: 12 million gloves, 130,000 N95 masks, 1.7 million surgical masks, 50,000 gowns, 130,000 hand sanitizer units, and 36,000 thermometers.


----------



## Gr3iz

A little bit of good news in the midst of the dismal ...
https://www.wired.com/story/the-pan..._medium=email&utm_source=nl&utm_term=list1_p3


----------



## Johnny b

According to the Johns Hopkins link at this time,

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html

there are twice as many confirmed COVID-19 infected cases in the US as in China.


----------



## Johnny b

Looks like it's questionable as to whether the US Postal Service will survive COVID-19

*How coronavirus could be the 'final straw' for the U.S Postal Service *

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/how-...traw-for-the-us-postal-service-165904883.html


----------



## valis

well that may be problematic....


----------



## Cookiegal

I saw this video on the news showing Boris Johnson washing his hands but not even close to doing it the proper way.


----------



## Johnny b

* A tiger at the Bronx Zoo tests positive for coronavirus *

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/05/us/tiger-coronavirus-new-york-trnd/index.html

I've also read of a dog that was infected.


----------



## Cookiegal

I heard about the tiger this morning. That's discouraging and indicates it probably can be spread to our pets. They say not to even let your dogs mingle or pet other dogs if you meet someone on a walk even if you are respecting the physical distance required.


----------



## Cookiegal

Boris Johnson has just been transferred to intensive care as his condition worsens: 

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-52192604


> Over the course of this afternoon, the condition of the prime minister has worsened and, on the advice of his medical team, he has been moved to the intensive care unit at the hospital.


----------



## Johnny b

Theories of 5G spreading Covid-19 appear to be causing destruction of cell towers in Britain.

* 5G-coronavirus conspiracy theory spurs rash of telecom tower arson fires *
https://fortune.com/2020/04/06/5g-coronavirus-conspiracy-theory-telecom-tower-fires/



> Telecom masts that enable the next generation of wireless communication were set on fire in the U.K. in recent days, apparently by people motivated by a theory that the tech helps spread the coronavirus. Investors are taking note.


----------



## valis

people are idiots...all i gotto say on that matter....


----------



## Johnny b

Of interest and ingenuity:

* 'It's not fancy, but it works': Mississippi doctor uses garden hose, lamp timer and electronic valve to create makeshift ventilators *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-medical-center-charles-robertson/2966719001/



> Dr. Charles Robertson, a UMMC pediatric anesthesiologist and the mastermind behind the idea, said he set out to make the "absolute simplest ventilator we can build with parts available in any city, you don't need special tools to put together and can be done quickly as the need arises."
> 
> Made with "primarily a garden hose, a lamp timer and electronic valve," the ventilator, named the Robertson Ventilator, for less than $100, can be assembled in approximately 20 to 30 minutes, meaning a dedicated team of four to five could produce nearly 100 in a day if needed, he said.
> 
> "The brain behind the thing is actually a lamp timer," he said. "It's not fancy but it works. This would be available as a last resort if the numbers increase as we think they might."
> 
> While in-demand ventilators may go to states that are the highest bidder, Robertson noted the parts he gathered are from Home Depot and Lowe's.


----------



## Cookiegal

valis said:


> people are idiots...all i gotto say on that matter....


The newly-coined word is "Covidiots". They are running rampant in my area unfortunately.


----------



## dotty999

people are still using local buses and I'm told the nearby park was really busy with lots of visitors not keeping their distance, when will they learn!


----------



## Johnny b

*Pfizer says early studies of potential coronavirus treatment show promise *

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/pfizer-says-early-studies-potential-104500916.html


----------



## Johnny b

* Fauci lowers U.S. coronavirus death forecast to 60,000, says social distancing is working *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...could-closer-60-k-new-model-shows/5122467002/



> Senior White House adviser Anthony Fauci said Thursday the death toll from the coronavirus could be closer to 60,000 Americans, assuming full social distancing, rather than the previously projected 100,000 to 240,000 deaths.
> 
> "The real data are telling us that it is highly likely that we're having a definite positive effect by this mitigation things that we're doing - this physical separation - so I believe we are gonna see a downturn in that," Fauci, the director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, told NBC's "Today" show.


----------



## Johnny b

* Fact check: Early studies show pink eye could be related to COVID-19 but in few cases *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-pink-eye-new-coronavirus-symptom/2940369001/

https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20200401/pink-eye-often-a-symptom-of-covid-19#1


----------



## Johnny b

*A 101-year-old British man was infected with coronavirus. He fought it for two weeks - and won*

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-old-british-man-keith-watson-nhs/5126604002/










:up:


----------



## Johnny b

* First in nation: Blood center, Premier using recovered patients' plasma to fight COVID-19 *

https://www.daytondailynews.com/new...ts-plasma-fight-covid/XyeMuglt8Tr4uSucZqfBnO/



> DAYTON -
> 
> The Community Blood Center's new COVID-19 Convalescent Plasma Program will launch Friday, giving local residents who have recovered from coronavirus "a unique opportunity to contribute to efforts to defeat the virus," program supporters said.
> 
> COVID-19 survivors who have documentation that they tested positive for the virus and have been symptom-free for at least 14 days may be able to donate plasma under the program.
> 
> The Mayo Clinic said that Premier Health is the first health system in the nation to treat a COVID-19 positive patient using the Mayo Clinic's plasma protocols, according to a press release.


----------



## Johnny b

Ohio:

*Foodbanks could serve 40 percent of Ohioans by time pandemic ends *

https://www.daytondailynews.com/bus...ns-time-pandemic-ends/vwktGbiYlbUGuyaLGSepxN/



> Food banks could be feeding up to 40 percent of Ohioans before the coronavirus pandemic is over as pantries have seen an increasing number of people who have never used food assistance before, officials said.
> 
> Before the coronavirus pandemic caused many people to lose their jobs, more than three out of 10 Ohioans had incomes low enough to use the food assistance system. Many people hadn't recovered from the last economic crisis, Hamler-Fugitt said.
> 
> The increased need is evident in Dayton by the long lines for the drive-through at The Foodbank. People lined up hours before the drive-through food pantry opened and the line of cars stretched more than a mile.


----------



## Cookiegal

I've deleted your last post John. Let's not turn this thread into another debate thread. If there is anything to add that fits with the theme of this thread please post that content here rather than linking to the "other" thread. Thanks.


----------



## Johnny b

OK will do...but that was relevant news


----------



## Cookiegal

Then post it here please.


----------



## Johnny b

With testing downplayed, statistics on the spread of Covid-19 will be difficult to map and estimate future projections.
This would be compounded with early back to work protocols as there would be little comparisons of before and after scenarios.

The US already has a lower test rate than many nation's tests per capita.
( I can post links, but they do contain a lot of politics, but this one is a business website and the article appears non political)
https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-testing-covid-19-tests-per-capita-chart-us-behind-2020-3

To the issue of reduced testing:

*Federal Support Ends For Coronavirus Testing Sites As Pandemic Peak Nears*

https://www.npr.org/sections/corona...r-coronavirus-testing-sites-end-as-peak-nears

So, with an early back to work protocol put in place, there would be a lot of unknown risk ( of new infections ) for the general population in the US to deal with.

Yes, there is a political angle that's unavoidable. But the issue itself is very relevant, imo, and I'm more concerned about this for even my own health than the way things are going on now.


----------



## Johnny b

* Fauci: Coronavirus immunity cards for Americans are 'being discussed' *

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/...ards-for-americans-are-being-discussed-178784



> Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, revealed Friday the federal government is considering issuing Americans certificates of immunity from the coronavirus, as the Trump administration works to better identify those who have been infected and restart the U.S. economy in the coming weeks.


----------



## Johnny b

Update on Federal Support Ending For Coronavirus Testing Sites:



> Trump administration reverses plan, will fund COVID-19 testing


https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy...s-funding-for-drive-through-covid-19-testing/



> UPDATE, April 10: Late yesterday the administration reversed course on its controversial plan to pull federal funding from drive-through community-based COVID-19 testing centers in several states.
> 
> Instead, the states can choose whether to continue to receive federal funding and support or take over operations themselves, federal officials said.


----------



## Johnny b

* New York City public schools will remain closed for rest of academic year, Mayor de Blasio says *

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/04/11/new...ools-will-remain-closed-for-rest-of-year.html


----------



## Johnny b

Korea:

* WHO Investigating Reports of Coronavirus Patients Testing Positive Again After Recovery *

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/04/who-reports-coronavirus-testing-positive-recovery.html



> The World Health Organization said it is investigating reports out of South Korea that some patients who had recovered from the coronavirus tested positive again after initially testing negative for COVID-19. On Friday, South Korea officials said 91 patients who were thought to have recovered from the coronavirus tested positive again.


----------



## 2twenty2

U.S. Coronavirus Deaths Top 20,000, Highest in World Exceeding Italy: Reuters Tally

https://www.usnews.com/news/top-new...s-death-toll-climbs-past-19-500-reuters-tally


----------



## Johnny b

Just some numbers to ponder.
Remember, these are derived from confirmed stats, and testing is in the low single digits percentage wise, in the US and elsewhere, so there is room for error.

From the Johns Hopkins data:

At this moment.
The US has 
About 30% of the world's confirmed COVID-19 infections
About 18% of the COVID-19 deaths
but only 4.2% of the world's total population ( data from Wikipedia and US Census )

Infection and death rates will likely change as the world recovers.
How much and for the better is the question.


----------



## Johnny b

An interesting article. 
Buying a new automobile in the US has changed:

* Coronavirus has dealerships moving to online sales - and car buying may never be the same *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...navirus-covid-19-online-car-sales/5129667002/



> The way we buy cars may never be the same, as auto dealers adjust to working under COVID-19 restrictions and customers discover they prefer the new approach, which leans heavily on internet sales and vehicle demos and could include valet-style pickup and delivery service for everything from test drives to oil changes.
> 
> "By the end of this year, you're going to see 80%-90% of U.S. new car dealers with full e-commerce capability in their shops" to handle everything online but the test drive and - maybe - the final signature, he said. Online deals at Ricart's domestic dealerships have doubled during the last six weeks, he said.


----------



## Cookiegal

Next thing you know we'll be able to order a car from Amazon.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> Next thing you know we'll be able to order a car from Amazon.


Good one Cookiegal


----------



## Johnny b

Here is a new Johns Hopkins data/map link that is specific to the US:

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/us-map

What the JH link in the opening post has, that is missing in the one above, is the graph for daily confirmed cases.
That is the graph that seems to best illustrate the peak in new cases.
Hopefully it will eventually be included in the new link.


----------



## Cookiegal

I've added the link to the initial post John.


----------



## Johnny b

Thank you


----------



## Cookiegal

You're welcome.


----------



## Professionalgirl

My family and I managed to escape the virus so far. I am tired of this pandemic restricting our freedom and causing us to watch our backs constantly for fear that we may stand too close to someone or make some type of mistake that stems from habitual norms in society and that is part of the reason this virus spread globally. I reside in the United states and this pandemic is out of control in ever corner of the entire nation! 

That is deeply concerning since governments and top level parties step in and focus so much emphases on the pandemic. I watched something so horrific you would think it was only a movie but it is reality. In New York City I watched someone go live from their mobile phones and shaking in fear and shouting this is real repetitively while thousands of dead bodies are placed on a very large freezer truck in body bags! 

I am not in that area and I know that if I was I would probably pass out for the first time. This virus is quite scary to say the least! My family and I have planned a safety net of instructions to protect ourselves from this horrible threat and its working. We here in my area are all in quarantine and are only allowed to leave our homes to work at an essential business or purchase groceries. The CDC now recommends that everyone wear masks regardless of whether or not you feel healthy because you could be a carrier and based on the CDC observations they recorded thousands infecting thousands in just a very short time because they thought they were healthy and they were carriers! We now have masks and are working on a spit guard in case someone near by sneezes and the droplets get on our eyes. That would be what the spit guard is used for. Not everyone is complying with the stay at home order or are wearing masks leaving the rest of us vulnerable to exposure! My husband and I planned not to allow anyone inside our home, stay away from others and just to be safe, we stay 10 feet away from others, we disinfect with at least 66% alcohol, Allpet DT at work and Lysol spray at home. If the grocery store is crowded we sit in our cars and wait or we leave and go to one that is less crowded or not crowded at all. That's how we kept ourselves safe and virus free.


----------



## Gr3iz

Hang in there, Tina. This, too, shall pass ...


----------



## Johnny b

Best wishes for you and your family, Tina.

And for all the TSG members.


----------



## Couriant

Cookiegal said:


> I've added the link to the initial post John.


Got mine from Carvana.com  I guess they don't have something like that in Canada?


----------



## Johnny b

Some good news for a change.

* What is remdesivir? Gilead Sciences drug reportedly shows promise treating coronavirus *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...ilead-sciences-covid-19-treatment/5150793002/



> A Gilead Sciences antiviral drug is reportedly showing promise for treatment of the coronavirus.
> 
> Remdesivir is causing "rapid recoveries in fever and respiratory symptoms, with nearly all patients discharged in less than a week" in patients at a Chicago hospital, medical site STAT reported.


----------



## dotty999

Here in the UK many aren't taking it serious. Gangs are gathering in the local parks, family picnics too! Groups of teenagers walking the streets. I went to my local shop recently and someone brushed against me instead of keeping the 2 metre distance!


----------



## Johnny b

Sorry to hear that dotty.

Some here don't seem to take it seriously either.
I was at the supermarket this morning.
An older couple was in front of me, neither wearing masks.
The cashier asked them several times to back away from the register, to the blue stripe on the floor
and they complained.
While a significant majority wear the masks and observe social distancing, there are some that seem oblivious to the problem. 
And there are still some employees that wear no masks or gloves.


I live along a state route and am seeing light traffic I didn't see 2 weeks ago.


----------



## GrinHulk

Employees in supermarket are really high risk when you have shoppers who won't observe social distancing and complain when they're being asked to step back a little. They're putting more people at risk.


----------



## dotty999

Interesting information from the World Health Organisation regarding wearing masks

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51205344


----------



## Johnny b

dotty999 said:


> Interesting information from the World Health Organisation regarding wearing masks
> 
> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51205344


Interesting.
But I think I'll ignore it and use common sense.
Wearing a mask is better protection than nothing.

The flaw in their argument about contaminated masks is, if it wasn't warn, you'd have breathed in that contamination.


----------



## dotty999

GrinHulk said:


> Employees in supermarket are really high risk when you have shoppers who won't observe social distancing and complain when they're being asked to step back a little. They're putting more people at risk.


I was in my local store recently when a member of staff brushed against me in passing!


----------



## Cookiegal

Couriant said:


> I guess they don't have something like that in Canada?





Johnny b said:


> The flaw in their argument about contaminated masks is, if it wasn't warn, you'd have breathed in that contamination.


Not necessarily, it could have come from your own hands touching the mask. Also, whatever the mask may stop is not prevented from getting into your eyes. You'd have to wear a shield or goggles to prevent transmission that way.


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> Not necessarily, it could have come from your own hands touching the mask. Also, whatever the mask may stop is not prevented from getting into your eyes. You'd have to wear a shield or goggles to prevent transmission that way.


Indeed, there is no 100% certainty that all transmission would/could be blocked as you presented.

Again, with out a mask in a scenario that involves possible aerosolized transmission, a mask is better protection than no mask at all. It's a matter of filtering the air entering a persons lungs.

The CDC even go to recommending home made cloth masks since the shortage of N95 masks.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/diy-cloth-face-coverings.html

Something is simply better than nothing.


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> Something is simply better than nothing.


I agree.


----------



## Johnny b

You know, not that many people say that to me


----------



## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> You know, not that many people say that to me


savor this moment....


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> You know, not that many people say that to me


Yeah I noticed that too so I thought I'd throw you a carrot.


----------



## Johnny b

hmmmm.....delicious lol!


----------



## Couriant

So the inevitable happened. We are being furloughed... I have to take voluntary unpaid time off for 105 hours for the fiscal year. :/


----------



## Johnny b

It appears there is another COVID-19 symptom.

* Coronavirus is causing hives and 4 other skin reactions - here's what dermatologists warn you to look for *

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/coronavirus-hives-skin-reactions-dermatologist-152002908.html


----------



## 2twenty2

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/22/health/cats-pets-coronavirus.html



> Two Cats Are First U.S. Pets to Test Positive for Coronavirus
> 
> The first pets in the United States, two cats from New York State, have tested positive for the virus that is causing the worldwide pandemic, the Agriculture Department and the Centers for Disease Control announced Wednesday.


----------



## Couriant

2twenty2 said:


> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/22/health/cats-pets-coronavirus.html


So now all the pets will be carrying it? sheesh


----------



## 2twenty2

Couriant said:


> So now all the pets will be carrying it? sheesh


I hope not.

They will need to practice social distancing and wear their masks 😁


----------



## Couriant

2twenty2 said:


> I hope not.
> 
> They will need to practice social distancing and wear their masks 😁


yeah, even though they noted it won't pass on from cats to humans, that is one scary thought. It can go from cats to cats though... hopefully it is just mild for the cats.


----------



## Johnny b

I had to go on an errand around 1 pm.
As I passed a local strip mall, I noticed just about all the businesses were open.
Even fast food restaurants with seated customers.
Traffic looked like the olden days before COVID-19.


----------



## ekim68

Coronavirus: 'Murder threats' to telecoms engineers over 5G



> Telecoms engineers have told Radio 1 Newsbeat they're being threatened and harassed by people who believe they're working on 5G, which has been wrongly linked to coronavirus.
> 
> Claims about any link have been branded complete rubbish by scientists.
> 
> But the union and trade body representing thousands of workers across the UK say they've had around 120 cases of abuse reported to them.


----------



## Johnny b

*"No evidence" that recovered COVID-19 patients cannot be reinfected: WHO*

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...tients-cannot-be-reinfected-who-idUSKCN2270FB



> The World Health Organization (WHO) said on Saturday that there was currently "no evidence" that people who have recovered from COVID-19 and have antibodies are protected from a second coronavirus infection.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> How about posting links to credible sources that define the issues rather than politically motivated provocateurs?
> You seem to argue in that vein, so why post the scare tactic of Pinsky?


Hi Johnny, I disagree that "more people are dying from the flu then they are with the novel Corona virus", as to reason I read numerous credible source information on both local health sites and the CDC as well as researching the statistics data. Here is a link to the data to prove that the flu is not as deadly as the Covid-19 virus. https://www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/#S2

Here are the statistics for Covid-19 https://data.cdc.gov/NCHS/Provisional-COVID-19-Death-Counts-in-the-United-St/kn79-hsxy/data

The reason, that Covid-19 death rates are so high is the fact that even though there is treatment is being developed and a vaccine that is not readily available, the death rate continues to rise. The treatment is still in the experimental phase and is not available to the public whereas a vaccine is available for most influenza viruses. Covid-19 spreads at a much higher rate because there is currently no treatment or vaccine available and is more wide spread than the flu. That explains why I disagree with you. The death rate for Covid-19 is extremely much higher when compared to the flu. The epicurve would display a very sharp linear pattern if the statistics for Covid-19 were implemented wear as the curve for flu cases wouldn't be as sharp.


----------



## Johnny b

Professionalgirl said:


> Hi Johnny, I disagree ...................


You are confused.


----------



## ekim68

More deaths, no benefit from malaria drug in VA virus study



> A malaria drug widely touted by President Donald Trump for treating the new coronavirus showed no benefit in a large analysis of its use in U.S. veterans hospitals. There were more deaths among those given hydroxychloroquine versus standard care, researchers reported.
> 
> The nationwide study was not a rigorous experiment. But with 368 patients, it's the largest look so far of hydroxychloroquine with or without the antibiotic azithromycin for COVID-19, which has killed more than 171,000 people as of Tuesday.


----------



## ekim68

As an aside..


Utah Was Really Into Trump's Miracle Cure. Now It Wants Its Money Back.


----------



## Johnny b

ekim68 said:


> As an aside..
> 
> Utah Was Really Into Trump's Miracle Cure. Now It Wants Its Money Back.


It appears my state, Ohio, has spent several hundred thousand dollars on that 'miracle cure' also.
:down:


----------



## CrazyComputerMan

London bus driver's family blames lack of PPE for his Covid-19 death

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-bus-ppe-covid19-death-a4421081.html


----------



## steppenwolf

it seems ive heard just one website say that wearing a masks cuts off oxygen that helps build immune system ....just one,,,doctors dont say this? i see lots of people wearing masks walking or jogging which seems even worse in areas where they will pass 3 people in a 10 block walk maybe

99,944% of Belgium didnt die of covid

similar numbers in other counties


----------



## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> it seems ive heard just one website say that wearing a masks cuts off oxygen that helps build immune system ....just one,,,doctors dont say this? i see lots of people wearing masks walking or jogging which seems even worse in areas where they will pass 3 people in a 10 block walk maybe
> 
> 99,944% of Belgium didnt die of covid
> 
> similar numbers in other counties


No, the masks being used filter out particulate matter, not oxygen or any gasses.

There's an idea. You could move to Belgium.
Problem solved 
For everyone 

But your percentage of deaths due to COVID-19 infection in Belgium is pure BS spin.
As of now, the Johns Hopkins site shows 47859 infected with 7501 deaths in Belgium.
That's a death rate of 15.6%

The US has a death rate of 5.6%.

Data source:
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html

So where would you rather live?


----------



## Johnny b

This is worrisome:

* Coronavirus update: German infection rate ticks higher after reopening moves, offers lesson to U.S. governors *

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/c...governors-2020-04-28?siteid=yhoof2&yptr=yahoo


----------



## Johnny b

For some positive news:

* Gilead Announces Results From Phase 3 Trial of Investigational Antiviral Remdesivir in Patients With Severe COVID-19 *

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/gilead-announces-results-phase-3-123500820.html



> Gilead Sciences, Inc. (Nasdaq: GILD) today announced topline results from the open-label, Phase 3 SIMPLE trial evaluating 5-day and 10-day dosing durations of the investigational antiviral remdesivir in hospitalized patients with severe manifestations of COVID-19 disease. The study demonstrated that patients receiving a 10-day treatment course of remdesivir achieved similar improvement in clinical status compared with those taking a 5-day treatment course (Odds Ratio: 0.75 [95% CI 0.51 - 1.12] on Day 14). No new safety signals were identified with remdesivir across either treatment group. Gilead plans to submit the full data for publication in a peer-reviewed journal in the coming weeks.


----------



## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> No, the masks being used filter out particulate matter, not oxygen or any gasses.
> 
> There's an idea. You could move to Belgium.
> Problem solved
> For everyone
> 
> But your percentage of deaths due to COVID-19 infection in Belgium is pure BS spin.
> As of now, the Johns Hopkins site shows 47859 infected with 7501 deaths in Belgium.
> That's a death rate of 15.6%
> 
> The US has a death rate of 5.6%.
> 
> Data source:
> https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html
> 
> So where would you rather live?


Depends on how you look at the numbers, by the raw numbers or by the percentage.










So certainly I wouldn't want to live in NY... or my home country of UK right now....


----------



## Johnny b

Couriant said:


> Depends on how you look at the numbers, by the raw numbers or by the percentage.
> 
> View attachment 276342
> 
> 
> So certainly I wouldn't want to live in NY... or my home country of UK right now....


New York City isn't a Nation.


----------



## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> New York City isn't a Nation.


You are missing my point. NY alone has more deaths than Belgium and Germany put together. The nation has over 55K, according to the CDC... so again, it all depends on how to look at the stats. I don't think using the %rate is fair considering the popluation size differences.


----------



## Johnny b

Couriant said:


> You are missing my point. NY alone has more deaths than Belgium and Germany put together. The nation has over 55K, according to the CDC... so again, it all depends on how to look at the stats. I don't think using the %rate is fair considering the popluation size differences.
> 
> View attachment 276345


If you want to make a case, it needs to be of equal considerations.

Like City to Cities of similar sizes.
Otherwise, one could point to some boondock city in the US and make a comparison to , say London. 
Logically, a fallacy and statistically, meaningless.

Per capita of a political/social group is the concept that needs to be followed, imo.
My example did.
Your NY City versus nations was a comparison of a hot spot to nations, that would include a wide variation of population densities.


----------



## Johnny b

BTW, At the moment, the infection in Belgium is .4% of the population.
In the US, it's .3%

Where would you rather live


----------



## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> BTW, At the moment, the *infection* in Belgium is .4% of the population.
> In the US, it's .3%
> 
> Where would you rather live


I guess you are talking about cases, where i talking about deaths?

Where would I want to live? Remote and away from dense popluation... Canada's woodlands/mountains looks good so far haha.


----------



## Cookiegal

Couriant said:


> Canada's woodlands/mountains looks good so far haha.


Indeed but nowhere near Quebec which has 51% of all of the cases in Canada and 58% of the deaths. Right now you can't even get to those safe regions as they have them blocked off, which is a good thing to protect those remote communities with few inhabitants.


----------



## Johnny b

Couriant said:


> ...........................
> 
> Where would I want to live? Remote and away from dense popluation... Canada's woodlands/mountains looks good so far haha.


Agreed 

A bit too cold for me in my later years though.
I live in Ohio. In a lower density environment, definitely not the boondocks though. lol

I'm OK with where I'm at.

If I moved, Australia would be the place. I have relatives there. Most of them anymore.


----------



## Couriant

Cookiegal said:


> Indeed but nowhere near Quebec which has 51% of all of the cases in Canada and 58% of the deaths. Right now you can't even get to those safe regions as they have them blocked off, which is a good thing to protect those remote communities with few inhabitants.


yikes! I have a friend in Howick QC that I was thinking of going to if i could.


----------



## Cookiegal

Couriant said:


> yikes! I have a friend in Howick QC that I was thinking of going to if i could.


You wouldn't be too bad there. Here are some stats:

Howick - population 630 - less than 5 cases (no actual number given)
Howick is in the Montérégie region which has a population of 1.5 million and 2,973 cases. Not too bad overall.

Just be sure not to go through Montreal to get there:

Montreal - population 1.78 million - 12,811 cases.


----------



## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> If you want to make a case, it needs to be of equal considerations.
> ...
> Per capita of a political/social group is the concept that needs to be followed, imo.
> ...


I agree with this. Right now I can't do math on a sleep apnea affected brain but what I was trying to convey on the death count was just a small part of one nation (US) surpassed the deaths in 2 nations put together. The nation (US) death count in itself is about 5x more than those 2 put together.

That area (NY: Pop: 6m) is 4K deaths less than the UK poulation... Pop:66m, so as a nation, the death count in the US could surpass every nation, with the exception of maybe China and Russia when this is all said and done.

Regardless, being in dense populated place is very scary indeed! I live in Phoenix but so far we have had only 122 deaths being reported.


----------



## Couriant

Cookiegal said:


> You wouldn`t be too bad there. Here are some stats:
> 
> Howick - population 630 - less than 5 cases (no actual number given)
> Howick is in the Montérégie region which has a population of 1.5 million and 2,973 cases. Not too bad overall.
> 
> Just be sure not to go through Montreal to get there:
> 
> Montreal - population 1.78 million - 12,811 cases.


I would have gone through there, or *Montréal-Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport* ....

I guess I will have to go through the US/Canada border via NY state... oh wait.... :/ haha


----------



## Couriant

an interesting take on virus spreading using an online game. It's a little long but the end result of what the person got was interesting indeed.


----------



## Johnny b

Couriant said:


> I agree with this. Right now I can't do math on a sleep apnea affected brain but what I was trying to convey on the death count was just a small part of one nation (US) surpassed the deaths in 2 nations put together. The nation (US) death count in itself is about 5x more than those 2 put together.
> 
> That area (NY: Pop: 6m) is 4K deaths less than the UK poulation... Pop:66m, so as a nation, the death count in the US could surpass every nation, with the exception of maybe China and Russia when this is all said and done.
> 
> Regardless, being in dense populated place is very scary indeed! I live in Phoenix but so far we have had only 122 deaths being reported.


Steppenwolf presented Belgium as an example of an insignificant death rate by presenting a stat representative of those that didn't get infected, and claimed similar stats elsewhere.

Steppenwolf is an antivaxxer and has not acknowledged the gravity of the current situation.

But his is a fallacy when considering both the death rate of the infected and the rate at which death occurs ( that being the element that floods health systems). The issue has been how quickly the disease spreads and floods a health system, as we've seen.

His stat was irrelevant to start with and as I pointed out, his argument was flawed in that Belgium's actual death rate of the infected was worse than the US.

Lets blame Steppenwolf for all the confusion LOL!


----------



## Johnny b

More symptoms:

* COVID-19 caused strokes in young people who had mild coronavirus symptoms, NYC doctors say *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...trokes-young-patients-nyc-doctors/3046447001/



> Reports of this phenomenon first came from Wuhan, China, according to the NEJM letter, where approximately 5% of patients who were hospitalized with the coronavirus suffered a stroke. The youngest reported patient was 55.
> 
> However, it's not just stroke doctors that have seen this trend in clotting. Mocco said he's heard from colleagues in heart, lungs and kidney medicine who have also seen complications in coronavirus patients caused by blood clots.
> 
> A study from the Netherlands published in early April looked at 184 patients who were checked into the intensive care unit for COVID-19 pneumonia. Nearly a third of those patients had suffered from thrombotic complications, more commonly known as blood clotting.
> 
> Although doctors can't confirm why the coronavirus seems to induce this, some experts have an educated guess. Mocco said research suggests the virus attaches itself to a host cell that not only exist in the respiratory tract, but also in blood vessels. This means the virus can go anywhere inside the body.


----------



## Gulo Luseus

Johnny b said:


> If you want to make a case, it needs to be of equal considerations.
> 
> Like City to Cities of similar sizes.
> Otherwise, one could point to some boondock city in the US and make a comparison to , say London.
> Logically, a fallacy and statistically, meaningless.
> 
> Per capita of a political/social group is the concept that needs to be followed, imo.
> My example did.
> Your NY City versus nations was a comparison of a hot spot to nations, that would include a wide variation of population densities.


OK 
New York- population 8.4 millon. 300 000 cases. 18 015 deaths.

London - population 8.9 million. 18 000 cases. 4 781 deaths.

UK= around 160 000 cases, 26 097 deaths

We are in lockdown, and most people are sticking to it but there are always idiots that dont, think it wont happen to them, and of whom the next we here is a tearful plea on facebook or other social media telling people their gram has it and you should be indoors.


----------



## Johnny b

Gulo Luseus said:


> OK
> New York- population 8.4 millon. 300 000 cases. 18 015 deaths.
> 
> London - population 8.9 million. 18 000 cases. 4 781 deaths.
> 
> UK= around 160 000 cases, 26 097 deaths
> 
> We are in lockdown, and most people are sticking to it but there are always idiots that dont, think it wont happen to them, and of whom the next we here is a tearful plea on facebook or other social media telling people their gram has it and you should be indoors.


That's a pretty big difference in statistics.

Do you know of any reason why?


----------



## Johnny b

Worth reading:

* Comparing COVID-19 Deaths to Flu Deaths Is like Comparing Apples to Oranges *
https://blogs.scientificamerican.co...u-deaths-is-like-comparing-apples-to-oranges/


----------



## Johnny b

Some new info and projections on COVID-19

* Coronavirus live updates: Pandemic could last 2 years, report says; some state lockdowns wind down; New York won't reopen schools *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...amp-david-social-distancing-may-1/3057754001/



> As many states move toward reopening after a horrific April that saw nearly 60,000 deaths because of the coronavirus, a new report offers a stark warning: A group of experts has concluded the pandemic could last as long as two years, until 60% to 70% of the population is immune.


The new report is this pdf:
https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/sites/default/files/public/downloads/cidrap-covid19-viewpoint-part1.pdf
( from the University of Minnesota Link: https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/ )

Too much to copy and paste.


----------



## Johnny b

A potential positive, but remember, from this article, phase 2 trials won't be initiated till this fall. And then there are phase 3 and 4 trials. ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phases_of_clinical_research )

*Moderna Prepares to Manufacture a Billion Doses of Coronavirus Vaccine*
https://www.fool.com/investing/2020...m_medium=feed&utm_campaign=article&yptr=yahoo



> Moderna, which has a platform based on messenger RNA (mRNA) that can develop new vaccine candidates in days, is currently conducting phase 1 trials of mRNA-1273 and has submitted an application to the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) to initiate phase 2 testing this fall.





> The companies expect to produce the first batches of mRNA-1273 at Lonza's U.S. facility in July 2020.


To go into production before the end of trials suggests they are confident of their vaccine.

Hope it works.


----------



## Gr3iz

State by state lockdown/resume dates. Of course, everything is carved in Jell-O ...
https://www.wired.com/story/which-s...&esrc=&source=EDT_WIR_NEWSLETTER_0_SCIENCE_ZZ


----------



## Gulo Luseus

Johnny b said:


> That's a pretty big difference in statistics.
> 
> Do you know of any reason why?


At a guess, amount of human contact. London, like the rest of the UK, has been a "not going out " zone for over a month now. Social distancing is enforced, and most people have taken to it easily. Shops (the few that are open) keep numbers down, and on the whole people stay away form each other. there are always idiots that decide they know better, but the majority are doing their best to keep it down.
I dont know what happening in NY, as reports seem to be sparse, so I guess theres more contact, but without antyone confirming it, no idea at all.


----------



## Gr3iz

Bored spitless, I downloaded a police scanner app to my phone and have been listening to it for the past couple of hours. There have been at least 3 or 4 calls to have the cops go disperse crowds, citing the "stay at home" executive order rule, or something similar.
LOTs of reckless driving reports! Some en masse! Reports of 25-50 at a time. One report of up to 100 (sounds funny to me!). One report of a traffic accident in that same area involving 2 Chargers and a Challenger. Another with a Camaro and a BMW. A couple of calls that needed wrecker to flip cars back onto their wheels. It is crazy out there!! ;-)


----------



## Johnny b

Gulo Luseus said:


> At a guess, amount of human contact. London, like the rest of the UK, has been a "not going out " zone for over a month now. Social distancing is enforced, and most people have taken to it easily. Shops (the few that are open) keep numbers down, and on the whole people stay away form each other. there are always idiots that decide they know better, but the majority are doing their best to keep it down.
> I dont know what happening in NY, as reports seem to be sparse, so I guess theres more contact, but without antyone confirming it, no idea at all.


Well, I have read in The Daily Mail that testing is worse in London than NY City complicated by a lack of nurses in hospitals. Johns Hopkins has no listing for tests completed in the UK. Any thoughts on that?
I also notice the Johns Hopkins site lists the UK, but doesn't list London in a breakdown of cities.

Some of our states are thought to be showing unrealistically low rates where the situations seem to be a lack of testing, and poor death certificate documentation because of a lack of trained coroners and medical examiners.

Personally, I would have thought London's stats would have been dramatically worse than NY because of the early herd mentality of UK's government.


----------



## ekim68

https://lifehacker.com/these-airlines-now-require-you-to-wear-a-mask-onboard-1843198986



> If you plan on getting on an airplane any time soon, you need to bring a mask along with you for the ride.


----------



## Gulo Luseus

Johnny b said:


> Well, I have read in The Daily Mail that testing is worse in London than NY City complicated by a lack of nurses in hospitals. Johns Hopkins has no listing for tests completed in the UK. Any thoughts on that?
> I also notice the Johns Hopkins site lists the UK, but doesn't list London in a breakdown of cities.
> 
> Some of our states are thought to be showing unrealistically low rates where the situations seem to be a lack of testing, and poor death certificate documentation because of a lack of trained coroners and medical examiners.
> 
> Personally, I would have thought London's stats would have been dramatically worse than NY because of the early herd mentality of UK's government.


to be honest, I wouldnt trust the Daily Mail to tell me what day it is  Although I wouldnt trust any papers we have for more than a smidge if the truth!

As far as testing goes, while we are told it is essential for monitoring cases it doesnt alter deaths. we havent had a loack of staff yet- that was a large motivation for the change from herd immunity to lockdown, that the number of cases could be trickled down. we have several nightingale hospitals set up that are still-in reserve, and while the NHS is pushed (they always are and deserve recognition for what they do) they do keep up.

I assume that JH includes anywhere non US as a country, so doesnt give detailed stats, in the same way that over here we see a breakdown for borough, but only see US deaths as opposed to by city.


----------



## 2twenty2

Several Pharmaceutical Companies Are Racing To Develop a Coronavirus Vaccine

https://science.slashdot.org/story/...s-are-racing-to-develop-a-coronavirus-vaccine


----------



## Johnny b

Went shopping at Walmart this morning.

Ohio now only mandates that people employed in businesses wear masks.
In Walmart they do. :up:
But of the shoppers I saw, maybe only 20% wore masks and of them maybe 25% (at best) wore nitrile gloves. :down:

I often wonder what is on the minds of those that go with out any protection.


----------



## Johnny b

Gulo Luseus said:


> ........................
> 
> I assume that JH includes anywhere non US as a country, so doesnt give detailed stats, in the same way that over here we see a breakdown for borough, but only see US deaths as opposed to by city.


I hadn't noticed that until you pointed it out.
Thanks.

But London's stats seem out of step with an unusually low infection rate, and an unusually high death rate among the infected.
I suspect there's a high error in collecting data.

I posted an link earlier referring to high error collecting in some US States.


----------



## Johnny b

This is not good news.
It's about statistics.

*Don't Be Fooled by America's Flattening Curve*
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive...te=1&user_id=1a77b4fbad71f2e7ae52d97f062d4192

Essentially, eliminate hot spots and statistics show an increase in daily 
infections, not a decrease.



















From this CDC pdf
https://int.nyt.com/data/documenthe...f7319f4a55fd0ce5dc9/optimized/full.pdf#page=1

CDC estimates of future cases of infection and deaths, per day.



















Now is the time to be extra cautious, so stay as safe as is reasonably possible.


----------



## Gulo Luseus

Our advice, at the moment (and it could well change in the next few days) is masks and gloves are not necessary. Given that most of th epeople I see wearing them dont understand why, I can believe it. Masks will give a positive effect as long as they are form fitting, cover nose and mouth, or in a lot of cases I see where shop workers have them, will not a positive effect when worn on the chin so they can talk to their mate from a range of 2 feet.
Similarly gloves- wearing them and then rubbing your face, eating or drinking, is distinctly non-productive. 

as far as London stats go, our stats sat-tues tend to be low, as the only data is hospital based. Come Tuesday/wednesday all sources are available including care homes and home deaths, so they go back up to around double the weekend rate.

I suspect that when the final figures for all countries are collated, the deaths will rise hugely, as most are only reporting hospital deaths. Add in the others, and this turns into a bigger problem than most realise. I wouldnt like to say that this is done this way to avoid panic, or for political purposes, but at the end (or at least the intermission) we will probably see something a bit nastier than we are now.


----------



## Johnny b

Good luck and stay well in England, GL.


----------



## Gulo Luseus

And the same back mate. Being stuck indoors for 6 weeks has been a real strain for most of us, but it seems to be working. I'll happily give up a few months of my life for the chance to have one afterwards.


----------



## Gr3iz

Has anyone seen any reports of the correlation between COVID and crime rates? Just curious ...


----------



## Wino

Saw some crime reports - some areas or types of crime up; others down. Domestic violence was way up, robberies down, child abuse up.


----------



## Gr3iz

Interesting, but not unexpected, I guess ...


----------



## Johnny b

Something to watch.
There have also been reported infections with several White House aides and a number of Secret Service agents.
How far do these infections go in the WH? How many more?

*Coronavirus updates: Multiple top health officials to self-quarantine *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ath-katie-miller-states-reopening/3097594001/



> Multiple top health officials and members on the White House's Coronavirus Taskforce will self-quarantine for two weeks after exposure to a person with the virus, according to official statements and media reports.
> 
> Among them, reportedly, is Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, who CNN says will begin a "modified quarantine" after a low-risk exposure. By virtue of his calm, Brooklyn-inflected White House briefings, Fauci has become a leading expert on the coronavirus.


..........................

*Fauci, 2 other members of coronavirus task force in quarantine *
https://www.post-gazette.com/news/n...tive-White-House-staffer/stories/202005090072
In addition to Fauci:


> Dr. Robert Redfield, director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, will be "teleworking for the next two weeks" after it was determined he had a "low-risk exposure" to a person at the White House,......
> 
> ....... FDA Commissioner Stephen Hahn had come in contact with someone who tested positive and was in self-quarantine for the next two weeks.


----------



## Johnny b

* South Dakota governor demands tribes remove travel checkpoints on Indian reservations *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...demands-tribes-remove-checkpoints/3104046001/



> A battle is brewing between a pair of South Dakota Indian tribes and the governor's office over checkpoints set up on the reservations restricting travel during the COVID-19 pandemic.
> 
> Gov. Kristi Noem sent letters Friday to leaders of the Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe and the Oglala Sioux Tribe demanding that checkpoints that have been set up on those reservations along state and U.S. highways be removed immediately.


----------



## Johnny b

* Simply talking in confined spaces may be enough to spread the coronavirus, researchers say *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-high-risk-coronavirus-infections/5186862002/


----------



## Johnny b

Some positive research worth reading, imo.

* T cells found in COVID-19 patients 'bode well' for long-term immunity *
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/05/t-cells-found-covid-19-patients-bode-well-long-term-immunity


----------



## ekim68

As an aside.. 


Australian poll finds 1 in 8 blame Bill Gates and 5G for coronavirus



> When it comes to believing stupid conspiracy theories related to coronavirus, young Australians are the most susceptible, or at least that's what they're telling pollsters.
> 
> According to a poll [PDF] conducted by Essential Research, one-fifth of all 18 to 34-year olds said they had some belief that Bill Gates was involved in the creation and spread of coronavirus, with the same number responding positive to the question: "The 5G wireless network is being used to spread the COVID-19 virus".


----------



## Gr3iz

<sigh>


----------



## Couriant

im le tired....


----------



## Johnny b

ekim68 said:


> As an aside..
> 
> Australian poll finds 1 in 8 blame BS ReceptivityBill Gates and 5G for coronavirus


There is a psychological term for that.

BS Receptivity.
( it's a real term )


----------



## ekim68

Ardern dances for joy after New Zealand eliminates coronavirus



> WELLINGTON (Reuters) - New Zealand lifted all social and economic restrictions except border controls after declaring on Monday it was free of the coronavirus, one of the first countries in the world to return to pre-pandemic normality.


----------



## Johnny b

* Coronavirus shutdowns prevented 60 million infections in the USA, study says *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...coronavirus-infections-study-says/5317334002/


----------



## 2twenty2

WHO chief warns virus is worsening globally
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/who-chief-warns-virus-is-worsening-globally


----------



## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> * Coronavirus shutdowns prevented 60 million infections in the USA, study says *
> 
> https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...coronavirus-infections-study-says/5317334002/


And Arizona cases surged since the shutdown was lifted... go figure.


----------



## Johnny b

* Beijing reinstated lockdown as US officials warn the same could happen here *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...us-officials-warn-the-same-could-happen-here/



> Authorities in Beijing have locked down parts of the city, reinstated some restrictions, and are testing tens of thousands of residents amid a burst of new SARS-CoV-2 infections.


----------



## Johnny b

Something positive:

* Steroid found to help prevent deaths of sickest coronavirus patients *

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...revent-deaths-of-sickest-coronavirus-patients


----------



## 2twenty2

> Coronavirus pandemic accelerating with Americas worst, warns WHO
> 
> The coronavirus pandemic is accelerating, with Thursday's 150,000 new cases the highest in a single day and nearly half of those in the Americas, the World Health Organization (WHO) said.


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...g-with-americas-worst-warns-who-idUSKBN23Q2OV


----------



## 2twenty2

https://torontosun.com/sports/other...lans/wcm/e1080f85-eea3-4a1a-93bc-082d85b8f1d5

Flurry of positive coronavirus tests in athletes hurts U.S. restart plans
Florida is one of several U.S. states that have seen their number of COVID-19 cases surge recently.


----------



## ekim68

Great, now the ocean is filled with COVID trash: Masks, gloves, and hand sanitizer



> Are oil companies the true heroes of the COVID-19 pandemic? That's sure what they'd like you to think.


----------



## Johnny b

Definitely a major problem.
Not to say the oil companies are heroes, but....
aren't the villains, the person/persons responsible for disposal of that trash?


----------



## 2twenty2

https://apple.slashdot.org/story/20...es-11-stores-just-weeks-after-re-opening-them



> "Mere weeks after reopening over 100 stores, Apple has announced that it will be closing a number of its locations," reports the International Business Times:
> Eleven stores in Arizona, Florida, North Carolina, and South Carolina will be closing as of Saturday due to spikes in coronavirus cases in certain communities. The six stores closed in Arizona are the only locations Apple operates in that state...
> 
> All of the states affected by these closures have been amongst those seeing a new surge in COVID-19 cases. Experts suggest that these regions may be seeing a spike in infections due to the fact that they avoided the worst of the virus's initial spread across the U.S. Florida, in particular, have been singled out as a new potential epicenter for the outbreak.


----------



## ekim68

"Totally predictable": State reopenings have backfired



> Call it a reopening backfire. But really: No expert thought that reopening this quickly was going to work in the first place.


----------



## ekim68

Nope, couldn't see this coming... 


Social gatherings help fuel rising coronavirus spread in parts of California


----------



## Johnny b

Wearing a mask and avoiding crowds seems like such an easy and simple concept.

When I go out to the supermarket, I notice fewer and fewer customers wearing masks.
Not just the young.


----------



## dotty999

Hardly anyone wears them in supermarkets in the UK. Mainly on the local bus service but many of us are exempt due to medical conditions


----------



## steppenwolf

democrat gov in WA threatening 90 days in jail with no mask -guess they dont wanna get reeclected


----------



## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> democrat gov in WA threatening 90 days in jail with no mask -guess they dont wanna get reeclected


Actually, it's a $100 fine and *up to* 90 days in jail.

Whether re-elected or not, it's to save lives and insure there is a society with an economy in the future.

But thanks for injecting politics into a situation calling for common sense.
It's becoming obvious all states should be mandating the wearing of masks.
The Covid-19 virus does not care what political party it's next victim belongs to.
But one thing is obvious, ignorance is it's 'friend'.


----------



## Johnny b

New information:

* Startling images reveal coronavirus forming tentacles in cells. It may help identify new treatments. *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...de-cells-providing-clue-treatment/3265085001/



> Startling, never-before-seen images show that the new coronavirus hijacks proteins in our cells to create monstrous tentacles that branch out and may transmit infection to neighboring cells.


----------



## valis

Houston is getting hammered....averaging well over 5k cases daily...and again, this is only Houston proper, Harris County....

It is all due to (IMO of course) a distinct lack of common sense.


----------



## 2twenty2

*Texas* and *Florida* crack down on bars, reversing coronavirus reopening

https://business.financialpost.com/...-down-on-bars-reversing-coronavirus-reopening


----------



## Johnny b

hmmmm?

Alcohol and Covid-19......what could possibly go wrong.


----------



## 2twenty2

New U.S. coronavirus cases hit 45,242 for biggest one-day increase of pandemic

https://torontosun.com/news/world/n...emic/wcm/7b1d8940-d301-46a0-b51d-1d0bc0a17e78


----------



## flavallee

Almost 127,000 deaths in the U.S., and still counting.


----------



## Johnny b

From my local news site:

* Coronavirus: Food insecurity has doubled locally, across Ohio *
https://www.daytondailynews.com/new...d-locally-across-ohio/cIXo5K5pzcIGbhKhF4lgmO/



> Ohio food insecurity rates have nearly doubled because of the coronavirus pandemic, a new study found, and food banks in the state say government action is needed now.
> 
> The Census Household Pulse Survey found that food insecurity rates in the state have gone from 13.9% to 23%.
> 
> .................
> "We're really worried that grocery stores won't survive this, especially in low income areas," Hamler-Fuggit said.


----------



## steppenwolf

i feel a lot of covid 19 news is fake,but i wear mask at times to please people


----------



## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> i feel a lot of covid 19 news is fake,but i wear mask at times to please people





> i feel a lot of covid 19 news is fake,


Just for clarification, statistics and medical science, or the deniers?


----------



## Johnny b

There is a lot of attention to the statistics of Covid-19 infections versus death, but what about statistics for those that were infected and left with impairments that will handicap them for life?

That social and societal impact goes beyond the current confirmed 125K deaths ( which some claim could be as much as 5 to 10 times that after adjustment ).
Not only will these people not likely be participating in the economy of the Covid-19 aftermath, a large part will likely be incapacitated and dependent upon help from our society.

Imagine this going on in your brain:










* COVID-19 Psychosis: A Potential New Neuropsychiatric Condition Triggered by Novel Coronavirus Infection and the Inflammatory Response? *
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7236749/

*When Covid-19 hits the brain, it can cause strokes, psychosis and a dementia-like syndrome, new survey shows *
https://www.statnews.com/2020/06/25/covid-19-brain-complications/

Something to consider:
If Obama Care is replaced with private insurance, pre-existing medical conditions will become an issue.
Covid-19 will be that issue for much of our population, not just for those treated for Covid-19 infection, it will likely include those that were asymptomatic also.

* Trump Administration, Republican Attorneys General Ask Supreme Court to Repeal ACA*
https://www.ajmc.com/newsroom/republican-attorneys-general-file-briefs-to-repeal-aca

* Covid-19 survivors could lose health insurance if Trump wins bid to repeal Obamacare *
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jun/27/obamacare-trump-covid-health-insurance


----------



## Johnny b

Update on infections:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/28/health/us-coronavirus-sunday/index.html



> A new survey by the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention suggests the total number of coronavirus infections across the US could actually be *six to 24 times greater than reported.*


----------



## 2twenty2

https://nationalpost.com/news/world...nds/wcm/5e4ce742-3fd7-467e-957d-187057b83a3b/

U.S. Treasury sent more than 1 million coronavirus stimulus payments to dead people, congressional watchdog finds


----------



## steppenwolf

Johnny b said:


> Just for clarification, statistics and medical science, or the deniers?


The Centers for Disease Control, updated from yesterday, April 4th, still states that mortality, quote unquote, data includes both confirmed and presumptive positive cases of COVID-19. That's from their website.

Translation? The CDC counts both true COVID-19 cases and speculative guesses of COVID-19 the same. They call it death by COVID-19. They automatically overestimate the real death numbers, by their own admission.

https://canadafreepress.com/article/the-cdc-confesses-to-lying-about-covid-19-death-numbers

i think the bible says dont trust in man,there are lots of liars,i dont like phones or internet anymore or tv much,internet is about same as robocalls,there seems to be few i trust now

anyone here into bible ?book of revelation?it doesnt paint a rosey picture


----------



## dotty999

I live in a town where there have been 767 Covid related deaths to date!


----------



## 2twenty2

*Coronavirus cases rise in US south and west as crowded protests spark worries*

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/03/us/us-coronavirus-protests/index.html


----------



## Drabdr

Please remember that Random discussion is for light hearted discussions of topics. Any debating is to be done in the controversial topics discussion forum.


----------



## steppenwolf

dotty999 said:


> I live in a town where there have been 767 Covid related deaths to date!


 were they really flu?my grandfather died of some lung thing years ago...id guess it was the depression a cold house burning papers or cardboard in a bad wood stove-nightmares


----------



## steppenwolf

do you think its man-made?if its man-made i think many will die maybe


----------



## dotty999

steppenwolf said:


> were they really flu?my grandfather died of some lung thing years ago...id guess it was the depression a cold house burning papers or cardboard in a bad wood stove-nightmares


They were confirmed Covid deaths


----------



## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> do you think its man-made?if its man-made i think many will die maybe


No. There is no evidence Covid-19 is man made.
To the contrary.
Edit: there is evidence it isn't man made.

I doubt you will understand the discussion in this article, but others reading this probably will:








https://abcnews.go.com/Health/virol...k-study-origins-coronavirus/story?id=71097846

Many are dying.
Try quitting the denial of reality and read the stats from the link at the beginning of this thread.


----------



## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> were they really flu?my grandfather died of some lung thing years ago...id guess it was the depression a cold house burning papers or cardboard in a bad wood stove-nightmares


That's pretty cold, slick.

Covid-19 is real and it's killing in more ways than just destroying the lungs.


----------



## 2twenty2

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/28/world/coronavirus-updates.html

500,000 global deaths are reported as the world's case total reaches 10 million.


----------



## steppenwolf

https://heavy.com/news/2020/05/jadon-hayden/



> Hayden was admitted to the nursing home to undergo rehabilitation and recovery on a temporary basis. It is not clear what rehabilitation and recovery Hayden was admitted for.


some say he and others young people had covid and were deliberately mixed in

id like to know if this is true


----------



## steppenwolf

According to his father, *Jaydon* *Hayden* was moved to the nursing home because he had *COVID-19*.

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/20...irus-beat-77-yr-old-veteran-still-week-later/

when i had shingles in eye i had to be in isolation or they said it could have wiped out old people in hospital

i guess times have changed


----------



## 2twenty2

*'A recipe for disaster,' U.S. health official says of Americans ignoring coronavirus advice*

Read more at https://www.todayonline.com/world/r...-says-americans-ignoring-coronavirus-advice-0


----------



## Johnny b

There is concern in Ohio ( my state )

* Coronavirus: Ohio positive test rate rises, 'cause for concern' *

https://www.daytondailynews.com/new...ses-cause-for-concern/Mh7f4Dc8BCJcjKQFztCiaI/


----------



## Johnny b

New concerns in addition to the Covid-19 pandemic.

* Swine flu in Chinese pigs monitored for 'pandemic potential' *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...pdates-face-masks-fauci-reopening/3279340001/



> A swine flu virus found in Chinese pigs has the potential to jump to humans and even spark a pandemic, researchers say.


* Prevalent Eurasian avian-like H1N1 swine influenza virus with 2009 pandemic viral genes facilitating human infection *
https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2020/06/23/1921186117

( PNAS first published June 29, 2020 https://doi.org/10.1073/pnas.1921186117
Contributed by George F. Gao, April 28, 2020 (sent for review December 9, 2019; reviewed by Ian H. Brown and Xiu-Feng Henry Wan) )



> Similar to pdm/09 virus, G4 viruses have all the essential hallmarks of a candidate pandemic virus. Of concern is that swine workers show elevated seroprevalence for G4 virus. Controlling the prevailing G4 EA H1N1 viruses in pigs and close monitoring in human populations, especially the workers in swine industry, should be urgently implemented.


----------



## Johnny b

* USA TODAY analysis of COVID-19 infection rates at the ZIP code-level shows how the virus has spread rapidly, but unevenly, across the U.S. *

https://www.usatoday.com/in-depth/g...eighborhoods-show-big-disparities/3257615001/



> Overall, data for more than 8,500 ZIP codes - about 26% of all U.S. ZIPs - were collected during the week of June 15, 2020 from 49 state, county and local health departments that publish data at that geographic level. Although far from comprehensive, the reports include slices from every U.S. Census region.
> 
> USA TODAY matched the ZIP code data with 2018 U.S. Census demographic data to examine income, race and population disparities in neighborhoods with varying infection rates.
> 
> The map and charts below show how unevenly the virus as spread across communities and neighborhoods since the first case was reported last January.


----------



## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> According to his father, *Jaydon* *Hayden* was moved to the nursing home because he had *COVID-19*.
> 
> https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/20...irus-beat-77-yr-old-veteran-still-week-later/
> 
> when i had shingles in eye i had to be in isolation or they said it could have wiped out old people in hospital
> 
> i guess times have changed


Times have changed, no doubt about that.

I remember you posting you were in effect, an antivaxxer.

Refuse a vaccine and unfortunate things can occur, like your experience with shingles.

Will you refuse to take a Covid-19 vaccine?


----------



## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> https://heavy.com/news/2020/05/jadon-hayden/
> 
> Hayden was admitted to the nursing home to undergo rehabilitation and recovery on a temporary basis. It is not clear what rehabilitation and recovery Hayden was admitted for.
> 
> According to the media outlet, the law firm said in the statement, "Westwood has been cooperating with the police and will continue to do so. The safety, health, and well-being of our residents remains a top priority of Westwood. We will continue to monitor the situation."
> 
> some say he and others young people had covid and were deliberately mixed in
> 
> id like to know if this is true
> 
> one of alex jones talking points


You have a computer.
Google it.


----------



## Johnny b

Nothing really new here that hasn't been discussed....except for this:

* Fauci tells Congress recent coronavirus surge caused by reopening too quickly, not following guidelines *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...auci-update-senate-state-pandemic/3279369001/



> New cases have been increasing by abut 40,000 a day, he said, adding that could rise to 100,000 a day without changes.
> 
> "We've really got to do something about that and we need to deal with it quickly," he said. "It could get very bad."


----------



## Johnny b

* Americans will remain barred from European travel as the EU gradually reopens its borders *

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/30/americans-to-remain-barred-from-european-travel.html


----------



## 2twenty2

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappen...mericans-about-canadian-health-care-1.5631874


> This former U.S. health insurance exec says he lied to Americans about Canadian health care
> 
> What were the lies you told Americans about Canada's public health-care system?
> 
> We told the Americans that the Canadian system was not the system that we should have anything to do with, that it was "socialized medicine." We used that term repeatedly to try to get people to be afraid of the Canadian system.


----------



## Cookiegal

A reminder to all about the stipulation on the rules page regarding quoting articles:


> It is illegal to post copyrighted articles in their entirety. Therefore, do not post full articles. You may quote a small section of an article as long as you also provide a link to the source. Any such excerpts from articles quoted and linked to be wrapped in quote tags to avoid confusion as to authorship.


I'm not going to single anyone out because I see several during the course of this thread. I know links to the source is not a problem because all are doing that but I wanted to quote the entire rule. Please remember that you shouldn't be quoting more than one paragraph or two if they are very short (like a couple of lines each). It's easy to get carried away and forget, especially when you have to expand the quote box to view the rest but we would appreciate you keeping this in mind when posting articles. Thanks for your understanding.


----------



## Johnny b

Near me:

* Dayton approves mandatory mask law, cites rapid COVID-19 spread locally *
https://www.daytondailynews.com/new...-covid-spread-locally/YyjlGrbuzIaoDjWdBROCnL/

I hate to see the infection rates in Dayton rise, but I'm glad wise heads prevail.


----------



## Johnny b

Contact tracing has gotten more difficult:

* Most COVID-19 patients don't know who infected them, CDC survey finds *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ho-infected-them-cdc-survey-finds/5354603002/


----------



## Cookiegal

John, you can post part of the article you know.


----------



## Couriant

Well considering people are going to the stores, it would make sense that they wouldn't know who gave it to them.


----------



## Cookiegal

Steppenwolf,

I've edited your last post. This thread is for posting updates and news regarding the virus so please refrain from posting comments that incite refutal or debate from others. There is another thread in the Controversial Topics forum where you can debate matters concerning the virus.

Also, you are to use quote tags when quoting a short portion of articles.


----------



## Johnny b

Sweden's herd immunity not working out:

* Sweden's prime minister orders an inquiry into the failure of the country's no-lockdown coronavirus strategy *
https://news.yahoo.com/swedens-prime-minister-orders-inquiry-114455827.html



> Sweden's prime minister said the country must now change its approach.


----------



## 2twenty2

*Coronavirus: What's happening around the world on Thursday*
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/coronavirus-july-2-covid-19-1.5634668


----------



## Johnny b

* The governor of Texas orders most residents to wear masks in public. *

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/02/world/coronavirus-us.html#link-31087731



> Gov. Greg Abbott of Texas issued a sweeping order on Thursday requiring most Texans to wear masks in public, in an abrupt reversal as cases soar in the nation's second-largest state. The order applies to Texas counties with 20 or more coronavirus cases.


----------



## Johnny b

* Young patients are dying, too, particularly obese ones, a W.H.O. official says. *

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/02/world/coronavirus-us.html#link-2ba4990f

Two concerns:



> "We should not become complacent that it's fine for young people to get infected," Dr. Swaminathan said, "because there is a subset, particularly those with obesity, those with habits like smoking, for example, who are at higher risk of complications and death."


And



> Fatalities from Covid-19, the disease caused by the virus, typically occur three to five weeks after patients are infected. But many countries divide the number of deaths by the number of infections.
> 
> "It has been suggested by scientists that, really to get an accurate idea of case fatality rates, you should divide by the number of cases two weeks ago, not the number of cases today," Dr. Swaminathan said.


----------



## Johnny b

*Coronavirus updates: Cases rise in 40 of 50 states; Jersey Shore open, but L.A. beaches closed; Texas mask mandate begins *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...cord-daily-cases-texas-face-masks/5370486002/



> Heading into the Fourth of July holiday weekend, the U.S. recorded 52,291 new cases of the coronavirus Thursday, surpassing Wednesday's record of 50,655, according to a tally kept by Johns Hopkins University Covid-19 cases rise in 40 of 50 states over past two weeks.
> 
> It's the largest single-day total in the U.S. since the pandemic began six months ago.


----------



## Johnny b

* 2 Texas counties urge residents to shelter in place as hospitals reach capacity *

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/04/us/texas-hospitals-coronavirus/index.html



> Hospitals in at least two Texas counties are at full capacity heading into the Fourth of July holiday weekend, with county judges urging residents to shelter in place.
> Judges in Starr and Hidalgo counties sent out emergency alerts Friday, warning residents that local hospitals in the Rio Grande Valley were at capacity.


Texas daily cases










Remember, there is at least a 2 week delay before showing the resulting deaths from today's infections.


----------



## ekim68

Another graph...


How severe is the pandemic where you live?


----------



## ekim68

A Virus Walks Into a Bar …



> As communities open up, it's becoming increasingly clear that the indoor bar scene is uniquely suited to transmission of Covid-19.


----------



## Johnny b

The lingering symptoms of Covid-19

* Donald Trump claims 99% of coronavirus cases are 'totally harmless.' The 'long haulers' with lingering symptoms say he's wrong. *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ors-donald-trump-totally-harmless/5386254002/



> People with complications, self-described as "long haulers," are uncounted in any official report as of now.
> 
> * Patients who experience COVID-19 complications is 'significantly higher' than 1% *
> Dr. Ashish Jha, K.T. Li Professor of Global Health at Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health and director of Harvard Global Health Institute, said it's harmful to not communicate COVID-19's risk and underplay its threat.
> 
> Though there is no data on long-term effects, Jha estimates "a sizable minority" of 10 to 20% of patients will have "meaningful long-term clinical effects of this virus."


----------



## Johnny b

*Dr. Anthony Fauci warns US is 'knee-deep' in first wave of coronavirus cases and prognosis is 'really not good'*

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...coronavirus-surge-really-not-good/5388472002/



> In an interview via Facebook Live, the nation's top infectious disease expert said, "We are still knee-deep in the first wave of this. And I would say, this would not be considered a wave. It was a surge, or a resurgence of infections superimposed upon a baseline."
> 
> New cases in the U.S. have reached record highs, climbing to around 50,000 a day. Nearly 3 million Americans have contracted the virus, with more than 130,000 deaths, according to data from John Hopkins University.
> 
> Fauci's characterization comes shortly after he warned Congress last week that new coronavirus infections could increase to 100,000 a day if the nation doesn't get its surge of cases under control.


----------



## Johnny b

Fox News:

*Herd immunity may not be achievable in fight against coronavirus*
https://www.foxnews.com/health/herd-immunity-may-not-be-achievable-in-fight-against-coronavirus

* Coronavirus immunity can be 'short-lived,' expert warns *
https://www.foxnews.com/health/coronavirus-immunity-can-be-short-lived-expert-warns

* Coronavirus expert says Americans will be wearing masks for 'several years' *
https://www.foxnews.com/us/coronavirus-expert-says-americans-will-be-wearing-masks-for-several-years


----------



## ekim68

Arizona Is #1, Bahrain Is #4



> There is no country in the world where confirmed coronavirus cases are growing as rapidly as they are in Arizona, Florida or South Carolina. The Sun Belt has become the global virus capital.


----------



## Johnny b

Interesting article at Arstechnica:

*Is SARS-CoV-2 airborne? Questions abound-but here's what we know *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...ne-questions-abound-but-heres-what-we-know/2/


----------



## Johnny b

List of unsafe hand sanitizers:

https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-safety-and-availability/fda-updates-hand-sanitizers-methanol


----------



## Johnny b

*Two months after infection, COVID-19 symptoms persist*
https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/07/two-months-after-infection-covid-19-symptoms-persist/



> Almost 90 percent still have at least one symptom long after the virus has gone.
> 
> The group ranged from 19 to 85 years old, with an average age of 57. Overall, they had spent an average of 13 days in the hospital while infected, and about 20 percent had needed assistance with breathing.
> 
> Two months after there was no detectable virus, only 13 percent of the study group was free of any COVID-19 symptoms. By contrast, a bit over half still had at least three symptoms typical of the disease.
> 
> (edit: there is more of interest in the article)


----------



## valis

Johnny b said:


> * 2 Texas counties urge residents to shelter in place as hospitals reach capacity *
> 
> https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/04/us/texas-hospitals-coronavirus/index.html
> 
> Texas daily cases
> 
> View attachment 278680
> 
> 
> Remember, there is at least a 2 week delay before showing the resulting deaths from today's infections.


I can vouch...it is a mess down here...just idiocy....


----------



## Johnny b

valis said:


> I can vouch...it is a mess down here...just idiocy....


I've got nothing...other than to wish you and yours the best.

I don't understand the resistance to masks and social distancing.

Ohio's infection rate has started to increase and there seems to be growing resentment against even the suggestions to wear a mask in public.


----------



## Johnny b

And then this pops up.

Vaccine Nationalism.

*'No one is safe until everyone is safe': Vaccine nationalism threatens global coronavirus effort *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...bal-efforts-race-stop-coronavirus/5384850002/

Too much to copy and paste.


----------



## Johnny b

Half way down this web page:

* You can become infected twice - and that's a blow to 'herd immunity' hopes *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ew-york-city-florida-oklahoma-who/5424429002/

Link to source:

*My patient caught Covid-19 twice. So long to herd immunity hopes. *
https://www.vox.com/2020/7/12/21321653/getting-covid-19-twice-reinfection-antibody-herd-immunity



> Emerging cases of Covid-19 reinfection suggest herd immunity is wishful thinking.
> 
> Covid-19 may also be much worse the second time around.


This is an important article. 
A bit long and too much to copy and paste here.
A must read, imo.


----------



## 2twenty2

Bottleneck for U.S. Coronavirus Response: The Fax Machine

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/13/upshot/coronavirus-response-fax-machines.html


----------



## Johnny b

* California Coronavirus Update: Governor Gavin Newsom Orders Indoor Service At All Restaurants, Bars, Movie Theaters In State To Close Again; No End Date Given *

https://deadline.com/2020/07/califo...urants-indoor-operations-in-state-1202984427/


----------



## Johnny b

With all the hazards of a pandemic, there is this warning in a city near me:

* City of Kettering warns of scammers pretending to be contact tracers*
https://www.daytondailynews.com/new...nding-contact-tracers/nEZu89g72O3a49mX6CG80N/



> The City of Kettering issued an alert warning of scammers posing as contact tracers to attempt to get ahold of personal information.


----------



## Johnny b

I just canceled regular checkups with my dentist and ophthalmologist for this week and rescheduled, because of the current rise in Covid-19 infections. 

They take the appropriate safety precautions, I just don't trust the general public that they have to deal with. 

In conversations with them, many patients are doing the same.


----------



## Johnny b

It's been reported there is a coin shortage and now some businesses are unable to make change with coins.

* With coins circulation dropping, Kroger won't be giving coins back *
https://www.daytondailynews.com/bus...won-giving-coins-back/GbpB2DstQ5AKVftX3RxNMN/



> Another way the world has changed due to the COVID-19 pandemic: The number of coins in circulation has plummeted.
> 
> In a brief statement, Kroger spokeswoman Erin Rolfes said the Federal Reserve is experiencing a coin shortage. Coin change from cash transactions will be applied to our customers' loyalty cards then automatically used on their next purchase.


----------



## Johnny b

The 'face of America' is changing.

* Can shopping malls survive the coronavirus pandemic and a new slate of permanent store closings? *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...il-mall-closures-shopping-changes/5400200002/



> "The whole business model of a mall, which is about pulling in as many people as you can and getting them to stay for as long as you can, has just unraveled," said Neil Saunders, managing director of consultancy GlobalData Retail.


----------



## 2twenty2

*Texas Hospital Says Man, 30, Died After Attending a 'Covid Party'*
Health experts have been skeptical that such parties occur, and details of this case could not be independently confirmed.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/12/us/30-year-old-covid-party-death.html


----------



## Gr3iz

Another Darwin award winner ... <sigh> And the gene pool breathes a sigh of relief along with me.


----------



## 2twenty2

Gr3iz said:


> Another Darwin award winner ... <sigh> And the gene pool breathes a sigh of relief along with me.


Or the new term is "Covidiot" (name for shaming ignorant, selfish coronavirus reactions)


----------



## Gr3iz

An interesting twist ...
https://www.wired.com/story/the-lat..._medium=email&utm_source=nl&utm_term=list1_p4


----------



## Johnny b

Several potential vaccine candidates to follow:

*Pfizer CEO Albert Bourla Raises Expectations That the Pharmaceutical Giant Can Deliver a COVID-19 Vaccine by Fall *
https://time.com/5864690/pfizer-vaccine-coronavirus/

*Moderna's COVID vaccine candidate appears to be safe and provide some immunity, new data from early trial shows *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...appears-safe-effective-data-shows/5435723002/


----------



## Johnny b

Florida.

Private parties, party boats and people that simply do not take the Covid-19 pandemic seriously:

* 'Epicenter of the epicenter': Young people partying in Miami Beach despite COVID-19 threat *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/trav...florida-even-covid-19-cases-surge/5449754002/


----------



## Johnny b

Insanity.

A meeting in Utah to decide school mask policy had to be called off because the room was crowded and filled with people not wearing masks.

* Meeting on masks in Utah schools postponed after crowd without masks fills the room *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...postponed-due-crowd-without-masks/3287459001/












> "This is the exact opposite of what we need to be doing," Ainge said at the meeting. "We are supposed to be physically distancing, wearing masks."
> 
> The audience responded with a loud chorus of boos.


----------



## ekim68

Thank goodness for facial recognition systems so we know who they are...


----------



## Johnny b

Dire times in Texas and Arizona:

* With morgues brimming, Texas and Arizona turn to refrigerator trucks *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...exas-and-arizona-turn-to-refrigerator-trucks/


----------



## 2twenty2

Masks offer much more protection against coronavirus than many think

https://www.latimes.com/california/...s-help-lower-your-exposure-to-the-coronavirus


----------



## 2twenty2

U.S. Coronavirus Cases Rise by Over 70,000 for Second Day in a Row

https://www.usnews.com/news/top-new...s-rise-by-over-70-000-for-second-day-in-a-row


----------



## Gr3iz

My daughter, in the health care field, tested positive this week. We've got to keep her 4 kids (actually 2 of them already lived with us) for a couple of weeks. Since I've got a surgery scheduled for Tuesday morning, I figured I should get tested, too. There are several places doing it, but the only place open on Friday afternoon was at a local hospital. We got there and there was already a long line snaking through the parking lot to the testing area. The guard told us it would be about 4 hours! I had brought two of my granddaughters (daughter's girls) with me, hoping to get them tested as well. When we got there we were informed 18 and older, so it was just me. We sat in the car for 4 hours, running much of the time for the A/C. I'd turn it off once in a while, but we couldn't bear it for long. They had a few Port-o-potties staged throughout the lot, and it came close to me needing to use one, but I held out. The test itself took roughly 30 seconds. I guess the longest time was the insurance part. 
I was proud of the 8-year old. She never whined or complained once! And her iPhone power lasted through most of the wait, fortunately! ;-)
I guess I'll hear something in the next few days. I hope!
Then, my oldest grandson came home from work early because he wasn't feeling well. He seldom gets sick! The old lady took him to that same hospital for his test a short while ago ...


----------



## Johnny b

Best wishes.


----------



## Gr3iz

Thanks!


----------



## steppenwolf

kid dies from "covid test" shoved up the nose -u google it


----------



## Johnny b

steppenwolf said:


> kid dies from "covid test" shoved up the nose -u google it


googled it.....nothing about a kid dying from a nasal swab.

Post a direct link.


----------



## Cookiegal

I deleted a couple of posts that weren't relevant to the spirit of this thread John. Also, what you quoted was their signature not a comment within a post.

It was in Saudi Arabia and was because the swab broke in the infant's nose requiring anesthesia and surgery to remove it but the child didn't survive.

https://www.newsbreak.com/news/0Pdg...s-after-covid-19-test-swab-breaks-in-his-nose


----------



## Cookiegal

I'm so sorry to hear that Mark.  I hope your test is negative. That's much too close to home for comfort for you.


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> I deleted a couple of posts that weren't relevant to the spirit of this thread John. Also, what you quoted was their signature not a comment within a post.
> 
> It was in Saudi Arabia and was because the swab broke in the infant's nose requiring anesthesia and surgery to remove it but the child didn't survive.
> 
> https://www.newsbreak.com/news/0Pdg...s-after-covid-19-test-swab-breaks-in-his-nose


Certainly a real tragedy.

Thanks for the link.


----------



## 2twenty2

@Gr3iz (MarK)

My family and I hope for the best for you and your family


----------



## Johnny b

General updates

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ago-update-school-reopening-plans/5464149002/

(Nothing of a good nature)


----------



## Gr3iz

Thanks guys! Now we wait ... <sigh> I'm not letting it get me down.


----------



## Johnny b

The economic crisis from Covid-19 has gotten this bad in Ohio.
No doubt the same is occurring throughout much of the US.

* Pandemic, economic crisis to trigger wave of evictions, experts say *
https://www.daytondailynews.com/ohi...tions-experts-say/E2L3D2JS4ZCT5CXQ7MLSVPGF3Q/

Too much to copy and paste everything important.



> Nationally, the COVID-19 Eviction Defense Project estimates 25.8 million Americans are a risk for eviction by September 2020. In Ohio, 800,000 renters could be at risk for eviction and Ohio landlords will be owed $345 million in back rent by then, the project estimated.
> 
> A lack of stable housing impacts children and their education, reduces financial means to buy healthy food and medical care, and exposes families to dangerous materials in substandard housing," according to the Ohio Association of Community Action Agencies' State of Poverty in Ohio report for 2020.
> 
> Electric and gas utilities also are making plans to resume disconnections and fees for non-payment.


----------



## ekim68

Walmart Workers Are Terrified of Enforcing Mask Rules



> Even in a time of record unemployment, some of Dan's colleagues at an Indiana Walmart have walked off the job. They aren't quitting over fears of catching COVID-19, he explained. They're quitting because of customers who become abusive when asked to wear face masks.


----------



## Johnny b

* It's not just dexamethasone: Other steroids may be used to treat critically ill COVID-19 patients, study says *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ed-reduced-risk-coronavirus-death/5478793002/



> Researchers at the Albert Einstein College of Medicine and Montefiore Health System led a study where most of their patients took prednisone, another steroid in the same family as dexamethasone, and found patients with high inflammation levels were associated with a 75% reduction in risk of going on mechanical ventilation or dying.


----------



## 2twenty2

Global coronavirus cases exceed 15 million: Reuters tally

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...d-15-million-reuters-tally-idUSKCN24N0KK?il=0


----------



## Johnny b

This relates to health after recovery:

*Symptom Duration and Risk Factors for Delayed Return to Usual Health Among Outpatients with COVID-19 ......... *
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6930e1.htm?s_cid=mm6930e1_w#T1_up


> COVID-19 can result in prolonged illness, even among young adults without underlying chronic medical conditions.


Stats:

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6930e1.htm?s_cid=mm6930e1_w#T1_down


> ...........positive test results (N = 270)* who reported returning to usual state of health or not returning to usual state of health at an interview conducted 14-21 days after testing - 14 academic health care systems,† United States, March-June 2020






















> 294 patients responded to an interview 2-3 weeks after testing, did not report a previous positive SARS-CoV-2 test before the reference test, and answered questions about symptoms. Of these, 276 (94%) reported one or more symptoms at the time of SARS-CoV-2 RT-PCR testing, with 272 (99%) reporting whether they had returned to their usual state of health by the time of the interview. Two additional patients excluded who were called at 7 days, with 270 included here.


----------



## Johnny b

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...portion-gop-convention-cdc-school/5495991002/

*DC adds quarantine requirement for nonessential travelers from hot spots *



> Washington, D.C., will require travelers coming to the city to self-quarantine for 14 days if they are arriving from a high-risk area on nonessential travel.


----------



## 2twenty2

Can You Get Covid-19 Again? It's Very Unlikely, Experts Say

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/22/health/covid-antibodies-herd-immunity.html


----------



## 2twenty2

Scientists are 3-D printing miniature human organs to test coronavirus drugs

https://theweek.com/speedreads/9276...miniature-human-organs-test-coronavirus-drugs


----------



## Gr3iz

Everybody in our household has finally gotten our test results back. Everyone is negative. Apparently my daughter had gotten a false positive result two weeks ago.


----------



## 2twenty2

Gr3iz said:


> Everybody in our household has finally gotten our test results back. Everyone is negative. Apparently my daughter had gotten a false positive result two weeks ago.


Thats good news


----------



## Cookiegal

That's great news Mark! I have to admit I was very worried about you. That happens often it seems. While it sure is great to hear it was wrong it puts so much stress on everyone in the meantime.


----------



## Gr3iz

Thanks folks! A load off our minds, for sure!


----------



## 2twenty2

Twitter temporarily restricts Donald Trump Jr.'s account after he posts video claiming masks are unnecessary

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/07/28/tech/twitter-donald-trump-jr/index.html

😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷😷


----------



## 2twenty2

Florida man buys Lambo with COVID relief funds, gets caught after car crash
The loan was supposed to cover employee salaries, but instead got him a new toy

https://driving.ca/lamborghini/auto...ovid-relief-funds-gets-caught-after-car-crash


----------



## 2twenty2

Misleading Virus Video, Pushed by the Trumps, Spreads Online

Social media companies took down the video within hours. But by then, it had already been viewed tens of millions of times.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/28/technology/virus-video-trump.html


----------



## Johnny b

* FDA opens door to rapid, at-home screening for COVID-19 *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2020/07/29/fda-opens-door-rapid-home-covid-19-tests/5536528002/


----------



## Johnny b

* US hits 150,000 deaths from COVID-19 as states struggle to halt resurgence *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...d-resurgence-deaths-surpass-150-k/5489494002/

I've already postponed my scheduled visits to my ophthalmologist and dentist, but I need to take appointments for a thermal image of my thyroid in several weeks and in October, an MRI brain scan.

I don't feel good about either in the best of times, but both are too important to skip.

Too many Americans are inconsiderate and selfish at the worst possible time.


----------



## Johnny b

*Buddy, the first dog to test positive for COVID-19 in the US, has died *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...est-positive-covid-19-us-has-died/5544133002/



> Buddy's family and doctors were unable to confirm if it was the lymphoma or the virus that ultimately took his life.


----------



## Johnny b

* Heart damage found in coronavirus patients months after recovering from COVID-19, study says *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...njury-months-after-recovery-study/5536249002/



> The first study included 100 patients..........
> 
> Researchers looked at cardiac magnetic resonance imaging taken nearly two and a half months after they were diagnosed and compared them with images from people who never had COVID-19. The study found heart abnormalities in 78 patients, with 60 of those patients showing signs of inflammation in the heart muscle from the virus.


----------



## Johnny b

* Birx warns US is 'in a new phase' of coronavirus pandemic with more widespread cases *

https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/02/politics/birx-coronavirus-new-phase-cnntv/index.html



> Dr. Deborah Birx on Sunday said the US is in a new phase in its fight against the coronavirus pandemic, saying that the deadly virus is more widespread than when it first took hold in the US earlier this year.
> 
> "This epidemic right now is different and it's more widespread and it's both rural and urban,"
> 
> ..............US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, projects more than 173,000 American deaths by August 22, and former US Food and Drug Administrator Dr. Scott Gottlieb warned on CNBC last month that the coronavirus death toll could double to 300,000 deaths by the end of the year, if the country doesn't change its trajectory.
> 
> "It's not super spreading individuals, it's super spreading events and we need to stop those. We definitely need to take more precautions," Birx


----------



## Johnny b

The Sturgis motorcycle rally is still on.

An estimated 250,000 are expected to attend over a 10 day period.
These are people that travel from all parts of the US to the event, and then go home.

This is exactly what Birx and Fauci warned about.


----------



## Johnny b

Some reality about the coming vaccine:

* A coronavirus vaccine won't change the world right away *
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/08/02/covid-vaccine/?itid=lk_inline_manual_87


----------



## Couriant

*Pro-Trump youth group TPUSA deleted a tweet mocking protective masks after its cofounder died of the coronavirus*
https://www.businessinsider.com/tpu...sks-after-montgomery-coronavirus-death-2020-7

but but but... i won't get the virus!!


----------



## Couriant

Taking this with a grain of salt that the guy did do everything right, but if he did, then it shows that everyone needs to do their part. Humans are resistant to change, especially if it affects their day to day, but this is not a time to be be resisting.


----------



## 2twenty2

How the Pandemic Defeated America
A virus has brought the world's most powerful country to its knees.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/09/coronavirus-american-failure/614191/


----------



## Johnny b

* Coronavirus: How the travel downturn is sending jet planes to 'boneyards' *

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-53549861


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> I'd like to keep this thread as a chronicle of events and projections, how to address avoidance and how to react if infected.......not a 'scare' or 'hopeless' scenario.
> 
> Coronavirus is spreading.
> 
> Some current events:
> 
> *US prepares for possible coronavirus pandemic, WHO officials say Iran outbreak 'worrisome' *
> https://www.cnbc.com/2020/02/21/coronavirus-latest-updates-outbreak.html
> 
> I usually shop in the early morning hours during the flu season to avoid crowds.
> I am up to date on my flu and pneumonia shots, while they don't address coronavirus, I suspect it helps in avoiding complications with them.
> 
> ( you all stay well )
> 
> Edited by Adminstrator Cookiegal with approval from the thread starter to include a link to the Johns Hopkins University's interractive map which is constantly updated to show the current statistics around the world:
> 
> https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html
> 
> Second edit to add link exclusive to the U.S.:
> 
> https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/us-map


Hi Johnny, The very time when the virus arrived in my county, I did panic and had nightmares about the virus. I could not slow my heart rate because I am a germaphobe and my husband has Coronary Artery Disease and if my husband is exposed he could die from it according to Mayo Clinic Website. As time passed I was able to get used to the fact that the pandemic exist in the county that my husband and I reside and the heart race subsided and the nightmares ceased. People are afraid of the unknown or the uncertainty of the unknown nature of such events and it's quite understandable because fear is what protects us from harm. I believe that a little fear is good for us for as strange as this sounds. When a person fears a potential danger they tend to do whatever it takes to avoid a potential direct threat that leads to safety in a majority of cases and may be less susceptible to the many dangers of society. On the other hand we may not be able to mitigate a direct threat no matter how fearful we tend to be so fear may not always work as anticipated.

My husband and I managed to escape the virus for this reason and my husband is alive and well. I would be lost without my husband and would probably not feel the same without him. I am grateful and thank god every day for such a wonderful man who is good to me. I can experience joyful moments and laughter. My husband helped to build a strong foundation that enables me to conquer anything life throws at me.

There is a new direct threat that I must address. For the first time the outbreak is extremely close within the community and is now posing a new direct threat to my husband and I. I believe our entire community may have been exposed to Covid-19. I am not used to the virus attacking someone so close to home. Our landowner has not been outside as usual to take care of the land and has not collected rent for the land. I knew something wasn't right so my husband and I decided to check on our landowner by calling. Our landowner indicated that he is sick. Every single land renter has interacted with our landowner in some manner. Now my heart is fluttering once again! Our landowner is now self quarantining and is asking residents to drop off the rent outside on the picnic table while making a receipt.

I noticed neighbors here in the sub rural area interacting with no masks and collaborating as a team to assist our sick landowner, including the landowner's family who lives in the home next to us! Based on my observations, I heard my neighbor coughing excessively to assist another neighbor who was rushed to the hospital within the 14 day incubation period.

Here is a scenario that shows just how quickly this virus can spread and it only takes one person to spread it globally. A person can spread the virus while asymptomatic (Without Symptoms) That one person in China did just that! I am using different names for the scenario.

Lets say Terry visits our landowner Jake who was exposed to Covid-19 but doesn't know it yet, with no mask because Terry feels healthy and does not feel sick. Terry visits Jake to make Landowners rental arrangements. Terry thinks she does not pose a threat to anyone so she interacts with no mask or social distancing. Jake unknowingly exposes Terry to the virus because he feels healthy and is in the incubation period. Terry than leaves and exposes her family to the virus. Now Terry's husband and children are exposed. Terry than visits Jake the landowners family next door to my husband and I with no mask and are within close contact. Sally next door gives Terry a hug because both do not feel sick or think they can spread the virus. Terry just unknowingly transmitted the virus to Sally. Sally interacts with her husband and children. Now Sally's entire family is infected and does not know. Sally realizes she forgot the sugar while shopping and visits another neighbor below me named Lucy to borrow a cup of sugar. Lucy is glad she can help and now Lucy is infected with Covid-19 and spreads it to her husband Dan. Jake our landowner contacts his family by phone to indicate he is sick and would like for them to call our other neighbor Adam across the street to assist with lawn care and other types of work. Adam is working closely with Jake the landowners family to complete yard work with no mask or social distancing. Adam was exposed to the virus and unknowingly transmits the virus to his mother Sara. Sara decides to have a large gathering and infects her entire family and friends. Adam visits my husband and I to borrow some bee spray. My husband opens the door widely and briefly speaks to Adam at the door with a mask on but Adam is not wearing a mask and coughs at our front door before answering. Adam just thinks it's Allergies and mistakes covid-19 for allergy symptoms and unknowingly transmits the virus to my husband and my husband exposes me. All of these events can occur in less than a week. This shows just how quickly a virus can spread within the community if society does not adhere to the CDC recommended guidelines!


----------



## Johnny b

Professionalgirl said:


> ( edited for brevity)
> This shows just how quickly a virus can spread within the community if society does not adhere to the CDC recommended guidelines!


Indeed.
One of my concerns is that too many people aren't taking the pandemic as seriously as they should.
There are carriers that are obviously ill and there are carriers that show none to little effects. I suspect there are many that never know, until testing, that they've been infected.
Everyone needs to be cautious and heed the advice of recognized health officials.
That and common sense goes a long way to staying healthy.

Best to you and your husband.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> Indeed.
> One of my concerns is that too many people aren't taking the pandemic as seriously as they should.
> There are carriers that are obviously ill and there are carriers that show none to little effects. I suspect there are many that never know, until testing, that they've been infected.
> Everyone needs to be cautious and heed the advice of recognized health officials.
> That and common sense goes a long way to staying healthy.
> 
> Best to you and your husband.


Most certainly Johnny. Now I am unable to sleep. Thank you for your concerns.


----------



## Cookiegal

If I were a renter (well I was a long, long time ago) at the beginning of the pandemic I would have given my landlord a series of post-dated cheques rather than having him visit me or me him every month. I actually did that when I was renting anyway just because it was more convenient.

Also, if someone comes knocking at my door and doesn't have a mask on I don't answer, instead I open a nearby window and we talk with the glass between us (they are windows that crank open but the same can be done with sliding windows, you just have to open it enough to be able to hear each other.

We all know that there are many covidiots out there who are not doing what they should be doing so we need to limit our contact with them as much as possible. 

Tina, if you're that worried you and your husband could get tested so you don't agonize while waiting the 14 days to find out if you contracted it or not.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> If I were a renter (well I was a long, long time ago) at the beginning of the pandemic I would have given my landlord a series of post-dated cheques rather than having him visit me or me him every month. I actually did that when I was renting anyway just because it was more convenient.
> 
> Also, if someone comes knocking at my door and doesn't have a mask on I don't answer, instead I open a nearby window and we talk with the glass between us (they are windows that crank open but the same can be done with sliding windows, you just have to open it enough to be able to hear each other.
> 
> We all know that there are many covidiots out there who are not doing what they should be doing so we need to limit our contact with them as much as possible.
> 
> Tina, if you're that worried you and your husband could get tested so you don't agonize while waiting the 14 days to find out if you contracted it or not.


Karen, the problem is my husband is very stubborn and refuses to adhere to my advice. I begged him not to open the door and he opened the door wide and I think it was out of spite. We own our own home but we are renting the piece of land that our home sits on.

In addition to this post, My husband is relying too much on the mask to compensate for social distancing and the Mayo Clinic Health Site clearly states, "Don't use your mask to compensate for social distancing." I highlighted the statement and sent it directly to my husband. I have this same issue with my mom. She thinks the mask is 100% foul proof. I explained that the virus can penetrate the mask. The mask will not protect you from the virus. The mask only protects others from the virus not you. Small droplets of saliva can land on another person's face while speaking and potentially infect others through their unprotected eyes. My husband is required to wear a face shield at work in addition to the goggles and mask. It is similar to hazmat helmets which offers the very best protection against the virus as long as proper procedures are followed by the recommended Health Department. So far no one at the plant contracted the virus because my husband uses Allpet DT to disinfect everything that the virus may come in contact with.

At one point my husband stood outside of a tackle bait store that sells fishing lures and people just poured out of the place with no masks and I hollard for my husband to back away but he refused to listen! I am that worried but visiting the testing site can cause him to get infected if he is not already infected. The virus is spreading at local clinics and the hospital. My husband and I do not visit the hospital or any clinic unless it is a dire emergency. We refuse to get exposed!


----------



## Cookiegal

Professionalgirl said:


> my husband is very stubborn and refuses to adhere to my advice.


Unfortunately you can't protect people from themselves. 


Professionalgirl said:


> visiting the testing site can cause him to get infected if he is not already infected


I agree if you have to wait in line but if they are the ones where they come to your car there is a lot less risk. However, I'd just wait the 14 days. Generally, by day 5 the symptoms start showing up so if you get beyond that the chances are very good that everything will be fine.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> Unfortunately you can't protect people from themselves.
> I agree if you have to wait in line but if they are the ones where they come to your car there is a lot less risk. However, I'd just wait the 14 days. Generally, by day 5 the symptoms start showing up so if you get beyond that the chances are very good that everything will be fine.


That's so true Karen. There is nothing I can do accept pray he doesn't get infected. I can't stand the wait but there is nothing else left to do but wait as you suggested. 😰


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## Couriant

I guess it depends on the testing site, but I have been to the Mayo Clinic's test site here and it's all done in the car. all the staff was using plastic shields, so if you need to get tested, that would be the best way.

Switching gears... My son's school (private) is under scrutiny by the faculty and staff after the school's plan to reopen.

This is part of the letter to the board:

" The American Academy of Pediatrics, whose guidance you have relied on elsewhere, explicitly states that "the individual needs and concerns of school professionals should be addressed with accommodations made as needed (e.g., for a classroom educator who is pregnant, has a medical condition that confers a higher risk of serious illness with COVID-19, resides with a family member who is at higher risk, or has a mental health condition that compromises the ability to cope with the additional stress)." *PCDS employees who fit these descriptions and have sought accommodation have been instructed that their only option is to resign.* "

This has left a sour taste... the school is meant to be one of the best in the state, yet they have told the employees this... just shows that they have no clue too...


----------



## Gr3iz

Hmmm ... I think the part of that letter that makes me wonder is where they say " e.g., for a classroom educator who is pregnant ... _or has a mental health condition_". Is this the kind of teacher you want for your kid? ;-)


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> I guess it depends on the testing site, but I have been to the Mayo Clinic's test site here and it's all done in the car. all the staff was using plastic shields, so if you need to get tested, that would be the best way.
> 
> Switching gears... My son's school (private) is under scrutiny by the faculty and staff after the school's plan to reopen.
> 
> This is part of the letter to the board:
> 
> " The American Academy of Pediatrics, whose guidance you have relied on elsewhere, explicitly states that "the individual needs and concerns of school professionals should be addressed with accommodations made as needed (e.g., for a classroom educator who is pregnant, has a medical condition that confers a higher risk of serious illness with COVID-19, resides with a family member who is at higher risk, or has a mental health condition that compromises the ability to cope with the additional stress)." *PCDS employees who fit these descriptions and have sought accommodation have been instructed that their only option is to resign.* "
> 
> This has left a sour taste... the school is meant to be one of the best in the state, yet they have told the employees this... just shows that they have no clue too...


Hi James, I don't see why they can't just continue cyber schooling as a substitute for in person classroom training. The children will learn just as much as they have when attending an actual classroom. I am strictly an online college graduate and have acquired all the skills necessary to achieve a B.A in Computer Information Science with the concentration of Cybersecurity and networking. This includes Hands on realistic simulated labs through Testout, Infotech and Cisco labs as well as live Java C++ coding. I had just as much experience as if I were attending an in person college campus. If the department of education is concerned about the development of social interaction and physical education, the department of education can incorporate online video instruction and live zoom meetings to compensate for the lack of social and physical interaction. Children can exercise, run, play ball right from their homes as if they attended a Brick and Mortar school. It is much safer than an in person interaction with students and faculty. Students and faculty will be less likely to contract Covid-19.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Gr3iz said:


> Hmmm ... I think the part of that letter that makes me wonder is where they say " e.g., for a classroom educator who is pregnant ... _or has a mental health condition_". Is this the kind of teacher you want for your kid? ;-)


Hi Mark, I think a teacher with a mental health condition teaching the children would be just fine as long as the teacher is taking medications to control the condition and the teacher qualifies for the job and has not had any mental health issues, works well with children, demonstrates maturity and makes appropriate decisions.

It could be considered discrimination if an employer fails to hire a fully qualified person for the job because of their race, age, gender orientation, culteralistic background, ethnicial values, physical or mental health status.


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## Gr3iz

Tina, I'm not prejudiced. At least not the way you may think. My little brother was born mentally retarded, and I have a cousin about the same age my brother would be who is autistic. That's my basis and experience for mental heath conditions. No amount of medication would have made either of them qualified for teaching. Sorry. It just struck me as an odd thing to include in an ill-conceived letter in the first place ...


----------



## Professionalgirl

Gr3iz said:


> Tina, I'm not prejudiced. At least not the way you may think. My little brother was born mentally retarded, and I have a cousin about the same age my brother would be who is autistic. That's my basis and experience for mental heath conditions. No amount of medication would have made either of them qualified for teaching. Sorry. It just struck me as an odd thing to include in an ill-conceived letter in the first place ...


I understand your point of view Mark. I acknowledge that some individuals with intellectual impairments may not qualify for the job because it is more than they can comprehend, and it may depend on the nature of the impairment that makes them incapable of handling specific employment positions, while others with intellectual impairments may do well at the same employment position.

I believe anyone can handle a variety of job positions if they are interested. It may take a lot of patience, compassion and understanding when dealing with individuals with special needs to acquire the skills needed for the job that they are interested in.

You would be surprised to find some with intellectual impairments may actually qualify for a teaching job. I know a women with Down Syndrome that works at the driver's license photo center as a receptionist and does a phenomenal job directing clients to the correct resources as well as typing info into the system. I believe Individuals with special needs can work during a pandemic and be trained to practice safety measures to mitigate the potential risk of contracting or transmitting Covid-19. I believe those with intellectual impairments actually adhere to the health guidelines better than most others with normal and even Higher intellectual functioning levels.


----------



## Couriant

As to the mental health comment, I think it's more of how these last few months has been stressful with the pandemic. My's son class of has been the center for most of the illnesses for the lower school, including the norovirus... and even recently the parents of said children have been travelling out of state so the potential of those kids bringing something back is high. We did the online learning at the end of the year and those kids were not that well behaved... mostly because the adults were leaving their kids unattended to do the classes. We sat with our son to make sure he doesn't act up too (he is a follower to some of the more misbehaving kids).

We will not take our kids to the school until there is a vaccine, or some actual data that this pandemic is done so online attendance will be happening here.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> As to the mental health comment, I think it's more of how these last few months has been stressful with the pandemic. My's son class of has been the center for most of the illnesses for the lower school, including the norovirus... and even recently the parents of said children have been travelling out of state so the potential of those kids bringing something back is high. We did the online learning at the end of the year and those kids were not that well behaved... mostly because the adults were leaving their kids unattended to do the classes. We sat with our son to make sure he doesn't act up too (he is a follower to some of the more misbehaving kids).
> 
> We will not take our kids to the school until there is a vaccine, or some actual data that this pandemic is done so online attendance will be happening here.


I'm so sorry your going through such a rough time right now. I think we are all on edge over this horrible pandemic. It seems like it is disrupting many lives and does not show signs of slowing down any time soon. My heart breaks for the ones who are sick and are persistently exposed because they are forced to attend school or work, especially our children. 💔

I don't blame you for refusing to send your children to school. I cant believe the system is ignoring the fact that the pandemic exist and it's not over, exposing our children to a potentially deadly virus!! The department of education must not realize that are endangering the welfare of our children!


----------



## Couriant

We've been quarantined since March and go out when necessary... so the kiddos has had it hard because they can't go out to see friends. So we are a little more lenient in letting our son play online games with his friends and recently got a Nintendo Switch as well for him.

I'm glad for our swimming pool...


----------



## Couriant

Professionalgirl said:


> Hi James, I don't see why they can't just continue cyber schooling as a substitute for in person classroom training. The children will learn just as much as they have when attending an actual classroom...


They are (suppoedly) have a hybrid system, but the online option is with the teacher using a webcam... they made it sound like more of a virtual class system where the kids can interact but I guess it's going to be a zoom session....

It was hard enough for the couple of hours... I can't fathom 8 hours....


----------



## Johnny b

Some serious words from Bill Gates:

* Bill Gates on COVID-19: Most US tests are "completely garbage" *

https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/08/bill-gates-on-covid-19-most-tests-are/

Too much that's important to copy and paste, but in context to the title of the article:



> * But people aren't getting their tests back quickly enough. *
> 
> Well, that's just stupidity. The majority of all US tests are completely garbage, wasted. If you don't care how late the date is and you reimburse at the same level, of course they're going to take every customer. Because they are making ridiculous money, and it's mostly rich people that are getting access to that. You have to have the reimbursement system pay a little bit extra for 24 hours, pay the normal fee for 48 hours, and pay nothing [if it isn't done by then]. And they will fix it overnight.
> 
> *Why don't we just do that? *
> 
> Because the federal government sets that reimbursement system. When we tell them to change it they say, "As far as we can tell, we're just doing a great job, it's amazing!"


----------



## 2twenty2

Coronavirus: What's happening around the world on Sunday
Number of COVID-19 cases in United States surpasses 5 million

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/coronavirus-covid19-world-aug9-1.5679855


----------



## 2twenty2

'Huge, foolish mistake': Sturgis residents split over giant bike rally as coronavirus cases rise
More than 250,000 people are expected to attend the Sturgis Motorcycle Rally in western South Dakota, even as the state sees a spike in COVID-19 cases.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...esidents-split-over-giant-bike-rally-n1235677


----------



## Johnny b

*HS that suspended teen who tweeted photo of hallway has 9 COVID-19 cases *

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy...weeted-photo-of-hallway-has-9-covid-19-cases/



> North Paulding High School in Dallas, Georgia, sent a letter to parents Saturday, saying, "At this time, we know there were six students and three staff members who were in school for at least some time last week who have since reported to us that they have tested positive."


https://www.ajc.com/education/9-cas...lding-high-school/OWH6MN7DZ5A2XDQMXX337AQEWI/


> The Paulding County high school that became infamous for hallways crowded with unmasked students will retreat online for at least a couple days this week after revealing that a half-dozen students and three staffers were diagnosed with COVID-19.


Exposure to Covid-19 usually leads to a 14 day quarantine.
If only 2 days, that's sounding like the possibility of making a bad situation worse for their community, imo.


----------



## Johnny b

* Greater Dayton RTA to offer free bus passes for those on unemployment *
https://www.daytondailynews.com/new...e-on-unemployment/MPQK6T4TGBHYDHKAXAW5OUGTNU/



> "We've seen the unemployment numbers since the pandemic shutdowns started in March, and we know a lot of people are struggling right now," said Judy Dodge, Montgomery County Commission President. "Many people looking for work visit the Job Services area of our Job Center. It's a natural partnership to connect our customers with free transportation through the RTA."


:up:


----------



## Johnny b

(This article is also about the quality of data)

* US childhood SARS-CoV-2 infections surging with the current peak *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...v-2-infections-surging-with-the-current-peak/



> *The last two weeks of July saw nearly 100,000 new cases in school-age kids and teens.*
> 
> ....................
> The final point this report underscores is that the current data-tracking system in the US is badly hampered by state-to-state variations in reporting. If we want to have a clearer picture of what's going on with the pandemic in the childhood population, we're going to have to start with standardizing the tracking of diagnoses and outcomes.


----------



## Johnny b

A warning for those that use hand sanitizers:

*FDA finds new toxic hand-sanitizer ingredient, expands warning to 157 products *

https://arstechnica.com/science/202...r-ingredient-expands-warning-to-157-products/



> *Regulators find toxic 1-propanol as well as methanol in some products. *
> 
> The FDA this week announced that it has identified hand sanitizers that contain 1-propanol, a toxic form of alcohol not yet seen in contaminated products.


*FDA updates on hand sanitizers consumers should not use *
https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-safe...ates-hand-sanitizers-consumers-should-not-use


----------



## Johnny b

*FDA approves COVID-19 saliva test developed at Yale in partnership with the NBA, NBPA *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...-test-developed-yale-nba-nbpa-aid/5590452002/


----------



## Johnny b

* Coronavirus creeps into US mink farms, "unusually large numbers" dead *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...-us-mink-farms-unusually-larger-numbers-dead/



> *Transmission risks to humans are unclear. *
> 
> The pandemic coronavirus has made its way onto two mink farms in Utah, leading to "unusually large numbers" of dead animals, according to a Tuesday announcement by the US Department of Agriculture.
> 
> The affected farms in Utah reported cases of COVID-19 in people working on the farms, who may have spread the infection to the animals.


*COVID-19 hits U.S. mink farms after ripping through Europe *
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/08/covid-19-hits-us-mink-farms-after-ripping-through-europe


----------



## Johnny b

https://www.aphis.usda.gov/aphis/ourfocus/animalhealth/sa_one_health/sars-cov-2-animals-us



> SARS-CoV-2 is considered to be an emerging disease by the World Organisation for Animal Health (OIE).


----------



## Johnny b

More on the saliva test:

* COVID spit test is faster, cheaper, avoids shortages-and now greenlit by FDA *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...per-avoids-shortages-and-now-greenlit-by-fda/


----------



## Cookiegal

I just heard a new Covid-19-related phrase this morning so in addition to covidiots those who refuse to wear a mask are called maskholes.  👍


----------



## Johnny b

LOL!

I like that.


----------



## Couriant

Cookiegal said:


> I just heard a new Covid-19-related phrase this morning so in addition to covidiots those who refuse to wear a mask are called maskholes.  👍


yeah I ahve been saying that ever since AZ had the recent spike that postponed my surgery a couple days before it was due... Not sure if I have heard it before that though. haha


----------



## Johnny b

(the motorcycle rally)
*Potential COVID-19 Exposure in Sturgis, SD *
https://news.sd.gov/newsitem.aspx?id=27179


----------



## Johnny b

* 'Silent spreaders' of COVID-19: Kids who seem healthy may be more contagious than sick adults, study says *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ptoms-more-contagious-than-adults/3392088001/



> A new study adds to growing evidence that children are not immune to COVID-19 and may even play a larger role in community spread than previously thought.
> 
> Researchers at Massachusetts General Hospital and Mass General Hospital for Children found that among 192 children, 49 tested positive for the coronavirus and had significantly higher levels of virus in their airways than hospitalized adults in intensive care units, according to the study published Thursday in the Journal of Pediatrics.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> * Greater Dayton RTA to offer free bus passes for those on unemployment *
> https://www.daytondailynews.com/new...e-on-unemployment/MPQK6T4TGBHYDHKAXAW5OUGTNU/


Hi Johnny, I don't think the unemployment rate is as bad now as it was in March. As to reason, the governor reopened most businesses and pretty much backed out on his plans for the color phases. The governor here in PA was receiving negative feedback from Pennsylvanians and pressures to reopen restaurants, bars and most other businesses. I have witnessed a very large increase in cases as large gatherings persist and no one is wearing a mask or maintaining a safe distance sadly. No one appears to adhere to the guidelines anymore. I believe a factor that plays a role in this is due to the social media's over-reassurance and disregarding the serious nature of this virus. It seems like this virus will never end until we are all infected!

My Best friend has a school age child who will be attending online school because a teacher was found to be infected with Covid-19. That scares me because I have a granddaughter in AZ who is forced to attend school and a few other relatives that are school aged, and are forced to attend school while parents are made to sign a waiver stating they are not responsible if their child is exposed to Covid-19. If my children were younger I would refuse to sign the waiver, and keep my child home, and I would place them in cyberschool. It may not be the best choice for a child's opportunity to interact with other children to improve fluency and development but at least it was save lives of family members whose immune systems are compromised due to diabetes and heart disease. A slightly delayed child is better than attending a brick and mortar school and possibly contracting a potentially deadly disease!

I now have a nephew that lives at a distance who was obsessed with preaching the gospel on the street and blessing the homeless as he practices sermons online to become an ordained pasture. My nephew takes his baby boy and his eight year old son for walks and sometimes his wife will go with him on the walks. The issue is that they are wearing their masks down over their chin and getting too close to other people as they bless and feed the homeless. I thought it would only be a matter of time before they are exposed to the virus. Sure enough, I was right!! They were exposed to the virus and that includes that poor innocent baby and the eight year old who had no choice to go where their parents want them to be. Now he is in quarantine because he is showing symptoms! I feel so bad for that poor baby and his brother and it breaks my heart as an Aunt. 💔


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> * Greater Dayton RTA to offer free bus passes for those on unemployment *
> https://www.daytondailynews.com/new...e-on-unemployment/MPQK6T4TGBHYDHKAXAW5OUGTNU/


Hi Johnny, I am one of those people who just graduated from online college this year with a B.A in Cybersecurity and an AS in Computer Information Science with the concentration of Networking and I was supposed to take an in person exam until the pandemic emerged and than all in person campuses were shut down and caused a delay in my ability to take the exam which is very much needed to obtain employment. I was left jobless because of that.


----------



## Johnny b

Of interest: the first officially *confirmed* re-infection of SARS-CoV-2 and it's not a panic scenario.

*Healthy 33-yr-old man first to have confirmed reinfection with SARS-CoV-2 *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...sars-cov-2-reinfection-reported-in-hong-kong/



> About 4.5 months later, the man tested positive for the virus again. This time, his infection was caught during entry screening at a Hong Kong airport, as he returned from a trip to Spain, via the United Kingdom, on August 15. Though he had no symptoms, he was again hospitalized. Clinical data showed he had signs of an acute infection, but he remained asymptomatic throughout his time in the hospital.
> ..............
> 
> There is mounting data suggesting that some immune responses can be completely protective against reinfection-at least for some period of time. From this new study, it's also rather encouraging that the man's second infection was even milder than the first-it was completely asymptomatic, in fact-hinting at helpful immune responses specifically against SARS-CoV-2.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> Of interest: the first officially *confirmed* re-infection of SARS-CoV-2 and it's not a panic scenario.
> 
> *Healthy 33-yr-old man first to have confirmed reinfection with SARS-CoV-2 *
> https://arstechnica.com/science/202...sars-cov-2-reinfection-reported-in-hong-kong/


I somehow knew that reinfection was going to recur at some point. Now the virus has mutated and is overlapping the first wave. Now since the virus mutated it has strengthened before the first wave had a chance to infect those who never had the virus. If you ask my opinion I think it is going to raise the death toll in those that never had the virus since it has strengthened!

I reside in the sub rural area where residents are at a safe distance and my husband and I own our own homes, With that being said I believe it is easier to prevent infection. However, my son resides directly in the urban area in an apartment building and a maintenance worker tested positive for covid-19 in his building. Two residents on the upper floor of the building were in contact with the maintenance worker who tested positive and all residents and maintenance use the same entrance and all staff members may eat lunch together. My son had a different maintenance worker at his apartment and did not have direct contact with the infected maintenance worker.

My concern is that he may become infected with the virus even though he did not have direct contact with the maintenance worker and the residents who had contact on a different floor other than my son's floor were asked to quarantine. The health care department is requiring that the entire floor above my son's floor be quarantined due to possible exposure through indirect contact.

All workers are checked daily for signs of infection such as fever, cough and other symptoms associated with covid-19. As soon as the worker experienced symptoms, he was sent to get tested and was immediately sent to quarantine while waiting for results. The results were a nightmare! The results revealed that he was in fact infected with covid-19!

My son's floor is currently not in quarantine but were sent letters warning residents about the infected maintenance worker without using names to comply with the HIPAA law regulations.

I am still deeply concerned that my son is at high risk of exposure because I have observed similar situations where indirect exposure to the virus has occurred such as a nearby nursing home in my area.

The nursing home staff member who works in the office of a large nursing home and has never had direct contact with patients tested positive for covid-19. The infected worker was the first to contract the virus and not long after that half of the residents also tested positive for the virus and sent to quarantine as the result of indirect contact.

When my son contacted me by phone and told me the news my heart was pounding. That scares me!


----------



## 2twenty2

Covid-19 Worldometer
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

CDC: Cases in the U.S.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/cases-in-us.html


----------



## Johnny b

Professionalgirl said:


> I somehow knew that reinfection was going to recur at some point. Now the virus has mutated and is overlapping the first wave. Now since the virus mutated it has strengthened before the first wave had a chance to infect those who never had the virus. ..................................


What do you mean by 'strengthened'? More virulent?

Personally, I think it's better to never be infected, rather than assuming it's better to be infected with an early strain.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> What do you mean by 'strengthened'? More virulent?
> 
> Personally, I think it's better to never be infected, rather than assuming it's better to be infected with an early strain.


No Johnny, I dont think its better to be infected with either virus. I was just simply stating that the first wave is not over and already the second wave occurred and that scares me regarding those who have never been infected. Those who were never infected are at greater risk for complications should they contract the mutated strain if they never had the virus to begin with.


----------



## Johnny b

Professionalgirl said:


> No Johnny, I dont think its better to be infected with either virus. I was just simply stating that the first wave is not over and already the second wave occurred and that scares me regarding those who have never been infected. Those who were never infected are at greater risk for complications should they contract the mutated strain if they never had the virus to begin with.


There are already 6 mutated strains of SARS-CoV-2.
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/08/200803105246.htm



> Across Europe and Italy, the most widespread is strain G, while the L strain from Wuhan is gradually disappearing.


These are the first wave.

The second wave will follow as a seasonal/global/social issue.

Check out this link:

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/hea...navirus/first-and-second-waves-of-coronavirus

Skip down to 
* Why are experts concerned about a second wave of coronavirus? *


----------



## Johnny b

* In alarming move, CDC says people exposed to COVID-19 do not need testing [Updated] *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...ople-exposed-to-covid-19-do-not-need-testing/



> The change immediately alarmed and outraged public health and infectious disease experts. It is well established that SARS-CoV-2-the pandemic coronavirus that causes the disease COVID-19-can cause completely asymptomatic infections in some and spread from other infected people before they develop symptoms (so-called "pre-symptomatic transmission"). In fact, some modeling studies have suggested that pre-symptomatic transmission may account for nearly half, or even more, of SARS-CoV-2 spread.


----------



## Johnny b

The CDC backpedals (sort of) on Covid-19 testing.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...lifornia-cdc-testing-unemployment/5640833002/


----------



## Johnny b

* Coronavirus live updates: Model predicts 410K US deaths by January; Labor Day weekend brings risk; South Dakota stages state fair *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...weekend-south-dakota-donald-trump/5712554002/



> Coronavirus death projections released ahead of Labor Day weekend are grim.
> 
> The Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation at the University of Washington's School of Medicine is predicting more than 410,000 deaths by January if mask usage stays at current rates. If governments continue relaxing social distancing requirements, that number could increase.


----------



## ekim68

As states lift restaurant restrictions, CDC report links dining out to increased Covid-19 risk



> Dining out raises the risk of contracting Covid-19 more than other activities, such as shopping or going to a salon, according to a report published Thursday by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.


----------



## Firehammer

Hi, From today all shall wear masks in public in Denmark says Mette Frederiksen Prime Minister.


----------



## Firehammer

Professionalgirl said:


> No Johnny, I dont think its better to be infected with either virus. I was just simply stating that the first wave is not over and already the second wave occurred and that scares me regarding those who have never been infected. Those who were never infected are at greater risk for complications should they contract the mutated strain if they never had the virus to begin with.


That is real scary


----------



## Couriant

Stupidity at its best:
University of Missouri Expels Two Students; Suspends Three for Violating Coronavirus Rules


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> Stupidity at its best:
> University of Missouri Expels Two Students; Suspends Three for Violating Coronavirus Rules


College people should know better James. They are supposed to be well educated. It appears as though the virus is spreading more on colleges then the elementary and grade schools. That's pretty sad that children know better than the adults!


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## 2twenty2

U.S. Surpasses Grim Milestone of 200,000 COVID-19 Deaths

https://www.usnews.com/news/us/arti...ass-grim-milestone-of-200-000-covid-19-deaths


----------



## Couriant

So about 2 weeks ago, some of the families from my son's school were having parties/vacation for the last holiday... well one of those kids were in school and started to get a headache and a fever... It's one of those hate to be right moment... if this is covid then everyone will be home ... which it should have been in the first place.


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## 2twenty2

A sign in front of a business.......


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## Professionalgirl

I could not sleep last night. I was up until 3:00 Am because a second maintenance worker contracted covid-19 in my son's building and more of the upper level floor residents were exposed and now are being quarantined on the upper level floors. My concern is if the residents on the lower level floor is exposed my son will be exposed and my son was born with a heart defect. I could not slow my heart rate down when my son called and told me. I wanted to get him out of that building quickly but thought it was too risky since his dad resides with me and I thought what if my son was exposed already. I am concerned for them both and do not want to lose either of them.

I took smoking cigarettes to a whole new level because the pandemic is causing undue stress. I just wish it would end so we can get our lives back to normal.

Yes James, I copied and pasted part of our conversation to the coronavirus forum. I feel it's important. There is a more aggressive strain as well that is killing people at random. It's not just impacting the elderly. This virus severely impacts teens as well. Even though the teen girl survived she still struggled to survive and this virus had a major impact on her physical health. In fact I have a video that proves this theory.

The video below shows just how serious this virus really is!


----------



## Couriant

I would hope your son can get tested, as well as the antibody check as well to see if would be cleared to come home... my thoughts are with you.

Tuesday last week my boss had to leave to go help a friend because his wife died due to covid, then the next day my colleague had to leave because his aunt passed away also... It really hits home when it happens to people you know.


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## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> I would hope your son can get tested, as well as the antibody check as well to see if would be cleared to come home... my thoughts are with you.
> 
> Tuesday last week my boss had to leave to go help a friend because his wife died due to covid, then the next day my colleague had to leave because his aunt passed away also... It really hits home when it happens to people you know.


As far as I know, my son may not have been exposed at all because the lower floor residents were not required to quarantine. The lower floor residents were not within contact of the maintenance workers or residents on the upper floors. I dont think its safe to get tested because it is an indoor facility and if you were not exposed prior to testing you may be exposed while testing.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> So about 2 weeks ago, some of the families from my son's school were having parties/vacation for the last holiday... well one of those kids were in school and started to get a headache and a fever... It's one of those hate to be right moment... if this is covid then everyone will be home ... which it should have been in the first place.


That's sad James. Those poor children have no choice but to be exposed to the virus because of a parent''s stupidity. I know that sounds rude but I am frustrated about this whole pandemic thing.


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## Professionalgirl

Professionalgirl said:


> That's sad James. Those poor children have no choice but to be exposed to the virus because of a parent''s stupidity. I know that sounds rude but I am frustrated about this whole pandemic thing.


In addition I would like to add that in my mom's building three residents are currently infected with the virus and they all use the same elevator! My mom is elder and is incapable of using the stairs and has no choice but to use the same elevator as all other residents. I am concerned that she may get trapped in a crowded elivator and wind up exposed to the virus.😰😨


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## 2twenty2

*U.S. President Donald Trump, Melania Trump test positive for coronavirus*

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/hope-hicks-trump-positive-covid-19-1.5747343

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/02/us/politics/trump-covid.html


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## Cookiegal

It was just a matter of time, in my opinion.


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## Johnny b

Trump pushed his luck too far for too long. 
Reality caught up with him.

I don't wish Covid-19 on anyone.

A good friend of mine contracted Covid-19 very early this year. Before social distancing and masks were even suggested.
It's ruined his life.
He's lost too much weight and muscle tone and hasn't been able to recover very much.
He survived, but like the percentage that are called 'long haulers, he now has heart problems and will be getting valve repair in the near future.

He was the go to guy in rounding up a motorcycle ride, on and off road.
He is so weak from Covid, he doesn't have the the confidence he can physically operate
the controls of a motorcycle.
He was known to take long hikes in state parks and forests when healthy.
Now, if he walks more than a couple hundred feet, he complains he feels like his legs are filled with lead and breathes with difficulty.


----------



## Couriant

2twenty2 said:


> *U.S. President Donald Trump, Melania Trump test positive for coronavirus*
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/hope-hicks-trump-positive-covid-19-1.5747343
> 
> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/02/us/politics/trump-covid.html


Until he shows us the test results, I don't believe it.

from the NYTimes post:

"Her positive diagnosis came on Thursday, according to the person familiar with her case, but the* White House made no announcement about the situation*, and Kayleigh McEnany, the White House press secretary, who had also been on the plane and exposed to Ms. Hicks, then *held a briefing with reporters without mentioning it or wearing a mask.*

Only after Bloomberg News reported Ms. Hicks's condition did Mr. Trump confirm it during an appearance on Thursday night on Sean Hannity's show on Fox News..."

 playing with peoples lives again...

Just a thought... it shows that he is losing in the polls.... and now he mentions it... looks like trying to get the sympathy vote


----------



## Couriant

haha


----------



## 2twenty2

Couriant said:


> View attachment 281345
> 
> 
> haha


LOL


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> It was just a matter of time, in my opinion.


I agree Karen. Now maybe Trump will take it more serious. That's if he survives considering he is in the high risk group!


----------



## 2twenty2

*Coronavirus Clinical Trials Hit by Ransomware Attack on Health Tech Firm*

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/03/technology/clinical-trials-ransomware-attack-drugmakers.html


----------



## Johnny b

This is a long article, but that's the realistic way scientific studies are presented.

* US states stopped their pandemic social restrictions too soon *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...-their-pandemic-social-restrictions-too-soon/

Outtakes:


> Overall, they estimate that the use of masks probably dropped the infection rate in Ontario by somewhere between 20-40 percent.
> ................
> From the start, public health officials said that the social restrictions were needed to control the infection rate so that testing and contact tracing could be effective at keeping the pandemic in check. Data from the pandemic has only served to indicate that this initial advice was exactly right. The United States' response, however, has been to lift the restrictions before the infection rate was controlled and to limit testing sufficiently to make contact tracing nearly impossible.
> 
> As an added bonus, the country has made some of the possible alternative ways of limiting the pandemic, such as the use of protective masks, a political issue.
> ...................
> 
> So while the papers give us some indication of what will be needed to keep the United States from seeing the pandemic continue to spread out of control, they also serve to highlight how we've done pretty much everything wrong.


----------



## Professionalgirl

I have an update on my son regarding Covid-19. Apparently the virus is spreading much faster than anticipated. That one maintenance worker spread the virus to almost the entire building in just one week!

Now there are quarantined apartments on my son's floor. My son indicated that he has not had close personal contact with anyone in his building and is doing well so far. My son told me he wants to leave the building and come home before he does get exposed. 

I told my son that it's too risky at this time since he may have had possible exposure and his dad has a heart condition.

My sister pulled my niece out of school because there was one case in the athletic department. A student at the school tested positive for the virus, and my sister asked her if she knew the person, and she does not and has not had any type of close personal contact with the other student. Thank the lord for that! 

All it takes is just one person to cause a catastrophic nightmarish outbreak! That's exactly what happened in my son's apartment building.

I as a parent with this knowledge have developed a stress response hives over this very direct threat and am having trouble sleeping at night with heart palpitations. I feel as though my heart is beating out of my chest. I am not able to slow my heart rate down knowing this virus is a direct threat to my son.😰😨


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> View attachment 281345
> 
> 
> haha


Yes, it is his own stupidity for not wearing a mask and downplaying this very real and direct threat. No one knows how the virus will affect them if they contract it and there are several different strains and severities of cases. It all depends on the amount of exposure. Some survive while others sadly pass from the virus depending on the amount of exposure.

Apparently Trump used the experimental drug and only had mild symptoms. I personally believe that Trump did not have enough exposure to take the virus more seriously, especially since the experimental drug was used in his treatment plan. The experimental drug lessoned the symptoms and shortened the duration of the virus.

My mom told me that she retrieved info on a local news source that some kid contracted the virus and spread it to his entire family. Everyone in the family died and he was the only survivor. Apparently the case for the family was severe and experienced over exposure to Covid-19.

My point is, had Trump exposed his entire family to a deadly strain maybe then he would have taken it more seriously.


----------



## Professionalgirl

I haven't heard from my son today. I pray he did not get exposed to the virus. I am now concerned that my husband may expose himself and me to the virus. I am unusually tired today. I am praying we did not somehow get exposed.


----------



## Johnny b

Best wishes , Tina, for you and your family.


----------



## Couriant

Professionalgirl said:


> I haven't heard from my son today. I pray he did not get exposed to the virus. I am now concerned that my husband may expose himself and me to the virus. I am unusually tired today. I am praying we did not somehow get exposed.


Anxiety can take out a lot from people, especially if you have concerns such as you have right not. Try not to worry too much and try to relax a little.

I too hope for the best for you and your family


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> Best wishes , Tina, for you and your family.


Thanks Johnny.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> Anxiety can take out a lot from people, especially if you have concerns such as you have right not. Try not to worry too much and try to relax a little.
> 
> I too hope for the best for you and your family


 Thanks James, It is kind of difficult not to worry since it is a direct threat to us all. I also broke out in hives the other night and have a mild sore throat. I am not sure if it was because I had heartburn or if a virus is present. That's why I am concerned.

I will try not to worry unless my husband is rejected from work and sent home with a fever.


----------



## Professionalgirl

There is a major Resurgence of the Coronavirus according to Governor Tom Wolf. Tom Wolf is at a press conference with Rachel Lavine to discuss the resurgence, statistics among social groups and plans to mitigate the uptick in cases.

https://www.governor.pa.gov/newsroo...-monitoring-dashboard-update-for-oct-2-oct-8/


----------



## Professionalgirl

I have an update. My mom told me that a second wave is affecting us here in the United States as she witnessed on a local news source. I suspect the second wave is here already but not in some areas just yet. As to reason, there hasn't been a major spike in my area but there has been in my mom's area. I suspect the second wave is overlapping the first. 

I suspect the second wave became airborne since it is spreading much faster than usual. If that's the case, we are all in trouble and can be exposed just by picking up a few items from the grocery store even with masks on! The airborne aerosols can and will penetrate the masks! If you can smell someone's cigarette smoke, you can bet your life you can easily get exposed to the virus if it became airborne. My mom told me that she walked outside of her apartment building one day with a mask on and she could still smell cigarette smoke when she walked past a women sitting nearby that was smoking a cigarette!

My son just told me during a phone conversation that they announced a few more residents and building workers tested positive for Covid-19 and all are asymptomatic carriers! The entire apartment building are being asked to quarantine. That includes my son! About two of the residents are on my son's floor! My son's building has never had any cases until just recently. That's another reason I suspect the virus become airborne!


----------



## 2twenty2

*U.S. surpasses 8 million coronavirus cases*

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-19-cases-8-million-united-states/
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/confirmed-coronavirus-cases-in-us-surpass-8-million/ar-BB1a5z4a
https://www.today.com/video/us-surpasses-8-million-coronavirus-cases-93965381742


----------



## Professionalgirl

I have an update. My son told me that an entire floor of his building is infected sadly. He also indicated there are 12 people on one of the upper floors and 45 new cases altogether in just one day!😰😨


----------



## Couriant

Professionalgirl said:


> I have an update. My son told me that an entire floor of his building is infected sadly. He also indicated there are 12 people on one of the upper floors and 45 new cases altogether in just one day!😰😨


Wow! I am sorry to hear that.... hope all is well for him and it says away from him.


----------



## 2twenty2

*Influencer Dmitriy Stuzhuk Dead Of Coronavirus After Telling Followers It Wasn't Real*

https://www.eonline.com/news/119944...navirus-after-telling-followers-it-wasnt-real


----------



## ekim68

Russia orders national mask mandate as coronavirus cases spike



> Russian President Vladimir Putin's administration is taking its most drastic measures yet to curb the second wave of COVID-19. The Russian government on Tuesday implemented a nationwide mask mandate, as coronavirus cases spike worldwide.


----------



## 2twenty2

*Denmark plans to cull 15 million minks after coronavirus mutation spreads to humans*

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/...s-after-coronavirus-mutation-spreads-n1246445


----------



## Johnny b

:up:

* Pfizer, BioNTech say their COVID-19 vaccine is more than 90% effective *
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine-114500360.html



> Nov 9 (Reuters) - Pfizer Inc on Monday said its experimental vaccine was more than 90% effective in preventing COVID-19 based on initial data from a large study, a major victory in the fight against a pandemic that has killed over 1 million people, roiled the world's economy and upended daily life.


:up:


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> Wow! I am sorry to hear that.... hope all is well for him and it says away from him.


Hi James. Thank you for your concerns. My son is doing well and has escaped the virus so far. However, I am still deeply concerned.

My husband's workplace was shut down because the machines are in need of repairs and it's a miracle that it wasn't due to the virus. No cases were ever reported at my husband's workplace.
I will definitely discuss this in our Coronavirus forum. My son's apartment building seems to have a growing number of cases at an alarming rate. I believe it's only a matter of time before we all end up with it if mitigation measures are not in place to at least try to eradicate the potentially deadly virus before it takes over the entire world. My mom's area set a record breaking amount of covid-19 cases. So far no cases never hit any of my family but I still think it's only a matter of time if we don't do something fast to stop the spread and that's a scary thought.😨

I personally don't trust either presidential candidate. However, I do believe that if Biden wins it will be somewhat a relief since he cares more about the mitigation efforts to control the spread of the pandemic and is not as bad as Trump. I believe Trump lacks maturity whereas Biden appears more mature than Trump. I don't think Trump cares too much about the safety of our people and downplayed the virus the entire time.


----------



## Professionalgirl

ekim68 said:


> Russia orders national mask mandate as coronavirus cases spike


I don't consider mask wearing in public a drastic measure. Now China is a different story! They threw everyone in medal boxes and treated the poor citizens like animals. That is what you call a drastic and very shocking measure!😲😨


----------



## Professionalgirl

The school superintendent near my area just shut down an entire middle school because the virus is out of control! All schools need to be forced to shut down before we all end up with the virus!😱

I have observed my neighbors children being dropped off by the school bus through the living room window and they seemed healthy the first couple of times and than coincidentally around the same time the middle school closed, the wee little girl who was in Head Start was not with her brother, and her brother did not appear healthy! He was walking slowly and holding his head like as if he had a headache and it makes me wonder. I pray he is okay.😰


----------



## Professionalgirl

In addition to the above statements, the school superintendent just shut down the senior high school for 14 days because the virus is spreading at an alarming rate!

In Other major apartment buildings there are entire floors exposed to the virus and are being quarantined! The mail carriers in some areas are all infected with the virus and the mail rooms had to be shut down. Yikes!😨

The government is planning another lockdown from what I hear and I think they should but they won't. This virus is getting out of control. Rachel Lavine just indicated there will be no shut down despite the rise! Now that really makes me mad!😡

There have been nursing home deaths on the rise in my mom and sister's area. They just added 70 cases in my area just today! There were poll workers in my are testing positive and there are nine maintenance workers and 60 residents in my son's building that tested positive and are being quarantined. 

All cases are scattered about and I have known a few friends of my husband and I who reside at a distance with both mild, moderate and severe cases and two almost died while a few survived and stated it wasn't that bad. I explained to the ones who do not think its that bad to reconsider the many different strains of the virus and assess the severity. My husband's friend said run and lock your doors after being exposed to the virus and having a severe case!

Someone needs to take a stand to mitigate this direct and real threat before we all end up with it.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Hi 2twenty2, I read about the virus mutation in minks and its scary! I suspect the virus become airborne since we have record breaking numbers of cases unexplained!😱

More residents in my son's building our contacting the virus, including his floor and it's unlike anything I have ever seen before and every single day a new resident tests positive for the virus. It happened as we spoke on the phone!😰

There are now 84 residents and nine maintenance workers with the virus.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Update! Based on my observations I noticed that people are hoarding TP and food again and there is no need for this because our governor is no longer issuing lockdowns out of fear that he will be impeached for doing so. Our governor was almost impeached the last time he developed a red, yellow and green light model to help mitigate the spread of the virus, thanks to the whiny cry babies who thought our governor was a plain mean bully when all he attempted to do is protect us PA citizens from the spread of the virus. 

Thanks to the hoarders they ran out of TP again and my husband had to purchase Dude Wipes to use for a couple of days until the TP was Restocked. I dont think its a good idea to hoard food because it's selfish and leaves others without. Many will see a bare shelf at the store and go hungry because of the hoarders! Some of us have to work and cannot always make it to the store in time and that leaves hard workers to go without. Its an injustice.


----------



## 2twenty2

*US coronavirus cases top 12 million. An expert says spread is now 'faster' and 'broader' than ever*

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/21/health/us-coronavirus-saturday/index.html


----------



## 2twenty2

Culled mink rise from the dead to Denmark's horror

*Carcasses rose to surface at improvised mass grave owing to gases from decomposition*


----------



## Professionalgirl

Did anyone in this forum recieve a Covid-19 Emergency Alert? My husband received several of them in the middle of the night after he forgot to shut his phone off. I received one Emergency alert about the possibility that hospitals may soon fill due to the record breaking covid-19 case outbreak. The alert is urging people to stay home and if you must venture out please wear a mask and maintain your distance. 

Our local news source indicates an early shut down of bars and to stop serving alcohol after 5:30Pm yesterday and were permitted to reopen today at 9:00Am. I personally believe that is not nearly enough to mitigate a catastrophic rise in covid-19 cases.

I suspect either the virus became 100% airborne or there are false positive test due to the many new test that were recently innovated and out on the market. I question the accuracy of these tests. As to reason it does not sound logical to suddenly have a record breaking rise in cases. There could be an increase in testing as the result of the record breaking rises in cases as well.


----------



## Couriant

Professionalgirl said:


> Did anyone in this forum recieve a Covid-19 Emergency Alert? My husband received several of them in the middle of the night after he forgot to shut his phone off. I received one Emergency alert about the possibility that hospitals may soon fill due to the record breaking covid-19 case outbreak. The alert is urging people to stay home and if you must venture out please wear a mask and maintain your distance.
> 
> Our local news source indicates an early shut down of bars and to stop serving alcohol after 5:30Pm yesterday and were permitted to reopen today at 9:00Am. I personally believe that is not nearly enough to mitigate a catastrophic rise in covid-19 cases.
> 
> I suspect either the virus became 100% airborne or there are false positive test due to the many new test that were recently innovated and out on the market. I question the accuracy of these tests. As to reason it does not sound logical to suddenly have a record breaking rise in cases. There could be an increase in testing as the result of the record breaking rises in cases as well.


I did not, maybe it was for your area/state?


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> I did not, maybe it was for your area/state?


Hi James, I am from PA. I think you have to have the Emergency App or the Covid-19 checker Alert App. The Covid-19 Checker alert app checks in daily with you and will ask if your feeling well and then users can tap the symptoms if any that they are experiencing and it also has a contact Alert system for your area as well. If Someone nearby in your area is infected the Alert system will notify you. It sounds very much like a weather beep or Amber Alert.

My husband received a nice health package from his medical insurance company that consist of a digital finger pulse reader, hand sanitizer, mini first aid kit with gauze and medical tape, disinfectant spray, Honey flavored sore throat and cough drops, surgical masks, Aloe Vera skin lotion, Bandaids and a Smart Thermometer that is used with your smart phone with bluetooth enabled. I set the Kasa smart thermometer app up and tested to ensure it works. I really like the smart thermometer that lights up green with a smile and a temp reading to indicate no fever and you can add other users to your profile after signing up. My husband and I are fever free. It checks for covid-19 symptoms as well. If you don't have symptoms you can simply tap the back button.

My husband's boss's son who will be taking over his dad's position and business as supervisor, tested positive for covid-19 but was not around my husband or at work for months. I believe the exposure to co-workers was low. Thank god my husband was not exposed.


----------



## Professionalgirl

I would also like to add that my husband's cousin and first family member who resides long distance was exposed to Covid-19. 

My husband's boss's son and his wife recovered fully and reported back to work. He and is wife had such a mild case that they still cooked full course meals and did not lose their appetites or feel sick. I am still skeptical about the testing. I suspect a false positive. Most people infected with Covid-19 experience a loss of taste and smell and loss of appetite. I am sure most people with covid-19 would experience some type of discomfort and energy loss.


----------



## Johnny b

Professionalgirl said:


> Did anyone in this forum recieve a Covid-19 Emergency Alert?....................


Nothing here.
My county has been designated as highest risk ( level 4 ) with most of Ohio at level 3.

https://www.whio.com/news/reopening...em-covid-19-cases/3UAV4K6S5JGMLAEEQMTYCRNMSU/


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> Nothing here.
> My county has been designated as highest risk ( level 4 ) with most of Ohio at level 3.
> 
> https://www.whio.com/news/reopening...em-covid-19-cases/3UAV4K6S5JGMLAEEQMTYCRNMSU/


Hi Johnny I am also from the USA. I have relatives in Ohio. I am from PA. Our country is indeed one of the highest risk countries right now sadly. 😔

I just viewed the Kinsa App for Covid-19 risk exposure severity in my area. According to the App the exposure risk is critical. The meter states the highest risk and indicates a 75-100 ratio with an uncontrolled spread of severe illness.


----------



## zebanovich

Hey guys, did you notice there will be approved vaccine on 20th December?

Make sure you don't get sick in those last few days! hold on a little longer, even if you have to starve


----------



## Johnny b

IMO, it's doubtful the shots will be available to the general public that soon.

From this current link, it appears there isn't an official/published order of priority yet.

https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/941589

Common sense would place health workers first.


----------



## zebanovich

Yes, health workers will be first, for general public it will take until April (hopefully not 1st April lmao) for EU, USA, Russia, China, UK and probably few other countries. (according local news here)

Because of many potential firms releasing the vaccine in the west, there are some news that Russia and China will cooperate on manufacturing of vaccines in an attempt to produce more than their competitors.

Good thing about this is that we ordinary mortals can only expect this to result in faster production due to competition.

Since first shipments won't meet global demands it's safe to assume it will take at least until end of 2021 for the virus to completely disappear, according to WHO they are struggling to get top countries to work together for supplies, right now major countries stockpile vaccines for them self instead of working together to help poor countries.

But that's not a problem if we mortals (non doctors) really want to get it that fast, you can always become health worker in these times right?  (I guess it depends on where you live)


----------



## Johnny b

I'm afraid I not very good material for a 'health worker' classification,,,,lol!

But, yeah....it's good to see the progress


----------



## zebanovich

I didn't mean to offend health workers btw. they're indeed heroes!
Just wanted to say, helping them is possible, but not many are willing to do it due to a fear I guess.


----------



## Professionalgirl

zebanovich said:


> Hey guys, did you notice there will be approved vaccine on 20th December?
> 
> Make sure you don't get sick in those last few days! hold on a little longer, even if you have to starve


Hi Zabanovich, I am not quite so sure if I should trust the vaccine, considering the potential side effects that may pose a serious health risk or whether or not the vaccine is effective. I believe the vaccine would be too new to attempt. I would rather observe what's going on with others who receive the vaccine first before making a decision to receive the vaccine.


----------



## zebanovich

Professionalgirl said:


> I am not quite so sure if I should trust the vaccine, considering the potential side effects that may pose a serious health risk or whether or not the vaccine is effective


I'm more concerned about the methods involved to produce the vaccine, not all of the methods are considered moral.

If and when I'll be able to choose I'll consider this list:
CovidCompareMoralImmoral.pdf (cogforlife.org)


----------



## Professionalgirl

zebanovich said:


> I didn't mean to offend health workers btw. they're indeed heroes!
> Just wanted to say, helping them is possible, but not many are willing to do it due to a fear I guess.


Thank you Zebannovich, I used to be one of those health care workers before I switched careers. I was formerly a nurse at a nursing home that consisted in the health care of the elderly.

I used to have a thick Mayo Clinic book when I was younger and I researched just about every infectious disease imaginable and wanted to become part of the infectious disease task force but I changed my mind because I analyzed it and was literally spooked at the possibility that I could accidently contract a deadly virus overseas and potentially spread it to family or out in the community. I was not willing to take that risk, so I pursue other options that I was interested in and here I am. I am now a college graduate with an AS with a 4.0 GPA in Computer Information Science with the concentration of Networking and a BA with a 3.8 GPA in advanced Computer Information Science with the concentration of Cybersecurity. I believe I enjoy my new career almost as much as I enjoyed my career as a nurse. That explains the connection between the two different chosen fields. I always had a passion for helping people in a heroic manner. I think I get that from my dad.


----------



## zebanovich

Thank you for being honest, I'm sure your dad is proud of you!

There is an old saying originating from Africa:
"Other person is the best cure one can get"

I guess that means either, no one can heal him self, or, nice words are priceless.


----------



## Professionalgirl

zebanovich said:


> Thank you for being honest, I'm sure your dad is proud of you!
> 
> There is an old saying originating from Africa:
> "Other person is the best cure one can get"
> 
> I guess that means either, no one can heal him self, or, nice words are priceless.


Thank you Zebanovich!

My dad was a go getter. He seized the opportunity to pursue various jobs and positions. My dad owned his own private detective agency and sold the business after he realized just how dangerous the job was, and before he purchased the business he was employed as a prison security guard and moved on to become a various salesmen that includes, anything from selling ionizers, car dealing, working in a men's clothing store, MTA truck driving lessons and more. My dad was employed as a spokesperson for Chamber of commerce.

My dad is sadly no longer with us as he passed away at approximately 19 years ago on Thanksgiving Eve. After retirement my dad volunteered at a Hertz Rental car company that involves the transport of vehicles for the company and one day he had a sudden heart attack while with the Hertz rental car company and was rushed to a nearby hospital where he was pronounced dead on arrival since the medical team could not revive him. My dad was diagnosed with an Aortic Aneurysm prior to his passing. I bet he is with the angels smiling down on me. I know he must be proud of my accomplishments.


----------



## zebanovich

My sincere condolences. 

God doesn't like laziness and your father was hardworking man so surely he's with angels right now.


----------



## Johnny b

With anecdotal 'evidence' comes shortages on over the counter products whether they work or not.
I've been wondering why the Melatonin at Walmart was seldom in stock recently.

I use it as a gentle sleep aid.

Here's what's happening:

* Fact check: Melatonin could help against COVID-19, but more studies are needed *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...p-against-covid-19-studies-needed/3768894001/

I have no idea if it really works against the virus causing Covid-19, but I wouldn't bet my life on just it alone. 

I noticed it cost more this morning.


----------



## 2twenty2

_*COVID-19 becomes top killer in U.S. as hospitals fill up: "It's one giant ball of anxiety"*_

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-19-top-cause-of-death-united-states-hospitals-fill/


----------



## Johnny b

This popped up at USAToday.
Foods to stockup on during a quarantine.

* Here's 20 foods you should buy during a quarantine (because of their long shelf lives) *
https://www.usatoday.com/picture-ga...-because-of-their-long-shelf-lives/115087886/

Dried beans and rice are a favorite of mine. I'm well stocked.

But, what to do if/when the power goes out during the winter? Those two foods need a lot of simmering, especially the dried beans.
I also keep a dozen cans of pinto beans ( they're pre-cooked ) so a reheat is easy and quick to do with a camp stove or sterno stove.
I also have a portable backup generator that powers a microwave oven nicely.

I also stockup on canned corn and peas to add to my beans and rice.

Tilapia is relatively inexpensive. I usually keep a dozen servings in the freezer along with a large bag of french fries and 3 or 4 lbs of chicken breasts.

Bagged potatoes don't seem to keep more than a couple weeks, so I only buy 3 or 4 lbs at a time.

And I keep a goodly supply of apple juice and lemonade on hand.

And coffee......lots and lots of coffee


----------



## Couriant

I have Nespresso and they tend to ship and be at my door within 2 days from ordering. 

quote
*12. Liquor
• Shelf life:* Indefinite

I guess the reporter doesn't have kids that are doing VSL... lol There is no shelf life because it will be gone within a few days


----------



## zebanovich

Couriant said:


> 12. Liquor
> *• Shelf life:* Indefinite


One person told me their village fights corona with alcohol and that it works for them...
He was pretty much serious and I have no doubt about that lmao 😀

Btw. my own cure: I use boiled wine (1/4 water, 3/4 wine, sugar and clove) and also a strong lemonade made of one whole lemon when the wine and heat starts to act. you should try it out  (it feels like carousel haha)


----------



## Johnny b

* Trump administration refused offer to buy millions more Pfizer vaccine doses 
*
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/dec/07/trump-administration-coronavirus-vaccine-pfizer



> Decision could delay the delivery of a second batch until the manufacturer meets its orders for other countries


----------



## Cookiegal

That could be good news for us in Canada. 👍


----------



## Professionalgirl

I want to make everyone aware that this virus is prevalent in doctors offices, hospital ER's, Pediatric physicians offices, eye doctors, nursing homes, mental health and dentist offices. Please exercise extreme caution if you have an appointment or work at any of the above in patient or outpatient facilities. Please wear a mask and maintain social distancing.

As to reason, my mom's companion had a dentist appointment and the dentist and other workers tested positive for Covid-19! My mom's companion arrived for his appointment and the receptionist had to cancel his appointment without warning! If he would have attended his appointment he very well could have been exposed!😰

I am grateful that he was not exposed. My mom's companion is Diabetic and could risk serious complications if he were exposed to Covid-19.

I can't speak for others but I personally refuse to see a doctor or visit the ER unless it is a life or death emergency! I recently broke my pinkie toe because I stubbed it off the furniture when my husband and I were preparing for Christmas. I just took care of it myself! My husband received a medical kit from his provider and I just gaused and buddy taped the pinkie toe and I used an emery board and taped a sponge that I cut to fit the emery board and than I located my old boot leg from years ago to wear as a shoe until it heals. I set the pinkie toe straight so when the bone heals the pinkie toe will fuse back together straight! I took care of it myself to prevent getting exposed to a potentially deadly virus! My mom of course argued with me like a typical caring mother until the receptionist canceled her companion's dental appointment. My mom called me the next night with a different outlook. She said to me "I don't blame you for wanting to take care of a non emergency yourself and proceeded to explain her companion's dilemma with the dentist. I am not going to die from a broken pinkie toe and I don't have to worry about exposure to covid-19. I don't care if all of my teeth fall out! I refuse to visit a dentist!


----------



## Professionalgirl

Everyone, please pray for my son who may be exposed to covid-19. He is showing symptoms of chest pains and was instructed by the health care team to quarantine himself for 14 days. I am terrified and unable to slow my heart rate. 😰😭


----------



## Johnny b

Best wishes.


----------



## Gr3iz

You need to remain calm, Tina. Worrying will not help anyone, least of all YOU!


----------



## Professionalgirl

Gr3iz said:


> You need to remain calm, Tina. Worrying will not help anyone, least of all YOU!


I am aware of that Mark. I am trying but it's not easy. I am one of those worry wart moms and moms never stop worrying about their children, especially if they feel their child is in danger😩😟.


----------



## Gr3iz

I know, dear. Believe me, I care. I meant no offense.

Has he gotten tested? (Not that that's always accurate, but ...)


----------



## Professionalgirl

Gr3iz said:


> I know, dear. Believe me, I care. I meant no offense.
> 
> Has he gotten tested? (Not that that's always accurate, but ...)


Yes he was tested just today and is waiting for test results.


----------



## Gr3iz

That's the maddening part. I waited over a week the one time I was tested (several months back). My daughter works in health care and received a positive response. So all of us had to get tested. Her next test was negative. It was a false positive that got us going ... <sigh>


----------



## Professionalgirl

Gr3iz said:


> That's the maddening part. I waited over a week the one time I was tested (several months back). My daughter works in health care and received a positive response. So all of us had to get tested. Her next test was negative. It was a false positive that got us going ... <sigh>


Oh no Mark! I'm so sorry. I could just imagine how scary that must have been for you!😰


----------



## Gr3iz

I couldn't do anything about it. It either was or it wasn't. I lost no sleep over it ...


----------



## Couriant

That is strange Mark, I get tested within 24 hours, though I do go to Mayo Clinic and they have their own labs I guess. But I would think in your case your results should have been quicker... it's not like you are doing it just to do it.

@Professionalgirl Wishing a negative result!


----------



## Gr3iz

This was back in July, James. I think the labs were kinda stacked up at the time.

Unfortunately she was just tested positive again! Now she and the kids are going to be quarantined for a couple of weeks! I was hoping the youngest, my 9 year-old princess, was going to help me with the tree. She loves helping to pick it out and decorate it. Of course, it may be easier without her help, but it won't be the same ... <sigh>


----------



## Couriant

Gr3iz said:


> This was back in July, James. I think the labs were kinda stacked up at the time.
> 
> Unfortunately she was just tested positive again! Now she and the kids are going to be quarantined for a couple of weeks! I was hoping the youngest, my 9 year-old princess, was going to help me with the tree. She loves helping to pick it out and decorate it. Of course, it may be easier without her help, but it won't be the same ... <sigh>


I was still able to get it done within 24 hours because I was meant to have surgery 2 days after the test, but then like i said Mayo have their own labs so maybe I'm just lucky.. it sucks that this hasn't been improved... but I can understand that tradition being broken.... we would normally be going up north to the Polar Express train like we did every year with my oldest... but that can't be done  come on 2021... please be nice.


----------



## Johnny b

This might be bad news for some allergy sufferers.

* 'Very inconsistent': 2 allergic reactions in the UK to COVID-19 vaccine puzzle researchers *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...izer-vaccine-allergic-reaction-uk/6505867002/


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> That is strange Mark, I get tested within 24 hours, though I do go to Mayo Clinic and they have their own labs I guess. But I would think in your case your results should have been quicker... it's not like you are doing it just to do it.
> 
> @Professionalgirl Wishing a negative result!


Thanks James, I pray for a negative result as well.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Gr3iz said:


> I couldn't do anything about it. It either was or it wasn't. I lost no sleep over it ...


Mark, you gave me hope. I know that if my son does test positive it could mean a false positive hopefully. If I keep that in my mind I may not worry so much unless my son presents with all symptoms. Even than, I may just pray he recovers.


----------



## 2twenty2

_UK issues anaphylaxis warning on Pfizer vaccine after adverse reactions_

https://www.reuters.com/article/hea...ine-after-two-adverse-reactions-idUSKBN28J1D1


----------



## Professionalgirl

Governor Wolf of PA tested positive for Covid-19. That doesn't surprise me. He doesn't always wear a mask and he does not practice social distancing.

If you view someone's eyes you can tell a person is possibly infected with Covid-19 because their eyes are pinkish red around the lids and the whites of their eyes are bloodshot. Governor Wolf's eyes definitely signal Covid-19. I was just thinking the other day that Governor Wolf is probably infected because his eyes were red.

For more information please visit Governor Wolf Test Positive.


----------



## Johnny b

This has always been a worry, but now it's here.

* The U.S. Has Passed the Hospital Breaking Point *
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/...s-happening-hospitals-are-overwhelmed/617301/



> A new statistic shows that health-care workers are running out of space to treat COVID-19 patients.


----------



## RT

All the stats, numbers and predictions can be confusing, depending on the source, the context in which they are presented.
So folks I speak with on the phone, and folks here have "Do you actually know any one that actually has it?"
To that I can now say yes, I do.

A former co-worker caught it (I presume) in the course of his job dealing with the public, but I do not think it was because of lack of caution and procedure on his part.
I don't know the exact circumstance, but he's got it.
My long time daily work partner is his wife, and she's in quarantine.
So I'm glad to be out of the work force, but I've wondered if and when some one I worked with would get it, in spite of the obvious mandatory safety protocol.

Just wish folks would get the message that this will get worse before it gets better, so YOU had better not make it worse!


----------



## Johnny b

A good friend of mine contracted Covid-19 very early in the scheme of the pandemic, late last winter.
Because of a heart murmur exacerbated by the Covid-19 infection, he was supposed to go into a hospital for heart valve repair early in the coming January.
Now that's off.


----------



## Johnny b

Of interest:

*Italian boy found with coronavirus more than a year ago could be Europe's first case *
https://news.yahoo.com/italian-boy-found-coronavirus-more-144934221.html



> A four-year-old Italian boy contracted Covid-19 as far back as November last year, Italian scientists believe, in a discovery that could dramatically rewrite the timeline of the spread of the illness.
> ...........
> The little boy, from a town near Milan in the Lombardy region, began to feel ill on November 21, suffering from flu-like symptoms and a rash, and it was initially thought that he was suffering from measles.
> ..........
> Last month, a study suggested the virus may have entered Italy as early as September last year, while a third study found traces of the virus in untreated sewage water in Milan and Turin in December.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> A good friend of mine contracted Covid-19 very early in the scheme of the pandemic, late last winter.
> Because of a heart murmur exacerbated by the Covid-19 infection, he was supposed to go into a hospital for heart valve repair early in the coming January.
> Now that's off.


I'm so sorry John. I hope he recovered. My husband and I have a few friends who contracted covid-19 as well, including our landlord (Renting piece of land) and my husband's boss. Some of our friends say it was nothing while others almost died. It depends on the different strains that a person has that determines how aggressive it will be. 😔

My son is doing well so that is reassuring and he sounds good over the phone. 
I finally heard from him but no test result back yet.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> Of interest:
> 
> *Italian boy found with coronavirus more than a year ago could be Europe's first case *
> https://news.yahoo.com/italian-boy-found-coronavirus-more-144934221.html


That makes me wonder if my husband and I already had the virus since He was diagnosed with viral syndrome and I had a nasty cold and could not breath last December even though the virus was not in our area yet and it only lasted for one day! It could have been an asthma attack since I am an allergy sufferer but now i'm starting to wonder.

I remember about 10 years ago when I had phnewmococial pneumonia and almost died! That is normally caused by the flu. I am still skeptical of the time because I read about sporadic cases of the Coronavirus in the US back then on the Health.org Ebola map.


----------



## Johnny b

Professionalgirl said:


> I'm so sorry John. I hope he recovered. ...........


He's not well.
He still has some mild mental confusion at times.
He can walk, but fatigues quickly.
Hopefully, after the heart valve operation, he starts gaining some of his strength back.


----------



## Johnny b

This recently popped up in the news:

* Snow leopard in Kentucky zoo becomes first ever to test positive for SARS-CoV-2 *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...leopard-tests-positive-sars-cov-2/6510269002/


----------



## Johnny b

Professionalgirl said:


> That makes me wonder if my husband and I already had the virus ............


You'll never know unless tested.
I've read there are people that get infected and show little to no symptoms.

And there is the issue of possibly getting infected more than once.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> He's not well.
> He still has some mild mental confusion at times.
> He can walk, but fatigues quickly.
> Hopefully, after the heart valve operation, he starts gaining some of his strength back.


Awe John I am so sorry. That must be difficult.🥺


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> You'll never know unless tested.
> I've read there are people that get infected and show little to no symptoms.
> 
> And there is the issue of possibly getting infected more than once.


I know and that's a cause for concern. There are probably allot more people out there that are infected and don't know they are sick.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> You'll never know unless tested.
> I've read there are people that get infected and show little to no symptoms.
> 
> And there is the issue of possibly getting infected more than once.


I know and it's deeply concerning. That's why it is not stopping. People are getting infected more than once like you suggested John. That virus mutate very rapidly and I never observed a pandemic so ridiculously out of control like the one we are overseving now! Thats scary!😨


----------



## Professionalgirl

Here is a video that supports my evidence that this virus may grow at catastrophic levels! I think it already has!!
https://abcnews.go.com/Video


----------



## 2twenty2

*US Covid-19 hospitalizations hit record high for 7th straight day*

https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/12/health/us-coronavirus-saturday/index.html

And this >

*CDC director: US COVID-19 deaths likely to exceed 9/11 toll for 60 days*

https://thehill.com/policy/healthca...deaths-likely-to-exceed-9-11-toll-for-60-days


----------



## 2twenty2

*Country singer Charley Pride dead from coronavirus at 86*

https://forums.techguy.org/threads/in-memoriam.101080/page-219#post-9766256


----------



## Professionalgirl

I have great news! My son tested negative for Covid-19! Whew! 😓
I can almost relax now. 😌


----------



## Gr3iz

Yay! Congrats Tina!!


----------



## 2twenty2

US seizes domains used for COVID-19 vaccine phishing attacks

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/ne...s-used-for-covid-19-vaccine-phishing-attacks/


----------



## Professionalgirl

Gr3iz said:


> Yay! Congrats Tina!!


Thanks Mark! 🙂


----------



## 2twenty2

What scientists know about the coronavirus variant spreading in the U.K.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/...virus-variant-scientists-say-spreads-n1251841


----------



## Johnny b

Some things to think about:
Viruses can become part of our genome ( DNA sequence )

*Endogenous retrovirus*
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endogenous_retrovirus

* VISDB: a manually curated database of viral integration sites in the human genome*
https://academic.oup.com/nar/article/48/D1/D633/5584539


----------



## Professionalgirl

I have some sad news.
My daughter's husband in Arizona tested positive for Covid-19 and my granddaughters and my daughter are okay so far and are asymptomatic and were just recently tested. The mouth swab was used on my daughter and my poor little granddaughter who is just five years old had the nose swab where they stick the swab all the way up in her little nose. My heart breaks for my precious granddaughter.💔

My son in law states he has lost his sense of taste and smell as well as experiencing a headache as his first symptoms. His mother and her side of the family all contracted the virus from his mother's friend. One of the family members have a serious case that almost warrants an emergency visit to the ER and may possibly be placed on a ventilator. All contact exposures are in quarantine. Everyone but the one family member is recovering with mild symptoms.

In addition to this post, all family members are maintaining their distance and wearing masks as well as quarantining to their rooms. My son in law and daughter occasionally checks on my grandaughter at a safe distance and will knock on her door to ensure she's okay. When a meal is prepared for my grandaughter it is set on the table and the person who prepared the meal leaves the room. The rest of the family eat meals in their rooms.


Please keep my family in your thoughts and prayers. 🙏


----------



## Johnny b

Not only is there a concern of a new Covid-19 mutated virus spreading in England, this BBC News video discusses it and reports of another mutated Covid-19 out of South Africa that also has the experts concerned.
It mentions a rise in numbers of infected youth.


----------



## Johnny b

At this early period of the new Covid-19 infection spreading in England, this is speculation by genetics experts:

* Genetics experts worry coronavirus vaccines might not work quite as well against UK variant  *
https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/23/heal...es-less-effective-prevent-covid-19/index.html



> The UK variant has an unusually large number of mutations -- 14 changes and 3 deletions in its genetic code that impact the building blocks of its proteins, according to the CDC.
> "This virus has like 17 unique mutations that haven't been seen elsewhere, and that is really unusual," Worobey said.
> "The accrual of 14 lineage-specific amino acid replacements prior to its detection is, to date, unprecedented in the global virus genomic data for the Covid-19 pandemic," British scientists reported last week.
> It's not just the number of mutations that has some scientists worried, but the way they might work together.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> At this early period of the new Covid-19 infection spreading in England, this is speculation by genetics experts:
> 
> * Genetics experts worry coronavirus vaccines might not work quite as well against UK variant  *
> https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/23/heal...es-less-effective-prevent-covid-19/index.html


Hi Johnny, I am beginning to lose hope. This is deeply disturbing. I feel as though we are all doomed . It seems like this virus is stopping at nothing to infect us all! This virus is already closing in on my family members who reside at a distance.😨😰


----------



## RT

John, my friend, I thank you for the updates, but I have to agree with Tina @*Professionalgirl*
that most news is cloaked in doom and gloom -
maybe that's the way it is, or maybe it's media intention -
I mean I have to skip watching the mainstream news on TV and sometimes this thread just to take a breath...and never know if it will be my last.

But anyway thanks for the info, it's stuff we need to know.
Local news can be confusing.

And the those darned conspiracy theories...


----------



## Johnny b

Hi RT 

For those that ignore, deny the potential of a pandemic, doom and gloom is a distinct possibility.
For those that respond with caution and pragmatism, there is hope.

Knowledge is 'king'.
Ignorance is 'short term bliss'. Sometimes very short.

I do have a small advantage on knowing what to expect in relation to vaccine research.
My sister recently retired from Pfizer as a senor research scientist and often explains what many of these news articles leave out.
Not that I understand it all ( lol ) it does help in understanding why certain criteria is important and why it's addressed the way it's being projected.

The 'news' does seem to leave a lot out.
But then, their reporters aren't scientists with first hand experience.
They publish what sells.
And that relates to what attracts readers the most.


----------



## RT

Johnny b said:


> Knowledge is 'king'.
> Ignorance is 'short term bliss'. Sometimes very short.


I sure do hate to report my short term bliss.
I'm still somewhat aware, but still ignorant in many ways.


----------



## mohittomar13

I never had it tested though, but I am quite sure it was Covid19. I was the one with least number of symptoms. I lost the sense of smell but for only one day. Recovered in 15 days completely. I got it from my cousin brother (maternal uncle's son). The entire family got infected in 3 days but everyone recovered in about the same time like I did. Mom, brother and his wife, maternal uncles, their wife, their kids our maid a total of 16 people (yes we are a big family living under one roof) got infected in just 3 days. But everyone recovered without any complications. We tried everything to not to catch the infection but still got it. 

It's been now 2 months and everything is fine now.

I mentioned all this as there is too much fear. I think if you follow a good diet and do not smoke or drink then you are fine. I suggest not to panic.


----------



## Johnny b

mohittomar13 said:


> .........................
> 
> I mentioned all this as there is too much fear. I think if you follow a good diet and do not smoke or drink then you are fine. I suggest not to panic.


There's no panic in the US.
More like an issue of too much denial.


----------



## Johnny b

RT said:


> ..... but I have to agree with Tina..................
> that most news is cloaked in doom and gloom -
> maybe that's the way it is, or maybe it's media intention -
> ..............


Just pointing out that according to Johns Hopkins data, the US has the largest number of infections and deaths from Covid-19 and yet .......not the largest population.
That is the way it is.


----------



## RT

mohittomar13 said:


> But everyone recovered without any complications. We tried everything to not to catch the infection but still got it.
> 
> It's been now 2 months and everything is fine now.
> 
> I mentioned all this as there is too much fear. I think if you follow a good diet and do not smoke or drink then you are fine. I suggest not to panic.


Hi Mohit, I have thought of you and yours...I know you live in very populated area, and have alot of folks under your roof.
Sorry to hear about the illness, but glad you have posted a good report on the outcome.
Hoping everyone remains safe and well!

Your advice about diet, smoking and drinking sort of destroys my personal strategy , but it's still good advice


----------



## Johnny b

RT said:


> I sure do hate to report my short term bliss.
> I'm still somewhat aware, but still ignorant in many ways.


We are all ignorant in various ways.
IMO, Awareness leads to understanding.
You do it well, RT.

If I was perfect, I probably wouldn't be wanting to ride 'death machines'......
( But I am aware of negative consequences )


----------



## Johnny b

An article on a previous Covid-19 denier:

* Dr. Drew Pinsky tests positive for COVID-19 months after apologizing for downplaying the virus *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/ente...-tests-positive-says-virus-no-fun/4084693001/

To his credit, he did publicly denounce his initial claims many months ago.


----------



## mohittomar13

RT said:


> Your advice about diet, smoking and drinking sort of destroys my personal strategy , but it's still good advice


 yeah..!! Smoking is bad..


----------



## Johnny b

A little more about that South African mutation:

* UK scientists worry vaccines may not protect against S.African coronavirus variant *
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...t-s-african-coronavirus-variant-idUSKBN2990T3

* South African COVID variant poses greater risk than UK strain: health secretary *
https://nypost.com/2021/01/04/south-african-covid-variant-greater-risk-than-uk-strain-health-sec/


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> Hi RT
> 
> For those that ignore, deny the potential of a pandemic, doom and gloom is a distinct possibility.
> For those that respond with caution and pragmatism, there is hope.
> 
> Knowledge is 'king'.
> Ignorance is 'short term bliss'. Sometimes very short.
> 
> I do have a small advantage on knowing what to expect in relation to vaccine research.
> My sister recently retired from Pfizer as a senor research scientist and often explains what many of these news articles leave out.
> Not that I understand it all ( lol ) it does help in understanding why certain criteria is important and why it's addressed the way it's being projected.
> 
> The 'news' does seem to leave a lot out.
> But then, their reporters aren't scientists with first hand experience.
> They publish what sells.
> And that relates to what attracts readers the most.


Hi RT and Johnny, I agree entirely with both of you. RT your right about the media that is filled with doom. We are all doomed and Johnny your right as well when you posted that "ignorance is short term bliss." In addition to your post ignorance is lack of knowledge and as you posted "Knowledge is King." Otherwise society in general will lack the knowledge in preparation for new challenges that we must be aware of. This virus is mutating at a very rapid pace and the vaccine is very short supplied. Medical scientist are not able to keep up with the rapidly evolving mutations and new variants of Covid-19 and other potentially deadly emerging infectious disease.

However, A friend of mine just received the new Covid-19 vaccine and I was pleased to know that a friend of mine was mature and brave enough to accept the vaccine. I asked her to keep me informed as to whether or not she experiences adverse affects and whether or not the vaccine is affective. I am not so quick to receive the vaccine myself and neither are my family members because of the vaccine's uncertainty, so we are just observing those who receive vaccines for awhile to ensure the safety and quality first before we waste our health insurance money on a vaccine that may or may not be affective. I am fully aware that only medical professionals at high risk will receive the vaccine as part of the phase one development and is not yet available to the public.

My son, two nieces and nephews as well as my son in-law, granddaughter and daughter were all exposed to the rapidly spreading coronavirus. My daughter's blood type is O+ and was left uninfected without symptom's despite the fact she was around my granddaughter. My granddaughter's other grandmother's blood type is also O+ (Same blood type as me) was also exposed to covid-19 and was left unaffected by the virus and does not have symptoms. My granddaughter is asymptomatic. My son in-law and my son's blood type is A+ and are infected with Covid-19 with symptoms. My granddaughter's pap on her dad's side is very sick with the virus. All reside on the other side of the United States in a major hot spot area for Covid-19 "Arizona." My husband and I reside in here in PA. I and family in AZ researched covid-19 and found sources that medical scientist conducted a study and claimed that "persons with O+ blood types appear less susceptible to Covid-19 and may possibly be resistant to the virus." I am beginning to suspect there is some truth to this theory. I noticed family members with O+ blood types were not infected while family members with A+ blood types are infected with symptoms.

https://www.hematology.org/newsroom/press-releases/2020/possible-link-between-blood-type-and-covid-19#:~:text=Among the COVID-19 positive,than people with type O.

My son in-law is curious about the blood type my granddaughter has. I analyzed the genotype sequence of parents with the two blood types mentioned. My mom's blood type is A+ and my dad's is O+. I was the first born and my blood type is O+ and my sister was born with A+ blood type. My husband's blood type is A+ and mine is O+. My first born daughter to my second husband's blood type is O+ and my son is the second born with an A+ blood type. I suspect my granddaughter's dad's family's blood type sequence contains the same pattern regarding the blood types. I suspect my granddaughter may have the suspected Covid-19 resistant O+ blood type since she had no symptom's and is the first born to one parent having A+ and the other with O+ blood types.

I suspect the negative blood types proceed dominance over positive blood types because my first born to my first husband's blood type is A- even though I an have O+ blood type. The sequence is different as opposed to the positive blood types. If one parent's blood type is negative and the other is positive than the sequence changes and the first born with have the negative blood type regardless of one parent having an O+ blood type.

I feel there is one more very important aspect to discuss and to gain insight as to how this very sneaky virus operates. I thought my son recovered from covid-19 and just last night he called and told me his throat is sore and is feeling dizzy. My son lost his sense of taste and smell and experienced all the classic symptoms of covid-19 even though he tested negative! This virus's sequential pattern appears in waves like as if a light switch is switched on and off every couple of days. My son regained his sense of taste and smell for a couple of days and then suddenly experienced a sore throat and wheezy cough! I am deeply concerned and have not been able to sleep as a result and because this virus is so sneaky leads me to believe that's part of the reason this virus is so difficult to eradicate. People assume they recovered and continue spreading the virus to others!😨😰


----------



## 2twenty2

Researchers close in on 'universal' flu vaccine as COVID-19 fight takes priority

https://www.upi.com/Health_News/202...-COVID-19-fight-takes-priority/5301610121867/


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## Professionalgirl

My son successfully recovered from Covid-19! Yay!🤩

I am so grateful he recovered. I had many sleepless nights wondering if he would pull through. Now I know I don't need to worry since he is capable of recovery.🥰


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## Gr3iz

Very happy for you, Tina! 

Now, be honest -- Did worrying about him help him any? Or hurt you? No need to tell me ... ;-) Just glad things worked out for you and him!


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## Professionalgirl

Gr3iz said:


> Very happy for you, Tina!
> 
> Now, be honest -- Did worrying about him help him any? Or hurt you? No need to tell me ... ;-) Just glad things worked out for you and him!


I think I was right to worry. My son experienced severe chest pains and that was scary but at least I know now that he does have some type of immunity and if he contracts it again I probably wont worry because I know he will be okay. I just didn't know previously how his immune system would respond.


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## Cookiegal

There are some really strange people in the world. We are on lockdown with a curfew so no one's supposed to be out on the streets between 8:00 p.m. and 5:00 a.m. unless it's to go to work, essential things, of course. One exception is that you're allowed to walk your dog but it can only be within 1/2 mile of your home. Fine. So the police intercepted a man and woman who were out walking past curfew. The man had a collar and leash on and the woman said she was walking her dog.  They each received a fine of $1,500. Intelligence seems to be in short supply these days.


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## Gr3iz

Takes all kinds ... ;-)


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## Cookiegal

Yes. People are also renting their dogs to people who don't have one. Shameful. Would they rent their kids if it were required to be out? Probably.


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## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> There are some really strange people in the world. We are on lockdown with a curfew so no one's supposed to be out on the streets between 8:00 p.m. and 5:00 a.m. unless it's to go to work, essential things, of course. One exception is that you're allowed to walk you dog but it can only be within 1/2 mile of your home. Fine. So the police intercepted a man and woman who were out walking past curfew. *The man had a collar and leash on and the woman said she was walking her dog.*  They each received a fine of $1,500. Intelligence seems to be in short supply these days.


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## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> There are some really strange people in the world. ............................


LOL!


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> LOL!


Understatement, right?


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## 2twenty2

Almost a third of recovered Covid patients return to hospital in five months and one in eight die

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...d-covid-patients-return-hospital-five-months/


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> There are some really strange people in the world. We are on lockdown with a curfew so no one's supposed to be out on the streets between 8:00 p.m. and 5:00 a.m. unless it's to go to work, essential things, of course. One exception is that you're allowed to walk your dog but it can only be within 1/2 mile of your home. Fine. So the police intercepted a man and woman who were out walking past curfew. The man had a collar and leash on and the woman said she was walking her dog.  They each received a fine of $1,500. Intelligence seems to be in short supply these days.


I'm sorry Karen, I could not help but to laugh. You are certainly right when you stated "There are some strange people in this world." Though the couple may be strange I guess people should do what makes them happy, even if some women is walking a human dog! I think the poor guy must have lost it during the Covid-19 lockdown.


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## Johnny b

An interesting question would be......

Was he wearing a spiked dog collar?

That would explain a lot


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## Professionalgirl

2twenty2 said:


> Almost a third of recovered Covid patients return to hospital in five months and one in eight die
> 
> https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...d-covid-patients-return-hospital-five-months/


OH NO!! My son had the virus and recovered! 😨

My granddaughter and daughter were exposed but my daughter has the less vulnerable blood type O+ like myself. My daughter escaped the virus even though she was exposed! My granddaughter was asymptomatic and my daughter and family in Arizona are all made to wear a mask when spending time with my granddaughter until she is no longer considered asymptomatic. The entire state of Arizona is under quarantine due to the extreme number of cases as well, and the PA border where my husband and I reside is shut down to outsiders.

As far as I know, my husband and I escaped the virus so far but I have a bad feeling this virus isn't going to end anytime soon and will eventually infect us all!

My husband, son, mom and sister are all considered the high risk group since all have A+ blood types! My husband has heart disease and my sister has an autoimmune disease similar to Lupus and cannot be exposed to this virus!

I also want to provide a very important link about those who receive the vaccine can still transmit the virus to others because of the vaccine shortage and the estimated time it takes for the vaccine to become affective as well as possible transmission to those who did not receive the vaccine.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-5578419...OTTJ6lnquHGIgf-LlkxZYh3oZ0389ZxEYMErBJ14lnHFI

There is another very important piece of information that I need to share. The original SARS virus can be transmitted throughout entire facilities and apartment buildings through poorly maintained sewage systems which explains why an entire apartment building full of residents were exposed to the deadly strain! I personally believe that one should use triple mask protection and to be worn properly using N95 masks instead of flimsy disposable surgical masks before entering their bathrooms if they reside in a facility or apartment building with poorly maintained sewage systems. A disinfectant like Lysol should be used in areas with poor sewage systems after entering bathrooms as well.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16696450/


----------



## Professionalgirl

I just contacted the CDC to enquire about the Covid-19 variant that was detected here in the United States for the first time in a non traveler, and expressed my concerns about the possibility of wildlife migrating across borders, or illegal immigrants transporting illegal wildlife across the border as the reason for the spread of the new variant in a non traveler.

https://abc7chicago.com/covid-varia...-pfizer-moderna-african-coronavirus/10095823/

On this same site above the medical professionals are warning us to avoid pain relievers like Tylenol and Ibuprofen because it can reduce the effectiveness of the vaccine.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Update, Now my sister's best friend and family are all sick with Covid-19 and her mother is in the hospital ion a ventilator. I tried warning my sister about allowing her best friend to visit. My sister has a mild form of Lupus and cannot be exposed to a virus that plays Russian Rolette with your immune system. My sister told me not to worry because her friend would never expose her to a potentially deadly virus and if she were sick she would call my sister to let her know and stay home. I tried explaining to her that she could be asymptomatic and can unknowingly spread the virus to her, and it wouldn't be intentional, and I know her heart is genuine but she could still expose her to the virus. 

Talk about close call! 😨😰


----------



## Couriant

Professionalgirl said:


> Update, Now my sister's best friend and family are all sick with Covid-19 and her mother is in the hospital ion a ventilator. I tried warning my sister about allowing her best friend to visit. My sister has a mild form of Lupus and cannot be exposed to a virus that plays Russian Rolette with your immune system. My sister told me not to worry because her friend would never expose her to a potentially deadly virus and if she were sick she would call my sister to let her know and stay home. I tried explaining to her that she could be asymptomatic and can unknowingly spread the virus to her, and it wouldn't be intentional, and I know her heart is genuine but she could still expose her to the virus.
> 
> Talk about close call! 😨😰


So she found out after she visited? If so, is your sister get tested? She should since she was exposed to someone that was.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> So she found out after she visited? If so, is your sister get tested? She should since she was exposed to someone that was.


Hi James, My sister hasn't been around her best friend in awhile. Thank God for that! Whew! 😥

My sister did have to test anyway for the virus because she was having outpatient surgery and tested negative. I am so grateful that God answered my prayers to guide and support my sister, and to enable her to make the right decisions and my sister was left unharmed.


----------



## Professionalgirl

My mom called and told me the Pfizer vaccine has hidden side affects that are not listed by the food and drug administration. The additional side affects include causing diabetes in women, flu like symptoms, high fever and muscle weakness and are enough to refuse the vaccine!

One dose or even the second dose does not mean people can run around without a mask or mingle like the outbreak is over. It takes a few months for the vaccine to actually take affect. This vaccine is still in the Beta (Developmental Phase) and was never actually released to the public for administration. This vaccine was dispersed early on an emergency basis only! No one knows whether or not how affective the vaccine is. It may or may not work at all and could be a dud just like the H1N1 Swine flu vaccine. That vaccine was ineffective.

Please do not allow the new vaccines to provide a false sense of security. The cases are already on the rise again in some areas after seeing a decrease on the Kinza App that was downloaded on the phone.

https://www.fda.gov/emergency-prepa...019-covid-19/pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine

I also would like to share that the new mutations are growing at a very rapid pace and is more aggressive than the last! 😨

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/transmission/variant.html


----------



## Cookiegal

Professionalgirl said:


> My mom called and told me the Pfizer vaccine has hidden side affects that are not listed by the food and drug administration. The additional side affects include *causing diabetes in women*, flu like symptoms, high fever and muscle weakness and are enough to refuse the vaccine!


Is your Mom an authority on this? Where exactly did she hear that? I can't find anything on the Internet making the claim about Diabetes. The other three you mentioned have been widely reported as potentially common side-effects.

We don't want to instill fear in people about getting the vaccine with false information.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> Is your Mom an authority on this? Where exactly did she hear that? I can't find anything on the Internet making the claim about Diabetes. The other three you mentioned have been widely reported as potentially common side-effects.
> 
> We don't want to instill fear in people about getting the vaccine with false information.


My mom seen this information on a live television broadcast on CNN so I am not able to provide a link to the source. Now that I think about it, I'm sure my mom did not intentionally spark fear in people about getting a vaccine and I think she's watching too much CNN and really should not watch news clips like this. CNN was previously known to provide false information mixed with sometimes truthful information. My mom was fearful as a result. I should know better than to believe any information on sources like CNN. I will be sure to inform her of this.

Update: My mom retrieved this source from USA Today. I have her on the phone and I informed her that even watching USA Today is not an accurate source and she understands. I'm not sure if it was just suspected or if it was meant to cause fear or panic in some way.


----------



## Johnny b

(updated Jan 25 2021 )

* Information about the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine *
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/Pfizer-BioNTech.html

It addresses minor side effects as discussed recently in this thread, and the issue of allergies being a concern.

All of which I thought was common knowledge at this point in time.


----------



## Couriant

Typically CNN would have links to their articles that was on TV, but I didn't find anything. I am diabetic so it would be on my radar if there were any indications regarding diabetics. Considering that Diabetes imo is more of lifestyle choices (for me I was drinking too much soda and eating too much carbs), and possible herdeity, a vaccine would not be a cause of diabetes. If what CNN said is true, then I would suspect that the affected people already had diabetes and didn't know, or was pre-diabetic and then the vaccine elevated their stats, but they based the numbers on A1C, which is an average of 3 months if I am not mistaken so a vaccine to even do that to me seems dubious. I would like to see any articles if you come across them 

I have had both shots. The first shot, I had no reaction. The only thing I had was the same soreness as I would with any shot. The second one I had minimal issues. The nurse that gave me the shot said to take tyenol before I go to bed as it should help. I felt like I had flu-like symptoms (face felt flushed) and tiredness, though I already have sleep apena but i felt more tired. Also my arm was a little more sore than the first one so I couldn't lift my arm up high to get stuff from top shelves. Other than that I was fine. Some people may not have any reaction, some may have worse, but that's the human body... everyone is different... no one should expect the same results. My colleagues sister had the vaccine and was fine until she was at work.... she had fallen asleep at her desk hard.

Anyone with common sense should know that this is not a cure, but to prevent the horrible effects of COVID. But there is no surprise that people are ignorant about the vaccine... and judging the last few years common sense seems to have been abandoned because of politics and conspiracy theories and Fox News... the best we can all do is protect ourselves first. Something is better than nothing... and I believe in Science.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> Typically CNN would have links to their articles that was on TV, but I didn't find anything. I am diabetic so it would be on my radar if there were any indications regarding diabetics. Considering that Diabetes imo is more of lifestyle choices (for me I was drinking too much soda and eating too much carbs), and possible herdeity, a vaccine would not be a cause of diabetes. If what CNN said is true, then I would suspect that the affected people already had diabetes and didn't know, or was pre-diabetic and then the vaccine elevated their stats, but they based the numbers on A1C, which is an average of 3 months if I am not mistaken so a vaccine to even do that to me seems dubious. I would like to see any articles if you come across them
> 
> I have had both shots. The first shot, I had no reaction. The only thing I had was the same soreness as I would with any shot. The second one I had minimal issues. The nurse that gave me the shot said to take tyenol before I go to bed as it should help. I felt like I had flu-like symptoms (face felt flushed) and tiredness, though I already have sleep apena but i felt more tired. Also my arm was a little more sore than the first one so I couldn't lift my arm up high to get stuff from top shelves. Other than that I was fine. Some people may not have any reaction, some may have worse, but that's the human body... everyone is different... no one should expect the same results. My colleagues sister had the vaccine and was fine until she was at work.... she had fallen asleep at her desk hard.
> 
> Anyone with common sense should know that this is not a cure, but to prevent the horrible effects of COVID. But there is no surprise that people are ignorant about the vaccine... and judging the last few years common sense seems to have been abandoned because of politics and conspiracy theories and Fox News... the best we can all do is protect ourselves first. Something is better than nothing... and I believe in Science.


Hi James, Sorry to misinform you. My mom actually retrieved the information from the USA Today show. I spoke with my mom just a little bit ago via phone and had a talk with her about this and she understands now that not all information is an accurate or reliable source. Apparently the Pfizer vaccine was supposedly causes diabetes in women. My question is why women when men are also vulnerable to diabetes as well? It makes no sense to me because the female antinomy has nothing to do with your pancreas and diabetes. My mom's companion also has diabetes and I have a few friends and family members with diabetes as well. a couple are female and one is male.

I also would like to point out that part of the information my mom told me was accurate about the second dose causing side affects but were exaggerated from whatever source my mom was viewing. I tend to view sources and than compare with the reliable sources such as CDC, FDA, PA Health Department and WHO and if all three are consistent, that's how I know it is a reliable source. My mom often confides in me for accurate information and anything she finds questionable I can quickly locate the information for her.


----------



## Cookiegal

I had to go out so that's why I haven't commented further until now.

I echo what James said. I can't find anything on USA Today either about this. I did find an article from last June saying they were studying the possibility that Covid-19 may trigger Diabetes.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...hether-covid-19-triggers-diabetes/3267863001/

Also, for them (USA Today as your mother claims) to indicate this was a *hidden *side-effect that government agencies are not divulging, that's a pretty serious allegation.

I'm sure your Mom misunderstood what she heard.

In any event please be careful when reporting information like that and be sure to verify it first. While this thread is not the same as the thread in the Controversial forum, serious allegations do need to be backed up, otherwise, anyone could say anything.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> I had to go out so that's why I haven't commented further until now.
> 
> I echo what James said. I can't find anything on USA Today either about this. I did find an article from last June saying they were studying the possibility that Covid-19 may trigger Diabetes.
> 
> https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...hether-covid-19-triggers-diabetes/3267863001/
> 
> Also, for them (USA Today as your mother claims) to indicate this was a *hidden *side-effect that government agencies are not divulging, that's a pretty serious allegation.
> 
> I'm sure your Mom misunderstood what she heard.
> 
> In any event please be careful when reporting information like that and be sure to verify it first. While this thread is not the same as the thread in the Controversial forum, serious allegations do need to be backed up, otherwise, anyone could say anything.


Hi Karen, Normally my mom confides in me for accurate information and I usually compare the information with at least three other reliable sources such as CDC, PA Health Department and WHO to determine the accuracy of such allegations and if all three are consistent than I will know the information is accurate.

I do apologize though for any misinformation that I provided.


----------



## Cookiegal

Professionalgirl said:


> I do apologize though for any misinformation that I provided.


----------



## Johnny b

I haven't gotten my covid shot/shots yet.
I have a 'ticket' but supplies are low in Ohio.
I applied for a shot as soon as allowed but by the time it was processed, they were all booked up.
The vaccines are claimed to more available, soon, as shipments are supposed to double.

I'm not much concerned about myself as I'm retired and I spend most of my time bugging you guys and gals LOL!
I'm well aware of 'safe practices' and follow them explicitly.
I haven't even had a cold this winter.
But I do get a runny nose if I use too much cayenne pepper on my beans


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> 👍


Hi Karen, I am quoting what you typed with an explanation to let you know I understand what was meant when you typed " I did find an article from last June saying they were studying the possibility that Covid-19 may trigger Diabetes." What was really meant by that article was the possibility that the vaccine could cause diabetes in both men and women in general and not just in women and they did not indicate that it would actually cause diabetes. It was just a stated theory based on suspicion rather than facts. Am I right? The part about women only was a misinformation on my mom's part. I will be sure to explain this to her.


----------



## Brigham

I had my first covid19 shot on 20th January. The only side effect for me was I felt a bit tired the following day. This may not be a side effect at all as I am 86 and I do tend to sleep more than I used to. The shot was the Pfizer one.


----------



## Cookiegal

Professionalgirl said:


> What was really meant by that article was the possibility that the vaccine could cause diabetes in both men and women in general and not just in women and they did not indicate that it would actually cause diabetes. It was just a stated theory based on suspicion rather than facts. Am I right?


First of all, you only quoted my thumbsup emoji. Secondly, no, you still don't get it. You need to read things more carefully. The article I posted a link to says they are investigating the possibility the Covid-19 *virus *not the vaccine may trigger Diabetes.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> First of all, you only quoted my thumbsup emoji. Secondly, no, you still don't get it. You need to read things more carefully. The article I posted a link to says they are investigating the possibility the Covid-19 *virus *not the vaccine may trigger Diabetes.


Okay they are investigating the possibility. I left out information. I'm sorry.


----------



## Cookiegal

Tina, It's the virus that may trigger it *NOT the vaccine*.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> Tina, It's the virus that may trigger it *NOT the vaccine*.


Oh, Maybe I did misunderstand than. I missed that information. I apologize.


----------



## Cookiegal

No problem.


----------



## Couriant

I suspect it's more of misinformation than anything... I found this snippet:



> A number of PWDs who've had access to a vaccine told DiabetesMine they experienced a sore arm and somewhat *elevated blood sugars* in the hours, and even a few days, following the shots.


https://www.healthline.com/diabetesmine/covid-vaccine-and-diabetes#blood-sugar-impact

Maybe this is what was meant to be reported?


----------



## Cookiegal

This from a trusted source on Diabetes:

https://www.diabetes.org.uk/about_us/news/coronavirus-vaccines


> *Vaccines and blood sugar levels *
> 
> Taking the vaccine may make your blood sugar levels go up.
> 
> When you get the vaccine, your body will start to produce what's called an immune response. This is nothing to worry about. Your body is just reacting to the vaccine because the vaccine is new to you.
> 
> Your body needs energy to produce this immune response, so it may release some extra glucose (sugar). This is what leads to your blood sugar increasing.


so it sounds like it's an expected response due to energy needed.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> I suspect it's more of misinformation than anything... I found this snippet:
> 
> https://www.healthline.com/diabetesmine/covid-vaccine-and-diabetes#blood-sugar-impact
> 
> Maybe this is what was meant to be reported?


I agree with you James. I believe Healthline is a reliable source because it uses links to the CDC and you cannot retrieve a more reliable source than the CDC. I read the information carefully this time and what I gathered from your article was that people were voicing their fears of long term effects since the vaccine is still new and unfamiliar to most of us which caused patients to refuse the vaccine. I hope I get it right this time and read thoroughly. (I tend to skip over words because I'm always in a hurry and need to slow down.).

I read information where one diabetic patient experienced slight elevation in her glucose levels while another Diabetic patient experience no changes in glucose levels. My personal opinion leads me to suspect that it is possible that the one patient with slightly elevated glucose levels were just coincidental since the other patient with diabetes experienced no changes or effects in glucose levels. I don't believe there is enough evidence to prove this theory and is just based on speculation.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> This from a trusted source on Diabetes:
> 
> https://www.diabetes.org.uk/about_us/news/coronavirus-vaccines
> so it sounds like it's an expected response due to energy needed.


Hi Karen, I also agree with your article because the UK medical science teams are the innovators of these new vaccines that are available to the elderly. The article indicates "that people with diabetes are at high risk for developing complications from coronavirus." However, it does not state anyone developing diabetes from either the virus or the vaccines. They are simply stating that you can develop complications from the virus if you have diabetes and are strongly encouraging people with diabetes to get the vaccine to protect themselves from complications. Diabetics are considered the high risk group and are eligible for the vaccine. My mom's companion is diabetic and is scheduled by the VA to receive his first Pfizer vaccine on Saturday since he is categorized as a person of the high risk group. hope I have this information correct and read the information carefully.


----------



## Cookiegal

Yes, that's correct Tina.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> Yes, that's correct Tina.


Thank god. Whew! I don't want anymore embarrassment that I bestowed upon myself. For once I finally have the information correct.


----------



## Brigham

There is a site called "The conservative woman" that I used to read ..I found it interesting when it was about politics. All the different arguments were there to be commented on. Since coved, however, It now contains an enormous amount of misinformation and scaremongering. Even the leaders of the various topics about the pandemic are encouraging people to not have the vaccine and running the government down about the lockdown and rules that try to keep us from harm.


----------



## Professionalgirl

I just researched information about the eligibility for the Covid-19 Pfizer of those with coronary artery disease like my husband and he is definitely listed in the high risk group and is eligible for the vaccine. According to the site his heart medications will not interfere with the effectiveness of the vaccine. However, I was unable to locate any information about the vaccine's possibility to interfere with his medicated heart stent. My mom and I are encouraging my husband to ask his heart doctor about the Pfizer vaccine to determine whether or not it's safe for him to receive the Covid-19 Pfizer vaccine with a medicated heart stent.

https://www.bhf.org.uk/informations...us-vaccine-your-questions-answered#sidePfizer


----------



## Cookiegal

For sure he should ask his doctor about it. That's always the safest way to go.


----------



## Brigham

If he did ask his doctor, would there be a charge for the advice? In the UK we have grown so used to getting medicine free at the doctors or hospitals, I've lost touch on how other countries fund their medicine.


----------



## Couriant

Brigham said:


> If he did ask his doctor, would there be a charge for the advice? In the UK we have grown so used to getting medicine free at the doctors or hospitals, I've lost touch on how other countries fund their medicine.


Not for calling in, but if we got an appointment and go to the office, we would be charged for that...


----------



## dotty999

Thankfully I get the vaccine next week!


----------



## Professionalgirl

Brigham said:


> If he did ask his doctor, would there be a charge for the advice? In the UK we have grown so used to getting medicine free at the doctors or hospitals, I've lost touch on how other countries fund their medicine.


What?? That's ridiculous! They don't charge charge here in the US for doctor advice.

My husband decided not to receive the vaccine or contact his doctor because he doesn't trust the vaccine. It is still very new and there is still allot we don't know about it since it is being administered on an emergency basis. I respect my husbands decision about this. I remain neutral on the subject because there may be risks associated with the shot later on or it may just benefit us in the long run.

I recently found more information regarding the Pfizer vaccine that my sister in-law sent me. There was a couple who received two doses of Pfizer 21 days apart and he contracted the virus about two weeks after the second dose and his girlfriend contracted the virus five days after the second dose. The couple reside in CA United States. The man indicated the case was mild. I wonder if they naturally had a mild case or if the vaccine actually protected against a more severe case.

https://www.wect.com/2021/02/10/cal...qfSHEvdws2CcARb0arz0aMBv-8-CeIEYzk0WHtKQrIxq4


----------



## Johnny b

Rather than panic over a non scientific news article, remember.....the vaccines are not rated 100% efficacy.
There will be a small percentage of people that will not benefit from the shots.


----------



## Couriant

I may be making this up, but I'm pretty sure that cases have been going down in certain areas, like assisted living homes after the vaccine was administered, and also I thought an European country was also seeing the cases going down but I can't seem to find anything to back that up... I truly understand people being hesitant, especially those with ailments that the vaccine _could_ make it worse, but for me I would rather put my faith in science... I would like to not have to worry 100% of the time if I didn't get the vaccine.


----------



## Cookiegal

Professionalgirl said:


> There was a couple who received two doses of Pfizer 21 days apart and he contracted the virus about two weeks after the second dose and his girlfriend contracted the virus five days after the second dose.


I've read that article and a couple of others and there is nothing that says his girlfriend also received any vaccine. The article talks only about a California man receiving both doses. Then goes on to say his girlfriend contracted the virus 5 days after HE received HIS second dose. So that means she likely got it from him and then he was likely reinfected by her two weeks later (three weeks after his second dose).


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> ........................So that means she likely got it from him and then he was likely reinfected by her two weeks later (three weeks after his second dose).


That's what the article infers.
It's not an established fact.
She could have been infected elsewhere.

IMO, poor reporting.

And this from the article:
https://www.wect.com/2021/02/10/cal...qfSHEvdws2CcARb0arz0aMBv-8-CeIEYzk0WHtKQrIxq4


> "I think I've heard of six or seven independent cases........


For all we know, that individual has been exposed to 'chinese whispers'.....(  )


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> That's what the article infers.
> It's not an established fact.


Yup, I was going to say that too but it's why I said "likely" as it's not a given fact.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Couriant said:


> I may be making this up, but I'm pretty sure that cases have been going down in certain areas, like assisted living homes after the vaccine was administered, and also I thought an European country was also seeing the cases going down but I can't seem to find anything to back that up... I truly understand people being hesitant, especially those with ailments that the vaccine _could_ make it worse, but for me I would rather put my faith in science... I would like to not have to worry 100% of the time if I didn't get the vaccine.


Hi James, the virus cases appeared to decrease in most areas I viewed by zip code here in PA in accordance with my husband's Kinsa mobile phone App that also reads the temperature of the thermometer via WIFI that was provided by his medical insurance agency. However, I have been monitoring the case counts to determine if any of these areas across the country are increasing and it is starting to increase after a decrease to the moderate risk zone in my son and my mom's area whereas, in my daughter's area across the country is decreasing gradually and in my area it is continuing to decrease almost to the low risk zone but that will change fast since the new variant is larking. This virus appears to raise up and down like a yoyo every time a new variant is present.

It appears as though the virus mutations are producing at a very high speed that is much faster than what our medical scientist can include in the vaccine. It seems like we are fighting a losing battle and the virus is winning.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> I've read that article and a couple of others and there is nothing that says his girlfriend also received any vaccine. The article talks only about a California man receiving both doses. Then goes on to say his girlfriend contracted the virus 5 days after HE received HIS second dose. So that means she likely got it from him and then he was likely reinfected by her two weeks later (three weeks after his second dose).


His girlfriend must not have had the vaccine than. Again My mistake.


----------



## Cookiegal

Professionalgirl said:


> His girlfriend must not have had the vaccine than


It doesn't appear so. Perhaps it wasn't her turn yet.


----------



## Johnny b

Professionalgirl said:


> .................................
> 
> It appears as though the virus mutations are producing at a very high speed that is much faster than what our medical scientist can include in the vaccine. It seems like we are fighting a losing battle and the virus is winning.


Delays you are concerned about are more an issue of the necessary time taken for testing. We're getting shots early because of 'emergency' designations.

Past research of other coronavirus enabled scientists to come up with the current vaccines as quickly as they did. 
My sister, a recently retired PhD research scientist for Phizer, has told me that's on a scale of about a decade. Especially with Moderna and Pfizer.
Their successes didn't just start 10-12 months ago.

IMO, a real battle has been one of social activity, including politics. There are still people that ignore safety protocols.
A recent article in mainstream news media projected that about 40% of deaths could have been avoided.
https://abcnews.go.com/Health/lancet-commission-examines-trumps-covid-response/story?id=75826837

Something to think about.
Evolution.
As long as humans ignorantly promote infection, the greater the size of the virus population and the greater the rate of mutations.
Competition increases, the advantaged survive at greater rates and the mutation becomes no longer the variant, it becomes the next standard example. And so on and so on.
And with the current corona virus mutating readily, it becomes an ugly tale of our own survival.

But all we have to do, or should have done, was use common sense.


----------



## Johnny b

* Israeli study finds 94% drop in symptomatic COVID-19 cases with Pfizer vaccine *
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...id-19-cases-with-pfizer-vaccine-idUSKBN2AE0Q2

:up:


----------



## dotty999

I'm looking forward to getting the vaccine in a couple of days


----------



## 2twenty2

CNN Exclusive: WHO Wuhan mission finds possible signs of wider original outbreak in 2019

https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/14/health/who-mission-china-intl/index.html


----------



## dotty999

Today is vaccine day!


----------



## Gr3iz

Yay! Best of luck to you!


----------



## Couriant

For those who wants to get the vaccine but is not in the groups that are currently allowed, you may be able to get it the vaccine sites requires volunteers. My wife just signed up to volunteer and the site she is helping does give the vaccine to the volunteers.


----------



## dotty999

I had the AstraZeneca this evening, fingers crossed!


----------



## Cookiegal

AstraZeneca is the one I wouldn't want given a choice but I guess we won't have a choice.


----------



## dotty999

There are conflicting reports on the vaccine but I'm remaining positive that it will help to some degree


----------



## Cookiegal

It's mainly the South African variant they say it's less effective against from what I've heard.


----------



## dotty999

I'm following the advice from our government.


----------



## Gr3iz

One of the 3 biggest lies: "Hi. We're from the government. We're here to help.". ;-)


----------



## dotty999

I guess we have to agree to disagree on this subject


----------



## Johnny b

Covid-19
Epidemic or endemic, that is the question.
Is it here to stay?

*Health officials say the coronavirus will likely become endemic in the next several years. What does that mean? *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...emic-experts-say-heres-what-means/4487953001/


----------



## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> Covid-19
> Epidemic or endemic, that is the question.
> Is it here to stay?
> 
> *Health officials say the coronavirus will likely become endemic in the next several years. What does that mean? *
> https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...emic-experts-say-heres-what-means/4487953001/


Yeah, a doctor that my wife helped when she was volunteering with a vaccine site said that we would probably be needing a shot every year like the flu shot... this will not go away anytime soon... probably not in my lifetime at least.


----------



## SeanLaurence

Gr3iz said:


> One of the 3 biggest lies: "Hi. We're from the government. We're here to help.". ;-)


That was a Ronald Reagan quote. I think it did a huge disservice to civil society. If your government isn't helping, then it is time to elect a better one. First you need to put forward worthy candidates. Then you need to inform the electorate why it matters.
Perhaps the lessons learned from the Texas power failures this week will make people see that regulation matters,
Naw - Most are probably still watching Tucker.


----------



## Johnny b

* A third Pfizer dose? The Covid-19 vaccine maker is studying booster shots. *
https://www.nbcnews.com/health/heal...vaccine-maker-studying-booster-shots-n1258775



> In an interview with NBC News' Lester Holt, Pfizer CEO Albert Bourla said the hope is that a third dose will boost the immune response even higher, offering better protection against variants.
> 
> "We believe that the third dose," Bourla said, "will raise the antibody response 10- to 20- fold."


----------



## SeanLaurence

Johnny b said:


> * A third Pfizer dose? The Covid-19 vaccine maker is studying booster shots. *
> https://www.nbcnews.com/health/heal...vaccine-maker-studying-booster-shots-n1258775


Does anyone else read this and think that he just wants to sell an extra 300 million doses?
or
Does it sound like they are re-formulating to accommodate some or all of the new variants?


----------



## Johnny b

SeanLaurence said:


> Does anyone else read this and think that he just wants to sell an extra 300 million doses?
> or
> Does it sound like they are re-formulating to accommodate some or all of the new variants?


They are addressing the new variants.


----------



## Professionalgirl

According to the Kinsa app I have installed, it indicates the case counts in every area are declining. I personally don't believe it will stay that way. The darn thing keeps bouncing up and down like a yoyo. I am skeptical that the estimated time for the pandemic will end is April. There will be a new variant popping up somewhere and the case counts will rise again to critical stages. Watch and see. It happens every three months based on what I observed. I am already observing a slight increase and decrease here and there in accordance to the Kinsa App.


----------



## Cookiegal

The numbers have been coming down in Quebec too but next week is a school break and a lot will depend on whether or not people follow the rules during that time. I suspect most won't and we will see numbers rise again a couple of weeks later.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> The numbers have been coming down in Quebec too but next week is a school break and a lot will depend on whether or not people follow the rules during that time. I suspect most won't and we will see numbers rise again a couple of weeks later.


I agree wholeheartedly and sadly.


----------



## SeanLaurence

Cookiegal said:


> The numbers have been coming down in Quebec too but next week is a school break and a lot will depend on whether or not people follow the rules during that time. I suspect most won't and we will see numbers rise again a couple of weeks later.


I am going to respectfully disagree with you here - I think most will "Follow the rules" but many won't. And yes, we will see an uptick in cases.


----------



## Cookiegal

SeanLaurence said:


> I am going to respectfully disagree with you here


You may be right but almost everyone I see of my neighbours and friends are doing at least one thing that goes against the rules yet they think they're complying. I feel like I'm the only one actually following the rules to the letter.


----------



## SeanLaurence

Cookiegal said:


> You may be right but almost everyone I see of my neighbours and friends are doing at least one thing that goes against the rules yet they think they're complying. I feel like I'm the only one actually following the rules to the letter.


When I am out shopping, I see everyone wearing masks. very few open noses.
Out visiting customers, I can see people take off masks in their private offices and put them on if someone comes in to talk.
I find it odd that people will wear masks when walking around outdoors though. 
The rules are meant to be followed by most people, most of the time. If everyone followed them to the letter the pandemic would be over rather quickly. 
In New Zealand, during the big lockdown a year ago, people were forbidden to go to the beach. This isn't because they would infect someone at the beach, rather, it signalled to everyone that the lockdown was serious and it stopped all unnecessary trips.


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> You may be right but almost everyone I see of my neighbours and friends are doing at least one thing that goes against the rules yet they think they're complying. I feel like I'm the only one actually following the rules to the letter.


I have a similar feeling.
In stores, I see more and more people, wearing masks, beginning to ignore that 6' personal space.
And I've had several friends criticize me for not wanting to go eat out at a local restaurant.

I've gotten my ticket for Covid shots, but haven't been able to get an appointment yet.


----------



## Cookiegal

We have a curfew in place from 8:00 p.m. to 5:00 a.m. yet my neighbour walks to another neighbour's house pretty much every evening for a visit.

We aren't supposed to have visitors (exception: a person living alone is allowed a visit from one person only) yet another neighbour's son and grandchildren come up every weekend and stay with them so they can go skiing. The government doesn't even want anyone over 65 minding their grandchildren as it's too risky.

Same here Johnny and some people ignore the arrows in the grocery store and go any way they want and they get indigant if you point out they're going the wrong way.

The government doesn't want people to do any non-essential travelling yet 170,000 people returned to Canada from abroad in December alone.

Another neighbour asked me to stop by for coffee sometime but I'm not allowed to do that if I follow the rules correctly.

Other people I know had a New Years Eve get together at a friend's house.

I could go on and on. That's why I say most because I have a harder time finding people like me who aren't breaking any of the rules.


----------



## Couriant

I feel like I need Cartman's Social Distancing stick when I am outside sometimes... haha


----------



## RT

Going to the "big" grocery store was an ordeal!
All employees were  l and masked but too many other folks...
One guy wore a mask, but had it pulled down below his nose.
A young mother with baby in the cart were unmasked... and making a point here, the child was sniffling and woman was coughing, and I don't mean just clearing her throat  

Felt like I needed a Level Five Evac Team...
Left without half my shopping list.


----------



## SeanLaurence

Cookiegal said:


> We have a curfew in place from 8:00 p.m. to 5:00 a.m. yet my neighbour walks to another neighbour's house pretty much every evening for a visit.
> 
> We aren't supposed to have visitors (exception: a person living alone is allowed a visit from one person only) yet another neighbour's son and grandchildren come up every weekend and stay with them so they can go skiing. The government doesn't even want anyone over 65 minding their grandchildren as it's too risky.
> 
> Same here Johnny and some people ignore the arrows in the grocery store and go any way they want and they get indigant if you point out they're going the wrong way.
> 
> The government doesn't want people to do any non-essential travelling yet 170,000 people returned to Canada from abroad in December alone.
> 
> Another neighbour asked me to stop by for coffee sometime but I'm not allowed to do that if I follow the rules correctly.
> 
> Other people I know had a New Years Eve get together at a friend's house.
> 
> I could go on and on. That's why I say most because I have a harder time finding people like me who aren't breaking any of the rules.


I can get behind everything you detailed here Karen. 170,000? Wow. I blame Trudeau for not shutting the borders down hard. This is the most egregious of the behaviors IMO.

I am going to disagree with you again though - I think the grocery store arrows are silly. I have not seen any science to suggest that it is useful, and I suspect that passing someone head on is "safer" than following someone. 
That being said, I do prefer my local 1km walk around Como Lake with everyone walking the same direction.


----------



## SeanLaurence

RT said:


> Going to the "big" grocery store was an ordeal!
> All employees were  l and masked but too many other folks...
> One guy wore a mask, but had it pulled down below his nose.
> A young mother with baby in the cart were unmasked... and making a point here, the child was sniffling and woman was coughing, and I don't mean just clearing her throat
> 
> Felt like I needed a Level Five Evac Team...
> Left without half my shopping list.


Yikes! I would be giving that coughing woman a wide berth. Are the cashiers all behind plexiglass?
Our "Superstore" has a policy that everyone wears a mask, and there is a bored security guard (no gun) at the front door counting to ensure the store does not exceed the mandated capacity. 
Last spring I had to wait in a long line outside to get in, and another to check out. Trick is to not be there a busy time. It was so surreal back then.


----------



## Johnny b

SeanLaurence said:


> .................I think the grocery store arrows are silly. I have not seen any science to suggest that it is useful, and I suspect that passing someone head on is "safer" than following someone.
> ................


From observation, it helps avoid bunching up when multiple carts stop at the same general location.
I usually go shopping early in the morning about 7:30 or so to avoid any crowding later in the day.


----------



## RT

yeah, used to be the cart just held and protected your items...
now the only place with a 'safe' cart is the hardware store when you have a couple of 12 foot boards there, on a dolly.
And all you wanted was a pack of screws and a light bulb


----------



## Johnny b

The last time I was at Lowes, I noticed a greater percentage of customers not wearing masks than, say, at Walmart.
A different culture of customers?


----------



## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> The last time I was at Lowes, I noticed a greater percentage of customers not wearing masks than, say, at Walmart.
> A different culture of customers?


Home Depot was the same... last 2 times I went, the first time no one including the workers expect a couple of eldery customers were wearing masks... then not too long ago all staff was but still a limited amount of customers were. Haven't been back since.


----------



## Johnny b

I finally got an appointment for my first Covid-19 shot.

I got to say, the State of Ohio website was absolutely no help at all.
More of a runaround chasing one link after another and too often coming to dead ends.
While pages opened, the information was seldom there as referred to, and sometimes a different topic was the focus.
A real frustration.

Because of allergies, I wanted the shot at a hospital clinic. 
Searching through several hospital networks, I found an opening in several days and grabbed it this morning.


----------



## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> I finally got an appointment for my first Covid-19 shot.
> 
> I got to say, the State of Ohio website was absolutely no help at all.
> More of a runaround chasing one link after another and too often coming to dead ends.
> While pages opened, the information was seldom there as referred to, and sometimes a different topic was the focus.
> A real frustration.
> 
> Because of allergies, I wanted the shot at a hospital clinic.
> Searching through several hospital networks, I found an opening in several days and grabbed it this morning.


Sounds like they are working on the same model Phoenix/AZ did... they had no clue on what's going on... plus allowed others to 'jump the queue'...


----------



## dotty999

Do you have to pay for the shot? We don't in the UK


----------



## Couriant

dotty999 said:


> Do you have to pay for the shot? We don't in the UK


Not out of pocket... I needed to add my insurance to the form but so far no costs.


----------



## Johnny b

dotty999 said:


> Do you have to pay for the shot? We don't in the UK


Medicare covers mine.
It's my understanding all shots are to be free.


----------



## SeanLaurence

Headlines in Vancouver BC today have the homeless substance abusers being offered $5.00 as an incentive to get vaccinated.
https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/downtown-eastside-5-dollars-covid-19-vaccine


----------



## Johnny b

A collection of Covid-19 data, from vaccine distribution to variant spread.

https://www.usatoday.com/in-depth/g...-been-given-in-us-how-many-people/6599531002/


----------



## Johnny b

Some good news. :up:

* Three vaccines. Increased manufacturing. How US will have enough COVID-19 vaccine for every US adult in May - or even sooner. *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ine-joe-biden-promise-coronavirus/6896798002/


----------



## Gr3iz

Got my 1st shot this afternoon. I got the Pfizer-Biontech formula. 2nd shot in 3 weeks.

They had the process down to an art form! Less than :30 from in the door to out the door, and that included some paperwork and a :15 observation period after!


----------



## Johnny b

I get my first shot this afternoon.
My sister got her second yesterday.
She lives within walking distance of me, but on the other side of a county line.


----------



## Johnny b

Some 'not good' news:

* More COVID-19 variants emerge closer to home: What to know about the ones discovered in Brazil, New York, California *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...azil-new-york-california-variants/6884525002/


----------



## Johnny b

* In Oregon, Scientists Find a Virus Variant With a Worrying Mutation *
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/05/health/virus-oregon-variant.html



> Scientists in Oregon have spotted a homegrown version of a fast-spreading variant of the coronavirus that first surfaced in Britain - but now combined with a mutation that may make the variant less susceptible to vaccines.


----------



## Johnny b

Some good news for those that got the Pfizer vaccine:

* Pfizer vaccine able to neutralize Brazilian coronavirus strain, study finds *
https://www.timesofisrael.com/pfize...ize-brazilian-coronavirus-strain-study-finds/

Details here:
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2102017?query=featured_coronavirus


----------



## Wino

Got my first shot Mar. 10 (Pfizer). Had to drive 210 mi. round trip - SATX to Cotulla, TX and scheduled for 2nd shot on 3/31/21. I'd like to relate the tale, but I'd get banned from TSG if I unloaded on Texas - place is like a 3rd world nation run by crack heads.🤬


----------



## Johnny b

These are still strange times, Wayne.
From local press, Ohio is about to be flooded with Covid-19 doses but it's estimated that there's a 30% rejection for taking the shots.
In our state legislature, there seems a movement to take away much of the Governor's ability to address pandemics/epidemics with emergency orders.
While Dewine supported Trump in the past, he's despised by the state GOP for the pragmatism used to save us from the worst of Covid.

I get my second shot on 3/31/21 also 
But I drive less than 10 miles round trip to get it.

Stay well


----------



## Johnny b

* Pfizer Will Test a Pill to Kill the Covid-19 Virus *
https://www.barrons.com/articles/pf...-the-covid-19-virus-51616517725?siteid=yhoof2



> Pfizer has started a Phase 1 trial of a pill that could foil the Covid-19 virus, the company said Tuesday.
> 
> The experimental drug inhibits enzymes essential to the replication of the SARS-CoV-2 virus; many successful antiviral drugs against HIV and hepatitis C work the same way.
> 
> If clinical trials prove the Pfizer antiviral safe and effective, the pill could be given at the first sign of infection, said the company's chief scientific officer, Mikael Dolsten, in the announcement.


----------



## 2twenty2

Covid19 vaccinations percentage by country


----------



## Cookiegal

Canada is really lagging behind and now with the latest news on AstraZeneca for sure that's going to set us back even more. They aren't giving it to anyone under 55 and most over 55 won't want it.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> *Canada is really lagging behind* and now with the latest news on AstraZeneca for sure that's going to set us back even more. They aren't giving it to anyone under 55 and most over 55 won't want it.


It's very embarrassing that we are lagging so far behind


----------



## Wino

I was surprised Canada not much further ahead of Mexico. What's up with youse guys?? USA surrounded by sick incompetents. That's what happens when nations suck up to an orange psychopath.


----------



## Cookiegal

Wino said:


> What's up with youse guys?


We never had the capability to manufacture vaccines and have to rely on other countries sending them to us when they want to (understandably) keep them for their own populations.

There is now one that is supposed to start manufacturing here but they won't even begin to produce any until the fall of this year.

The U.S. is "lending" us 1,500,000 AstraZeneca (we have to pay them back) because they haven't even approved it yet for their own use. But now it will be hard to get people to take it.


----------



## Johnny b

My sympathies go out to you neighbors to the north.

We may have more vaccine, but there is a too common absence of common sense.

Stay well.


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> My sympathies go out to you neighbors to the north.


Thanks Johnny. I got my first shot this morning and it was Pfizer, thank goodness.


----------



## Wino

I get my 2nd Pfizer shot tomorrow - got a 210 mi. round trip to get it. Hope the drive isn't wild goose chase and actually get that which was promised when I got 1st shot 3 weeks ago. Texas is so screwed up by idiots running the state, not sure what will happen tomorrow.


----------



## Cookiegal

You're lucky to get it after three weeks. Here they decided to stretch it out to 16 weeks so they can get more people vaccinated with a first dose.


----------



## Gr3iz

3 weeks here in Tenn., too. Got my 2nd last Thu.


----------



## dotty999

I've had my first dose but have to wait several weeks before I have the next


----------



## 2twenty2

The Pandemic's Wrongest Man
In a crowded field of wrongness, one person stands out: Alex Berenson.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/04/pandemics-wrongest-man/618475/


----------



## 2twenty2

Where I live it appears that we are going into our third lockdown!


----------



## Cookiegal

Quebec has a better vaccination rate than Canada, we are currently at nearly 17%.

But we are also on the verge of another complete lockdown. For now they`ve done it to certain regions that are more problematic but it will depend on how things play out in the coming days.

There was a gym in Quebec that wasn`t following the directives and that resulted in several patrons and employees getting infected and then causing outbreaks in 20 places of business. The total is up to 168 right now just from that and continues to grow. 

Plus it`s now the UK variant that is running rampant.


----------



## 2twenty2

Almost third of UK Covid-19 hospital patients readmitted within four months

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...spital-patients-readmitted-within-four-months


----------



## 2twenty2

Reported side effects following COVID-19 vaccination in *Canada*

https://health-infobase.canada.ca/covid-19/vaccine-safety/


----------



## Johnny b

2twenty2 said:


> Reported side effects following COVID-19 vaccination in *Canada*
> 
> https://health-infobase.canada.ca/covid-19/vaccine-safety/


I don't see any data at the link.
I allowed all javascript, turned off Privacy Badger and disabled HTTPS-only mode.

What was I missing?


----------



## Gr3iz

I had to allow just about everything (in NoScript) before I saw any numbers ...


----------



## Johnny b

I went back and double checked my settings.

In Privacy Badger, allowing the tracker ajax.googleapis.com made the site work for me.


----------



## 2twenty2

Stay at home orders starting tomorrow in my area. Been designated as a hot zone but other cities located in my area have higher infections but not designated as hot zones???????


----------



## Wino

I'm convince Canadian's are the cause of an uptick in CV19 cases in Michigan !!


----------



## 2twenty2

Wino said:


> I'm convince Canadian's are the cause of an uptick in CV19 cases in Michigan !!


----------



## 2twenty2

Got my first covid-19 shot today. Pfizer.  Next one suppose to be in June.


----------



## Cookiegal

So due to new restrictions in place to try to control the spread of the virus Montreal and Laval had the curfew that was previously at 9:30 p.m. put to 8:00 p.m. starting last night to try to prevent people from gathering and having parties, etc.

In protest, rioters broke windows, set fires and caused a lot of damage to businesses like stores and restaurants that have already been hit hard by the pandemic. 

If I hadn't have already lost faith in humanity this would have done it for me but that shipped sailed a long time ago.


----------



## Wino

Cookie, as Walt Kelly's Pogo stated: " _We have met the enemy, and they are us_ "!


----------



## Cookiegal

Seriously, at times I think there are more bad people in the world than good.


----------



## Couriant

I think the term is uneducated... a lot of people just don't understand how it (the virus) works and why we need these protections.


----------



## Cookiegal

Couriant said:


> a lot of people just don't understand how it (the virus) works and why we need these protections.


I think it's more than uneducation James. Lack of eductation doesn't drive someone to destroy property. There has to be something else going on.


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> Seriously, at times I think there are more bad people in the world than good.


I've felt this way for quite a while.


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> I think it's more than uneducation James. Lack of eductation doesn't drive someone to destroy property. There has to be something else going on.


------>the rationale......"It's someone else's fault, teach them a lesson."


----------



## dotty999

Our town has finally opened up completely! It was so nice to see lots of of people sitting out in the sunshine,children playing together, such a welcome sight!


----------



## Cookiegal

You guys are almost all vaccinated. So lucky. 

Canada is getting better, we`re up to 21.59% who've had their first dose and here in Quebec we're up to 23.5%.


----------



## dotty999

Patiently awaiting my second jab!


----------



## Brigham

I have had my second dose several weeks ago. My wife, who is considerably younger than me, gets her's this Friday.


----------



## Johnny b

* It's too late for vaccines to save Michigan, CDC director explains *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...cines-to-save-michigan-cdc-director-explains/



> Highly effective COVID-19 vaccines are simply too slow to stop surges like the one underway in Michigan, Rochelle Walensky, director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, said Monday.
> 
> The state has seen a 400 percent spike in cases since March 5, when state officials eased restrictions on residential gatherings and occupancy limits for bars, restaurants, venues, and stores. Since then, the highly transmissible B.1.1.7 coronavirus variant has also increased in prevalence. Now, the state's seven-day average for new daily cases is over 7,377, and hospitals are filling up.


A lack of common sense.

A long term friend of mine suffered from Covid-19 early in the pandemic.
He's recently been through heart surgery for damage done by covid and is going back in today for a less invasive operation also caused by Covid-19.

I'd always requested he wear a mask when he visited.
It irked him but he complied.
A little over a month ago, he told me he'd had his first shot of the Pfizer vaccine when we discussed difficulty in getting appointments.
Yesterday, I asked if he'd had his second shot, yet.
He informed me he had no intention of getting the shots because of negative reactions, claiming potential DNA damage and strange 'growths' from it.

He's now in denial that his heart problems were associated with Covid-19 and claims it's safe to be out in the public with out a mask.

Some friend.


----------



## 2twenty2

Well along with the lock down and stay at home orders already in place, it looks like a curfew may be coming where I am.


----------



## Cookiegal

2twenty2 said:


> Well along with the lock down and stay at home orders already in place, it looks like a curfew may be coming where I am.


Welcome to the club. But it doesn't change anything for me as I don't go out after supper.


----------



## dotty999

I go out every day so life feels pretty normal as normal goes under the circumstances


----------



## Johnny b

Things are a bit edgy in Ohio with next door Michigan experiencing a rapid infection rate.

Still too many people not taking masks and social distancing seriously.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> Welcome to the club. But it doesn't change anything for me as I don't go out after supper.


Its going to be a big relief when this mess is all over with. I haven't gone out for dinner in over a year when I use to go out about once a week. The only places I've been is the pharmacy, post office, doctor and groceries.


----------



## Johnny b

2twenty2 said:


> Its going to be a big relief when this mess is all over with. I haven't gone out for dinner in over a year when I use to go out about once a week. The only places I've been is the pharmacy, post office, doctor and groceries.


Pretty much the same here.
I did go to the library about a week ago. Not many people there but I didn't feel comfortable.
Sometimes I get in my car or on my motorcycle and go for an hour ride in the countryside, but the gas station is about my only intended destination and it's not often I need the gas.

I am outside a lot now that the weather is improving.
I have a 3 acre lot that's wooded on 2 sides and needs a lot of cleanup.
I had a crew take out the big trees last summer but left the small stuff and brush for myself. Good exercise.
I used to put it off, now I see it as a goal.


----------



## 2twenty2

Johnny b said:


> Pretty much the same here.
> I did go to the library about a week ago. Not many people there but I didn't feel comfortable.
> Sometimes I get in my car or on my motorcycle and go for an hour ride in the countryside, but the gas station is about my only intended destination and it's not often I need the gas.
> 
> *I am outside a lot now that the weather is improving.
> I have a 3 acre lot that's wooded on 2 sides and needs a lot of cleanup.
> I had a crew take out the big trees last summer but left the small stuff and brush for myself. Good exercise.
> I used to put it off, now I see it as a goal.*


 I go outside for a walk but I don't venture too far.


----------



## Cookiegal

2twenty2 said:


> Its going to be a big relief when this mess is all over with. I haven't gone out for dinner in over a year when I use to go out about once a week. The only places I've been is the pharmacy, post office, doctor and groceries.


My thing was going out for lunch and used to do that twice a week with friends. A local restaurant has a great breakfast and I would have that for lunch most of the time. I really do miss that. The rest is pretty much the same as you.

Yesterday I had to go and get my Spring car maintenance done (oil change and tire change) and it wouldn't have been too bad but they said I should also do a wheel alignment which added more time so I sat there for three hours with a mask and distanced of course but I didn't feel that comfortable. Uusally I walk around outside while waiting but it was pouring rain.


----------



## Cookiegal

At the grocery store this morning I had to ask three peopel to turn around because they were going against the arrows you're supposed to follow.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> At the grocery store this morning I had to ask three peopel to turn around *because they were going against the arrows you're supposed to follow*.


Not just the customers doing it but the some of the employees too and not only that but also not distancing either.


----------



## Johnny b

The floor arrows at my local Walmart were removed before the first of the year.
I seldom go into Krogers and when I do it's just for the pharmacy, so I don't remember seeing any. 
There are still floor markers for social distancing, though.

I shop early in the morning hours, just after Walmart opens. 7 am.
Usually less than a dozen or so customers there that early.


----------



## Cookiegal

2twenty2 said:


> Not just the customers doing it but the some of the employees too


Yeah, there's this large aisle that's split in two with stuff stacked up down the middle so you have to go down one side and up the other. Well I ran into an employee who had a large wagon stocking shelves and he wouldn't move so I had no choice but to duck through the stuff in the middle to go to the other side and against the arrows for a short bit until I could cross back to the proper side or else I would have had to go all the way back down again and avoid the other side completely. He said that was fine and there weren't many people in the store at that hour.


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> The floor arrows at my local Walmart were removed before the first of the year.


I haven't been to Walmart since the beginning of the pandemic but there isn't one that close to my place anyway. It's a 45 minute drive. I just didn't want to take the chance.

One pharmacy removed the arrows but not the other and they only have the distancing markers where you have to wait at the cash. The other day a woman was behind me looking at her phone and she was coming right up to me. I had to ask her to stop and stay behind the line. She apologized. I hate having to do that but geez they should know better by now.


----------



## 2twenty2

My local walmart - Arrows in the pharmacy section, grocery section and electronics section *but none in clothing, toys, hardware/motive, housewares, books etc! *


----------



## 2twenty2

99.992% of fully vaccinated people have dodged COVID, CDC data shows
No vaccine is 100% effective. But the COVID vaccines seem pretty darn good.

https://arstechnica.com/science/202...ated-people-have-dodged-covid-cdc-data-shows/


----------



## Cookiegal

So Ontario and Quebec are closing their borders to each other except for essential travel.

The situation in Ontario is out of control right now with more infections than in the previous two waves. 

There are some hot spots in Quebec but overall it's not as bad as the second wave for now.


----------



## Johnny b

* More J&J troubles: Vaccine manufacturing halted and more possible clot cases *

https://arstechnica.com/science/202...acturing-halted-and-more-possible-clot-cases/


----------



## Johnny b

* U.S. will boost 'Do Not Travel' advisories to 80% of world *

https://www.reuters.com/business/he...-travel-advisory-state-department-2021-04-19/



> The U.S. State Department said on Monday it will boost its "Do Not Travel" guidance to about 80% of countries worldwide, citing "unprecedented risk to travelers" from the COVID-19 pandemic.


----------



## Johnny b

* Is herd immunity to COVID-19 possible? Experts increasingly say no. *

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...le-but-vaccines-can-control-covid/7139419002/

This stands out:



> What Fauci doesn't explicitly state, but others do, is that with about a quarter of Americans saying they might not want to be immunized, herd immunity is simply not an attainable goal.
> 
> "It's theoretically possible but we as a society have rejected that," said Dr. Gregory Poland, director of the Mayo Clinic's Vaccine Research Group. "There is no eradication at this point, it's off the table. The only thing we can talk about is control."


----------



## Johnny b

An interesting article on misconceptions:

* No, vaccine side effects don't tell you how well your immune system will protect you from COVID-19 *
https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-04-vaccine-side-effects-dont-immune.html


----------



## dotty999

I get my second jab on Friday!


----------



## Gr3iz

Let's hope it's uneventful!


----------



## Professionalgirl

Johnny b said:


> The floor arrows at my local Walmart were removed before the first of the year.
> I seldom go into Krogers and when I do it's just for the pharmacy, so I don't remember seeing any.
> There are still floor markers for social distancing, though.
> 
> I shop early in the morning hours, just after Walmart opens. 7 am.
> Usually less than a dozen or so customers there that early.


Oh Boy Johnny, I am so angry with Walmart shoppers right now! I had the most horrific experience with the lack of social distancing and I was literally jam packed in an isle with people beside me, behind me and IN front of me! I was literally trapped with other shoppers that were less than six feet away! Thankfully I am less susceptible to the virus because of my blood type! O+.


----------



## Professionalgirl

I also in addition to this want to point out stupid behavior and a lack of concern regarding my niece who just had her sweet 16 Birthday! I was infuriated that she visited friends while the case count in her area was critical and out of control with a lack of social distancing and no mask! She is not vaccinated. Her mother was recently fully vaccinated with Pfizer. Thankfully she may have some immunity but Pfizer does not protect against the most common variant B.1.1.7 UK strain which is the most prevalent and dominating strain! One of my niece's friends told her that her grandmother tested positive for covid-19! My sister since had her daughter tested and the results were negative. What a relief to know!!

My mom's companion visited his daughter's with cold symptoms and he had close contact that included a hug. My mom's companion visited his daughters without a mask and is also fully vaccinated with Pfizer. My mom's companion's daughter and his daughter's husband both tested positive for Covid-19 and my mom's companion was left unaffected by his daughter's recent covid-19 infection. Pfizer must truly work as promised! Yay! Thumb's up for Pfizer!! 

If the risk level is moderate or above it is not safe to mingle with others!, especially without a mask or social distancing! You shouldn't even visit someone during the low risk levels because the virus still exist within the area. The area I reside in is now in the moderate risk zone and my daughter's area increased to the moderate risk zone but decreased back to the low risk level zone. My son's area risk level zone is still high and increasing!


----------



## Johnny b

Professionalgirl said:


> .................
> 
> ............................... Pfizer does not protect against the most common variant B.1.1.7 UK strain which is the most prevalent and dominating strain!
> 
> ...............


Please link to your source. Thanks 
I've seen articles that claim the Pfizer is effective against B1.1.7, but less so against B1.351

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/pfizer-jab-may-not-be-as-potent-against-b-1-351-variant


> *The research suggests that the second dose of the Pfizer vaccine provides a major boost to protection against both new variants.*


https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/15/well/live/covid-variants-vaccine.html



> All of the major vaccines in use - Pfizer-BioNTech, Moderna, Johnson & Johnson, AstraZeneca, Sputnik and Novavax - have been shown to be effective against B.1.1.7.


----------



## Cookiegal

Professionalgirl said:


> but Pfizer does not protect against the most common variant B.1.1.7 UK strain which is the most prevalent and dominating strain!


Sorry but this is not true. While the efficacy seems to be slightly reduced somewhat it is still quite effective against the UK variant.


----------



## Cookiegal

I'll just say that even though this is the thread in Random and not the one in Controversial Topics where more evidence is required, you can't just make sweeping statements saying that something is 100% useless without some basis of confirmation. We don't want people all of a sudden being afraid to get the Pfizer vaccine because of something they've read here, especially since the UK variant is the most prevalent one currently.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> Sorry but this is not true. While the efficacy seems to be slightly reduced somewhat it is still quite effective against the UK variant.


I know. That's what I read on the PA Health department page. My mom's companion's daughter must have had a different variant that was covered under the Pfizer vaccine because he was exposed but did not contract the virus from her.


----------



## Cookiegal

Professionalgirl said:


> That's what I read on the PA Health department page


Can you post a link to what you read please Tina?

As I'm sure you're aware, none of the vaccines ar 100% effective so you can still get the virus but they should prevent serious illness and death.


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> Can you post a link to what you read please Tina?
> 
> As I'm sure you're aware, not of the vaccines ar 100% effective so you can still get the virus but they should prevent serious illness and death.


Hi Karen. I am not sure I can locate that link again. However, I do have evidence by the CDC that it is 95% affective. You can still get sick if your exposed to the latest variant because Pfizer does not protect against the new variant, which leaves me puzzled as to why my mom's companion did not get sick after he was exposed. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/Pfizer-BioNTech.html

My mom's companion was definitely exposed to his daughter who was infected with the virus but did not contract the virus despite his close contact with her. His daughter was tested for the virus and the test was positive. How did he escape the virus when he can still get sick after exposure even when fully vaccinated with Pfizer?


----------



## Johnny b

Professionalgirl said:


> ...............
> 
> You can still get sick if your exposed to the latest variant because Pfizer does not protect against the new variant, which leaves me puzzled as to why my mom's companion did not get sick after he was exposed. ...............
> 
> .....


Which new variant are you referring to?


----------



## Johnny b

* Fact check: CDC recommends masks in most cases even after COVID-19 vaccine *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...sks-most-cases-even-after-vaccine/7300967002/

IMO, mostly common sense, but needs to be repeated often.


----------



## 2twenty2

Quebec confirms first case of B.1.617 variant, in the Haute-Mauricie region

https://torontosun.com/news/local-n...gion/wcm/fd898c68-e489-4707-a6a2-3dc5bfdd6c81


----------



## Johnny b

2twenty2 said:


> Quebec confirms first case of B.1.617 variant, in the Haute-Mauricie region
> 
> https://torontosun.com/news/local-n...gion/wcm/fd898c68-e489-4707-a6a2-3dc5bfdd6c81


I followed your link......that looks depressing.
India looks to be in dire straits.
And now it's in North America.


----------



## Cookiegal

Professionalgirl said:


> You can still get sick if your exposed to the latest variant because Pfizer does not protect against the new variant


You need to stop making unsubstantiated claims. Yes you can still get sick because none of the vaccines can prevent illness 100% but they are still effective to some degree against the UK variant which, I'm sure, is the one you're referring to.

I found this on the PA Health Department site:



> Do the Current COVID-19 Vaccines Protect Against New Variants?
> 
> These variants are associated with an increased likelihood of spreading from one person to another, and in some cases, an increased likelihood of severe illness and death. Vaccine effectiveness is still being assessed, but early data indicates that the current COVID-19 vaccines may be less effective in preventing someone from getting infected with a variant of COVID-19, but that vaccines still provide protection against severe disease, hospitalization, and death. The presence of variant strains circulating in Pennsylvania should not stop you from getting the COVID-19 vaccine.


The fact that your Mom's companion didn't get Covid-19 after being in close contact with his infected daughter doesn't mean she didn't have the UK variant. "Less effective" doesn't mean not effective at all.


----------



## Johnny b

There appears to be some worry over resistance in Ohio, to getting vaccinated.

* Ohio sees 'significant decline' in COVID vaccine doses administered, DeWine says *
https://www.daytondailynews.com/loc...us-status-in-ohio/PH2JWF3TVBBQXNIQT5JG7HIPUI/



> "There's no doubt our herd or population is more and more protected as a result of vaccines, but until we get a lot more vaccines in people's arms, the unvaccinated are quite simply playing a COVID lottery," said ODH Chief Medical Officer Bruce Vanderhoff. "And it's a lottery whose consequences are pretty stark."
> 
> "We're not in this separately," the governor said. "The sad truth is that when someone makes a decision not get vaccinated and they end up getting [COVID], they very well may be giving it to other people, and other people who are very vulnerable."


From 'Right to Life' logic, when does one person's claims of liberty infringement supersede another person's right to live? ( rhetorical question )


----------



## Professionalgirl

Cookiegal said:


> You need to stop making unsubstantiated claims. Yes you can still get sick because none fo the vaccines can prevent illness 100% but they are still effective to some degree against the UK variant which, I'm sure, is the one you're referring to.
> 
> I found this on the PA Health Department site:
> 
> The fact that your Mom's companion didn't get Covid-19 after being in close contact with his infected daughter doesn't mean she didn't have the UK variant. "Less effective" doesn't mean not effective at all.


Karen, I must not be wording things correctly and it's causing you and others to misunderstand what I type. I am somewhat upset that you are accusing me of dishonesty. I read that information on the PA health department a while back before the vaccines were available for emergency use. That information may no longer be available on the site. It stated that the "Pfizer vaccine may not protect against some newer variants of Covid-19". The information was probably removed to make room for updated information. I would never intentionally misinform or mislead anyone.

Karen, you could be right when you suggested that "Just because my mom's companion did not get sick when he was exposed, does not mean his daughter did not have the B.1.1.7 UK variant." In addition to your statement, No one really knows what variant she had unless a medical scientist studies and confirms the variant type she has.

This is my last post. From now on I remain mute in this forum, including any other forum.


----------



## Cookiegal

Professionalgirl said:


> it's causing you and others to misunderstand what I type.


There's no misunderstanding on my part. You stated " _*Pfizer does not protect against the most common variant B.1.1.7 UK strain* which is the most prevalent and dominating strain_" which is simply incorrect.


Professionalgirl said:


> I am somewhat upset that you are accusing me of dishonesty


I'm not accusing you of being dishonest as I don't think it's intentional but you are posting misinformation.


Professionalgirl said:


> I read that information on the PA health department a while back before the vaccines were available for emergency use.


I couldn't find anything to that effect on their website but even if that's the case (I don't think they categorically stated that but will give you the benefit of the doubt) that was over four months ago. Why would you post information that old as fact now when much more research has been done about the virus variants and the performance of the vaccines since then? The situation is evolving rapidly with new information coming out all the time. Four months is ancient history.


Professionalgirl said:


> This is my last post. From now on I remain mute in this forum, including any other forum.


That's your choice of course.


----------



## Johnny b

Professionalgirl said:


> Karen, I must not be wording things correctly and it's causing you and others to misunderstand what I type. .......................


Just saying....anytime there are unknown variables, positioning an unproven thought as an absolute is likely to draw attention and much of it probably unwelcome especially with life and death issues.



> This is my last post. From now on I remain mute in this forum, including any other forum.


As many times I've been wrong giving computer advice, with logic like that, I'd have been gone from TSG long ago. 

You are a member in good standing.
And you've never been banned. 

If you want to stay, stay 
If you'd like to debate, well there is a forum for that , too.
But I caution you about the use of absolutes lol!


----------



## Johnny b

Getting back to topic.
About booster shots.

* 'We are still dealing with the unknown' Doctor on Covid-19 *
https://finance.yahoo.com/video/still-dealing-unknown-doctor-covid-211935750.html

*Dr. Adrian Burrowes, Family Medicine Phy. & CFP Physicians Group CEO*


> The data is showing that most people who are vaccinated have at least six months' worth of immunity, but it is possible, highly possible that you may need a booster going forward and maybe even an annual shot going forward as well.
> 
> ....
> Yeah, so there's so much unknown with these vaccines that I would be highly against people trying to mix vaccines. We have very good vaccines out right now, especially with Pfizer and Moderna.


I had the Pfizer shots.


----------



## valis

wait....Geology???


----------



## Johnny b

valis said:


> wait....Geology???


Yep


----------



## Cookiegal

Professionalgirl,

I've deleted some of your posts and issued a formal warning on your profile with loss of 3 points for being argumentative and discruptive to the site. I think if you read back through the posts on this issue that remain you will see that you have misinterpreted the intentions of myself and Johnny b. For my part, I can't sit back and watch when misinformation is posted as fact that could change people's minds about a vaccine. Some people will read statements such as the one you made about the Pfizer vaccine and believe it and then spread that around. TSG is not social media but we do have a large readership and certainly don't want to be a negative influence, especially on anything so important.

Johnny b, on the other hand, was actually being nice to you and you misunderstood his comment. He was talking about mistakes he had made (not you) and was trying to convince you to stay. That certainly didn't deserve the attack from you that followed.

Your argumentative and disruptive behaviour has earned you a temporary 3-day banning of your account. If you decide to return after that time then I expect you to read things more carefully and if you have an issue with something a member has posted use the Report button and the Moderators will decide if any action is warranted.


----------



## 2twenty2

*Japan Declares 3rd State Of Emergency, 3 Months Ahead Of Olympics*

https://www.npr.org/sections/corona...state-of-emergency-3-months-ahead-of-olympics


----------



## valis

Johnny b said:


> Yep


no idea you were a dirt nerd....that's awesome.....


----------



## Cookiegal

valis said:


> no idea you were a dirt nerd


maybe just a dirty nerd.  🤪


----------



## Wino

Cookiegal said:


> maybe just a *dirty nerd* .  🤪


That would be me !


----------



## Johnny b

valis said:


> no idea you were a dirt nerd....that's awesome.....


LOL!

However, I was never a practicing geologist.
My life took a detour after graduating the university......I did other stuff 

The evolutionary/creationist debates were my first real shocker at a debate forum.
I couldn't believe ( ! ) some of the claims 
On a positive, I ran into a lot of new geological info that renewed my interests in geology 
And it dovetailed into climate change.


----------



## valis

Johnny b said:


> LOL!
> 
> However, I was never a practicing geologist.
> My life took a detour after graduating the university......I did other stuff
> 
> The evolutionary/creationist debates were my first real shocker at a debate forum.
> I couldn't believe ( ! ) some of the claims
> On a positive, I ran into a lot of new geological info that renewed my interests in geology
> And it dovetailed into climate change.


still....cool as a bad sin to find out something about someone you've known for going on 20 years and had NO idea about.....deeply impressed hondo, they don't give out BS's to idjits. I am proof of that.


----------



## Johnny b

valis said:


> still....cool as a bad sin to find out something about someone you've known for going on 20 years and had NO idea about.....deeply impressed hondo, they don't give out BS's to idjits. I am proof of that.


My sister is the one that made the big leap into the sciences.
She retired several years ago from Pfizer as a senior scientist. 
A PhD in Biochemistry. Masters in both Biology and Chemistry
We talk frequently about the topic of this thread and she helps me understand some of the finer points.......for me the understanding of which has a short shelf life lol!


----------



## valis

Good god. A family of braniacs.

My kid can play the clarinet.


----------



## Johnny b

Brainiac?

LOL!

If you remember, I had a lump the size of my fist removed from my noggin and it made no difference 

( I can still fake it pretty good  )


----------



## valis

Well it obviously wasnt the 'dont be disagreeable' part...lol...


----------



## valis

Enough...back to tje subject


----------



## 2twenty2

*CDC panel recommends U.S. resume use of J&J Covid vaccine, saying benefits outweigh risks*

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/04/23/jj-...l-recommends-resuming-use-of-jj-vaccine-.html


----------



## Johnny b

This is sure to pop up with some people claiming it's a reason to ignore social distancing and the wearing of masks.
I take this as bad journalism. And it makes me angry.

* MIT study challenges indoor social distancing, finds 'no difference between 6 feet and 60 feet' *
https://news.yahoo.com/mit-study-challenges-indoor-social-161347738.html



> MIT professors Martin Bazant and John Bush found that people who maintain six feet of distance indoors are no more protected than if they were 60 feet apart - even when wearing a mask.


The implication being that wearing a mask, made no difference in transmission.
This is what Bazant and Bush presented in their paper concerning masks:

* A guideline to limit indoor airborne transmission of COVID-19 *
https://www.pnas.org/content/118/17/e2018995118#disp-formula-6


> Our theoretical model quantifies the extent to which transmission risk is reduced in large rooms with high air exchange rates, increased for more vigorous respiratory activities, *and dramatically reduced by the use of face masks.*
> 
> ...........
> We here build on models of airborne disease transmission in order to derive an indoor safety guideline that would impose an upper bound on the "cumulative exposure time," the product of the number of occupants and their time in an enclosed space. *We demonstrate how this bound depends on the rates of ventilation and air filtration, dimensions of the room, breathing rate, respiratory activity and face mask use of its occupants, and infectiousness of the respiratory aerosols.*
> 
> ...........
> Particular consideration is given to respiratory jets,* which may substantially elevate risk when face masks are not worn.*


Common sense..........avoid small rooms populated with a lot of people and wear a mask.
You are re-breathing a lot more shared air than outside or in a mostly empty room.


----------



## Cookiegal

In Ontario, six people were injected with a saline solution that didn't contain any vaccine:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/york-region-saline-covid-19-vaccine-mackenzie-1.5993539

Thank goodness they caught it.


----------



## valis

Ive said in the past....6' in a closed environment doesnt cut it. Like the old 'smoking/non smoking' sections. Its like having a pee/non pee section in a pool. 

I am watching the Brazil and India outbreaks and gotta say....wouldnt surprise me if the US gets another one...

and good lord....a fake injection???


----------



## Couriant

valis said:


> Ive said in the past....6' in a closed environment doesnt cut it. Like the old 'smoking/non smoking' sections. Its like having a pee/non pee section in a pool.
> 
> I am watching the Brazil and India outbreaks and gotta say....wouldnt surprise me if the US gets another one...
> *
> and good lord....a fake injection???*


In all the places I would have guessed... Canada isn't one of them lol Florida maybe...

I'm sure that the US will have another outbreak because of the people still refusing to wear a mask or not vaccinate. Dr. Fauchi said we would never achieve close to herd immunity because of those people.


----------



## valis

Yuppers...the whole 'it is somebody else's problem'....


----------



## Cookiegal

Now they're talking about a possible link to inflammation of the heart in mostly young males with the Pfizer vaccine. Pfizer says they haven't seen any more instances than what would be expected in the general population but that's what they said at the beginning with the AstraZeneca vaccine:

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coron...e-who-received-pfizer-covid-19-shot-1.5401640


----------



## Couriant

Cookiegal said:


> Now they're talking about a possible link to inflammation of the heart in mostly young males with the Pfizer vaccine. Pfizer says they haven't seen any more instances than what would be expected in the general population but that's what they said at the beginning with the AstraZeneca vaccine:
> 
> https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coron...e-who-received-pfizer-covid-19-shot-1.5401640


That's interesting news. Has there been any other cases in other countries? The article doesn't seem to imply that and only seems to be in Israel.


----------



## Cookiegal

I just heard about it this morning and so far I only see it mentioned in Israel. Here's another article:

https://globalnews.ca/news/7787723/israel-covid-heart-inflamation-pfizer/

Apparently, there have been around 600,000,000 does of Pfizer administered around the world so it would be a very insignficant number if there was to be a connection.


----------



## Cookiegal

We've also just had our first death confirmed to be related to the AstraZeneca vaccine in Quebec, a 54 year-old woman: 

For a while they weren't giving it to anyone under 55 and then just recently they decided to lower the age to 45 and over.

https://montrealgazette.com/news/lo...updates-quebec-records-xx-cases-xx-new-deaths


----------



## Johnny b

An interesting article on a potential coronavirus cure.

Nanotraps.

* Scientists design "Nanotraps" to catch, clear coronavirus *
https://www.innovations-report.com/...-design-nanotraps-to-catch-clear-coronavirus/



> Researchers at the Pritzker School of Molecular Engineering (PME) at the University of Chicago have designed a completely novel potential treatment for COVID-19: nanoparticles that capture SARS-CoV-2 viruses within the body and then use the body's own immune system to destroy it.
> 
> These "Nanotraps" attract the virus by mimicking the target cells the virus infects. When the virus binds to the Nanotraps, the traps then sequester the virus from other cells and target it for destruction by the immune system.
> 
> In theory, these Nanotraps could also be used on variants of the virus, leading to a potential new way to inhibit the virus going forward. Though the therapy remains in early stages of testing, the researchers envision it could be administered via a nasal spray as a treatment for COVID-19.


Considerable detail:

https://www.cell.com/matter/fulltex...m/retrieve/pii/S2590238521001661?showall=true


----------



## Tildy

Interesting Video

*Why you can't compare Covid-19 vaccines*


----------



## Cookiegal

Very interesting indeed.


----------



## Johnny b

Interesting.


At about 4:19....Amesh Adalja pretty much nailed it.
From a scientific/statistical pov, testing conditions and comparisons should be of a more uniform nature.

Should be, but in the midst of a global emergency, obviously tough to do when time is a factor.

I was ready to take what was offered and didn't know what my first was going to be until I signed up for an appointment.
It turned out to be Pfizer.


----------



## Johnny b

Brazil is rejecting Russia's Sputnik V vaccine.

* Brazil rejects Sputnik V vaccine, says it's tainted with replicating cold virus *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...says-its-tainted-with-replicating-cold-virus/



> Health regulators in Brazil say that doses of Russia's Sputnik V COVID-19 vaccine contain a cold-causing virus capable of replicating in human cells.
> ............
> Moreover, quality-control issues weren't the end of Anvisa's concerns. In an overall evaluation of the Russian vaccine, Brazil's regulators found its safety and efficacy were based on insufficient, limited, and sometimes faulty data and analyses.


----------



## 2twenty2

Anti-Vaxxer Hijacks QR Codes at COVID-19 Check-In Sites

https://threatpost.com/anti-vaxxer-hijacks-qr-codes-covid19/165701/


----------



## Couriant

I know that syringes looks like rockets, but why would they name their vaccines Sputnik? .. lol

And as for the QR code... thats why I don't bother with those on posters, etc. Always go to the source, no quick cuts.


----------



## Johnny b

* True US death toll over 900,000, new IHME report says.............. *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-variants-fda-mask-california-nyc/4964560001/



> The true death toll from COVID-19 across the nation is probably over 900,000, more than 50% higher than the most commonly used tallies, according to a new analysis by the Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation (IHME) at the University of Washington School of Medicine.
> 
> Data collected by Johns Hopkins University, based on deaths reported as COVID-related, put the U.S. death toll at about 580,000. The IHME data also puts the global death toll at 6.9 million, more than twice the Johns Hopkins number.


----------



## Cookiegal

Thousands of people protested in Montreal recently to protest public health restrictions and now it may have turned into a super spreader event. 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/mont...onstration-covid-19-tested-positive-1.6018867

I really wish people wouldn't have the right to protest because it's always the innocent who suffer, at least during times like these when doing so puts the health and lives of others in danger. Unfortunately, that would be a topic for CT and I just don't have the energy to pursue it. I'm just so fed up with PEOPLE.


----------



## Tildy

Cookiegal said:


> Thousands of people protested in Montreal recently to protest public health restrictions and now it may have turned into a super spreader event.
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/mont...onstration-covid-19-tested-positive-1.6018867
> 
> I really wish people wouldn't have the right to protest because it's always the innocent who suffer, at least during times like these when doing so puts the health and lives of others in danger. Unfortunately, that would be a topic for CT and I just don't have the energy to pursue it. I'm just so fed up with PEOPLE.


HEAR , HEAR !!!


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> Thousands of people protested in Montreal recently to protest public health restrictions and now it may have turned into a super spreader event.
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/mont...onstration-covid-19-tested-positive-1.6018867
> 
> I really wish people wouldn't have the right to protest because it's always the innocent who suffer, at least during times like these when doing so puts the health and lives of others in danger. Unfortunately, that would be a topic for CT and I just don't have the energy to pursue it. I'm just so fed up with PEOPLE.


I fully understand the sentiment.
But the expression of that freedom, essentially, defines the attitude of a society. For better or for worse.

That element is a topic for CT.

I go in for my 13th (as I remember) MRI tomorrow and haven't been feeling so good about the future, in general, lately.


----------



## Gr3iz

Good luck Johnny b (Goode)! ;-)


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> I go in for my 13th (as I remember) MRI tomorrow and haven't been feeling so good about the future, in general, lately.


I hope it goes well Johnny and hope for the best results.


----------



## Tildy

Sooon!!!!!! - funny and kinda sad too


----------



## flavallee

I had my first Pfizer vaccine this morning.
I go back in 3 weeks for the second dose.
So far, no side effects.


----------



## Cookiegal

flavallee said:


> I had my first Pfizer vaccine this morning.


You waited a long time Frank.


----------



## Brigham

flavallee said:


> I had my first Pfizer vaccine this morning.
> I go back in 3 weeks for the second dose.
> So far, no side effects.


Best of luck flavallee. You see how I keep my eye on you.


----------



## flavallee

Even though I don't leave home often and come in contact with strangers, I haven't procrastinated on purpose.
There's been so much changing news about the vaccine that I decided to wait until things settled down.
Now that it has, I decided it was time to get vaccinated.
The pharmacy only a few blocks from my apartment complex recently started giving the vaccine, so I signed up.


----------



## Cookiegal

flavallee said:


> I decided to wait until things settled down.


👍


----------



## Gr3iz

Finally joined the herd, eh Frank? ;-) Good for you!


----------



## valis

" Data collected by Johns Hopkins University, based on deaths reported as COVID-related, put the U.S. death toll at about 580,000. The IHME data also puts the global death toll at 6.9 million, more than twice the Johns Hopkins number. "


Johnny b said:


> I fully understand the sentiment.
> But the expression of that freedom, essentially, defines the attitude of a society. For better or for worse.
> 
> That element is a topic for CT.
> 
> I go in for my 13th (as I remember) MRI tomorrow and haven't been feeling so good about the future, in general, lately.


I disagree. The betterment of the society as a whole should be what we are aiming for, not defining free speech. Common sense here.

Hope you feel better. Whats the MRI for? You already have MORE than enough holes in your head...but seriously hope all is well.


----------



## Johnny b

Defining 'free speech' and it's limits is a necessity for 'betterment'.
How well we do it defines how durable/efficient a democracy functions.
It's important in defining our society.


As far as my MRI's go....
It was an unusually large slow growth tumor that enveloped and grew partially into blood vessel walls.
Not all of the tumor could be removed surgically, especially along those blood vessels.
Followup was with a 'gamma knife' that "trimmed off" what wasn't cut away.

Elements ( small ) of the tumor still existed in the last MRI but it hasn't grown larger since the gamma treatments.

There is a lot I haven't mentioned in the past about my condition.
A lot I'd rather not post.

I've been getting a biannual MRI checkup and probably will till either the health system fails or I do. lol.

My appointment is for 8 am this morning. 
I won't know the results till Thursday.


----------



## valis

Jesus man....hope it gets better. Let us know what comes back Thursday.


----------



## Skivvywaver

I got the J&J March 6th. I am extremely tired of the whole business. Did my vaccine work? Why am I still wearing a mask? Can I spread it? Read your paperwork. You can still catch it, you can still spread it.

I think if I were to catch it, it would be a lighter case but I am done with it. If I was born with 22,630 days to live and today is the 22,630th day. It's been nice knowing you. I am not staying away from people and locking down this summer. That crap is over.


----------



## Johnny b

Skivvywaver said:


> I got the J&J March 6th. I am extremely tired of the whole business. Did my vaccine work? Why am I still wearing a mask? Can I spread it? Read your paperwork. You can still catch it, you can still spread it.
> 
> I think if I were to catch it, it would be a lighter case but I am done with it. If I was born with 22,630 days to live and today is the 22,630th day. It's been nice knowing you. I am not staying away from people and locking down this summer. That crap is over.


Hi Scott 

aka 'Stoner' here.
About the 'paperwork'.
It's really about the odds of getting infected and then....the degree of damage done.
With the shot/s.....you have a better chance of not getting infected and then if so, the odds favor less biological damage.
About masks.....they reduce viral load transmission and allow for better results from a healthy immune system.

About lock downs. ..... IMO, using common sense with the above in place will allow a lot of normal social interactions.

IMO, Covid 19 with it's constant mutations, will persist much like the flu.
Get a booster every year and most people will be protected from the 'next' strain/variant.

Knowing you from the past, you're pretty savvy and will get along.

Take care bud


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b,

What you already shared with us was bad enough and I'm sorry to hear there's more to it than that and am sending positive vibes for the results on Thursday.


----------



## Skivvywaver

Today they are recommending a whole new set of rules. If you've had the vaccine it's good to back to "business as usual". I really didn't change anything other than to wear a mask in stores where it was required. June 2nd is when the mask mandate ends in Ohio. It's about time.


----------



## Couriant

Skivvywaver said:


> Today they are recommending a whole new set of rules. If you've had the vaccine it's good to back to "business as usual". I really didn't change anything other than to wear a mask in stores where it was required. June 2nd is when the mask mandate ends in Ohio. It's about time.


From what I heard, the CDC is suggesting that once a state hits over 70% vaccinations then masks are not required. Not sure about the social distancing plus this was from someone showing me from their phone from a few feet away so i didn't read the article.


----------



## Couriant

When You've Been Fully Vaccinated

"If you've been fully vaccinated:

You can resume activities that you did prior to the pandemic.
You can resume activities without wearing a mask or staying 6 feet apart, *except where required by federal, state, local, tribal, or territorial laws, rules, and regulations, including local business and workplace guidance*."
I guess that's what I was referring to and the article wasn't from CDC but some local site here in AZ.

Here is a reference to the 70% in PA, NJ and Philly


----------



## 2twenty2

Just 12 People Are Behind Most Vaccine Hoaxes On Social Media, Research Shows

https://www.npr.org/2021/05/13/9965...books-twitters-ability-to-curb-vaccine-hoaxes


----------



## Johnny b

* FDA In Brief: FDA Authorizes Longer Time for Refrigerator Storage of Thawed Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine Prior to Dilution, Making Vaccine More Widely Available *

https://www.fda.gov/news-events/pre...orage-thawed-pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine


----------



## Cookiegal

I just found out that the site provided by the provincial government to make appointments to be vaccinated (which is not hosted by the government) contained a vulnerability that would allow hackers to access sensitive information which includes our provincial health card number (which also shows the first three letters of our last name and the first letter of our given name and our date of birth), gender and the date and time of the appointment.

Apparently, it was discoverd by white hat hackers during a cyber security event but they claim it was never exploited and has now been plugged. Way to lose confidence in the system when they're trying to convince people to get vaccinated. Get your vaccine and lose your identity at the same time. 

It's breaking news this morning and I can't find a reference on English sources that I would normally use but there are reliable ones in French. Here's one English source I found:

https://news.in-24.com/news/30881.html


----------



## valis

Cookiegal said:


> I just found out that the site provided by the provincial government to make appointments to be vaccinated (which is not hosted by the government) contained a vulnerability that would allow hackers to access sensitive information which includes our provincial health card number (which also shows the first three letters of our last name and the first letter of our given name and our date of birth), gender and the date and time of the appointment.
> 
> Apparently, it was discoverd by white hat hackers during a cyber security event but they claim it was never exploited and has now been plugged. Way to lose confidence in the system when they're trying to convince people to get vaccinated. Get your vaccine and lose your identity at the same time.
> 
> It's breaking news this morning and I can't find a reference on English sources that I would normally use but there are reliable ones in French. Here's one English source I found:
> 
> https://news.in-24.com/news/30881.html


Yikes....not good...at least its been plugged...


----------



## Johnny b

The vaccine works well. But you do need to get the full treatment.

* Hospitals say most COVID-19 patients admitted now have not had a vaccine  *
https://www.daytondailynews.com/loc...not-had-a-vaccine/QELDNR2ZBJGOFADIX6KIWGNP6U/



> In a recent analysis of one of the largest Ohio hospital networks, Cleveland Clinic, early data shows from January to mid-April, 99% of patients admitted for COVID-19 were not fully vaccinated.


:up:


----------



## ekim68

An update from Axios...


COVID-19 cases hit lowest point in U.S. since pandemic began



> By the numbers: The U.S. averaged roughly 16,500 new cases per day over the past week, a 30% improvement over the week before. New cases declined in 43 states and held steady in the other seven.


----------



## 2twenty2

'Dawson's Creek' writer Heidi Ferrer dies after long COVID-19 battle

https://people.com/tv/dawsons-creek-writer-dies-by-suicide-after-year-long-covid-battle/


----------



## Johnny b

* They Relied on Chinese Vaccines. Now They're Battling Outbreaks. *
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/22/business/economy/china-vaccines-covid-outbreak.html

Too much to copy and paste.
IMO, worth reading it all.


----------



## 2twenty2

'Likely link' between rare heart inflammation and Pfizer, Moderna vaccines: CDC advisers

https://torontosun.com/news/world/l...tion-and-pfizer-moderna-vaccines-cdc-advisers


----------



## 2twenty2

Scientist Finds Early Virus Sequences That Had Been *Mysteriously Deleted*

https://dailyhealth-news.com/2021/0...sequences-that-had-been-mysteriously-deleted/

https://www.todayonline.com/world/s...virus-sequences-had-been-mysteriously-deleted

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com...mysteriously-deleted/articleshow/83794589.cms


----------



## Johnny b

Pfizer vaccine may not be as effective against the Delta variant.

* Pfizer vaccine protection takes a hit as Delta variant spreads, Israeli government says *

https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/06/health/israel-pfizer-efficacy-delta-variant-intl/index.html



> The Israeli government says its analysis has shown the Pfizer-BioNTech coronavirus vaccine appears to be less effective against infections caused by the Delta variant compared to other strains of Covid-19.
> In a brief statement issued on Monday, the government said that as of June 6, the vaccine provided 64% protection against infection. In May -- when the Alpha variant dominated in Israel and the Delta strain had not yet spread widely -- it found that the shot was 95.3% effective against all infections.
> The government added that the vaccine was now 93% effective in preventing severe disease and hospitalizations, compared to 97% reported in the medical journal The Lancet in May.


----------



## Wino

Any CV19 vac is better than none. It's unfortunate this nation is so full of ignoramuses'. Read couple of articles recently stating of CV19 deaths only .02% were vaccinated. The majority no vac deaths are either anti-vac, lazy, ignorant or RWN, but I repeat myself.


----------



## Johnny b

Wino said:


> Any CV19 vac is better than none. .....................


:up:

And wearing a mask in the company of others, common sense.


----------



## Tildy

This family will cheer you up


----------



## valis

BoSox/Yanks cancelled due to Covid. Several of the top players in the British Open had to withdraw. Tokyo is experiencing the highest surge in Covid in 6 months, right before the Olympics.
But yeah, lets continue to pretend it ain't there. No masks and full crowds!


----------



## Wino

Out bi-weekly shopping today - Wally, Costco, Sam's - near no one masking outside of a few employees. People are so blatantly nonchalant with few exceptions. I masked from F150, back to F150. Monday had cystoscopy - had to be masked to enter medical bldg., but once in area for procedure, no one masked at all (except myself), not even Doc. Signage said "fully vaccinated - no mask, otherwise required" - considering 35% +/- of population fully vaccinated, I suspect there were many liars/pretenders I saw this week. I'm learning to have a very huge distaste for my fellow americans (lower case as sign of purposely disrespecting stupidity).


----------



## Johnny b

* New long COVID studies warn we're still in "uncharted territory"  *
https://newatlas.com/health-wellbeing/new-study-long-covid-symptoms-coronavirus/



> With successful vaccines helping prevent hospitalizations and deaths from COVID-19 scientists are racing to understand the long-term effects of this novel disease. Dubbed "long COVID", a handful of new studies are beginning to shed light on this unusual chronic condition, highlight who is more susceptible and what kind of symptoms are most common.


Below is the study. It's a long read.

*Characterizing long COVID in an international cohort: 7 months of symptoms and their impact*
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/eclinm/article/PIIS2589-5370(21)00299-6/fulltext

excerpts:


> A significant number of patients with COVID-19 experience prolonged symptoms, known as Long COVID.
> 
> Patients with Long COVID report prolonged, multisystem involvement and significant disability. By seven months, many patients have not yet recovered (mainly from systemic and neurological/cognitive symptoms), have not returned to previous levels of work, and continue to experience significant symptom burden.
> 
> Public discourse on COVID-19 has largely centered around those with severe or fatal illness [
> [1]
> ]. However, recent studies show that a growing number of patients with initially mild COVID-19 will experience prolonged symptoms..............
> 
> Patients with Long COVID can experience relapsing-remitting symptoms[
> [7]
> ]. In this cohort, a minimum of 85.9% (84.8% to 87.0%) of respondents reported experiencing relapses


There is a lot to read of significance.
Be sure to read 
*3.6.5 Impact on work*

Under the * Discussion * header, this stands out:



> Overall, these findings suggest that the morbidity of COVID-19 illness has been greatly overlooked. Patients experience multisystem symptoms for over seven months, resulting in significant impact to their lives and livelihoods.


IMO, this will cause a strain on social services and be a negative factor on our economy.


----------



## Kapustin Yar

Are there any anti-vaxxers here? If so I'd like to know your reasoning. Did you know that your refusal to get vaccinated may cause my state to go back to Phase I and we will lose all the freedom we have gained recently. This will happen because emergency room beds will be over the 90% capacity.


----------



## Kapustin Yar

RT said:


> I agree, there are some folks around here that won't even go a local Chinese restaurant even though the folks that run them are born American of oriental decent, haven't traveled at all because they work too hard to have time off.
> 
> It's kind of silly, unless you travel or live near a major travel city, or otherwise at risk from what is known so far.
> It doesn't hurt to be cautious, but IMHO a good portion of the US population would be more in danger of the seasonal flu rather than coronavirus.


The seasonal flu isn't deadly.


----------



## Cookiegal

Kapustin Yar said:


> Are there any anti-vaxxers here? If so I'd like to know your reasoning.





Kapustin Yar said:


> The seasonal flu isn't deadly.


There are three threads ongoing regarding Covid-19 and this one is in the Random Discussion forum where such controversial discussions are not allowed. If you want to pursue that avenue there's a thread in the Controversial Topics forum that would be more suitable. 

Plus, if you do pursue it in the Controversial Topics forum, I would point out that the statement you quoted by RT was made in February 2020 which was at the very beginning of the pandemic and we didn't yet know what we were dealing with. Hardly debate material as much has changed since then.


----------



## Johnny b

Just to address 'seasonal flu'.... my late wife's elderly grand parents on her fathers side both died from 'seasonal flu' back in the early 1980's.
There are statistics every year about those kind of deaths.
But influenza is no where near as lethal as the coronavirus that causes Covid-19.
I get a flu shot every fall.


----------



## Johnny b

Being carelessness affects everyone. When Democrats do it, the result is the same.
When anyone does it, the results are the same. Covid-19 spreads.

* Delta goes to Washington, infects vaccinated Capitol staffers *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...shington-infects-vaccinated-capitol-staffers/


----------



## Kapustin Yar

Johnny b said:


> Being carelessness affects everyone. When Democrats do it, the result is the same.
> When anyone does it, the results are the same. Covid-19 spreads.
> 
> * Delta goes to Washington, infects vaccinated Capitol staffers *
> https://arstechnica.com/science/202...shington-infects-vaccinated-capitol-staffers/


I don't like it either but getting vaxed is still safer than free-balling. lol


----------



## Johnny b

IMO, I think the Texas-DC infections should be a lesson that it takes combinations of specific efforts to promote safety within large bodies of people, politicians too.
Vaccinations are the greatest positive effort with wearing a mask, social distancing and awareness of personal health definitely helpful.
And especially so as a new variant initiates what is believed to be a 4th wave of Covid-19.

I would also think this critical among government officials and employees and the medical profession. A society tends to break down as their effectiveness diminishes.


----------



## Johnny b

Some interesting info:

* Spacing Pfizer COVID shots boosts antibody levels after initial drop -study *
https://www.reuters.com/business/he...y-levels-after-initial-drop-study-2021-07-22/

* Two doses of Pfizer, AstraZeneca shots effective against Delta variant: study *
https://www.reuters.com/business/he...against-delta-variant-study-finds-2021-07-21/


----------



## Johnny b

From the Wall Street Journal:
(there is a paywall for the complete article)

* Covid-19 Pill Race Heats Up as Japanese Firm Vies With Pfizer, Merck  *
https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-...anese-firm-vies-with-pfizer-merck-11627205403



> A Japanese company has started human trials of the first once-a-day pill for Covid-19 patients, joining Pfizer Inc. and Merck & Co. in the race to find treatments for the disease.
> 
> Osaka-based Shionogi & Co., which helped develop the blockbuster cholesterol drug Crestor, said it designed its pill to attack the Covid-19 virus. It said the once-a-day dosing would be more convenient. The company said it is testing the drug and any side effects in trials that began this month and are likely to continue until next year.


linkage from above article:

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04960202
* A Study of PF-07321332/Ritonavir in Nonhospitalized High Risk Adult Participants With COVID-19 *



> Brief Summary:
> 
> The purpose of this study is to determine whether PF-07321332/ritonavir is safe and effective for the treatment of adults who are ill with COVID-19 and do not need to be in the hospital, but are at an increased risk of developing severe illness. Throughout the study period, provision will be made to allow study visits to be conducted at a participant's home or another non-clinic location if available. The total study duration is up to 24 weeks.


----------



## Johnny b

* Should you be wearing a mask again? Here's a map of the Covid hot spots subject to the CDC's new guidance *
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/28/her...t-spots-under-the-cdcs-new-mask-guidance.html



> CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky told reporters Tuesday that masks should be worn in public, indoor settings by everyone, including fully vaccinated people, in areas "with substantial and high transmission."


There is an interactive map that designates transmission rates on a county level.
My county is listed as 'substantial'.


----------



## Johnny b

* Pfizer data suggest third dose of Covid-19 vaccine 'strongly' boosts protection against Delta variant *
https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/28/health/pfizer-third-dose-data-bn/index.html

Some potentially good news:



> Among people ages 65 to 85, the Pfizer data suggest that antibody levels against the Delta variant after receiving a third dose of vaccine are greater than 11-fold than following a second dose.
> The data, which included 23 people, have not yet been peer-reviewed or published.


----------



## Johnny b

Some potentially bad news:

* Researchers are concerned about the possibility that COVID-19 might lead to dementia *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...n-infection-long-haulers-dementia/5405461001/



> With many people complaining about brain fog, attention problems and confusion after COVID-19, researchers are exploring whether infections could have long-term consequences for the brain.
> 
> Early studies are not reassuring.
> 
> In several trials made public Thursday, scientists have found changes in brain biology after hospitalization with COVID-19, problems lingering months after infection, and a link between smell loss and mental sharpness in older adults.


Even getting a mild Covid-19 infection could have a devastating impact on job opportunities, health insurance, even political appointments.... for many victims no matter what their status was before being infected.

It's time the vaccine/mask/social distancing deniers and procrastinators faced reality.
They are the majority of the next victims.


----------



## Johnny b

Be aware.

* 'The war has changed': Internal CDC document urges new messaging, warns delta infections likely more severe *
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/07/29/cdc-mask-guidance/



> The delta variant of the coronavirus appears to cause more severe illness than earlier variants and spreads as easily as chickenpox, according to an internal federal health document that argues officials must "acknowledge the war has changed."
> 
> ......................
> It cites a combination of recently obtained, still-unpublished data from outbreak investigations and outside studies showing that vaccinated individuals infected with delta may be able to transmit the virus as easily as those who are unvaccinated. Vaccinated people infected with delta have measurable viral loads similar to those who are unvaccinated and infected with the variant.


There are questions about that unpublished data. Too much to copy and paste:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/heal...a5fe48582d_story.html?itid=lk_inline_manual_9


> "I think the implications [of the data] are that people who are vaccinated, even when they're asymptomatic, can transmit the virus, which is the scientific foundation of why this recommendation is being made," Anthony S. Fauci, President Biden's chief medical adviser, said in an interview with The Washington Post.
> 
> But Fauci noted there is not yet clinical data on what the high viral loads mean in terms of disease transmission. "You can make a reasonable assumption that vaccinated people can transmit the virus just like unvaccinated people can," Fauci said.


----------



## Johnny b

More on that new CDC concern about the Delta variant:

* CDC shares 'pivotal discovery' on Covid-19 breakthrough infections that led to new mask guidance *
https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/30/health/breakthrough-infection-masks-cdc-provincetown-study/index.html



> Experts say that vaccination makes it less likely that you'll catch Covid-19 in the first place -- but for those who do, this data suggests they could have a similar tendency to spread it as unvaccinated folks.


This appears to be what un-nerved the CDC and brought about the new mask recommendations for vaccinated people:



> The researchers found evidence that viral loads were similar among 127 fully vaccinated people and 84 others who were unvaccinated, partially vaccinated or whose vaccination status was unknown. Viral load is a proxy for how likely someone might be to transmit the virus to others.


It's not just about vaccinated people getting infected. It's an intense concern about transmission of Covid-19 from vaccinated people which hasn't been observed in the past.
Thus the sudden recommendation that the vaccinated should wear masks.

The Delta mutation acquired a new shocking ability and the CDC responded.
Now it's the public's turn. Wear a mask, it's the smart thing to do.


----------



## Johnny b

* Delta Tops 70% of All NYC COVID Strains as New Case Average Keeps Surging  *

https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/cor...ns-as-new-case-average-keeps-surging/3186986/

Points:


> The delta variant has been found in 72% of positive NYC samples studied, up from 57% in the health department's last report
> That strain is now the dominant one in New Jersey as well
> Existing vaccines have proven effective protection against the variant; virtually all new COVID deaths and hospitalizations are among unvaccinated people, officials at all levels of government say


IMO, this is the 4th wave in the US.
And has the potential to be a worse case scenario especially if the general public doesn't take the situation seriously.

A world view of stats, look to the sharp increase in daily cases, the graph in red.










Now a view of US stats:
Again, the daily case graph in red










Notice the daily cases for the US.
It's at 200,000 a day.
There was concern the Delta infection rate could reach a 200,000+ level by October.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health...rive-a-steep-rise-in-covid-deaths-model-shows


> Each scenario also includes a range of how bad things could get - the very worst end of the range for the most likely scenario shows about 240,000 people getting infected and 4,000 people dying each day at the October peak, which would be almost as bad as last winter.


It's the end of July/beginning of August and the US is already experiencing 200,000 cases daily.

Please think positively. Get the vaccine if you haven't already, wear a mask, consider social distancing and simply use common sense.

edit: for those that want to check out the Johns Hopkins Covid Map daily:
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html


----------



## Johnny b

*COVID-19 surge hits Asia; Tokyo, Thailand, Malaysia post record infections *
https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-...ysia-post-record-covid-infections-2021-07-31/

Too much to copy and paste, but this stands out:



> The surge in Delta variant cases is rattling parts of Asia previously relatively successful in containing COVID-19.......................
> 
> .......................
> 
> COVID-19 infections have increased by 80% over the past four weeks in most regions of the world, WHO Director-general Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus said on Friday.


----------



## Johnny b

A positive observation.

I had to go to Walmart just before noon today and noticed more people are now wearing masks.

:up:


----------



## Wino

Noticed same here at Wally and grocery store - mask wearing seemed back in vogue. Easy to pick out the enemy - depending on your perspective ! 

Picked this up off another forum - "COVID started out as a virus. But it has mutated into an IQ Test."


----------



## Johnny b

I suspect the drive to mask up in Ohio is helping to drive the current decline from high rates of Delta infection seen recently.

https://www.daytondailynews.com/loc...re-than-1000-cases/LXPJNXBHBRCSPIM5LC5H6XES7M

The more we know, the more it's addressed, the greater the positive outcome. Common sense.

Vaccines are of the greatest importance.
But it takes a period of time for the shots to build up the necessary immunity.
In the meantime, masks and social distancing are a logical response in that open short term period of exposure.

In the future, plan ahead, don't wait for the 'panic'. It's a lot safer that way. For everyone.


----------



## Johnny b

The above good news didn't last long.

* Ohio reports more than 2,000 daily COVID cases for first time in nearly four months *
https://www.daytondailynews.com/loc...early-four-months/PM7GDDPYDNFY3AZTF6BYRBEIWI/


----------



## Johnny b

Something to think about:

* People who've had COVID, twice as likely to get reinfected than those who get vaccinated, CDC says *
https://abc7news.com/covid-immunity...d-twice-as-likely-to-get-reinfected/10936598/



> ....... the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention released a study reporting that individuals who've had COVID are twice as likely to get reinfected.


https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7032e1.htm


> In this case-control study, being unvaccinated was associated with 2.34 times the odds of reinfection compared with being fully vaccinated.
> 
> To reduce their likelihood for future infection, all eligible persons should be offered COVID-19 vaccine, even those with previous SARS-CoV-2 infection.


----------



## Cookiegal

We will be starting to have to use a vaccination passport to access non-essential services like restaurants, bars, gyms, festivals, etc. as of September 1st. It's a good thing and I'm glad about it.


----------



## Johnny b

*Biden administration expected to recommend COVID booster shots for all Americans amid case surge *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...nited-states-biden-administration/8160915002/



> Biden administration health officials are expected to recommend COVID-19 booster shots for all Americans, regardless of age, eight months after they received the second shot, a source familiar with the plans confirmed to USA TODAY.
> 
> The news, which will be announced as soon as this week, comes as the delta variant rages across the country. It also comes amid anxieties about the Pfizer vaccine's waning immunity and the Food and Drug Administration's approval of booster vaccines for immunocompromised people.


----------



## Johnny b

Two research articles of interest:

* COVID-19 vaccines may trigger superimmunity in people who had SARS long ago *
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/202...er-superimmunity-people-who-had-sars-long-ago

* This 'super antibody' for COVID fights off multiple coronaviruses  *
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01917-9


----------



## Johnny b

Deer are testing positive for Covid-19 antibodies.

* Deer in 4 states have been exposed to the coronavirus, USDA study shows. What does that mean for humans? *

https://news.yahoo.com/deer-4-states-exposed-coronavirus-012530339.html


> The study, not yet peer-reviewed, showed that 40% of deer tested across four states in 2021 were positive for antibodies, meaning they had been exposed to the virus at some point. The positive tests do not necessarily indicate deer had active infections.


The study:
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.07.29.454326v1.full


----------



## Wino

I have my Pfizer booster shot scheduled for next Tuesday 8/24 due to immunocompromise from COPD and lung cancer radiation treatment. My second shot was had 3/31/21.


----------



## Johnny b

Best of luck :up:


----------



## Gr3iz

Is radiation treatment a condition for which they advocate a booster? If so, I may need to look into that ...


----------



## Wino

Gr3iz said:


> Is radiation treatment a condition for which they advocate a booster? If so, I may need to look into that ...


I was told by radiologist/oncologist/pulmonologist AND my GP (that's four separate physicians) to continue to mask up as very susceptible to lung diseases + existing COPD. When I asked GP about booster and whether I needed a prescript or letter to get a booster he said no and to go get the shot. One of the early booster requirements is cancer treatment of any type. While I have completed my radiation treatments for the time being, I'm still in cancer treatment mode while we wait to see if successful.
I want to get the booster done and over, so I can get my normal flu shot in late Sept. or early Oct. when released and want it spaced away from Covid shot. I just wish more people were as concerned.


----------



## Gr3iz

Mine was not lung, but still ... I'll have to check with my PCP ...


----------



## Gr3iz

MEMPHIS, Tenn. - Wednesday afternoon, the Shelby County Health Department issued an updated directive making the wearing of masks mandatory for public indoor settings, with few exceptions. The mandate, which applies to everyone over the age of 2-years-old, goes into effect Friday, August 20, at 7am.

https://www.localmemphis.com/articl...tive/522-19984475-175b-4722-9f14-e8a0c42185c5


----------



## valis

And the beat goes on.....sigh....


----------



## Wino

I just left the Nextdoor site which I rarely read. Apparently our school district voted to require mask last night. Post started by anti-masker stating he was going to run for school board next year to "stop the madness" and asking what poster thoughts were on what the board should address. The response from most were beyond stupid, even going off the rails on how schools were teaching 5 year old's to masturbate. I'm surrounded by idiots. I posted the following:



> Separate schools at all grade levels in all districts - one masked; the other unmasked. Give a choice to the parents and staff, even if the separate schools not convenient, tough, suck it up.


EDIT: First response "you're supporting segregation" and how the media has mislead us about covid. He got the first part correct, the second is just ignorance. No doubt segregating anti-maskers would help, I'm all for it.


----------



## Johnny b

Wino said:


> .............No doubt segregating anti-maskers would help, I'm all for it.


In order to be PC with the loons, we should call it 'quarantining' the anti-maskers.

:up:


----------



## Johnny b

This is insanity.

These people won't take the Covid vaccines, but will take advice from non medical sources to ingest livestock dewormer to prevent/cure Covid 19.

* As covid-19 surges in Mississippi, some people are ingesting an unproven livestock dewormer *
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/08/21/mississippi-ivermectin-covid-surge-livestock/



> Cases of people consuming ivermectin to treat the coronavirus in Mississippi are drawing alarm, with the state's health department issuing an alert Friday warning people not to take the drug, saying the state's poison control center has "received an increasing number of calls from individuals with potential ivermectin exposure taken to treat or prevent covid-19 infection."
> ................
> Between March and this month, Fox News hosts Tucker Carlson, Sean Hannity and Laura Ingraham promoted the use of ivermectin as an alternative covid treatment to millions of viewers on their prime-time shows. Sen. Ron Johnson (R-Wis.) was suspended from YouTube in June for posting a video touting ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine as treatments for covid-19.




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1428903827273654285
I find this horrifyingly depressing.


----------



## valis

Idiots got to idiot....


----------



## Johnny b

valis said:


> Idiots got to idiot....


Perhaps, but i just can't fathom anything other than actual mental instability being a contributing factor in convincing and leading a person to such an irrational conclusion.

From fish tank additives to clorox/Lysol disinfectants.....and now to livestock de-wormers.


----------



## Gr3iz

Not from the deep end of the gene pool ...


----------



## Wino

The damage wrought on this nations psyche by Trump is horrifying, immense, immeasurable and permanent. 😤🤬
He was/is the catalyst for an underlying flaw in human nature.


----------



## Johnny b

* Donald Trump Booed at Alabama Rally After Encouraging Crowd to Get COVID-19 Vaccine *
https://www.newsweek.com/donald-tru...ncouraging-crowd-get-covid-19-vaccine-1621811

While there is a lot of political dark humor to that event, imo, it just goes to show that insanity has a mind of it's own.


----------



## Johnny b

Headline says it all.

* Ultra-Vaxxed Israel's Crisis Is a Dire Warning to America *
https://news.yahoo.com/ultra-vaxxed-israel-debacle-dire-073840050.html



> The massive surge of COVID-19 infections in Israel, one of the most vaccinated countries on earth, is pointing to a complicated path ahead for America.
> 
> In June, there were several days with zero new COVID infections in Israel......
> ..........
> Fast forward two months later: Israel reported 9,831 new diagnosed cases on Tuesday, a hairbreadth away from the worst daily figure ever recorded in the country-10,000-at the peak of the third wave.............


Too much to copy and paste, but it's about an accumulation of factors from the Delta variant to removing social restrictions.


----------



## Wino

Johnny b said:


> * Donald Trump Booed at Alabama Rally After Encouraging Crowd to Get COVID-19 Vaccine *
> https://www.newsweek.com/donald-tru...ncouraging-crowd-get-covid-19-vaccine-1621811
> 
> While there is a lot of political dark humor to that event, imo, it just goes to show that insanity has a mind of it's own.


They were not booing their hero Trump. They were booing the vax.


----------



## Cookiegal

We start using our vaccination passport September 1st to access all kinds of non-essential activities like eating in restaurants, going to gyms, festivals, sporting events, participating in most sports, etc. It will be more reassuring when doing those things. 

Kids will start back to school next week and all elementary and high school grades (except Kindergarten) will have to wear masks even in class when seated at their desks as well as in all common areas in most regions. They are doing this rather than having small groups where the kids can only play with the kids in their bubble.


----------



## Johnny b

Recent CDC report:

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/pdfs/mm7034e5-H.pdf

This stands out:


> On July 25, the SARS-CoV-2 infection rate among unvaccinated
> persons was 4.9 times and the hospitalization rate was 29.2 times
> the rates among fully vaccinated persons.


The vaccines offer a protection that denial can't.


----------



## Johnny b

Maybe..........read all the article. It's not a 'done deal' yet.
* U.S. plans COVID-19 booster shots at six months instead of eight - WSJ *
https://news.yahoo.com/u-plans-covid-19-booster-194751104.html



> (Reuters) -U.S. health regulators could approve a third COVID-19 shot for adults beginning at least six months after full vaccination, instead of the previously announced eight-month gap, the Wall Street Journal reported on Wednesday.


----------



## Johnny b

Of positive interest:

* "Inescapable" COVID-19 Antibody Discovery - Neutralizes All Known SARS-CoV-2 Strains *
https://scitechdaily.com/inescapabl...ery-neutralizes-all-known-sars-cov-2-strains/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sotrovimab


----------



## Johnny b

Not a surprise.

* Pfizer's CEO tell us why he thinks we'll need COVID-19 vaccines every year, like flu shots *
https://www.businessinsider.com/pfi...redicts-annual-covid-19-boosters-shots-2021-8


----------



## Johnny b

Statistics previously understated.

*One-third of Americans were infected with COVID by December 2020: new study *
https://news.yahoo.com/one-third-americans-were-infected-150000744.html



> Nearly one-third of the entire U.S. population had been infected with COVID-19 by the end of 2020 - a much higher rate of infection than previously known, a startling new study has found.
> 
> The study, which was conducted by researchers at Columbia University's Mailman School of Public Health and published in the journal Nature on Thursday, reveals that 103 million Americans, or 31% of the population, had been infected by December 2020 - and that the rate of infection in New York City at the time was even higher at 44%.
> .............
> The peer-reviewed research found that by the end of 2020, infection rates were particularly high in several regions and in big cities, with 48% of people in Chicago infected, 52% of Los Angeles and 42% of Miami.
> 
> In parts of the Midwest like Minnesota, Wisconsin and Iowa, more than 60% of the population had been infected, the study found.


----------



## Johnny b

Back to topic:

*Animals and COVID-19 *
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/201...rus/2019-ncov/animals/pets-other-animals.html



> What You Need to Know
> 
> Based on the available information to date, the risk of animals spreading SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, to people is considered to be low.
> We are still learning about this virus, but we know that it can spread from people to animals in some situations, especially during close contact.
> More studies are needed to understand if and how different animals could be affected by COVID-19.
> People with suspected or confirmed COVID-19 should avoid contact with animals, including pets, livestock, and wildlife.





> *People can spread SARS-CoV-2 to animals, especially during close contact. *


There is more in the article...and likely more to come that is currently unknown.


----------



## Cookiegal

Some posts have been moved to the thread in the Controversial Topics forum.

A reminder that this thread is Random is not for serious political discussions or debates.


----------



## Wino

Cookiegal said:


> Some posts have been moved to the thread in the Controversial Topics forum.
> 
> A reminder that this thread is Random is not for serious political discussions or debates.


I suspect some post in Random to avoid confrontation they would get in Controversial. I understand the need to keep Random apolitical, but some comments just beg for rebuttal. Thanks for moving!


----------



## Cookiegal

Wino said:


> I understand the need to keep Random apolitical, but some comments just beg for rebuttal.


It's not always obvious as it can be a fine line between the two for sure.


----------



## Johnny b

Most mutated variant so far.

* New COVID variant detected in South Africa, most mutated variant so far *
https://www.jpost.com/health-scienc...uth-africa-most-mutated-variant-so-far-678011



> The C.1.2 variant first detected in South Africa is more mutated compared to the original virus than any other known variant.
> 
> A new coronavirus variant, C.1.2, has been detected in South Africa and a number of other countries, with concerns that it could be more infectious and evade vaccines, according to a new preprint study by South Africa's National Institute for Communicable Diseases and the KwaZulu-Natal Research Innovation and Sequencing Platform. The study is awaiting peer review.


The study:
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.20.21262342v1.full


----------



## Johnny b

* 14 Portable Morgues Heading To Central Florida Hospitals Amid 'Unprecedented Deaths' *
https://news.yahoo.com/14-portable-morgues-heading-central-040347228.html



> Fourteen portable morgues are being sent to central Florida hospitals amid what one official called "unprecedented deaths" during the state's record COVID-19 crisis.
> 
> Each refrigerated morgue holds 12 bodies, Lynne Drawdy, executive director of the Central Florida Disaster Medial Coalition, who ordered the units, told the Orlando Sentinel.


................

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/cor...0210827-ljpu6e3lhneshfk42cyivkbnam-story.html



> "The number of deaths right now is unprecedented," said Lynne Drawdy, executive director of the Central Florida Disaster Medical Coalition, who ordered the units for health systems here. "What we're hearing from the hospitals is that the death count right now is higher than it ever has been."
> 
> Although she could not say how many of the deaths are due to COVID-19, she said COVID-19 is unquestionably the "precipitating event."
> 
> Florida is now reporting an average of 227 COVID-19 deaths a day - a state record and by far the highest count in the nation.


----------



## Johnny b

Not unexpected:

* EU to recommend reinstating Covid-related travel restrictions on US, reports say *
https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/eu-travel-restrictions-intl-hnk/index.html



> The European Union is expected to recommend on Monday that member states reinstate Covid-related travel restrictions and halt nonessential travel from the United States and five other countries, a diplomatic source told CNN on Monday.
> The EU would reestablish coronavirus travel restrictions such as quarantine and testing requirements for unvaccinated travelers from those countries, according to the source.
> Other countries to be removed from the safe travel list would be Kosovo, Israel, Montenegro, Lebanon and North Macedonia, the diplomat said.


----------



## Johnny b

* What Pfizer's scientists consider the 'biggest surprise' about their COVID-19 vaccine *
https://news.yahoo.com/pfizers-scientists-consider-biggest-surprise-154509783.html



> The aspect of Pfizer's coronavirus vaccine that really stunned the company's scientists was the fact that vaccinated participants in the Phase 3 efficacy trial had protections against the pathogen by day 12, a time at which there was barely any antibody response, _Stat News reports_. "That was the biggest surprise," said Vidia Roopchand, Pfizer's principal scientist for viral vaccines.
> 
> Roopchand is still trying to figure exactly why that is - not that it's a bad thing - by poring over the data. One possibility is that other aspects of the immune system such as T-cells that Roopchand says have largely been neglected in immunology research may have played a significant role.


----------



## Johnny b

Concerns on the Delta variant.
Not a surprise, but disappointing.
There has been similar recent speculation.

* COVID-19 live updates: Vaccines not as effective at preventing hospitalizations as initially thought, CDC says *
https://1430wcmy.com/2021/08/30/cov...spitalizations-as-initially-thought-cdc-says/



> *Vaccine effectiveness against hospitalization drops, CDC says*
> The COVID-19 vaccines' ability to keep people out of the hospital appears to be dropping slightly, particularly for those 75 and older, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention announced Monday during an advisory panel.
> 
> The CDC has previously estimated that 97% of people in the hospital being treated for COVID-19 are unvaccinated, but that data was collected before the spread of delta, a hyper-transmissible variant that many doctors have warned appears to be making people sicker.
> 
> The latest CDC analysis estimates that the ability of the COVID vaccines to keep a person out of the hospital is now between 75% to 95%.
> 
> For people older than 75 in particular, vaccine effectiveness against hospitalization experienced the steepest decline, from more than 90% to 80% between June and July.
> 
> Health experts are also concerned that a person's immunity could be waning over time, particularly among older people whose bodies are less likely than younger people to develop a strong immune response to the vaccines.
> 
> However, the vaccine still remains highly effective at preventing serious illness, according to the briefing.


It's becoming more important to return to masks and social distancing.


----------



## Johnny b

* Largest study of masks yet details their importance in fighting Covid-19 *
https://news.yahoo.com/largest-study-masks-yet-details-023712519.html


> A study involving more than 340,000 people in Bangladesh offers some of the strongest real-world evidence yet that mask use can help communities slow the spread of Covid-19.


source:

* The Impact of Community Masking on COVID-19: A Cluster-Randomized Trial in Bangladesh *
https://www.poverty-action.org/publ...-covid-19-cluster-randomized-trial-bangladesh

pdf download ( a 94 page pdf/ 5.4 mb )
https://www.poverty-action.org/site..._RCT____Symptomatic_Seropositivity_083121.pdf


----------



## 2twenty2

Poison Control Centers Are Fielding A Surge Of Ivermectin Overdose Calls



> Poison control centers are seeing a dramatic surge in calls from people who are self-medicating with ivermectin, an anti-parasite drug for animals that some falsely claim treats COVID-19.
> 
> https://www.npr.org/sections/corona...exposure-cases-poison-control-centers[quote/]


----------



## Wino

WAIT!! This should work fine for anyone pig headed enough to believe this stupidity.🤪


----------



## 2twenty2

Vietnamese man jailed for 5 years for spreading coronavirus

https://torontosun.com/news/crime/vietnamese-man-jailed-for-5-years-for-spreading-coronavirus


----------



## Johnny b

Article of interest:

* New Studies Find Evidence Of 'Superhuman' Immunity To COVID-19 In Some Individuals *
https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...uman-immunity-to-covid-19-in-some-individuals


----------



## Johnny b

* One in 5,000: The Real Chances of a Breakthrough Infection *
https://news.yahoo.com/one-5-000-real-chances-183201138.html



> ..............
> more data has become available, and it suggests that the true picture is less alarming. Yes, delta has increased the chances of getting COVID for almost everyone. But if you're vaccinated, a COVID infection is still uncommon, and those high viral loads are not as worrisome as they initially sounded.
> 
> How small are the chances of the average vaccinated American contracting COVID? Probably about 1 in 5,000 per day, and even lower for people who take precautions or live in a highly vaccinated community.
> ..............
> 
> The chances are surely higher in the places with the worst COVID outbreaks, like the Southeast. And in places with many fewer cases - like the Northeast, as well as the Chicago, Los Angeles and San Francisco areas - the chances are lower, probably less than 1 in 10,000.
> ................
> Here's one way to think about a 1-in-10,000 daily chance: It would take more than three months for the combined risk to reach just 1%.


----------



## 2twenty2

The Pandemic Has Set Back the Fight Against H.I.V., TB and Malaria

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/07/health/covid-tb-hiv-malaria.html


----------



## Johnny b

A bit of a long read but very informative.

* Massive numbers of new COVID-19 infections, not vaccines, are the main driver of new coronavirus variants *
https://theconversation.com/massive...ain-driver-of-new-coronavirus-variants-166882

( Written by two scientists:
https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=dcezvIQAAAAJ&hl=en&oi=ao
and 
https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=v88WxTwAAAAJ&hl=en&oi=ao )

Summed up:


> The coronavirus remained essentially unchanged for months until the pandemic got out of control. With relatively few infections, the genetic code had limited opportunities to mutate. But as infection clusters exploded, the virus rolled the dice millions of times and some mutations produced fitter mutants.
> 
> The best way to stop new variants is to stop their spread, and the answer to that is vaccination.


----------



## 2twenty2

Pro-China misinformation operation attempting to exploit US Covid divisions, report says

https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/08/poli...tion-operation-coronavirus-pandemic-protests/


----------



## Johnny b

Ivermectin.

dated 02 August 2021

* Flawed ivermectin preprint highlights challenges of COVID drug studies *
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-02081-w#ref-CR1



> The study's withdrawal from a preprint platform deals a blow to the anti-parasite drug's chances as a COVID treatment, researchers say.
> 
> The paper summarized the results of a clinical trial seeming to show that ivermectin can reduce COVID-19 death rates by more than 90%1 - among the largest studies of the drug's ability to treat COVID-19 to date. But on 14 July, after internet sleuths raised concerns about plagiarism and data manipulation, the preprint server Research Square withdrew the paper because of "ethical concerns".


And yet it still seems acceptable by many people.

Linkage at this site:
* Why Was a Major Study on Ivermectin for COVID-19 Just Retracted? *
https://grftr.news/why-was-a-major-study-on-ivermectin-for-covid-19-just-retracted/


> Following these initial detections, Grftr News provided a copy of the data to science fraud expert Nick Brown and asked him to analyse it. Mere hours later, Brown had already conducted an extensive preliminary analysis and agreed to take a more in-depth look. Brown's complete findings run for several pages and have been posted to his blog.


Led to Brown's blog:

https://steamtraen.blogspot.com/2021/07/Some-problems-with-the-data-from-a-Covid-study.html


> This post appears at the same time as this piece at grftr.news by Jack Lawrence. Jack contacted me to ask if I could help him look at a number of issues with a prominent study of Ivermectin for the treatment of Covid-19. My speciality is forensic numerical data analysis finding errors in numbers, so I concentrated on that and suggested some other names to Jack to help him look at things like the study design, methods, and reporting.


To say there are problems with the data .....is an understatement.


----------



## Johnny b

* 400,000 people are infected each year with coronaviruses carried by bats, an early study suggests. Researchers say the data could help prevent future pandemics. *
https://www.businessinsider.com/people-infected-virus-bat-covid-19-sars-cov-2-pandemic-2021-9



> Coronaviruses from bats could infect 407,422 people each year, a study said.
> The findings could help target areas for surveillance and stop human virus outbreaks, they said.
> About 478 million people live in regions where the bats are, the researchers said.
> ...................
> The findings could be used to target areas for surveillance, which could help with earlier and more accurate identification of viruses that could cause the next human outbreak, they said.


The study ( not yet peer reviewed )
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.09.09.21263359v1.full.pdf


----------



## 2twenty2

Howard Stern says anti-vax 'idiots' should 'die with COVID'

https://www.tribute.ca/news/index.p...-vax-idiots-should-die-with-covid/2021/09/15/


----------



## Wino

I love happy news stories.


----------



## Gr3iz

Some people's kids ... 
There's just no telling some people ... <shaking head>


----------



## Johnny b

One of the things bothering me is I now live in a society that has a large portion that will not voluntarily take actions to survive and willingly infect others to somehow prove their intentions are logical and just.
I don't wish them death, I don't want them anywhere near me or others trying to survive.
They are intensely selfish.
They want the benefits of a society without any consideration or input of/for it's safety and welfare.

Recently, a friend, a colleague of my sister, a retired scientist, suffered a stroke at home, in a fall broke his neck, and living alone wasn't found for what is believed to be about a week.
All the ICU facilities where he lives in North Carolina are filled. Swamped with Covid patients, mostly non vaccinated.
A room with a bed was found. 
He's on O2.
I don't think he'll survive.
His care is minimal compared to normal occupancy.


There are similar stories every day in the news.
Damn you people that take life so lightly.


----------



## Johnny b

* How COVID-19 hybrid immunity could be a potential pandemic game-changer *
https://www.yahoo.com/gma/covid-19-hybrid-immunity-could-100339328.html


----------



## Johnny b

It just keeps getting worse and worse in Ohio where I live.

https://local12.com/news/local/ohio...-4100-cincinnati-hospitalizations-icu-deaths-

8349 new daily infections reported yesterday.
It seemed just a couple weeks ago it was under 1000.


----------



## Johnny b

I just called in to my family doctor for flu and tetanus shots to find they're short staffed because of Covid.


----------



## lochlomonder

I live in ND and I'm just glad it's a sparsely-populated state relative to its size. There are far too many anti-vaccination idiots here for my liking, but it's a lot easier to keep away from them here. Thankfully, my wife got her Pfizer booster shot during a recent trip to the Mayo Clinic, and we'll just keep on doing what needs to be done to stay safe, which includes measures to keep others safe as well.


----------



## Wino

I'll be getting my annual flu shot week of Sep. 26 as this will be four weeks after Pfizer CV19 booster shot.


----------



## 2twenty2

Five Oregonians hospitalized due to misuse of ivermectin for COVID-19

https://news.ohsu.edu/2021/09/17/fi...ized-due-to-misuse-of-ivermectin-for-covid-19

Ivermectin misuse in Arizona is leading to hospitalizations, clinical leader warns

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/me...italizations-clinical-leader-warns/ar-AAOuEuZ


----------



## Johnny b

This was bound to happen:

* The days of full covid coverage are over. Insurers are restoring deductibles and co-pays, leaving patients with big bills. *
https://news.yahoo.com/days-full-covid-coverage-over-220408021.html


----------



## 2twenty2

The US death toll from Covid-19 just surpassed that of the 1918 flu pandemic

https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/20/health/us-covid-deaths-surpass-1918-pandemic/index.html


----------



## Johnny b

Johnny b said:


> I just called in to my family doctor for flu and tetanus shots to find they're short staffed because of Covid.


1/2 hour before my appointment, I got a call cancelling it. His clinic was too short staffed this morning and recommended going to a local pharmacy.

Damn that's depressing.


----------



## 2twenty2

San Francisco's mayor blasted for dancing maskless at a crowded club. She called her critics the 'fun police.' 

https://www.seattletimes.com/nation...d-club-she-called-her-critics-the-fun-police/

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...n-Fran-Mayor-BLM-founder-party-nightclub.html

George Holliday, Man Who Videotaped Rodney King Beating, Dies Of COVID

https://losangeles.cbslocal.com/202...videotaped-rodney-king-beating-dies-of-covid/


----------



## 2twenty2

In Canada 🇨🇦

Ford says he understands concerns as vaccine certificates loom in Ontario
https://torontosun.com/news/provinc...y-after-election-as-vaccine-certificates-loom

Bar and restaurant operators ponder how they'll enforce COVID-19 vaccine rules starting in Ontario this week
https://www.cp24.com/news/bar-and-r...rules-starting-in-ontario-this-week-1.5591555

Ontario premier releases statement one day before COVID-19 vaccine certificate is implemented
https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/ontario-...-vaccine-certificate-is-implemented-1.5594188

https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=2285571


----------



## Johnny b

* America's Largest Grocery Chain Is Changing Its Mask Rule *

https://news.yahoo.com/americas-largest-grocery-chain-changing-154606565.html



> According to a report from _Grocery Dive_, effective last week, Kroger is now requiring all workers, including Kroger employees and outside contractors, to wear masks inside the chain's stores, office buildings, and other facilities.


This morning, I used the local Kroger pharmacy for flu and tetanus shots.
Those in the pharmacy all wore masks.
But I saw more than a half a dozen employees through out the store with out masks and even passed a stock clerk in an isle wearing a mask below her chin.
It may be 'required', but it was obvious that it wasn't being enforced where I was.


----------



## Johnny b

Something to watch for that looks promising:

* A COVID-19 booster shot that could protect against multiple variants at once is being tested in humans for the first time *
https://news.yahoo.com/covid-19-booster-shot-could-102710458.html



> The vaccine, called GRT-R910, uses a new technology called self-amplifying messenger-ribonucleic acid (mRNA), which replicates itself once injected into muscle. COVID-19 vaccines from Pfizer and Moderna use mRNA, which teaches our body how to make a protein that triggers an immune response, but it cannot self-replicate.
> 
> Self-amplifying mRNA promises lower doses than existing vaccines, which means it's potentially cheaper and has fewer side-effects, Insider previously reported.


edit:
link to early trial
https://www.manchester.ac.uk/discov...ovid-19-vaccine-booster-begins-in-manchester/


----------



## Johnny b

* Covid-19 death rate more than 4 times higher in least vaccinated states than in most vaccinated *
https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/21/health/us-coronavirus-tuesday/index.html



> The average rate of Covid-19 deaths in the 10 least vaccinated states was more than four times higher over the past week than the rate in the 10 most vaccinated states, according to a CNN analysis.
> In the least vaccinated states, roughly eight people out of every 100,000 residents died of Covid-19 over the past week, compared with only about two out of every 100,000 people in the 10 most vaccinated states.
> CNN used data from Johns Hopkins University and the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention for the analysis.
> Less vaccinated states tend to have higher hospitalization rates, too.


----------



## Johnny b

A new concern.
The R.1 variant:

*A New US/Japan Variant To Watch *
https://www.forbes.com/sites/williamhaseltine/2021/09/20/a-new-usjapan-variant-to-watch/



> The variant, which originated in Japan, has over 10,000 entries in the GISAID SARS-CoV-2 database. The variant contains five mutations previously noted in variants of concern or interest, two of which are in the Spike protein (Figure 1). It also contains many unique mutations.


----------



## Johnny b

Maybe it's time to start handing out Darwin Awards.

* Asthma group warns against social media trend of inhaling hydrogen peroxide to treat coronavirus *
https://www.yahoo.com/news/asthma-group-warns-against-social-215148355.html


----------



## 2twenty2

Richmond Hill doctor draws fire for reportedly handing out vaccine exemptions

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/20...ns.html?li_source=LI&li_medium=star_web_ymbii


----------



## Johnny b

2twenty2 said:


> Richmond Hill doctor draws fire for reportedly handing out vaccine exemptions
> 
> https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/20...ns.html?li_source=LI&li_medium=star_web_ymbii


Read it.
Very disturbing.

I'm constantly perplexed as to why deniers accept the rationale they embrace.
IMO, politics doesn't explain all of it away and if it's BS Receptivity, probably a lot of environmental issues. But why are some people more receptive than others? ( rhetorical question )


----------



## Johnny b

I'm scheduled to get my booster shot this Friday


----------



## 2twenty2

YouTube Will Remove Videos With Misinformation About Any Vaccine

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-videos-with-misinformation-about-any-vaccine

related -

Russia Threatens Retaliation After YouTube Deletes RT Germany Account

https://gizmodo.com/russia-threatens-retaliation-after-youtube-deletes-rt-g-1847765519


----------



## Johnny b

Long haulers in China:

* A year later, 45% of COVID patients in Wuhan still have symptoms *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...-covid-patients-in-wuhan-still-have-symptoms/


----------



## Johnny b

Got my booster shot at 9 AM and feel fine


----------



## Wino

Johnny b said:


> Got my booster shot at 9 AM and feel fine


My booster was sore 2nd day thru 4th. Flu shot about 4 days. No adverse reaction to either.


----------



## Johnny b

Wino said:


> My booster was sore 2nd day thru 4th. Flu shot about 4 days. No adverse reaction to either.


9 days ago I got the flu and tetanus shots. One in each arm.
Both were listed having potential soreness at the injection site.
And I got intense soreness within hours, plus slight fatigue, sore muscles and joints the next day. About day 4 it all cleared up.

My first and second covid shots didn't do much of anything. The nurse said I might experience a stronger reaction with the booster.
She also said not to massage the soreness. It tends to break up the process.
And that it normally takes about 2 weeks to get the full effect.

I got the timing down pretty good.
I have to go downtown to the Sheriff's office in 2 weeks to renew my concealed carry license ......while covid rampages through downtown Dayton.
I'll be the one wearing a mask


----------



## Cookiegal

John, I've deleted your post as the one Scott made that you were replying to has been moved to the thread in the CT forum since it wasn't appropriate for this one.


----------



## Johnny b

OK with me.

Skivvy's a good guy, just about as opinionated as myself


----------



## 2twenty2

Utilities Took Public Money, Gave CEOs Millions, and Then Turned People's Lights Off During the Pandemic

https://gizmodo.com/utilities-took-public-money-gave-ceos-millions-and-th-1847769904


----------



## Johnny b

My arm was a bit sore at the injection point when I turned in for the night, but most of it is now gone, day 2.
A lot less than my recent flu and tetanus shots.
Nothing to complain about. No loss of motion or inconvenience.
No fever or headaches so far.


----------



## 2twenty2

'The Big Delete:' Inside Facebook's crackdown in Germany

https://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory/big-delete-inside-facebooks-crackdown-germany-80282391


----------



## 2twenty2

Meet molnupiravir, Merck's Thor-inspired pill that hammers COVID

https://arstechnica.com/science/202...mercks-thor-inspired-pill-that-hammers-covid/


----------



## Johnny b

2twenty2 said:


> Meet molnupiravir, Merck's Thor-inspired pill that hammers COVID
> 
> https://arstechnica.com/science/202...mercks-thor-inspired-pill-that-hammers-covid/




https://forums.techguy.org/threads/coronavirus-spread-to-eu-usa.1239391/post-9843205

I finally beat you to something lol.


----------



## 2twenty2

Johnny b said:


> https://forums.techguy.org/threads/coronavirus-spread-to-eu-usa.1239391/post-9843205
> 
> I finally beat you to something lol.


Oops. Didn't mean to step on your toes. 😁


----------



## Johnny b

No problamo


----------



## Wino

Johnny B - We can renew Carry license on line - surprised not same in Ohio.


----------



## Johnny b

Wino said:


> Johnny B - We can renew Carry license on line - surprised not same in Ohio.


Not entirely. I'd heard it could be done.
But I filled out the request and at the end it required my presence at the Sheriff's office to prove my identity. I had to set an appointment for that.


----------



## Johnny b

* 'We've turned many rural communities into kill boxes.' COVID death rates higher in rural areas *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...al-americans-twice-rate-urbanites/5952106001/



> Rural Americans are dying of COVID at more than twice the rate of their urban counterparts - a divide that health experts say is likely to widen as access to medical care shrinks for a population that tends to be older, sicker, heavier, poorer and less vaccinated.


I really hate reading of this.
I grew up in a rural setting. My Dad had an 80 acre farm.
That was back in the late 1940's and 50's.
Life was different then.
Things change.


----------



## ekim68

Coronavirus (COVID-19) Vaccinations



> 45.8% of the world population has received at least one dose of a COVID-19 vaccine.
> 6.36 billion doses have been administered globally, and 22.93 million are now administered each day.
> Only 2.3% of people in low-income countries have received at least one dose.


----------



## Johnny b

Looks like there may be some potential issues with Merck's 'game changer'.

* Merck's Covid Pill Could Pose Serious Risks, Scientists Warn *
https://www.marketwatch.com/articles/merck-covid-pill-risks-51633398722?mod=mw_more_headlines



> Molnupiravir works by incorporating itself into the genetic material of the virus, and then causing a huge number of mutations as the virus replicates, effectively killing it. In some lab tests, the drug has also shown the ability to integrate into the genetic material of mammalian cells, causing mutations as those cells replicate.
> 
> Merck (ticker: MRK) says it has run extensive tests in animals that show that this isn't an issue. "The totality of the data from these studies indicates that molnupiravir is not mutagenic or genotoxic in in-vivo mammalian systems," a Merck spokesperson said.


----------



## 2twenty2

Popular WLOX anchor loses job for refusing to get COVID vaccine. 'I preserved my integrity.'

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/p...d-vaccine-i-preserved-my-integrity/ar-AAPaQ0i
https://torontosun.com/news/world/mississippi-news-anchor-loses-job-after-refusing-covid-vaccine

And

City of Toronto warns unvaxxed employees to get shot or lose job

https://torontosun.com/news/local-n...rns-unvaxed-employees-to-get-shot-or-lose-job


----------



## Wino

Not sure about preserving her integrity, but certainly preserved her ignorance of the situation. Not sure about Canada, but here (USA TX) if let go for cause, you get no unemployment benefits (or it used to be that way - I never lost an appeal with someone I fired).


----------



## 2twenty2

'You should die': The plague that is 'COVID rage'




__ https://www.facebook.com/hamiltonspectator/posts/10159159863817247



(Don't know if link will work. I don't have a facebook account and never will. I don't go to the site either.)


----------



## Johnny b

2twenty2 said:


> 'You should die': The plague that is 'COVID rage'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __ https://www.facebook.com/hamiltonspectator/posts/10159159863817247
> 
> 
> 
> (Don't know if link will work. I don't have a facebook account and never will. I don't go to the site either.)


This link works for me:

https://www.thespec.com/news/hamilton-region/2021/10/07/the-plague-that-is-covid-rage.html


----------



## Johnny b

From India.

* Merck drug less effective against moderate COVID -India regulatory source *
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/merck-drug-less-effective-against-082021674.html



> Aurobindo Pharma Ltd wants to discontinue a late-stage trial of molnupiravir in moderate COVID-19 patients, the regulator's expert committee said on Friday.
> 
> "There is no significant efficacy against moderate COVID and the effective efficacy is towards mild cases," the source said on condition of anonymity due to the sensitive nature of the discussions.


----------



## Johnny b

A long but interesting article:

* No, your antibodies are not better than vaccination: An explainer *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...tion-why-everyone-should-get-a-covid-19-shot/



> Infection does offer some immune protection-but it's unreliable compared with vaccines.


----------



## Johnny b

I often feel like I'm living in a syfi disaster movie.

* Here's What the Next Six Months of the Pandemic Will Bring *
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2021-09-12/6-month-covid-outlook-2021



> The race between vaccinations and new variant strains won't end until Covid-19 has touched almost everyone.


----------



## Johnny b

https://www.sfchronicle.com/health/...-the-incredibly-stark-difference-16519941.php










Vaccines work.


----------



## 2twenty2

Canada's overworked healthcare sector brace for staff shortages as vaccine mandates loom
https://torontosun.com/news/nationa...-for-staff-shortages-as-vaccine-mandates-loom

How disagreements over vaccination and COVID-19 have ripped apart these Alberta families
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-covid-vaccination-disagreement-family-1.6201953

Alberta man battling COVID-19 in hospital as family divided over vaccinations
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/alberta-man-covid19-hospital-family-division-1.6202368

CHAUDHRI: New vaccine mandate may leave thousands of City of Toronto workers unemployed
https://torontosun.com/opinion/colu...ousands-of-city-of-toronto-workers-unemployed

Italian police arrest far-right party leaders after anti-vax riot
https://torontosun.com/news/world/italian-police-arrest-far-right-party-leaders-after-anti-vax-riot


----------



## 2twenty2

> COVID-19 deaths are surging in Russia, but vaccination lags
> 
> Officials warn country will pass 30,000 cases per day, as daily death toll approaches 1,000


https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/russia-covid-19-coronavirus-deaths-vaccination-1.6207201


----------



## Johnny b

Hat tip to an anti-masker that inadvertently/mistakenly used an NIH article to back misinformation claims, but instead offered tests claiming N95 and surgical masks reduce viral transmission:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8084286/


> A randomized controlled trial of 2862 healthcare personnel reported no significant differences in laboratory-confirmed influenza infection among users wearing N95 or surgical masks, with incidence rates of 8.2% and 7.2%, respectively [30]. Likewise, Smith et al. and Long et al. found no significant differences in laboratory-confirmed illnesses in healthcare workers and users who wore N95 _vs._ surgical masks [84,86]. Offeddu et al. also found no significant differences for SARS and influenza (H1N1) infections, although *wearing an N95 or surgical mask reduced the risk of SARS transmission by approximately 80%, compared to not wearing a mask* [87].


( bolding mine )

Thanks Jack.


----------



## 2twenty2

Coronavirus: What's happening in Canada and around the world on Tuesday

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/coronavirus-covid19-canada-world-1.6207641


----------



## 2twenty2

GM Canada To Require All Personnel To Be Fully Vaccinated Against COVID-19

https://gmauthority.com/blog/2021/1...nnel-to-be-fully-vaccinated-against-covid-19/


----------



## 2twenty2

Two Ontario doctors barred from issuing COVID medical exemptions
https://torontosun.com/news/provinc...-barred-from-issuing-covid-medical-exemptions


----------



## Johnny b

Ohio is in 3rd spot on Jonhs Hopkins Covid map and it's no wonder.

I had to go to Walmart shortly after 12 noon.
While most of the employees wore masks, I'd estimate 5% or less of the walk-ins were wearing masks.

And now there a new variant of Delta being reported in the UK.
https://www.bbc.com/news/health-58965650


----------



## Johnny b

The UK appears to be having a resurgence of Covid infections.

* Delta's surprise U.K. comeback is a warning sign for the U.S. *
https://news.yahoo.com/deltas-surprise-uk-comeback-is-a-warning-sign-for-the-us-090008459.html

This stood out and should be considered by those that think their natural immunity from a Covid infection is all they need to stay healthy:



> On top of that, U.K. residents are "increasingly reporting catching Sars-CoV-2 for a second or even third time," according to the Guardian. A year ago, reinfection seemed rare; only two dozen cases had been recorded worldwide. But just like protection from vaccination, natural immunity also seems to fade over time and in the face of new variants such as Delta. In Oklahoma, for instance, reinfections have risen 350 percent since May.


----------



## Johnny b

* Without Covid-19 jab, 'reinfection may occur every 16 months' *
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...tion-may-occur-every-16-months-say-scientists



> New analysis has suggested that unvaccinated individuals should expect to be reinfected with Covid-19 every 16 months, on average.


----------



## Johnny b

Russia is also starting to experience this new Delta AY.4.2 variant.

* Russia reports cases of more contagious COVID-19 variant - reports *
https://www.reuters.com/world/europ...ntagious-covid-19-variant-reports-2021-10-21/


----------



## 2twenty2

🇨🇦 Don't expect EI if you lose your job for not being vaccinated, minister says
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/ei-vax-status-1.6220287


----------



## 2twenty2

India crosses the milestone of 1 billion COVID-19 vaccinations

https://www.npr.org/2021/10/21/1047...-milestone-of-1-billion-covid-19-vaccinations


----------



## Couriant

2twenty2 said:


> 🇨🇦 Don't expect EI if you lose your job for not being vaccinated, minister says
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/ei-vax-status-1.6220287


That is the same thing here.


----------



## 2twenty2

The danger of COVID-19 misinformation is 'mind-boggling,' says Dr. Anthony Fauci

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/ideas/the-...mind-boggling-says-dr-anthony-fauci-1.6218070


----------



## Johnny b

^^^^^A good read. Thank you.


----------



## 2twenty2

Johnny b said:


> ^^^^^A good read. Thank you.


You're welcome.


----------



## 2twenty2

2 B.C. doctors linked to website selling bogus mask and vaccine exemption 'certificates'

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-enable-air-mask-vaccine-exemptions-1.6221825


----------



## 2twenty2

Covid news - live: BMA 'concerned' over possible mandatory NHS vaccines as UK regulator reviews Novavax

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/covid-uk-news-live-lockdown-cases-b1946039.html


----------



## 2twenty2

The CRB has ended. Here's how it may impact Canadians' taxes

https://globalnews.ca/news/8322709/crb-end-date-2021-taxes-clawback/


----------



## 2twenty2

Ontario doctor critical of COVID-19 response ordered to halt practice
https://torontosun.com/news/provinc...of-covid-19-response-ordered-to-halt-practice

Ottawa paramedic charged in fake COVID-19 vaccination certificate probe
https://torontosun.com/news/local-n...robe/wcm/3c23d010-da87-42bf-b53d-06d81d792344

Jason Momoa tests positive for COVID-19 on Aquaman sequel set: report
https://torontosun.com/entertainmen...ive-for-covid-19-on-aquaman-sequel-set-report


----------



## 2twenty2

Global numbers of *Covid cases and deaths rise for the first time in 2 months*, WHO says
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/10/28/glo...or-the-first-time-in-two-months-who-says.html


----------



## Johnny b

*Vaccine confers better protection than natural immunity, CDC finds *

https://news.yahoo.com/vaccine-conf...han-natural-immunity-cdc-finds-201511956.html



> The new study finds that people who had natural immunity from having recently fought off COVID-19 and who were not vaccinated were 5.49 times more likely to experience another COVID-19 infection than were vaccinated people who had not previously been infected.


https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7044e1.htm?s_cid=mm7044e1_w


----------



## Johnny b

* China's COVID-19 outbreak developing rapidly, health official says *
https://news.yahoo.com/chinas-covid-19-outbreak-developing-020148934.html


----------



## 2twenty2

Nearly 300 WestJet workers suspended over COVID vaccine rules
https://torontosun.com/news/national/nearly-300-westjet-workers-suspended-over-covid-vaccine-rules


----------



## Johnny b

Breakthrough statistics on unvaccinated versus vaccinated.

https://news.yahoo.com/had-covid-19-vaccine-breakthrough-174739324.html


----------



## Johnny b

I just got back from the election poll.
An unusually large turn out, given it was only about local issues.

I saw something I thought was a bit depressing.
It was obvious that most of the elderly weren't wearing masks and many of them complained when entering the building that they had to. 
The building is part of the Sinclair College complex and their rules demand everyone entering must wear a mask.
Free masks were available.


----------



## Wino

Johnny b said:


> I just got back from the election poll.
> An unusually large turn out, given it was only about local issues.
> 
> I saw something I thought was a bit depressing.
> *It was obvious that most of the elderly weren't wearing masks and many of them complained when entering the building that they had to.
> The building is part of the Sinclair College complex and their rules demand everyone entering must wear a mask.
> Free masks were available.*


Not surprised in Ohio or Texas or Florida or Okla. or Missouri or Miss. or S Dakota or N. Dakota or about any red state. I mailed my ballot in - tracked it, so know it counted - all on state constitutional changes. Chances of me ever seeing the inside of a polling booth are slim and none in my case. Besides me being particular with whom I'm seen with - might tarnish my lefty credentials.


----------



## Johnny b

* New study suggests SARS-CoV-2 spreading widely within wild deer population *

https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/11/sars-cov-2-seems-to-readily-jump-to-deer-spread-among-them/



> Earlier this year, researchers found that many wild deer in Michigan had antibodies that suggested the animals had been exposed to SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19. It was a significant cause for concern, as a large population of susceptible animals could act as a reservoir that allows the virus to spread back to humans.


----------



## 2twenty2

Four doctors not co-operating with investigations into COVID practices, medical regulator says
https://www.cp24.com/news/4-docs-no...o-covid-practices-medical-regulator-1.5650333


----------



## Gr3iz

Got my Pfizer booster today! All up to date ...


----------



## Johnny b

* Pfizer antiviral drug could nearly end deaths from COVID-19, company study suggests *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-prevents-covid-deaths-drug-study/6284097001/



> A new drug being developed by Pfizer offers the possibility of nearly putting an end to deaths from COVID-19.
> 
> When given within five days of the onset of symptoms, the antiviral therapy called Paxlovid, prevented almost 90% of deaths from COVID-19 compared to a placebo, a Pfizer study found.


Merck's drug, Molnupiravir, works as a mutagen.
Pfizer's drug, Paxlovid, works as a protease inhibitor.

Since I've already had an issue with a tumor, I won't be taking the Merck drug if infected.


----------



## 2twenty2

Europe once again at centre of Covid pandemic, says WHO
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/nov/04/covid-europe-epicentre-pandemic-who


----------



## Johnny b

More on the Pfizer drug:

* Pfizer says its antiviral pill can cut 89% of COVID hospitalizations and deaths *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...-cut-89-of-covid-hospitalizations-and-deaths/



> PF-07321332 is a protease-inhibiting drug; it works by hindering a specific enzyme, called a protease, found in SARS-CoV-2 and other coronaviruses. The protease plays a critical role for the virus by snipping apart strings of proteins into smaller units that are functional-and vital to the virus's ability to make infectious copies of itself. By inhibiting the protease, PF-07321332 prevents SARS-CoV-2 from replicating.
> 
> By contrast, molnupiravir thwarts SARS-CoV-2 by posing as a building block for the virus's genetic code, which is in the form of RNA. When the virus's RNA-dependent RNA polymerase-an enzyme that makes copies of SARS-CoV-2's RNA code-incorporates the drug into new RNA strands, those strands are doomed, and the virus is unable to make viable copies of itself. Though early animal and human trial data suggest that molnupiravir is safe, there exists the theoretical possibility that the drug could also damage the human genetic code.


----------



## Gr3iz

I had no reactions to the first two shots. The booster, however, was another story! Yesterday (the day after the shot) I was drained all day, completely without any energy. I laid in my recliner most of the afternoon. Last evening I had a temp of 101.6. 

So far today, I seem to be OK. Body temp back to 98.


----------



## 2twenty2

Gr3iz said:


> I had no reactions to the first two shots. The booster, however, was another story! Yesterday (the day after the shot) I was drained all day, completely without any energy. I laid in my recliner most of the afternoon. Last evening I had a temp of 101.6.
> 
> So far today, I seem to be OK. Body temp back to 98.


----------



## Cookiegal

Gr3iz said:


> So far today, I seem to be OK. Body temp back to 98.


Sounds good.


----------



## Johnny b

Good to hear you're feeling better.


----------



## Gr3iz

Thanks Johnny!


----------



## Johnny b

Interesting article on Long Covid:

* New clues to the biology of long COVID are starting to emerge  *
https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2021/11/12/1053509795/long-covid-causes-treatment-clues



> "It's still early days. But we believe that long COVID is not caused by one thing. That there are multiple diseases that are happening," says Akiko Iwasaki, a professor of immunobiology at Yale University who is also studying long COVID.
> 
> ..............
> "We are finding elevated cytokines in long-COVID patients and we're trying to decode what those cytokines mean. We're also seeing some distinct auto-antibody reactivity and are trying to find out what those antibodies are doing and whether they are causing harm," Iwasaki says.


----------



## 2twenty2

'YOU ARE AN ENEMY': Gene Simmons slams 'evil people' refusing COVID vaccine
https://torontosun.com/entertainmen...mons-slams-evil-people-refusing-covid-vaccine
https://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/national/article255740661.html
https://presslasvegas.com/news/cana...ons-slams-evil-people-refusing-covid-vaccine/
https://www.thewrap.com/gene-simmons-anti-vaxxers-covid-deniers-enemy/


----------



## 2twenty2

Joseph Brant Hospital fires 13 as mandatory COVID shots take effect
https://www.thespec.com/news/hamilton-region/2021/11/11/covid-hamilton-latest-news.html


----------



## Johnny b

More on the issue of Deer becoming infected and the inference that wildlife in general may become victims as well with future mutations:

* Penn State researchers believe white-tailed deer are contracting coronavirus from humans *
https://www.wgal.com/article/penn-s...are-catching-coronavirus-from-humans/38239170



> Between December 2020 and January 2021, Penn State researchers found 80% of white-tailed deer sampled in Iowa tested positive for the virus.
> 
> But researchers said white-tailed deer have the potential to be a reservoir for the virus to continually circulate. This may potentially create new strains of the virus that could be a threat to other wildlife and humans, according to researchers.


----------



## Cookiegal

I'm having trouble finding a link in English but the Granby Zoo in Quebec is going to vaccinate some of their animals against Covid-19 (mainly gorillas and tigers).


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> *I'm having trouble finding a link in English* but the Granby Zoo in Quebec is going to vaccinate some of their animals against Covid-19 (mainly gorillas and tigers).


https://new.in-24.com/News/312050.html
OR
https://www.cbc.ca/listen/live-radi...-lions-gorillas-soon-getting-covid-19-vaccine


----------



## Cookiegal

Thanks knuck but I hate going to obscure websites and the other I found but it's a radio station you have to listen too. It wanted to know my location so I said no thanks.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> Thanks knuck but I hate going to obscure websites and the other I found but it's a radio station you have to listen too. It wanted to know my location so I said no thanks.


Sorry.

The podcast didn't ask for my location? Its CBC radio


----------



## Cookiegal

2twenty2 said:


> Sorry.


No need to be sorry for anything. 


2twenty2 said:


> he podcast didn't ask for my location?


They don't care where you are. 


2twenty2 said:


> Its CBC radio


Yup, I know.


----------



## Wino

Cookiegal said:


> I'm having trouble finding a link in English but the Granby Zoo in Quebec is going to vaccinate some of their animals against Covid-19 (mainly gorillas and tigers).


I trust your honesty and war against lies, so I don't need to access no stinkin' websites - your word is good!!


----------



## Cookiegal

Wino said:


> I trust your honesty and war against lies, so I don't need to access no stinkin' websites - your word is good!!


Thank you Wino.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> No need to be sorry for anything. *They don't care where you are*.


😱


----------



## Johnny b

* Three snow leopards at Nebraska zoo die from COVID-19 complications *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...id-lincoln-childrens-zoo-nebraska/8607774002/



> The snow leopards are among several to contract the coronavirus in zoos around the country. The snow leopards NeeCee, Kimti and Meru all tested positive at the Louisville Zoo and recovered from their illnesses late last year. Ramil and Naphisa, two snow leopards at the San Diego Zoo, tested positive this summer after zookeepers noticed coughs.
> 
> Other zoo animals including lions, tigersand gorillas have gotten COVID at zoos, and some cases have been attributed to transmission from handlers.


----------



## Johnny b

Another variant of interest:

* New COVID variant found in France: Reason for panic or not quite yet? *
https://www.jpost.com/health-and-we...ance-reason-for-panic-or-not-quite-yet-684878



> The spike protein of the variant known as B.1.640 has some unprecedented mutations.
> 
> ................ One in particular has drawn attention: the spike protein, which is what allows the virus to cling to the human cell and start the infection process, has some deletions.
> The question is whether this will make the virus more or less infectious.
> ...............
> "This variant exemplifies that if you leave some of the world's population without access to vaccines, then the virus will continue to multiply and it will lead to more variants," Cohen said.


----------



## Johnny b

Not SARS-CoV2, but another viral outbreak to deal with:

* Bird flu spreads in Europe and Asia *
https://www.reuters.com/business/he...ay-reports-bird-flu-farm-oie-says-2021-11-15/



> Several outbreaks of severe bird flu in Europe and Asia have been reported in recent days to the World Organisation for Animal Health (OIE), in a sign the virus is spreading quickly again.


----------



## Johnny b

More on Merck's 'game changer': molnupiravir

First, the scientist: William A. Haseltine
A reputable authority with a lifetime of achievements.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_A._Haseltine

* A prominent virologist warns COVID-19 pill could unleash dangerous mutants. Others see little cause for alarm *
https://www.science.org/content/art...ngerous-mutants-others-see-little-cause-alarm


> Now, William Haseltine, a virologist formerly at Harvard University known for his work on HIV and the human genome project, suggests that by inducing viral mutations, molnupiravir could spur the rise of new viral variants more dangerous than today's. "You are putting a drug into circulation that is a potent mutagen at a time when we are deeply concerned about new variants," says Haseltine, who outlined his concern Monday in a Forbes blog post. "I can't imagine doing anything more dangerous."
> ..........
> Underpinning Haseltine's worry are studies that show coronaviruses can survive with molnupiravir-induced mutations.


_______________________

Forbes article by Haseltine:

* Supercharging New Viral Variants: The Dangers Of Molnupiravir (Part 1) *
https://www.forbes.com/sites/willia...-variants-the-dangers-of-molnupiravir-part-1/

* Harming Those Who Receive It: The Dangers Of Molnupiravir (Part 2) *
https://www.forbes.com/sites/willia...eceive-it-the-dangers-of-molnupiravir-part-2/

Too much to copy and paste, but this stands out in his first article:


> We are potentially headed towards a world class disaster.


This in the second article:


> Today, my focus is on the people who may receive the drug as a treatment and the possibility that molnupiravir could lead to cancerous tumors in those patients and birth defects in the unborn.


There is much to read and consider in both articles.


----------



## ekim68

On Podcasts and Radio, Misleading Covid-19 Talk Goes Unchecked



> False statements about vaccines have spread on the "Wild West" of media, even as some hosts die of virus complications.


----------



## 2twenty2

FDA Asks Federal Judge to Grant it *Until the Year 2076* to Fully Release Pfizer's COVID-19 Vaccine Data

https://aaronsiri.substack.com/p/fda-asks-federal-judge-to-grant-it


----------



## Johnny b

More on that FDA release issue:

https://www.reuters.com/legal/gover...ss-foia-request-over-vaccine-data-2021-11-18/

Not a good way to build trust.


----------



## Johnny b

*First Known COVID Case Was Vendor at Wuhan Market, Scientist Claims *
(repost from the NewYork Times )
https://news.yahoo.com/first-known-covid-case-vendor-131118427.html



> A scientist who has pored over public accounts of early COVID-19 cases in China reported Thursday that an influential World Health Organization inquiry had likely gotten the early chronology of the pandemic wrong. The new analysis suggests that the first known patient sickened with the coronavirus was a vendor in a large Wuhan animal market, not an accountant who lived many miles from it.


----------



## Johnny b

*US advisers support expanding COVID boosters to all adults *
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/us-expands-covid-boosters-adults-132943754.html



> Now, anyone 18 or older can choose either a Pfizer or Moderna booster six months after their last dose, regardless of which vaccine they had first.


----------



## 2twenty2

South Africa Raises Alarm Over New Coronavirus Variant
https://www.wsj.com/articles/south-africa-raises-alarm-over-new-coronavirus-variant-11637862061


----------



## flavallee

I got my Pfizer booster shot today. 

Now we have to wait and see what the new variance will do and if a second booster shot will be necessary.


----------



## Johnny b

More info on Omicron:

* Why the omicron Covid variant is the most concerning so far  *
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...Echobox&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1638006464

A lot of serious worry.
Too much to copy and paste.


----------



## Johnny b

* Merck says its Covid antiviral treatment less effective than first thought *
https://www.ft.com/content/5991288f-7e62-4de4-9d41-88285d29ee62



> Merck's Covid-19 oral antiviral treatment is not as effective as first thought, the pharma group said on Friday, after a full analysis of trial results provided new data on its ability to reduce hospitalisations and deaths.
> 
> The company said its oral drug, molnupiravir, showed a relative risk reduction of 30 per cent when compared with placebo in all 1,400 enrolled patients on the trial. It had said last month that reduction was of "approximately" 50 per cent as it published preliminary data on a smaller sample of patients.


----------



## Johnny b

* Womp, womp: Efficacy of Merck's Thor-inspired COVID pill crumbles, vexing experts *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...-inspired-covid-pill-crumbles-vexing-experts/



> In a 13-to-10 vote, advisors for the Food and Drug Administration narrowly supported authorizing Merck's Thor-inspired antiviral pill molnupiravir for use against severe COVID-19.
> 
> Molnupiravir's final data and today's vote is a significant disappointment from the early fanfare around the drug...........
> 
> AMDAC members largely felt that Merck had not done enough safety monitoring to better understand the risk of mutations in people, particularly in pregnant people.
> 
> Following the close vote and many expressions of concern, the FDA will now decide if it will issue an emergency use authorization for molnupiravir.


----------



## Johnny b

More info on molnupiravir :

* FDA advisers narrowly recommend authorization of first antiviral pill to treat covid-19 *
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/11/30/merck-covid-pill/


----------



## 2twenty2

Virus that causes COVID-19 found in three white-tailed deer in Eastern Townships
https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/virus-t...te-tailed-deer-in-eastern-townships-1.5689436


----------



## 2twenty2

Many Severe Covid-19 Survivors Go on to Die Within a Year, Study Finds
https://gizmodo.com/many-severe-covid-19-survivors-go-on-to-die-within-a-ye-1848144418


----------



## Johnny b

* Omicron covid variant three times more likely to cause reinfection than delta, South Africa study says *
https://news.yahoo.com/omicron-covid-variant-three-times-112324337.html


----------



## 2twenty2

The Coronavirus in a Tiny Drop
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/12/01/science/coronavirus-aerosol-simulation.html


----------



## 2twenty2

Fake Covid-19 Vaccine Certificates Are Being Advertised On the Dark Web
https://www.bankinfosecurity.com/darknet-markets-advertise-fake-covid-19-vaccine-passports-a-18010


----------



## Cookiegal

A man in Italy tried to get away with presenting a prosthetic arm to receive the vaccine so he could get the "super health pass" which is the equivalent of our vaccination passport. Covidiots. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/italian-dentist-presents-fake-arm-vaccine-get-covid-pass-n1285358


----------



## 2twenty2

Two hippos in Belgian zoo test positive for COVID-19
https://torontosun.com/news/world/two-hippos-in-belgian-zoo-test-positive-for-covid-19


----------



## Johnny b

Omicron and evolution:
(repost from USAToday)
* Where did the coronavirus omicron variant come from? Scientists suggest it evolved in one person. *
https://news.yahoo.com/where-did-coronavirus-omicron-variant-160843670.html

Too much to copy and paste.
An interesting article about mutations and the immunocompromised


----------



## Johnny b

* Mixing Pfizer, AstraZ COVID-19 shots with Moderna gives better immune response -UK study *
https://www.reuters.com/business/he...a-gives-better-immune-response-uk-2021-12-06/

Too much to copy and paste, but a worthwhile read and something good to know.


----------



## Johnny b

* Most reported U.S. Omicron cases have hit the fully vaccinated - CDC *
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/mo...ses-have-hit-fully-vaccinated-cdc-2021-12-10/



> Most of the 43 COVID-19 cases caused by the Omicron variant identified in the United States so far were in people who were fully vaccinated, and a third of them had received a booster dose, according to a U.S. report published on Friday.
> ................
> While the numbers are very small, they add to growing concerns that current COVID-19 vaccines may offer less protection against the highly transmissible new variant.


While reports are early and scant, the threat is obviously there and it's a good idea to be using masks and practicing social distancing.
In my area, I've noticed a lack of both as time passes.

Use common sense. You wouldn't cross a busy highway with out looking both ways. It only increases the risk of injury.
Why would a person intentionally choose a greater risk of being infected? ( that's rhetorical )


----------



## Wino

Grocery shopping yesterday. More unmasked than masked. Makes it easy to pick out the Trumpist.


----------



## Johnny b

Some good news:

* Final data on pills to treat Covid-19 holds strong against hospitalization and death, Pfizer says *
https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/14/health/pfizer-paxlovid-pills-covid-treatment/index.html



> Pfizer's updated results for its experimental treatment for Covid-19 showed it cut the risk of hospitalization or death by 89% if given to high-risk adults within a few days of their first symptoms, the company announced in a news release Tuesday.


----------



## Johnny b

Some not so good news:

* Omicron is spreading 'every place at once,' experts say. What it could mean for holiday plans. *
https://news.yahoo.com/omicron-spreading-every-place-once-013616133.html



> The omicron variant of the coronavirus is moving faster than surveillance systems can track it and has so unnerved some medical experts that they're starting to put the brakes on preparations for their holiday gatherings.


edit:

*CDC director shares update on spread of omicron variant, now in 33 states *
https://news.yahoo.com/cdc-director-shares-spread-omicron-133655311.html


----------



## Johnny b

* UPDATE 1-Omicron more likely to reinfect than Delta, no milder -study *
https://www.reuters.com/business/he...ly-reinfect-than-delta-study-says-2021-12-17/

* Omicron cases doubling in 1.5 to 3 days in areas with local spread - WHO *
https://www.reuters.com/business/he...-days-areas-with-local-spread-who-2021-12-18/


----------



## Johnny b

I was in Krogers and Walmart yesterday.
With Covid-19 ramping up in Ohio, at noon, less than half the customers at Kroger were wearing masks. All the employees seen were wearing masks.
At Walmart, early in the morning, about 1/3 of the customers weren't wearing masks and 1/2 of the employees weren't also.

Even if you're vaccinated, a minor re-infection is still possible and with that, the possible transmission to others.
Wearing a mask and social distancing is a good idea for everyone.

Not using common sense only prolongs the pandemic.


----------



## 2twenty2

All stores in my area require customers and staff to wear masks. No mask, no entry. Restaurants, sporting venues, etc require masks and proof of vaccination


----------



## Cookiegal

Yes, although it varies province to province they are generally more strict on the measures in Canada.

The same as knuck, here everyone has to wear a mask when entering a place of business and so do all of the employees. If they aren't the establishment can call the police and have them expelled (and they will also be fined) if they won't leave voluntarily or comply with the mask regulation.

But even despite that, I'm still not comfortable going into a brick and mortar store (other than groceries) with the cases on the rise and this variant being more easily spread. We don't even know if the 2 metres and masking is enough to protect us at this point because so many vaccinated people are getting infected and claim they followed all the rules (who knows if that's actually true or not). I always wear protective glasses as well as they said from the beginning it can't enter through the eyes too.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> Yes, although it varies province to province they are generally more strict on the measures in Canada.
> 
> The same as knuck, here everyone has to wear a mask when entering a place of business and so do all of the employees. If they aren't the establishment can call the police and have them expelled (and they will also be fined) if they won't leave voluntarily or comply with the mask regulation.
> 
> But even despite that, I'm still not comfortable going into a brick and mortar store *(other than groceries)* with the cases on the rise and this variant being more easily spread. We don't even know if the 2 metres and masking is enough to protect us at this point because so many vaccinated people are getting infected and claim they followed all the rules (who knows if that's actually true or not). I always wear protective glasses as well as they said from the beginning it can't enter through the eyes too.


Like you I'm also not comfortable entering a store and so lately I have been ordering my groceries online (Walmart) and having them delivered to my door.


----------



## Cookiegal

2twenty2 said:


> Like you I'm also not comfortable entering a store and so lately I have been ordering my groceries online (Walmart) and having them delivered to my door.


I've been considering that in the future as the cases are even higher than in the beginning. For now, a kind neighbour has been picking up groceries for me (just had emergency abdominal surgery last week and can't drive or lift anything over 10 lbs.). When you order online, I don't like the fact that you can't pick your stuff yourself they send you the things that are not as fresh or are close to expiring because no one is buying them them. But, as long as it's edible I guess it's a small price to pay for being safe.


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> ....................................... I don't like the fact that you can't pick your stuff yourself they send you the things that are not as fresh or are close to expiring because no one is buying them them. But, as long as it's edible I guess it's a small price to pay for being safe.


Just a little humor......I wouldn't buy any fruits or vegies at Walmart sight unseen. Krogers, too.

I limit my shopping to early hours when possible. Usually no later than 9 am.
But sometimes, like with Kroger Pharmacy, I just go. They're busy even in the mornings.
Fortunately, that's seldom.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> I've been considering that in the future as the cases are even higher than in the beginning. For now, a kind neighbour has been picking up groceries for me *(just had emergency abdominal surgery last week and can't drive or lift anything over 10 lbs.)*. When you order online, (*I don't like the fact that you can't pick your stuff yourself)* _*they send you the things that are not as fresh or are close to expiring because no one is buying them them. *_ But, as long as it's edible I guess it's a small price to pay for being safe.


1)Hoping your feeling better.💐

2)I don't either but I'd rather that then being in the store.

3)I have never received any groceries that have been close to the expiry date. What does happen is if there are items you pick and are not available you don't know until the order is in transit. There is an option for substitutions but I never have that selected as I don't know what the substitution would be.


----------



## Johnny b

It's getting dangerous to even be in a hospital, imo.


----------



## 2twenty2

Johnny b said:


> It's getting dangerous to even be in a hospital, imo.


Getting dangerous to be anywhere where there is people

I got my booster shot appointment set for Jan. 4


----------



## Johnny b

2twenty2 said:


> Getting dangerous to be anywhere where there is people


Indeed.
Sadly.


----------



## Johnny b

I like to stay informed, but this issue is getting me depressed.
Not that I could get infected so much, as the mentality of the deniers and the laissez faire attitude that's being promoted.
I sense a lot of bad/severe times to come from this and have a hard time seeing past it.
Not a lot of cooperation when it comes to survival.


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> .I wouldn't buy any fruits or vegies at Walmart sight unseen. Krogers, too.


Exactly.


Johnny b said:


> I limit my shopping to early hours when possible. Usually no later than 9 am.


I did that for a while but then I would just go any time as well. I live in a small rural community and we didn't have many cases here until last week.


----------



## Cookiegal

2twenty2 said:


> Hoping your feeling better.


Thanks Knuck. Slow but sure. 


2twenty2 said:


> I have never received any groceries that have been close to the expiry date.


You're lucky. I see them on the shelf and even some canned goods actually past their expiry date. You have to be careful and always check the dates.


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> It's getting dangerous to even be in a hospital, imo.


Believe me, it's the last place I wanted to be and they were overcrowded of course. I never even made it into an examination cubicle which is normally where the ER doctor comes to see you. I went from spending 10-1/2 hours in the hallway of the ER right up to surgery. I have to say I was treated very well though, all the doctors nurses and orderlies were nice and took the time to help despite being very busy.


----------



## Cookiegal

Sadly, we just heard on the news yesterday that a 2 month old baby that was healthy at birth contracted Covid-19 (assuming at home) and died.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> Thanks Knuck. Slow but sure.
> You're lucky. I see them on the shelf and even some canned goods actually past their expiry date. *You have to be careful and always check the dates.*


----------



## Johnny b

I've stocked up on a lot of dried foods ( beans  and pasta ) so my trips to the store are a lot less these days, maybe once every 2 weeks.
Canned goods, too. Sweet corn and peas. Some frozen fish but not a lot.
And typical needs like paper towels and toilet paper.

I've almost become a prepper.


----------



## Johnny b

Cookiegal said:


> .........................................(just had emergency abdominal surgery last week and can't drive or lift anything over 10 lbs.). ........................


Hope all is well now.


----------



## 2twenty2

Johnny b said:


> I've stocked up on a lot of dried foods ( beans  and pasta ) so my trips to the store are a lot less these days, maybe once every 2 weeks.
> Canned goods, too. Sweet corn and peas. Some frozen fish but not a lot.
> And typical needs like paper towels and toilet paper.
> 
> *I've almost become a prepper.*


Out of 100 points
Your score 45 😁

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2069270/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doomsday_Preppers


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> Hope all is well now.


I'm getting there. Thanks Johnny.


----------



## Johnny b

2twenty2 said:


> Out of 100 points
> Your score 45 😁
> 
> https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2069270/
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doomsday_Preppers


lol.
There's preppers and then there are doomsday prepprs. 

But when you run out of toilet paper, well .................


----------



## Johnny b

* Vaccine Data Gaps Point to Millions More in U.S. Who Lack Shots *
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-point-to-millions-more-in-u-s-who-lack-shots



> The U.S. government has over-counted the number of Americans who are at least partly vaccinated against the coronavirus, state officials warn, meaning millions more people are unprotected as the pandemic's winter surge gathers steam.
> ...............
> On the bright side, the miscount means more Americans have received booster shots than shown in official federal data.


----------



## Johnny b

* Omicron may sideline two leading drugs against COVID-19 *
https://abcnews.go.com/Technology/wireStory/omicron-sideline-leading-drugs-covid-19-81844019



> For more than a year antibody drugs from Regeneron and Eli Lilly have been the go-to treatments for early COVID-19, thanks to their ability to head off severe disease and keep patients out of the hospital.
> 
> But both drugmakers recently warned that laboratory testing suggests their therapies will be much less potent against omicron,........
> ............
> A third antibody from British drugmaker GlaxoSmithKline appears to be the best positioned to fight omicron. But Glaxo's drug is not widely available in the U.S.
> ........
> U.S. health officials are now rationing scarce drug supplies to states.


----------



## Johnny b

IMO, common sense would alleviate the intensity of this cautionary news article.
That would involve masks, social distancing and vaccines. 
Hopefully, medicines from pharma will be approved soon.

* U.S. could see 1 million cases per day, warns departing NIH director Francis Collins  *
https://www.npr.org/2021/12/19/1065575540/nih-director-francis-collins-omicron


----------



## 2twenty2

US could be in store for a 'grim beginning' to the new year, experts warn, as dual variants of Covid-19 spread
https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/20/health/us-coronavirus-monday/index.html


----------



## Johnny b

* Omicron responsible for more than 73% of new US cases, CDC data shows *
https://www.cnn.com/world/live-news/omicron-variant-coronavirus-news-12-20-21-intl/index.html


----------



## Johnny b

* Mask up! The best face masks for use against COVID-19 [Updated] *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...tain-the-best-masks-for-use-against-covid-19/

I've been using 3M N95 masks long before the Covid-19 pandemic, for a mold allergy problem.
Prices have come down since the beginning of the pandemic and they're quite reasonable now.


----------



## 2twenty2

Three arrested for anti-vax COVID-19 jab scam in Sicily
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/worl...ily-for-anti-vax-covid-19-jab-scam/ar-AAS1DbE
https://torontosun.com/news/crime/three-arrested-for-anti-vax-covid-19-jab-scam-in-sicily


----------



## Johnny b

That's crazy!


----------



## Johnny b

I had to go Walmart today.
With Omicron raging in Ohio, somewhere between 10 to 20 percent were wearing masks, and those seem to be more of the middle aged.

So when I just read this I wasn't surprised.

* Ohio reports highest daily COVID case total of entire pandemic *
https://www.springfieldnewssun.com/...-in-nearly-a-year/OF5LPZFAS5EF7GNHGSDQPTLLHM/



> "The 12,502 cases reported in the past 24 hours is the highest true 24-hour case reporting throughout the entire pandemic, with only days that have reflected backlogs or multi-day reporting after holidays exceeding today's figure," said Megan Smith, Ohio Department of Health spokeswoman.


And as far as the severity of infection, I've been reading conflicting reports.

edit: more on Ohio

* Central Ohio frontline nurses pleading for community to help stop spread of COVID-19*
https://www.nbc4i.com/community/hea...or-community-to-help-stop-spread-of-covid-19/

* 'The crisis is dire': Ohio National Guard to begin deployment at state's medical facilities on Thursday *
https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/h...ities/95-1aece3f4-b29a-4f45-86a4-925225005ce9


> Ohio Adjutant General Maj. Gen. John Harris says most of the over 1,000 national guard members will be sent to Northeast Ohio hospitals.


----------



## Johnny b

:up:

* Coronavirus (COVID-19) Update: FDA Authorizes First Oral Antiviral for Treatment of COVID-19 *
https://www.fda.gov/news-events/pre...rizes-first-oral-antiviral-treatment-covid-19



> Today, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration issued an emergency use authorization (EUA) for Pfizer's Paxlovid ..............
> 
> "Today's authorization introduces the first treatment for COVID-19 that is in the form of a pill that is taken orally - a major step forward in the fight against this global pandemic," said Patrizia Cavazzoni, M.D., director of the FDA's Center for Drug Evaluation and Research.


----------



## Johnny b

*Early use of convalescent plasma reduced hospitalizations, raising hopes for treating omicron variant, scientists say *
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/12/21/covid-treatment-convalescent-plasma/


----------



## Johnny b

Ohio:

* Ohio reports nearly 16,000 daily COVID cases, sets record for 3rd straight day *
https://www.daytondailynews.com/loc...early-16000-cases/QUUEDM33J5CA5HZM6E6Y5GVDBY/


----------



## Johnny b

This article is not designed to scare anyone off of using the Pfizer pill.
It's about how to use it properly in conjunction with other drugs.

* Pfizer antiviral pills may be risky with other medications *
https://www.nbcnews.com/health/heal...pills-covid-symptoms-may-risky-drugs-rcna9683



> In its fact sheet about Paxlovid, the FDA has published a detailed list of medications that may interact harmfully with ritonavir, including those that should not be paired with the Covid antivirals.
> 
> However, pharmacists stress that many of the drug interactions are manageable and that they should not preclude most people from taking Paxlovid.


https://www.fda.gov/media/155050/download


----------



## Johnny b

FYI:

* COVID vaccine cocktails: A guide to mixing and matching Pfizer, Moderna, J&J booster shots *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...cine-booster-shots-pfizer-moderna/9022187002/


----------



## Johnny b

It's not looking good in my state, Ohio.

https://abc6onyourside.com/news/local/ohio-coronavirus-update-december-29-2021



> The Ohio Department of Health reported 20,320 new coronavirus cases and 592 more hospitalizations.
> 
> That breaks the record for Ohio's highest number of COVID-19 cases ever reported in a single day, which was previously set on Dec. 23, 2021, with 15,989 new COVID-19 cases.
> 
> There have been 1,975723 cases, 95,709 hospitalizations, and 28,780 deaths in Ohio since the start of the pandemic.


----------



## Cookiegal

Because of rising cases and hospitalizations the government just implemented some new measures here. Schools only go back January 17th, restaurants have to close as of 5:00 p.m tomorrow and we now have a curfew of 10:00 p.m. to 5:00 a.m. among a few other things. They don't want any gatherings for New Years at all.


----------



## renegade600

arkansas broke a single day record of almost 5k. Though it is not as high as most states, it is still a scary figure.


----------



## Johnny b

https://www.daytondailynews.com/loc...total-covid-cases/ON6WLAT3PNB2HBQ5EUUNF5PLUM/



> The state set another record for daily cases, reporting 20,598 on Friday. The previous record was 20,320 daily cases on Wednesday. Ohio is averaging 11,797 cases a day over the last 21 days, according to the state health department. A year ago, on Dec. 31, 2020, the state's 21-day average was 8,025 cases.


----------



## Johnny b

An article about the virology going on over at Walter Reed.
It's in the early stages of testing and looks good so far.

* US Army Creates Single Vaccine Against All COVID & SARS Variants, Researchers Say  *
https://www.defenseone.com/technolo...ctive-against-all-covid-sars-variants/360089/



> Walter Reed's Spike Ferritin Nanoparticle COVID-19 vaccine, or SpFN, completed animal trials earlier this year with positive results. Phase 1 of human trials, wrapped up this month, again with positive results that are undergoing final review, Dr. Kayvon Modjarrad, director of Walter Reed's infectious diseases branch, said in an exclusive interview with _Defense One_ on Tuesday. The new vaccine will still need to undergo phase 2 and phase 3 trials.


.................

There is much information here:

* Series of preclinical studies supports the Army's pan-coronavirus vaccine development strategy *
https://www.wrair.army.mil/node/657

........................

Here is a research article on their project:

* A SARS-CoV-2 ferritin nanoparticle vaccine elicits protective immune responses in nonhuman primates *
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/scitranslmed.abi5735

Abstract:


> The emergence of severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) variants stresses the continued need for next-generation vaccines that confer broad protection against coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19). We developed and evaluated an adjuvanted SARS-CoV-2 spike ferritin nanoparticle (SpFN) vaccine in nonhuman primates. High-dose (50 μg) SpFN vaccine, given twice 28 days apart, induced a Th1-biased CD4 T cell helper response and elicited neutralizing antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 wild-type and variants of concern, as well as against SARS-CoV-1. These potent humoral and cell-mediated immune responses translated into rapid elimination of replicating virus in the upper and lower airways and lung parenchyma of nonhuman primates following high-dose SARS-CoV-2 respiratory challenge. The immune response elicited by SpFN vaccination and resulting efficacy in nonhuman primates supports the utility of SpFN as a vaccine candidate for SARS-causing betacoronaviruses.


----------



## Cookiegal

This happened in your state of Ohio Johnny. 

An elderly wowan died from Covid-19 after contracting it from a friend who hid the fact that they had tested postive so they could all play cards. 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ID-friend-hid-infection-attend-card-game.html


----------



## Johnny b

That is really sad.

I read too much of it.
I find I can't say much more than that.


----------



## 2twenty2

Well where I am, we're back in lock down 🔑🗝🔒


----------



## 2twenty2

New patent-free COVID vaccine developed as *"gift to the world"*
https://newatlas.com/health-wellbeing/patent-free-coronavirus-vaccine-protein-subunit/


----------



## 2twenty2

I am on my way to get the booster shot.


----------



## Gr3iz

Way to go knuck!


----------



## 2twenty2

Gr3iz said:


> Way to go knuck!


Thanks Mark!


----------



## Cookiegal

2twenty2 said:


> I am on my way to get the booster shot.


I just got back from getting mine.


----------



## 2twenty2

Cookiegal said:


> I just got back from getting mine.


 😍


----------



## Gr3iz

Good deal, Cookie!


----------



## Cookiegal

Gr3iz said:


> Good deal, Cookie!


I wasn't crazy about mixing vaccines but here right now we have no choice. I got two Pfizer shots and this time it was Moderna. Pfizer is in short supply right now and they need it for the kids who can't get Moderna. Anyway, I felt it was more important to get the extra protection no matter what. Some say mixing might even give a slightly better protection.


----------



## Gr3iz

That stuff is all above my pay grade ... ;-)


----------



## Johnny b

I read several weeks ago, mixing was OK.

https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/p1021-covid-booster.html


----------



## Cookiegal

Gr3iz said:


> That stuff is all above my pay grade


Mine too.


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> I read several weeks ago, mixing was OK.


Yeah, that's what they're all saying.


----------



## Johnny b

* New COVID variant 'IHU' with 46 mutations detected in France *
https://news.yahoo.com/covid-variant-ihu-46-mutations-031400156.html



> The 46 mutations had not been detected in other countries, The Independent noted.
> 
> The person infected with the B.1.640.2 variant, dubbed IHU after being discovered by scientists at the IHU Mediterranee Infection, was fully vaccinated and had just returned from a three-day trip to Cameroon when they tested positive, the researchers said.
> 
> Any speculation or alarm would be premature, the researchers said.


----------



## Johnny b

* Nation averaging 550,000 reported infections per day; Biden tells vaccinated people: 'You are highly protected.' Live COVID updates. *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...micron-cases-biden-vaccines-tests/9084898002/



> The U.S. topped the 1 million mark in new coronavirus cases for the first time Monday. Though the total of 1.08 million was likely enhanced by holiday weekend backlogs, it obliterated the previous record of 591,000 set Thursday.
> 
> By Tuesday at 9:30 p.m. ET, another 859,245 new cases had been reported.


in addition:



> Biden pointed out the U.S. has enough vaccines and booster shots for everybody in the nation, but 35 million adults have yet to get the shots.


That's not going to end well.


----------



## Johnny b

* COVID-19 may have killed nearly 3 million in India, far more than official counts show *
https://www.science.org/content/art...3-million-india-far-more-official-counts-show



> *New analysis bolsters idea that country's seemingly low death rate was misleading*


----------



## Johnny b

Booster shots are important against Omicron.

* Omicron resistant to most monoclonal antibodies but neutralized by a booster dose *
https://medicalxpress.com/news/2022-01-omicron-resistant-monoclonal-antibodies-neutralized.html

A lot to read. This stood out:


> The scientists observed that the blood of patients previously infected with COVID-19, collected up to 12 months after symptoms, and that of individuals who had received two doses of the Pfizer or AstraZeneca vaccine, taken five months after vaccination, barely neutralized the Omicron variant. But the sera of individuals who had received a booster dose of Pfizer, analyzed one month after vaccination, remained effective against Omicron.


----------



## Johnny b

Local hospitals in my area are having to adjust to the spiking cases of Covid-19:

* Premier Health will postpone nonemergency procedures amid record COVID hospitalizations *
https://www.daytondailynews.com/loc...-hospitalizations/L4XPZTIZ5JHABPPOYHDBPCLJ7E/



> The hospital network announced Friday that this policy will go into effect Monday, Jan. 10, and last through Jan. 31. This move comes after Kettering Health, the Dayton region's other major hospital network, suspended nonemergency procedures on Wednesday.


----------



## Johnny b

Be careful about where you get a Covid test:

*What's the Center for COVID Control? Questionable sites spotlight nation's thirst for quick testing *
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ing-americans-describe-long-waits/9133310002/



> As Americans nationwide continue to scramble for access to quick, reliable COVID-19 tests amid a national shortage, state and local authorities are warning residents to be on the lookout for fraudulent pop-up sites trying to scam people out of money and personal information. Some regretful test-takers spoke to USA TODAY about a particular string of testing centers: the so-called "Center for COVID Control."


----------



## Johnny b

And here's an article on fake test kits:

* Officials are warning the public about fake Covid-19 testing kits. Here's how to spot them *
https://www.cnn.com/2022/01/08/us/fake-covid-19-testing-kit-how-to-know-wellness/index.html


----------



## 2twenty2

I've seen it posted here that everybody knows somebody who has it/got it. Well I didn't until now. My ex has it


----------



## Johnny b

A 'new' variant to watch out for:
Deltacron.
A variant with the mutations of both Delta and Omicron.

* Cyprus Finds Covid-19 Infections That Combine Delta and Omicron *
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-that-combine-delta-and-omicron?sref=ctSjKj2N



> A strain of Covid-19 that combines delta and omicron was found in Cyprus, according to Leondios Kostrikis, professor of biological sciences at the University of Cyprus and head of the Laboratory of Biotechnology and Molecular Virology.
> 
> "There are currently omicron and delta co-infections and we found this strain that is a combination of these two," Kostrikis said in an interview with Sigma TV Friday. The discovery was named "deltacron" due to the identification of omicron-like genetic signatures within the delta genomes, he said.


----------



## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> ...
> 
> in addition:
> 
> Biden pointed out the U.S. has enough vaccines and booster shots for everybody in the nation, but *35 million adults* have yet to get the shots
> 
> That's not going to end well.


something tells me this is the 1/2 half of the trump supporters that are the fanatics and believed Trump... and probably would booed him too if they were in that talk where he said he got the booster.


----------



## Couriant

2twenty2 said:


> I've seen it posted here that everybody knows somebody who has it/got it. Well I didn't until now. My ex has it


It was a matter of time that my brother in law (Strong opposer to vaccine; lives in FL) and his daughter caught it. A year or two ago he finish chemo for a cancer in his neck... You would think he would be more cautious. My father in law (really old, also in FL) had a bad infection (not flu/crona related) and had a below knee amputation. Last March he had a stroke. Thankfully he has had his shots now but he is still considered high risk. He couldn't celebrate his birthday because his son has the virus.... we ended up ordering pizza for him...

I am not surprised anymore... in any of it. I heard for the first time 'no jab, no job' - I think it's Bank of America (it's one of those big banks if it's not BoA) that will be firing people next week that they had to put on non-paid leave until they got the vaccine. While it sucks to be threaten of your livelihood, this is not some bullying technique. This is a serious thing and people outside their bubble needs to be protected.


----------



## Johnny b

Couriant said:


> .........
> 
> .............. This is a serious thing and people outside their bubble needs to be protected.


I agree 100%.


----------



## Johnny b

Couriant said:


> something tells me this is the 1/2 half of the trump supporters that are the fanatics and believed Trump... and probably would booed him too if they were in that talk where he said he got the booster.


No doubt.

Those supporters also seem to have forgotten it was Trump that ordered that lock down early into the pandemic.


----------



## Johnny b

* Novartis to seek FDA approval for COVID-19 treatment after positive data *
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/n...for-covid-19-treatment-ensovibep-271641796764



> Novartis AG and Molecular Partners AG on Monday reported positive topline data from their antiviral Covid-19 treatment ensovibep, and will seek expedited regulatory authorizations globally.
> 
> The results from a Phase 2 study of 407 patients receiving a single intravenous dose of ensovibep showed a 78% reduction in hospitalization or emergency-room visits related to Covid-19 compared with a placebo, and a improvement in time to a clinical recovery, Novartis said.


----------



## Johnny b

* T-cells from common colds can provide protection against COVID-19 - study *
https://www.reuters.com/business/he...protection-against-covid-19-study-2022-01-10/



> LONDON, Jan 10 (Reuters) - High levels of T-cells from common cold coronaviruses can provide protection against COVID-19, an Imperial College London study published on Monday has found, which could inform approaches for second-generation vaccines.


also:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...d-by-common-cold-also-fend-off-covid-in-study

And:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-common-cold-t-cells-natural-immunity-variant-proof-vaccine/

The study:
*Cross-reactive memory T cells associate with protection against SARS-CoV-2 infection in COVID-19 contacts *
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-021-27674-x


----------



## Johnny b

* U.S. sets new COVID hospitalization record, signaling Omicron surge could be less mild than experts hoped *
https://news.yahoo.com/us-sets-new-...e-less-mild-than-experts-hoped-100032439.html

Much worth reading.
This stands out:



> "Mild means mild - relatively mild - for the individual who's infected. But it does not necessarily mean mild at a population level."
> .............
> ...............tests are now catching just one in four or five U.S. infections - which means that Omicron is actually infecting more than 3 million Americans each day.
> ..........
> "Every Covid + patient requires the same isolation to protect other patients from getting infected,"
> 
> "As an E.R. Doctor, I Fear Health Care Collapse More Than Omicron," Spencer elaborated on why U.S. hospitals trying to treat more than 140,000 COVID-19 patients at once represents an "unfolding tragedy."


And especially, this:


> "The Omicron surge is real - and even if Omicron is 'milder,' it's not mild," Spencer concluded on Twitter. "It causes severe disease half as often as Delta, but infects 2-4x as many people, potentially washing out any potential 'benefit.'"


So....everyone needs to be wearing a mask when appropriate, practice social distancing, and get fully vaccinated if not already.
This pandemic is far from over.


----------



## 2twenty2

Johnny b said:


> * U.S. sets new COVID hospitalization record, signaling Omicron surge could be less mild than experts hoped *
> https://news.yahoo.com/us-sets-new-...e-less-mild-than-experts-hoped-100032439.html
> 
> *So....everyone needs to be wearing a mask when appropriate, practice social distancing, and get fully vaccinated if not already.
> This pandemic is far from over.*


 👨‍⚕️ 👩‍⚕️ 😷<.................................................>😷


----------



## Johnny b

I just rescheduled my appointment with my ophthalmologist to early summer.
Hopefully, conditions will be better then.
Fortunately, it's just a checkup, no issues.


----------



## 2twenty2

Johnny b said:


> I just rescheduled my appointment with my ophthalmologist to early summer.
> Hopefully, conditions will be better then.
> Fortunately, it's just a checkup, no issues.


I canceled my 2020 appointment and my 2021 appointment because of covid


----------



## lochlomonder

An elderly friend of ours was hospitalised last week with pneumonia and C. Diff., so she was in rough shape. Because of the rising requirements for COVID cases, she was basically booted out of hospital, told to drink plenty of fluids, and told she needed to pay a $900 co-pay for a specific medication. Thankfully, the patient advocate called Merck and got them to provide her the medication for free through some scheme, so that's one less worry on her mind.

So, an old lady doesn't get the treatment she needs because of selfish people who still insist they don't want to be vaccinated. I'm beyond angry with this wholly-selfish attitude.


----------



## Cookiegal

Quebec's public health director Horacio Arruda has resigned citing erosion of public opinion leading to failure to comply with directives:

https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/quebec-...admitting-erosion-of-public-opinion-1.5734967


----------



## Johnny b

* U.S. issues 'Do Not Travel' warning for Canada *

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us-cdc-tells-americans-avoid-travel-canada-2022-01-10/



> WASHINGTON, Jan 10 (Reuters) - The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and U.S. State Department on Monday advised against travel to neighboring Canada because of a rising number of COVID-19 cases as the Omicron variant spreads.


----------



## Johnny b

Take notice:

* FDA head: Omicron is a "natural disaster… most people are gonna get COVID" *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...ral-disaster-most-people-are-gonna-get-covid/

Too much to copy and paste it all.

First and last paragraphs:


> US officials are comparing the ultratransmissible omicron coronavirus variant to a natural disaster as the country continues to shatter records, logging over 1.4 million new COVID-19 cases Monday and seeing hospitalizations at all-time highs of over 140,000.
> 
> "I think it's hard to process what's actually happening right now, which is: most people are gonna get COVID, alright," Woodcock said. "And what we need to do is make sure that the hospitals can still function, [and that] transportation [and] other essential services are not disrupted while this happens. I think after that will be a good time to reassess how we're approaching this pandemic."


----------



## Johnny b

* How to spot fake N95 and KN95 masks online *
https://news.yahoo.com/spot-fake-n95-kn95-masks-153716157.html



> According to the CDC, about 60% of masks labeled as KN95, the Chinese version of the high-filtration masks, are actually counterfeit.
> ........
> "So when buying an N95 ... look for the stamp that says, 'NIOSH,'"
> 
> NIOSH stands for the National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health, and it's the certifying federal entity for a variety of masks and respirators, including the N95.
> ........
> However, if you spot the NIOSH approval on a KN95 masks, that's a red flag.
> 
> "(The) CDC, through NIOSH, does not approve KN95 masks or any other respiratory protective device certified to international standards," according to a CDC notice about counterfeits.


* Counterfeit Respirators / Misrepresentation of NIOSH-Approval *
https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/usernotices/counterfeitResp.html


----------



## Johnny b

* Don't use this at-home COVID test, FDA warns. It could give you a false positive *
https://www.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article257246337.html

* Potential Risk of False Test Results *
https://www.fda.gov/medical-devices...9-tests-fda-safety-communication#falseresults


----------



## mohittomar13

I got infected with Corona thrice and with Omicron once already. I think the body's immune system must have understood that this idiot is not going to stay home, so let's upgrade the germ-fighting mechanism. But it is not that I do not stay at home, the problem is this infection is so contagious that you can't escape it. The only defense is the body's immune system.

I've been taking Tinospora cordifolia juice. I have plenty growing in the backyard. I drink the juice in the morning on an empty stomach. The Ayurveda doctor told me to give a break after every 90 days as it so potent that it might trigger an auto-immune disease. But so far it seems to be working. I always check on NCBI's website before trying any ayurvedic medicine. The report seems promising.


----------



## Johnny b

mohittomar13 said:


> ..........................
> 
> The best home remedy, for now, is Tinospora cordifolia juice. ................


The plant doesn't seem common in the US.
And there are some concerns with liver and drug interactions.
The list at the link includes several drugs I take, so for myself, I'd pass on it.

https://www.webmd.com/vitamins/ai/ingredientmono-1157/tinospora-cordifolia

I looked up "Ayurveda medicine" to learn it's approach to medical treatment.
I prefer the "western" concepts, but a healthy mind and healthy living go a long way to staying healthy. And that's something currently in short supply here in the US.
We are what we eat and when we think like a loon.....well.....there you go.

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/wellness-and-prevention/ayurveda


----------



## mohittomar13

Thanks for sharing those links @Johnny b . When we like something we tend to see only the +ve side and forget about the -ve side, I think that what was happening with me. 🤣🤣 Your links provide details about when not to take Tinospora. Whenever taking a medicine we must look both at its positive and negative effects. Its interaction with other medicines may be one of the reason the doctor suggested to give a 35-40 days break before continuing the juice again. Not sure though. But he was mentioning something about auto-immune problems that Tinospora can trigger if taken for longer period of time.

I usually check papers and researches on NCBI's website. It's a USA Govt website that publishes research related work. As its backed by government so the information must be true. I found an article on it about the benefits of Tinospora.

By the way since I've started taking the juice in the morning I've experienced that I fall ill very less now. This could be a placebo. But I'm happy that not just me but everyone at my place recovered from corona completely and without any long term problem.

This could also be due to the eating habits. Almost everyone at my house is vegetarian only kids eat eggs sometimes when they are out with friends. And no one consumes alcohol and none smoke cigarettes.

👍👍


----------



## Johnny b

* Texas scientists' new Covid-19 vaccine is cheaper, easier to make and patent-free
*
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/jan/15/corbevax-covid-vaccine-texas-scientists



> Although more than 60 other vaccines are in development using the same technology, Bottazzi said their vaccine is unique because they do not intend to patent it, allowing anyone with the capacity to reproduce it.


:up:


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## Johnny b

More on that Walter Reed vaccine that's about to go into trials:

*Army vaccine could protect against COVID and all future coronaviruses *
https://www.cnet.com/health/army-vaccine-could-protect-against-covid-and-all-future-coronaviruses/



> The vaccines from Moderna, Pfizer and Johnson & Johnson all target the specific virus -- SARS-CoV-2 -- that causes COVID-19. But Army scientists designed their vaccine to be "pan-coronavirus," meaning it could protect against future strains of COVID as well as other coronaviruses.


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## Cookiegal

mohittomar13 said:


> I've been taking Tinospora cordifolia juice. I have plenty growing in the backyard. I drink the juice in the morning on an empty stomach.


Mohit, while it's fine to say you are taking something, to claim it's the best home remedy is not something we allow as it can't be substantiated nor do we give medical advice. If we were to allow that we would have to allow all of the snake oil remedy posts and we certainly don't want to go there. Therefore, I've edited your post accordingly (the quote above is the edited version). Please keep this in mind in the future. Thanks for understanding.


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## mohittomar13

Cookiegal said:


> If we were to allow that we would have to allow all of the snake oil remedy posts and we certainly don't want to go there


😀😀😂😂

Ok, I will keep that in mind. 👍👍 I also support the idea that one should carefully examine both positive and negative effects of a medicine before starting with it. 👍👍


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## Cookiegal

Thanks Mohit. That is definitely smart advice.


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## Johnny b

More issues with crossover infections:

* COVID-infected hamsters in pet shop trigger animal cull in Hong Kong *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...in-pet-shop-trigger-animal-cull-in-hong-kong/



> Authorities in Hong Kong are planning to cull around 2,000 small animals after a pet store employee and several imported hamsters tested positive for COVID-19, according to a report by the Associated Press.
> ...........
> Authorities halted all sales of hamsters in the city as well as the import of hamsters and other small animals, such as chinchillas
> ............
> Meanwhile, people who bought pet hamsters in the city since December 22 must undergo testing. If their pets test positive, they must go into quarantine.


----------



## 2twenty2

Czech anti-vax folk singer dies after catching COVID on purpose
https://torontosun.com/news/world/czech-anti-vax-folk-singer-dies-after-catching-covid-on-purpose


----------



## Johnny b

I was reading the article below and came across some info on Ivermectin.

* Inmates sue Arkansas doc, jail after unknowingly taking dangerous doses of ivermectin *
https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy...owingly-taking-dangerous-doses-of-ivermectin/

At the end of the article:



> Early in the pandemic, a petri dish study suggested that the drug may have some antiviral qualities but at doses that would be 100-times higher than what had been approved in humans.
> ...........
> The widespread misuse of the drug has led to spikes in demand, and, according to a new study in the Journal of the American Medical Association, a surge in insurance reimbursements, too. Despite the fact that they should be incentivized not to cover ineffective treatments, private health insurers are spending around $130 million a year, the study's authors estimate.


( edit: underlining mine )


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## Johnny b

Concerns are rising over a new variant of Omicron:

* New Mutant Omicron Feared to Be the Most Contagious Variant Yet *
https://news.yahoo.com/experts-fear-mutant-omicron-most-100214234.html


----------



## CrazyComputerMan

Johnny b said:


> Concerns are rising over a new variant of Omicron:
> 
> * New Mutant Omicron Feared to Be the Most Contagious Variant Yet *
> https://news.yahoo.com/experts-fear-mutant-omicron-most-100214234.html


This is why as government is scrapping masks to be mandatory but I'll still wear mine till the cases ease to the lowest. This year I'm considering going to London (high covid risk area) but I'll be sticking with trains that have Windows, buses and cycling. Won't be touching London Underground.


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## Johnny b

Have a safe trip.


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## 2twenty2

Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in pulling music from Spotify over 'lies'
https://www.cbc.ca/news/entertainment/joni-mitchell-spotify-neil-young-1.6332374


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## Johnny b

More info on Omicron BA.2

* The omicron subvariant is more contagious, but vaccinated people are less likely to spread it, study finds *
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/01/31/the...are-less-likely-to-spread-it-study-finds.html


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## Cookiegal

Prince Charles has tested positive for Covid-19 for a second time. Apparently the queen was in contact with him two days before so she's being monitored. I really hope she doesn't get it or at least not suffer severe consequences due to her age.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...sts-positive-Covid-forced-self-isolation.html


----------



## Johnny b

* Risk of new heart problems jumps after COVID; mRNA shot side effects no different for cancer patients *
https://www.reuters.com/lifestyle/s...na-shot-side-effects-no-different-2022-02-09/



> An average of one year after their recover from the acute phase of the infection, the COVID-19 survivors ( edit: unvaccinated ) had a 63% higher risk for heart attack, a 69% higher risk for problematic irregular heart rhythm, a 52% higher risk of stroke, a 72% higher risk of heart failure, and a nearly three times higher risk of a potentially fatal blood clot in the lungs compared with the other two groups, according to a report published on Monday in Nature Medicine.
> 
> The risks were high even in people who had mild COVID-19 and did not need to be hospitalized for it, he noted in a Twitter thread. "It really spared no one," Al-Aly told Reuters.


----------



## Johnny b

Like most biological diseases, some form/variation of the Sars Cov virus will be with us for many generations.
IMO, two points.
1.Over time, we'll evolve a natural immunity to reduce both transmission and severity. Herd immunity.
2. Medical science will devise better vaccines and therapies also reducing infection rates and severity.

The pandemic will subside to epidemic proportions. And those epidemics will eventually become sporadic as mankind learns to co-exist.
But the causes will still be there.
Those that refuse vaccines into the future, refuse a common sense approach to healthy practices....they'll have a higher incidence and severity of illness.

Oddly, it's a reality many people either ignore or deny.


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## Cookiegal

Johnny, the user you were responding too was a spammer so they are gone and their posts deleted so I removed the quote from your post.


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## Johnny b

Spammers.....
I got up late .....lol.
Only just had my first coffee of the day.

Oh well.


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## Cookiegal

Queen Elizabeth tests positive for Covid-19:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/queen-elizabeth-covid-1.6358708


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## valis

Ahhh jeeze...


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## Cookiegal

Yeah, they say she has mild symptoms but she has had health issues recently which they never revealed and she is 95 years old so I hope it doesn't take a more serious turn. It would be a shame if that was how she left the throne after all these years.


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## Cookiegal

Now Justin Bieber has Covid-19.


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## Johnny b

I read where claims are made the pandemic is almost over.
IMO.....we are seeing a downside of a 'wave' and the future isn't written.


----------



## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> we are seeing a downside of a 'wave' and the future isn't written.


I think you're right but I also think at this point it's never going to end and we have to expect that we will all get it eventually unless they come up with a vaccine that will protect us with one shot every year like the flu.


----------



## Johnny b

Agree.


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## sportzriter13

Full disclosure, as someone who lost their mom to covid less than a month ago, this is a raw nerve. 

The thing is, too many people see the statement "we have to learn to live with it" as an excuse for pretending it's over. They see that and think we no longer need masks, or vaccines and that people who are vulnerable just have to stay home. 

That is messed up on so many levels. For so many people who survived with major side effects or who lost someone, there's never going to be a sense of normal. Nor will that happen for the healthcare workers (including my husband) who are suffering from the burnout and PTSD from their work. We need to normalize some of the precautions that were adopted because, as we've learned the hard way, vaccines aren't perfect and we'll need to expect variants to keep cropping up. 
We need to normalize allowing work from home when possible, ensuring people who are sick stay home, and perhaps wearing masks during times of high transmission or if we're feeling iffy but have to go out. 
Working from home meant not picking up colds that turned into sinus and ear infections...actually had some state protected sick time to spare. I wish every state in the US had state protected paid sick time and state protected paid time for caregivers. When mom was on the vent, I could not work and balance all the support/responsibility that came with it. 

Also, we need to remember that people who are at high risk deserve to live too...which is why remote access to events, and encouraging vaccination for anyone who can is a must.


----------



## Johnny b

Sorry to hear of your loss.


I agree.
I think we, as a society, should embrace the common sense you point out.

There is another Covid thread in the 'Controversial Topics' forum you might like to participate in. It goes to the debate side of issues more so rather than the general information theme in this thread.


----------



## lochlomonder

I just got back home after one of the worst times of my life. My wife and I both contracted COVID at the start of February; a breakthrough omicron infection since we're both vaccinated and boosted. However, due to the fact my wife has a compromised immune system, she ended up being hospitalised with double pneumonia and blood clots on her lungs after her sats plummeted and she became incoherent.

The attending doctor blitzkrieged her system with antibiotics, antivirals and steroids and, thanks to his diligence and the sterling work of the nurses, I was able to take her home yesterday after 9 days in hospital.

The reason I'm sharing this is because it speaks to @sportzriter13's point about pretending to live with it. I guess this means vulnerable people will remain shut-ins for the foreseeable future. Also, I saw the same stress with the nurses her husband has felt, since they are under-staffed due to colleagues falling ill with breakthrough COVID while treating patients. I can only imagine how difficult it is for them to persist under such arduous circumstances, and they deserve our abiding love & support.

I, too, lost my mother to COVID, and share in your pain, @sportzriter13. My deepest condolences to you and your family.


----------



## Johnny b

Hi Colin.

The best to you and your wife.
Be well


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## sportzriter13

lochlomonder said:


> I just got back home after one of the worst times of my life. My wife and I both contracted COVID at the start of February; a breakthrough omicron infection since we're both vaccinated and boosted. However, due to the fact my wife has a compromised immune system, she ended up being hospitalised with double pneumonia and blood clots on her lungs after her sats plummeted and she became incoherent.
> 
> The attending doctor blitzkrieged her system with antibiotics, antivirals and steroids and, thanks to his diligence and the sterling work of the nurses, I was able to take her home yesterday after 9 days in hospital.
> 
> The reason I'm sharing this is because it speaks to @sportzriter13's point about pretending to live with it. I guess this means vulnerable people will remain shut-ins for the foreseeable future. Also, I saw the same stress with the nurses her husband has felt, since they are under-staffed due to colleagues falling ill with breakthrough COVID while treating patients. I can only imagine how difficult it is for them to persist under such arduous circumstances, and they deserve our abiding love & support.
> 
> I, too, lost my mother to COVID, and share in your pain, @sportzriter13. My deepest condolences to you and your family.


I am SO glad you both are OK!
Also, so damn sorry about your mom. 
My husband is an EMT, so seeing his stress, one can only imagine how hard it is for nurses that care for the patients day in and day out. Definitely get attached.

Your wife and our moms are why I'll ring the alarm for any issue that could prevent pharmacies from dispensing antivirals. ❤


----------



## Cookiegal

Colin,

I'm so sorry for the loss of your Mom and for you and your wife's horrible experience with Covid-19. I'm very glad you were able to stay out of the hospital and that you could bring your wife home after such a scare. I sincerely hope there are no long-lasting effects for either of you.


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## Gr3iz

Colin, I'm glad your wife survived, brother! Sorry to hear about your mother, though ...

Taking my old lady for her booster shot in about :30. She had lost her card and I just got the shot records in the mail yesterday to confirm her initial vaccines.


----------



## lochlomonder

Johnny b said:


> Hi Colin.
> 
> The best to you and your wife.
> Be well


Thanks, Johnny. Much appreciated


----------



## lochlomonder

sportzriter13 said:


> I am SO glad you both are OK!
> Also, so damn sorry about your mom.
> My husband is an EMT, so seeing his stress, one can only imagine how hard it is for nurses that care for the patients day in and day out. Definitely get attached.
> 
> Your wife and our moms are why I'll ring the alarm for any issue that could prevent pharmacies from dispensing antivirals. ❤


Thank you so much! I truly feel for your husband and others in the medical field. It's so damned exhausting for all of them, but I'm hoping the clouds will part and clearer skies will peek through. From what I've seen about pharmacies dispensing antivirals, the initial outlook is promising. Of course, that's contingent on supply & demand. When my wife tested positive at first, she was given a regimen of Paxlovid. I've heard good things about it, but probably moreso for people with healthy immune systems. Still, it's a lot of progress since the two-plus years since COVID was first identified.

May your Mom's memory ever be a comfort to you and your family. ❤


----------



## lochlomonder

Cookiegal said:


> Colin,
> 
> I'm so sorry for the loss of your Mom and for you and your wife's horrible experience with Covid-19. I'm very glad you were able to stay out of the hospital and that you could bring your wife home after such a scare. I sincerely hope there are no long-lasting effects for either of you.


Thank you so much, Karen 

I was sleeping in a cot in her room, so I was glad to do that. I know my Dad couldn't even be with my Mum at the end, so I swore to myself that would never happen with my wife and me. Thank God, we live to fight another day!


----------



## lochlomonder

Gr3iz said:


> Colin, I'm glad your wife survived, brother! Sorry to hear about your mother, though ...
> 
> Taking my old lady for her booster shot in about :30. She had lost her card and I just got the shot records in the mail yesterday to confirm her initial vaccines.


Thank you so much, Mark 

Good for you getting your good lady boosted, brother. I think this makes a lot of difference for this variant in lessening the effects. For me, it was more of a constant headache, congestion, and feeling as if Mike Tyson had used my flanks as a speedball. Still, for me that's nothing in comparison to what others have endured. I count myself fortunate, and will line up for any successive vaccines as required.


----------



## 2twenty2

Toronto Zoo is gearing up to vaccinate 146 animals against COVID-19
https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/20...o-vaccinate-146-animals-against-covid-19.html


----------



## Johnny b

* Omicron is trouncing the argument for "natural immunity" to COVID *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...g-the-argument-for-natural-immunity-to-covid/



> Bad news if you're unvaccinated and think you have strong protection after omicron.


----------



## Johnny b

Ivermectin in the news.
It's been discredited so many times, this isn't exactly shocking.

* Study finds ivermectin, the horse drug Joe Rogan championed as a COVID treatment, does nothing to cure the virus *
https://fortune.com/2022/03/31/ivermectin-covid-joe-rogan-cure-treatment-effectiveness-study/



> ........ on Wednesday, a largescale scientific study showed that ivermectin has "no significant effects" in treating COVID.


Test results here:
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2115869


----------



## Cookiegal

Here in Quebec we're entering a sixth wave. No end in sight.


----------



## Johnny b

Sorry to hear that.

Our press seems to push the view that we might not be hit as severely as Europe and SE Asia, and with less serious medical problems.

IMO, too many people are taking that as fact.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/03/29/health/ba-2-dominant-us/index.html

I still wear a mask around others and still practice social distancing.
But when I go out shopping, very few are doing the same.
I'm concerned about this BA.2 variant having a grater impact than anticipated.


----------



## Cookiegal

For now masks are still obligatory in stores and restaurants and they were talking about relaxing that soon but with the numbers we're showing now and increase in hospitalizations I hope they don't do that. 

I actually started wearing a face shield in addition to the mask. I've had a few sideways looks but no comments so far. But I don't care what anyone thinks.


----------



## Johnny b

An update on vaccine research:

* NIH begins trial of COVID boosters to fight future variants *

https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/04/nih-begins-trial-of-covid-boosters-to-fight-future-variants/


----------



## 2twenty2

U.S. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi tests positive for COVID

https://torontosun.com/news/world/u-s-house-speaker-nancy-pelosi-tests-positive-for-covid


----------



## Johnny b

People are letting their guard down.
And there are those around Pelosi that also have contacted the latest version of Covid.

* After maskless schmoozing, DC elite hit with COVID outbreak *
https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/04/after-maskless-schmoozing-dc-elite-hit-with-covid-outbreak/

Vaccines and masks are useful for avoidance and reducing severity.
Social distancing and common sense, too.


----------



## Wino

Johnny b said:


> People are letting their guard down.
> And there are those around Pelosi that also have contacted the latest version of Covid.
> 
> * After maskless schmoozing, DC elite hit with COVID outbreak *
> https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/04/after-maskless-schmoozing-dc-elite-hit-with-covid-outbreak/
> 
> *Vaccines and masks are useful for avoidance and reducing severity.
> Social distancing and common sense, too.*


Common sense !! In Washington DC !! You serious!! 

Got my 2nd. booster last week. Still masking and distancing when possible - grocery store aisle not good - when out and about. Would estimate 50/50 roughly of masked / unmasked, but probably closer to 30/70. Seems many have the attention span of a cocker spaniel !


----------



## Johnny b

Why does 'common sense' seem so complicated?

Is it unconstitutional?


----------



## Gr3iz

Johnny, it's one of those oxymorons, kinda like _military intelligence _or _happily married_ ... ;-)


----------



## Johnny b

Gr3iz said:


> Johnny, it's one of those oxymorons, kinda like _military intelligence _or _happily married_ ... ;-)


Indeed lol.


----------



## Johnny b

Wino said:


> Common sense !! In Washington DC !! You serious!!
> 
> ............................Would estimate 50/50 roughly of masked / unmasked, but probably closer to 30/70. Seems many have the attention span of a cocker spaniel !


Lately when I go shopping, I stand out as the exception.
I've experienced unmasked people looking at me and taking pains to avoid me in the isles.
I don't complain.
I'm glad they do.

Every spring I send flowers to my neurosurgeon and her staff.
It's a small florist shop.
I walk in as another unmasked customer walks out.
I approach the counter and the manager, unmasked, takes one look at me and rushes to the back to get her mask.
I laughed to myself.
If the person leaving was infected, a good chance she probably was, also.

She was more afraid of me with a mask than the apparent stranger that just left unmasked.
Go figure.


----------



## Gr3iz

I, too, am the exception, rather than the rule. I'm masked in any store and medical facility, even when most are not. I don't care!


----------



## SeanLaurence

Johnny b said:


> Lately when I go shopping, I stand out as the exception.
> I've experienced unmasked people looking at me and taking pains to avoid me in the isles.
> I don't complain.
> I'm glad they do.
> 
> Every spring I send flowers to my neurosurgeon and her staff.
> It's a small florist shop.
> I walk in as another unmasked customer walks out.
> I approach the counter and the manager, unmasked, takes one look at me and rushes to the back to get her mask.
> I laughed to myself.
> If the person leaving was infected, a good chance she probably was, also.
> 
> She was more afraid of me with a mask than the apparent stranger that just left unmasked.
> Go figure.


Sounds like she did not want to offend a customer. 
Presumably she knows enough about your medical history that she would assume you are at a higher risk.
Unfortunately, Covid lingers in stale air, so if anyone came in with an infection and the room was not ventilated then putting on masks would have little effect.
Our provincial health officer estimated that half the population got infected with Omicron in the last wave.


----------



## Johnny b

SeanLaurence said:


> Sounds like she did not want to offend a customer.
> Presumably she knows enough about your medical history that she would assume you are at a higher risk.
> Unfortunately, Covid lingers in stale air, so if anyone came in with an infection and the room was not ventilated then putting on masks would have little effect.
> Our provincial health officer estimated that half the population got infected with Omicron in the last wave.


Well, she doesn't know my medical history to start with and with a mask on, my age doesn't show. ( fortunately )
Transactions in the past were done mostly over the Internet.

My 'high risk' is from age and another issue most don't have or at least know of.
In the past, I had an over active immune system that created issues with histamine-like reactions in mast cells. A mold sensitivity from an unusually high exposure.
A much lower severity than seen with Covid sufferers, but still difficult to address. The 'lung' issue.
It took almost 3 years of experimental therapy to get over it. EPD. Now illegal in the US.
So I'm more concerned about what I breath in, than most people, to start with.



> Unfortunately, Covid lingers in stale air, so if anyone came in with an infection and the room was not ventilated then putting on masks would have little effect.


It depends.
With a N95 mask, there is a reduction of airborne contaminants that can reduce the viral load to levels not infectious. And a lot of that depends on the individuals immune system.
A mask is a filter. It doesn't influence the body's biological reaction. 
Also, the virus ( like all virus ) that causes Covid-19 can only 'live' so long with out a host.
It's only goal/function is to replicate.
Environmental conditions can affect it. It simply breaks down chemically over time.


----------



## Johnny b

A long article about 'wishful thinking' and Covid-19.

* A new COVID wave is probably coming, and America just doesn't seem to care *
https://fortune.com/2022/04/09/new-covid-wave-return-to-office-fauci-omicron-subvariant/


----------



## Cookiegal

We are getting our second boosters now (fourth doses).


----------



## Johnny b

I've had my first booster, but have decided to wait several weeks, at least. to decide if and when I take 2nd.
There are some potential issues to consider.
I'm waiting on expert recommendations.
And it's nothing to do, by any means, of the 2nd booster being unsafe. It is safe.

An interesting article on ventilation:
( mostly common sense imo but important )

* This invisible Covid-19 mitigation measure is finally getting the attention it deserves*
https://www.cnn.com/2022/04/10/health/covid-19-ventilation-matters-wellness/index.html


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## 2twenty2

Got my 2nd booster shot this morning. 4 shots now and counting.


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## 2twenty2

Hip hop pioneer DJ Kay Slay dies of COVID-19 at age 55

https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/dj-kay-slay-covid19-death-1.6422546


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## Johnny b

This has been on my mind for a while, concerning when to time a second booster shot.
It's a long article, but important. And there is no definite, singular answer.
A lot of 'ifs' and considerations.

* Boost now? Boost later? Tricky calculation for a 4th coronavirus shot. *
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2022/04/20/when-to-get-second-covid-booster/


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## Cookiegal

I'm facing the same dilemma John. They say they're working on a vaccine that will last longer and be directed more to the current variants of Omicronthat should be available in the Fall so I'm thinking I may just wait for that especially if the booster is only going to last four weeks. I'm still careful, wear a mask, glasses and a face shield and even gloves when I go grocery shopping and that's pretty much the only place I go or the pharmacy. One exception is I just had to get my car's oil and tires changes but I was in a secluded corner of the showroom with no one around me. I wanted to wait outside and walk around but it was very cold and windy.


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## Johnny b

I still take the same precautions as when the pandemic waves were at their greatest.

Infection rates are starting to climb in Ohio. 
People have become too relaxed for their own good.

I've got a dentist appointment next week that I can't skip and I cringe at going.


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## Cookiegal

Johnny b said:


> I've got a dentist appointment next week that I can't skip and I cringe at going.


Same here only mine is the week after.


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## 2twenty2

Toronto Zoo begins vaccinating some of its animals against COVID-19
https://www.cp24.com/news/must-watc...ome-of-its-animals-against-covid-19-1.5870815


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## 2twenty2

Surprisingly low Shanghai COVID-19 death count spurs questions

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireS...ai-covid-death-count-spurs-questions-84208602
https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coron...ovid-19-death-count-spurs-questions-1.5869917
https://focuswashington.com/2022/04...-toll-revives-questions-about-chinas-numbers/


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## Johnny b

Now it's BA.2.12.1

* Covid Whiplash: Now-Dominant BA.2 Variant Being Quickly Overtaken Across The U.S. By Yet Another Faster-Growing Omicron Offshoot, Says CDC *
https://deadline.com/2022/04/new-covid-variant-ba-2-12-1-quick-spread-united-states-1235007619/



> The new Omicron sublineage BA.2.12.1 now accounts for 19% of all new cases specifically sequenced for variants in the country, according to data released Tuesday by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control. That means the strain - barely on the national radar two weeks ago - is now being identified in close to 1 in 5 newly-sequenced cases..............


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## Cookiegal

So yesterday I'm out for a walk with Cassie and meet a friend walking her dog. We talk a bit and then she says she got Covid. I thought OK maybe weeks or more ago but no, she just tested positive on Tuesday. I just said OK see you around and walked away. She's supposed to be isolating on her property not out walking the streets with no mask on. Right now the rules if you test positive are to isolate at home for 5 days and then for 10 more days you're supposed to wear a mask when out in public. I wasn't closer than 10 feet from her so hopefully it will be OK but it's irresponsible.


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## Cookiegal

So now we have Monkeypox to worry about.


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## Johnny b

* Top Biden health officials sound warning on rising coronavirus infections *
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2022/05/18/rising-covid-cases-health-officials-warning/



> The increase in new infections, nearing 100,000 a day, comes as Memorial Day weekend approaches


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## Johnny b

* 3 ways to get COVID pills, if you've just tested positive *
https://www.npr.org/sections/health...get-covid-pills-if-youve-just-tested-positive


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## Johnny b

* Pfizer CEO predicts 'constant waves' of COVID-19 because of complacency about the coronavirus and politicization of the pandemic *
https://www.businessinsider.com/pfi...-coronavirus-complacency-albert-bourla-2022-5


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## Johnny b

* Sliding to mild? Nope-omicron BA.2 caused worse COVID symptoms than BA.1 *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...n-ba-2-caused-worse-covid-symptoms-than-ba-1/



> The findings are "contrary to the perception that recent variants have become successively milder," according to the study authors, led by epidemiologist Paul Elliott of Imperial College London.


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## Johnny b

Of interest to African Green monkeys And Sars-CoV-2, I found this:

* Establishment of an African green monkey model for COVID-19 and protection against re-infection *
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41590-020-00835-8


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## valis

Lets move it to the debate thread please.


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## freedave

valis said:


> Lets move it to the debate thread please.


Done . . .


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## Johnny b

New concerns over Long Covid:

* Vaccines may not prevent many symptoms of long covid, study suggests *
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2022/05/25/long-covid-vaccines-slight-protection/

.................................

China's economy hit hard from their latest Covid wave.........

* 100,000 Chinese officials attend emergency meeting to revive Covid-hit economy *
https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/26/business/china-state-council-economic-meeting-intl-hnk/index.html


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## Johnny b

* BA.4, BA.5 rise in Europe; officials sound alarm of COVID-19 surge to come *
https://arstechnica.com/science/202...-ba-5-uprising-braces-for-next-wave-of-cases/



> So far, there's no indication that BA.4 or BA.5 cause more severe infections than the currently circulating omicron subvariants-specifically BA.2 and BA.2.12.1. But, the pair appear better able to evade immune protection from vaccines and prior omicron infections, possibly leading to more breakthrough infections. "As in previous waves," the ECDC writes, "an increase in COVID-19 cases can result in a rise in hospitalizations, ICU admissions, and deaths."


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## valis

Yup, here we go...Fauci tested positive as well. Should be an interesting summer.

As an aside, I got laughed at for wearing a mask today.


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## valis

link



> The 81-year-old, who is *fully vaccinated and twice boosted*, is currently experiencing mild symptoms,


buckle up everyone. May be a bumpy ride.


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## Johnny b

valis said:


> Yup, here we go...Fauci tested positive as well. Should be an interesting summer.
> 
> As an aside, I got laughed at for wearing a mask today.


I was out and about today.
Walmart, a motorcycle dealer ( for parts ) and Lowes.
I was the only one wearing a mask.

No one commented and neither did I.


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## valis

Johnny b said:


> I was out and about today.
> Walmart, a motorcycle dealer ( for parts ) and Lowes.
> I was the only one wearing a mask.
> 
> No one commented and neither did I.


And yet how it spreads is a mystery...


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## Johnny b

I was also at my local library....same deal.

But I did find the new 'The Batman' movie.
I'll comment in the 'car' thread


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## Johnny b

*Pfizer says tweaked COVID-19 shots boost omicron protection *
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/pfizer-says-tweaked-covid-19-140734243.html


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## 2twenty2

5 covid shots and counting. Got another booster, bivalent COVID vaccine yesterday.


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## 2twenty2

*Nearly Half of Covid Patients Haven’t Fully Recovered Months Later, Study Finds*









Nearly half of COVID survivors haven't fully recovered 6 months later: Study


A new study from Scotland found six months after COVID infection, 48% of patients say they have only partially recovered or haven't recovered at all.




abcnews.go.com


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## 2twenty2

*Hundreds of Canadians are still dying of COVID-19 every week. Who are they?*



https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/covid-deaths-canada-winter-2022-1.6637476


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## 2twenty2

*AstraZeneca password lapse exposed patient data*









AstraZeneca password lapse exposed patient data


Internal passwords were online for more than a year before a good-faith security researcher found them.




techcrunch.com


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## 2twenty2

*Princess cruise ship with at least 800 positive COVID-19 cases docks in Australia*









Princess cruise ship with at least 800 positive COVID-19 cases docks in Australia


The Majestic Princess cruise ship arrived in Sydney, having sailed from New Zealand. Officials said 800 people on it tested positive for COVID.



www.usatoday.com


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## 2twenty2

*Scientist who worked at Wuhan lab says COVID was man-made virus*









Scientist with NY non-profit tied to Wuhan lab says COVID a man-made virus


Andrew Huff said COVID leaked from the Wuhan Institute of Virology in China two years ago and blamed authorities for the “biggest US intelligence failure since 9/11.”




nypost.com


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## 2twenty2

*Top WHO official says China undercounting COVID deaths*









Top WHO official says China undercounting COVID deaths


A top World Health Organization (WHO) official on Wednesday said China is underreporting deaths from COVID-19 and called for more transparency about the scope of the country’s outbreak. &#822…




thehill.com


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## 2twenty2

*Why XBB.1.5 — the latest Omicron offshoot — could 'outcompete' other COVID-19 subvariants*



https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/omicron-xbb-1-5-1.6703384


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