# Right To Repair



## zx10guy

I'm not sure if this is the correct place to put this thread but I'll do it here. If the moderators feel this is not as political (which it shouldn't be), please move to the General forum for more broad exposure.

For those that have not been tracking, there has been an increased movement to push the Right to Repair for us consumers covering digital electronics. Being this forum is made up of DIY people at its core, you all need to take notice as to what is happening in the industry and the ultimate consequences of not codifying your legal rights.

In the past electronics would either come with a full blown set of schematics or you could obtain one easily from the manufacturer. There was a culture of being open repair knowledge. You had the option of attempting the repair yourself or hire an independent repair shop or a repair shop tied to the factory. The current state of affairs is that manufacturers are doing a full assault on your right to have options to repair a device you purchased and own. I don't have to dig too deep to present evidence as to how this is happening now. I'll bring up Apple. Apple has on multiple occasions have implemented changes in their hardware which block the consumer on having access to full repairs without going to Apple directly or to an Apple authorized repair facility. Examples of this are changes to the screen where if a non Apple screen is installed into a current gen iPhone will not work due to firmware checks to ensure it's a factory sourced screen. Why is this a problem? Apple has strangled the supply chain where independent shops are finding it harder and harder to gain access to these parts in the supply chain. A battery replacement which one would think is straight forward is no longer so in current gen iPhones. The OS does a check with the battery to see if it's a validated part. The battery still works but health checks are suspended. Again access to the necessary tools/parts is limited to do what many would agree is a mundane fix. There's a power chip which Apple has made part of their T2 security ecosystem. A chip which if extracted from a donor system will do a self wipe rendering itself useless. A chip that Apple has told the manufacturer of the chip to not sell to anyone but Apple.

Many of the anti right to repair lobbyists and manufacturers have used security to scare legislatures to not pass right to repair bills. Yet if you send your broken device which you cannot power up for various reasons in for repair, you're told all your data will be wiped and that recovery of said data is not possible (Apple). Yet companies such as Louis Rossmann group and iPad Rehab has shown Apple that data recovery is possible with the vast majority of repairs. Jessa Jones has a video up on her channel where the family of a deceased hiker went to Apple and pleaded for help to recover data from the iPad the hiker had with him before passing. Apple flat out said they couldn't help. The family went to Jessa who was able to get the iPad to power back up and access all the data on the device. A device which was exposed to the raw elements for weeks. Lobbyists hired by various manufacturers and special interests have paid these individuals tons of money to prevent these bills from passing. These lobbyists have used scare tactics of data security or physical safety which are just pure FUD.

While I've been picking on Apple, other organizations and manufacturers have put forth concerted efforts to stop these types of legislation: Microsoft, CompTIA, Electronic Gamers Association, etc, etc. Why are they doing this? Because there's tons of money to be had by squashing right to repair with digital electronics. They want to corner the market on being able to repair your device or to force you to purchase new hardware. It's a win win for manufacturers. It's a net lose lose for consumers and the environment as perfectly repairable devices are now ending up in the garbage.

CompTIA is one that I was shocked to see lobbying against right to repair. A non profit that has built their business model around certifications to work on certain types of equipment. You would think such an organization would be pro right to repair.

Bills have been introduced in Nebraska, Hawaii, Maine, Massachusetts, New York, Maryland, to name a few. Hearings have already been held with some of theses states. The number of lobbyists and representatives present during these hearings is astounding as the anti-repair side of this is putting forth a strong concerted effort to stop this movement. They know it only takes one state to pass legislation before others will follow.

To drive this home. One would never dream of not being able to take their car to a place of their choosing or even to do your own repair. Yet this is also under assault now. Manufacturers are using the DMCA to lock out consumers or independent repair shops from being able to easily access the electronics in their vehicles. John Deere has already done this where even if the part is replaced, you have to get an authorized dealer with a scan tool only they have access to to program the ECU to accept the repaired component. BMW has a new encryption scheme implemented into their DMEs which limits certan things one can do. Fortunately there are still scan tools/apps available that can still access the DME but how long will this be the case?

Louis Rossmann has put up a number of videos on his Youtube channel discussing right to repair along with various hearings he has attended in person to provide testimony. This should be an important issue for everyone of us.


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## Johnny b

It is indeed a serious problem.

I was aware of it some time ago concerning John Deere.
It's become a critical problem for farmers during the short windows for plowing and planting. A breakdown in the field requires scheduling for a technician for even the simplest of repairs. With electronic controls on modern implements, dealer's have found a gold mine in restricting owner and 3rd party repairs.

And I read the other day that the military is starting to run into problems with right to repair.

* The U.S. Military Has a 'Right to Repair' Problem * 
https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a30859791/us-military-right-to-repair/

* Even The American Military Is Struggling With Right-To-Repair *
https://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/even-the-american-military-is-struggling-with-right-to-1841531517


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## zx10guy




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## Brigham

I hope some enterprising manufacturer, will use the ease of repair, as a selling point.


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## Chawbacon

Brigham said:


> I hope some enterprising manufacturer, will use the ease of repair, as a selling point.


Yep! I agree with this statement 100%!

I understand the restrictions on proprietary software; however, it would be great to purchase products from a company that allows you the ability to repair your own devices for parts replacement.


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## Couriant

I have followed Louis for a bit before I got too busy. I also watched a video by Linus about his endeavours on trying to get Apple to fix his iMac, even if he had to pay full repair costs...

Anyways, I can see how vendors don't want their customers outsourcing parts because they won't get the $$ for the parts or the consumer won't by the next device until years later.... but at the same time, if the device is out of warranty, why should they care? They got their money and they still want to stick it to the consumer by not allowing them to have a chance to repair their purchased device.


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## Couriant

I'm surprised this thread hasn't had any more traction than it has 

I watched a video where the ESA cited piracy for the reason not to allow independent repair stores to have their schematics, etc to help with repairs... but then simultaneously added that the devices are already being cracked... citing that the Switch has been cracked already and it's only been out a few years...

I am all for digital locks and safeguarding the software, but her arguments are moot in this respect.


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## prunejuice

I am so angry with Apple's stance on "Right-To-Repair" that I have chosen to limit myself to ONLY 3 major purchase of iProducts next year.
Take _THAT_, Cupertino.


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## Wino

Not angry with Apple - have never owned anything they made. Makes it difficult to boycott them. LOL


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## Johnny b

Same here, lol.

I've viewed Apple products in the past as expensive fads.


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## Johnny b

Interesting article about car repair.

* A fight over the right to repair cars turns ugly *
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2022/02/a-fight-over-the-right-to-repair-cars-turns-ugly/


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## Couriant

Johnny b said:


> Interesting article about car repair.
> 
> * A fight over the right to repair cars turns ugly *
> https://arstechnica.com/cars/2022/02/a-fight-over-the-right-to-repair-cars-turns-ugly/


that sounds like retaliation… which shouldn't be allowed …


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## Johnny b

Couriant said:


> that sounds like retaliation… which shouldn't be allowed …


Indeed.
I was involved in auto repair up until the mid '90s.
The manufacturer's attitude had been one of an increasing restraint of repair information and a resulting backlash by the repair industry. Laws were written. It helped, but initially released in forms that were diagnostic computers. Eventually hand helds became a diagnostic tool, but I was leaving the business at that time, too late for me.
Now code readers are common with onboard diagnostics. Helpful, but imo, too often like generic solutions.

IMO, the attitude of manufacturers is nothing new, just more intense and there's no excuse to not to have contingency plans that meet future legal requirements. Just a way to rationalize foot dragging to avoid compliance.
Their problems didn't start with legislation, their problems initiated the legislation they complain about.


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## Couriant

Apple is trying to make it so you don't own the hardware now:
https://www.macworld.com/article/626219/apple-hardware-subscription-service-rumors.html


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## Johnny b

In a perverse way, this is rather funny......

* Russian troops stole $5M worth of farm vehicles from a John Deere dealership, which remotely locked the thieves out of the equipment *
https://www.businessinsider.com/russian-troops-locked-out-of-stolen-john-deere-farm-equipment-2022-5



> Russian troops occupying the Ukrainian city of Melitopol stole nearly $5 million of farm vehicles from a John Deere dealership and shipped some of them more than 700 miles to Chechnya, CNN reported, only to find they had been rendered useless by a remote-locking system that prevented the thieves from turning the equipment on.


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## Ciberblade

This has been a huge issue, and one that has been very personal in my life. I started my career in component level repair. I KNOW. It's been a subject that I return to quite often...and, reminds me of an article I read towards the end of last year. Just a sec, I'll got find that...

...back. I think this is the one, but it may have been through the iFixIt guys themselves. https://www.engadget.com/apple-user...ee5m87AwjQuyHf0AmxSPXxa903eoH9nbcvWmsK2F65Jp6


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## Couriant

Ciberblade said:


> This has been a huge issue, and one that has been very personal in my life. I started my career in component level repair. I KNOW. It's been a subject that I return to quite often...and, reminds me of an article I read towards the end of last year. Just a sec, I'll got find that...
> 
> ...back. I think this is the one, but it may have been through the iFixIt guys themselves. https://www.engadget.com/apple-user...ee5m87AwjQuyHf0AmxSPXxa903eoH9nbcvWmsK2F65Jp6


The problem with the repair program is that 1) it's only for iPhones 12, 13, mini, and SE and 2) it does not cover all parts for example the charge port... but you can get the battery at least.


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## RT

In a minor comment, over the years I have often see a sticker or engraving on things that says "No user serviceable parts."

Perhaps this goes back to the days of "shade tree mechanics" who could work on a car with a screwdriver, couple of wrenchs and an oily cloth 
Now it takes a computer and a trained tech to charge $$$ to even tell you what the problem is,and he's just repeating the computer 

The last fridge I got was estimated to last 6 years, thankfully it lasted ~10.. but it was a sealed back, no way to get to replace a fan or compressor.
You need a new one, another one you can't service yourself.

Reminds of the story of the 100 year old light bulb.
The so called
Centennial Light

So reliable the company went out of business, because after you bought one, practically never had to be replaced.

Things are now designed with a built-in "end of life" expectancy, so as to keep the economics flowing 

.


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## Couriant

FTC Takes Action Against Harley-Davidson and Westinghouse for Illegally Restricting Customers' Right to Repair

little by little....


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