# Can subliminal tapes/cds be copied?



## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

This is a question I had many years ago, and never got a definate answer. Now I have the internet (and this board) maybe someone will know?

At the time, I was buying subliminal tapes, which have a low voice track (under the white noise/sound) that supposedly your brain picks up and is programmed by (in a positive way) without actually hearing it with the ears.

I wanted to copy the tapes, so I could have one upstairs (for bed) and one to play in headphones, for during the day, etc.

Some of the catalogs offering the tapes said copying them wouldn't work, because they were made in a specific way, the subliminal parts added extra and wouldn't come onto the copy. Of course, they might say this to get you to buy extra ones and not make copies.

I wrote to several tape manufacturers at the time, who said they had no actual statistics about this, but seemed like anything one ONE tape would copy onto another.

Also, I've since known someone who went to a hypnotist, who copied a subliminl tape he had (a bought one) on relaxation, he gave to clients to bring home with them.

I haven't thought of this is a long time, but recently someone sent me 2 subliminal cds. Relaxation ones.

I made copies on my cd burner, so I can play them at night while going to sleep, and have copies to use on the computer when I'm online. Regardless of the subliminal message, the music is flowing and relaxing, in itself. I think it's something that affects brainwaves and puts you into ALPHA or something.

Maybe nobody has ever asked this question before, and maybe there are no answers, but someone who knows about sound tech stuff might know.

Do the copies still have the subliminal messages on them?

On the same note, is there anyway (using the computer) of hearing WHAT is being said on the subliminal track? 

I mean, we might buy (use) a tape or cd that says it has subliminal messages on it, and who knows WHAT the messages really are?

Thanks!

~ Carrie


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## mhoydis (Feb 3, 2004)

hahahahahahaha


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## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

I guess the joke is, when I first started going on computer help sites, I was told (more than once) "there are no stupid questions". 

I guess they didn't say there are no funny ones.

I actually wanted to know the answer, I thought it was an audio/tech topic.

~ Carrie


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## Fransey (Jan 26, 2002)

Carrie:
I'm curious, too....about whether subliminal tapes
can be copied. I don't see what's so funny about
a question like that. Some people, when they have no
solution, like to ridicule the questioner. Kinda thoughtless,
I'd say. If this Forum doesn't answer such questions,
surely the Moderator will come in and say so.

If noone has an answer, that's OK... 

It's possible an electronics/recording chatroom would
be able to help you. Bye.


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## JayT (Apr 15, 2003)

I think it is a perfectly valid and legitimate question. And if CD burners make "exact copies" of other CDs, I don't understand why it would not make an exact copy of the subliminal portion of the CD. Just my opinion, but it makes sense.


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## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

Since I thought of this earlier, I've been putting words into google search to try and find answers. But, all I get are ads FOR subliminal tapes, and a few articles I found that says they DO work. But, you have to be careful what's on them, because the subconscious takes things literally and doesn't recognize negatives (I don't know who figure that out (LOL).

Like "I don't want to eat fattening foods" (on a diet tape) would be heart as "I want to eat...." etc.

Now, I'm wondering if there is a program one can play a cd in, and adjust and hear what the subliminal track is?

That would also be a way of finding out if they can be copied.

I think some of the companies producing them (at least years ago) made out the subliminal track was somehow added/embeded in them AFTER the music was put on.

But, they might just say that so people wouldn't copy them and pass them around, so fewer people would buy them. I remember one catalog had in it "please don't copy them and pass them around, tell your friends about them and let them order their own", or something.

I wrote to a tape company at the time, Memorex I think it was (there was an address to write if you had any questions) and they didn't know. The person who answered said he felt whatever was on the main tape would be copied onto the new one.

If we could find a way to hear what was on the tape it would answer it.

I don't know why someone saw it as a joke, either. I thought it was an interesting/fascinating subject to learn about.

Maybe the idea of someone playing a tape while sleeping or doing other things and changing themself? 

I think just relaxing would be a help, in itself.

~ Carrie


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## kath100 (Aug 20, 2003)

Hello Carrie,
In my opinion whatever is on the audio tape / cd will be copied.
The medium plays back audio frequencies and the only way they can get to your brain is via the ears so they must be heard.
If they could mask the sounds on a copied cd, why dont they use that now as a method of copy protection?
I think you have raised a very good and thought provoking question so ignore the hahaha's.
Why dont you copy a cd and give it to a friend to try without telling them that there may be information missing, see what opinions they give you.


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## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

That's a good point, about using it as anti-copy protection.

I can copy a cd and play it myself, but since subliminal is below the level the brain "hears" the sound (but, supposedly the subconscious still picks it up) it's not something that can be checked by just listening to it.

There's also the idea that cd burners (and players for that matter) might mask out subliminal sounds, as they would unwanted noise. Like the Dolby system does with stereo.

Of course, if that were true, the subliminal sounds would be taken out when even the original was played.

It's probably not something most people think about or ask about, and before I got 2 subliminal cds a week ago, I hadn't had any since I bought some tapes back in the early 80's.

I'm not sure if they ever did anything to change my thinking, because my life might have been different without them, I have no way of knowing.

Oh, about a year ago, there was a movie "Josie and the *****cats" (based on the cartoon series) and in the plot, they (the rock group) found out the recording company was adding subliminal messages to their music cds. Kids would listen and hear (subconsciously) messages, telling them to BUY something.

They used the recording equipment (in the movie), with the many complex equalizers, for each track, to take out all BUT the subliminal message and hear it/find out it was there.

Who knows if this isn't being done now? Back in the 50's it came out this was being done in movies, flashing subliminal messages to people, like "buy popcorn", etc.

~ Carrie


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## dbn (Dec 16, 2003)

I agree. Whatever is on the subliminal tape or cd would be copied. 

It would be interesting to have a program that could pull apart the signals allowing us to hear what is the actual subliminal message. I don't know of any programs like that off hand, but I know they have to exist. I am sure that it is pretty standard in recording studios. I have read somewhere about special programs that are able to pull up and concentrate on only certain portions of a recording while putting all other portions in the background on mute. I cannot remember where I read that though. Sorry. 

Ignore the Ha Ha's. Most of us here take all questions seriously. And by the way, THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A STUPID QUESTION! Don't let one reply gotten here represent what the rest of us are all about.


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## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

I imagine recording studios woudl be able to do it, like they record different tracks separately and add them together, maybe some louder, etc.

Probably not something many people would be looking for, so not available as a free download (LOL)

I wouldn't even know what to call it.

Oh, I still believe there's no such thing as a stupid question (and this one seemed to get responses and something to think about). 

Maybe just people who SEE stupid questions.

Who knows, maybe the HAHAHAs meant he felt the post was entertaining? (I should go into standup?)

~ Carrie


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## kiwiguy (Aug 17, 2003)

Tapes and CDs are *very* different in this regard.

A copy of a CD should be accurate to the original (provided you don't rip the audio off it, rather do a disk copy) and therefore every bit of data should accurately transfer.

A tape however is analogue, and if the subliminal message was just above the noise, or in the noise level it probably/certainly would be lost on a copy.


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## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

I knew someone would know!

Do you know a way of hearing what the subliminal message on the cd is?

I think the messages on a tape are "below" the level of the sound you can hear. Like so low you hear them but don't know you are.

Which, of course, means there might not be any message on them at all (copy or not).

I saw a lot of ads for subliminal tapes and cds while searching for answers, earlier. There SHOULD be some way of checking to see what the message is.

Also, to see if there are subliminal messages in other audio, (or even video- on websites or t.v. shows) just so we'd know.

Not to be paranoid or anyting 

~ Carrie


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## kiwiguy (Aug 17, 2003)

The subliminal message (if it exists) is just part of the entire sound track. Its not like its a separate "layer" so it cant be extracted.

As to it being present, if it's as you state then the ability for it to even be detected (by your ear/brain...) would hugely depend on the sound system you were listening to it with. Unless the signal to noise level was of a high enough quality, the "subliminal" content may never make it to your ear.


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## kiwiguy (Aug 17, 2003)

http://realmagick.com/articles/50/550.html


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## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

Maybe they work or don't work based on the belief the person has?

Sort of like the power of suggestion?

The ones I have, have a flowing, electronic sort of music (maybe something to put the brain in Alpha?) which seems relaxing in itself.

Also, every now and then there is actual words spoken, as part of the flow of the music (meant to be heard in a low way).

That's probably what's being said in the rest of the cd, in a softer way. 

The idea is the brain (subconscious) picks up words and remembers them, even when they're not loud enough to be consciously heard.

I hadn't thought about this in a long time, and probably wouldn't have bought subliminal tapes or cds now.

Just now I have a computer and internet, I thought I could find out more about it.

~ Carrie


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## Fransey (Jan 26, 2002)

I made an inquiry at another site & this is one answer I got:

>Inquiry:
>On copying a CD with imbedded material....(in order to keep & listen
>to a specific CD in the rec-room, and the same one, but a 2nd CD for 
>portable use.)
>Will the imbedded material transfer over to the copy, or will 
>only the music be transferred? Please be specific. Thanks. Francey

Answer: 
When you make a CD copy
the copy is EXACTLY the SAME
because it's digital...
(if you would copy a program and the program would change even of a few bytes it wouldn't work...)
so make your copy 
the content, it's the same...
...and enjoy your cd...


The situation is different if you make mp3s....Hope this helps.


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## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

That's good to know.

Now, is there a way to find out what's ON the subliminal track on the cd? 

Or, if there really is one for that matter (LOL)

And, what about making a cd from a subliminal tape?

I once learned how to put a cassette tape onto a computer, and then burn a cd, and told someone else interested in this, and she is putting ALL her tapes onto CDs.

I wouldn't want to do this with audio cds, because only one side of most cassette tapes fits on ONE cd.

it's kind of fascinating in a way. How things work.

~ Carrie


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## contralto (Jan 21, 2004)

hi, carrie,

i saw "josie and the *****cats" and i also wondered whether or not subliminal messages could be used in a negative way as they used them in the movie. 

in the '80's i had a few subliminal cassette tapes mainly on relaxation and pain relief. the latter suggested that you hear the man's voice in the left ear, i believe. i always listened that way, but to be honest i never really trusted that there were any subliminal messages on the tape, as where was the proof of that? i thought if i spent the time relaxing instead it would likely do as much good. i have since learned to meditate or even work on a new song, and that works, too. learning new music has a repetitive cycle, or rhythm, and that is relaxing for me. 


i hope someone will answer your question regarding how to find out what is ON the subliminal track on a CD. it is a good question.

~contralto
(diane)


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## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

I guess it's the end result that counts, if we feel better (more relaxed) that's what counts.

I once got a set of tapes, something called "alphanetics". It included a pictures, a triangle with a flame inside (etc) to put on the wall and look at while listening. It had various subjects, starting with "relax", and "self-image", etc. One side for morning and one for night. They weren't subliminal, you could hear the voice.

I no longer have the picture, and sometimes think of the tapes and play some. Since they were only 20 mins long, I put several of them onto a 90 min tape (finally) to play when I was in bed at night longer.

I do think relaxing and getting into what must be the alpha state is a help in itself. Sort of detached from ego issues, centered, peaceful.

I'm not much good at meditating (on it's own) my mind seems too active. 

But, I think it might be the answer to a lot of problems in life we seem to have. Or, think we do.

~ Carrie


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## kenneth2k1 (Oct 9, 2003)

Hi Carrie:

From what I have researched, there is not much solid proof of subliminal audio actually having any effect. Although I am sure subliminal suggestion is effective, it is usually found in the form of advertisement and repitition, not non-audible subliminal suggestions.

I might suggest self-hypnotism as an alternative. There are many books out there, and in my experience it was more effective to help me "overcome" some things.


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## contralto (Jan 21, 2004)

carrie,

i used to listen to meditation tapes, as my mind was tough to turn off. but then a few years ago the priest at my church did a lenten series on meditation, and i followed his advice, and voila! i could meditate on my own without tapes. it is worth all the trouble to learn the techniqe. i don't meditate on a regular basis as some individuals do, but if i am stressed i can decide to meditate and after about 45 minutes i am incredibly relaxed and also very refreshed. and it is as if the 45 minutes just flew by; really quite incredible. 

maybe you can achieve a state akin to this with self-hypnosis, as kenneth2k1 suggested. i tried self-hypnosis with tapes, but prefer meditation.

i think you are right in that many of our problems are a matter of perception. focusing on the positive goes a long way.

whatever method you choose to pursue, good luck.

~diane


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## kenneth2k1 (Oct 9, 2003)

Diane

The self-hypnotism book that helped me was called Self Hypnotism, The Technique and its Use in Daily Living by Leslie LeCron, 0-451-08779-8 195. It's old and most likely out of print, but I'm sure you can find something similar.

I did meditation sessions when I was into the martial arts. Very refreshing and helpful for focusing energy. If you try it yourself, without tapes, i think you will find that "self-hypnotism" is almost exactly like meditation. The only difference I found was that it offers a more stuctured and stable way to achieve a relaxed state. I also found it more useful for unconscious exploration. Just my experience.

But whatever works!


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## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

I've always thought martial arts was the answer to just about everything, and have tried to learn it (at times) on my own.

I have learned (and practiced for many years) yoga and later Tai Chi (from t.v. shows that were on at the time) but have moved around the country a lot, and in the past few years got away from it.

Once you get away, it's hard to get back 

I used to use tapes by Roy Masters that were really good. Also the "Alpha" tapes. 

Wayne Dyer also had a tape out on "sound" meditation, where you start out saying awwwwwwww softly and get louder and louder. It really does put one into an "outher world" kind of state.

I think, with me, it's remembering to actually do that's the problem. I get up- hit the ground running, always so much to do, and one thing after another.

Maybe it's having a computer and internet now (though I can play music and meditation type tapes on my cd-rom) 

Since last night I've been dealing with a mutated version of the MY DOOM virus I found (files that say 11111a, 11111b, 11111c) I don't know where they came from, and have been running anti-virus (and anti MY DOOM) scans daily. As I get the links to them, here. 

I'm not letting it disturb my peace, and I think it's all out now.

HijackThis found the reg keys and we got them out right away.

One of my goals is to not let how someone else is choosing to be (or what seems to be happening around me) effect how I choose to feel.

At least I'm aware.

Funny, the topic we can get into, and what we can learn on a computer help board 

The internet is great for communication, joining and sharing.

~ Carrie


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## contralto (Jan 21, 2004)

kenneth,

i am currently reading a book called "excuse me, your life is waiting" by lynn grabhorn. i am part of a weekly dream analysis group; we are taking a break from dreams to read and discuss lynn's book. i find that i get more out of a book when i discuss it with others. there is an accompanying workbook that we are going through as well. in a nutshell, it is mostly about avoiding negativity.

yeah, whatever works! 

~diane


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## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

Lynn Grabhorn has a very large/active Yahoo egroup.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/GrabhornGroup/

I think I'm not setting priorities right, letting other things (I think I "should" do) get in the way or what might help me align and get into a more positive and producitve "flow" and this de-energize me.

(I was just cleaning my keyboard with a q-tip and alcohol and now the G is sticking. An example of leaving well enough along?)

~ Carrie


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## contralto (Jan 21, 2004)

carrie,

sorry about your MyDoom problem. the occasional price we have to pay for accessing the internet, i guess. good for you that you did not let it get you down.

thanx for the link to the lynngrabhorn group at yahoo. it may be a little too far out there for me, but i'll read the posts and see.

i have been practicing yoga for a year, and cannot imagine myself stopping it. a yoga instructor i met at church designed a yoga routine around my physical problems, and then others joined the class. i think of it as an example of the universe providing what i need. it is good exercise, a calming influence, and i think the names of some of the poses are humorous. down dog, for one. 

ever thought of getting back into yoga? :up: 

~diane


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## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

> ever thought of getting back into yoga?


 Many times, and I have started. At one time I felt like you, I couldn't imagine NOT doing it, and would every afternoon or evening no matter what was going on, or where I was (except maybe when packing/unpacking, or on the road moving somewhere)

I should say I have 7 children (now all grown, most with families of their own) so that kind of got in the way, too. We homeschooled our kids for the last 17 years they were school age. I now have 10 grandchildren (only one nearby, she and her parents live with me) and one greatgrandchild who will be 2 in March. I KNOW this is the time for yoga! (look at what it does for Madonna)

I used to make tapes of music I liked (mainly I'd catch them from the radio) and put that one while doing yoga. Gave me something to focus on, I guess.

I learned starting in 1967 with a t.v. show (Richard Hittleman) but a few years later, we moved and the local stations didn't carry the show. There have been others. Same with the Tai Chi show (Joey Bond) we don't get where I now live.

I know I can do it on my own, but the t.v. shows were something to remember at the same time everyday.

Tapes don't seem to be the same, and I get bored with the same over and over.

Just to keep this on topic (computers) I have devised a few variations of yoga postures and stretches while sitting (or standing) in front of the computer. Doing side bends in the chair, or leaning over the back of the chair.

I have dial up which can be slow, and I'm trying to get into the habit of doing something like that while waiting.

~ Carrie


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## Rockn (Jul 29, 2001)

If it's on the tape it can be copied. Unless the voices aren't really there at all....scary!!


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## zzabb (Nov 8, 2005)

Gotta question for you Carrie...
do you still have those alphanetic tapes?
i had them too way back in the 80s and i have wanted to get them again, but i can't seem to find the company that produced them...
could you pretty please look on the case and get their address for me?
thank you soooooo very much (-:
mike


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## starchild (Sep 17, 2002)

I thought I was the only one who ever heard of these. I don't remember how I found them, I think I got an ad in the mail.

I have most of them, still in the case. They are pretty old, and some of them I put together on longer tapes and still have one I dig out every now and then and play - like when I got to bed at night (with 3 topics on it)

The tapes say "Life Synamics 2118 South Grand Santa Ana CA 92705

This set starts with Introduction, Relax into Alphanetics, and ends with The Open Door to Success (11 tapes in all) I think there may have been other sets, because it says "Other additional Titles Available write for catalog and information."

Maybe something can be found online

There was a triangle that came with it, to paste on cardboard and put on the wall a certain distance away. I thought the one I had was gone, but one day came across it in a box of old photos. It was worn and ripped and I scanned it, and tried to fix the flaws and ripped parts on the computer.

I don't know if we really need the triangle, it says on the tapes to look at it, or imagine seeing it. It has a circle in the middle with a "flame".

I like the feeling of drifting and floating one can get into. I forget this a lot, but it says one can get into this (Alpha) and stay that way, function in life. Just with a more quiet and centered mind.

Sounds good to me.

~ Carrie


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## zzabb (Nov 8, 2005)

oh thank you thank you!!!!
i'd kiss ya but i just met ya (-:

i thought i was the only one who had these (-:
yes that is it exactly, when i moved i lost the tapes somewhere but still had the triangle, i got rid of the triangle because it was useless without the tapes...

i've listened to a ton of relaxation tapes and subliminal tapes but none seemed to be as good as that one, i too loved the feeling of floating away and being totally relaxed like that...

i'm certain i got mine from the mail but it may have been like a club, or membership type thing (secret society hehehehe)... it was soooooo long ago i have problems remembering all the details

i have looked and looked on the net for it but nothing like that is around, in fact your post is the only thing I could find, but now i'll have to search for the company to see if it is still around
thank you again, especially for the quick response

mike


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