# Solved: Sitemaps



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

I have done a sitemap.html which is part of the navigation and also a sitemap.xml which I have submitted to Google. My client has hired a SEO company and they have said that the sitemap should be "embedded" in the website.

What does this mean and how do I do it?

Thanks


----------



## leroys1000 (Aug 16, 2007)

If you follow the instructions in google webmaster tools,the
sitemap.xml should be put in the root directory of the website,
then the location provided in webmaster tools for indexing.

If you don't yet have webmaster tools,get it,it's free.
https://www.google.com/accounts/ServiceLogin?service=sitemaps&passive=true&nui=1&continue=https://www.google.com/webmasters/tools/&followup=https://www.google.com/webmasters/tools/&hl=en
Lot of good tools and help files there.


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

Yes, I did that previously. I have just checked in Webmaster Tools etc and it said that Google could not recognise my sitemap and to validate it before resubmitting. I find that strange as I used the Google generator to do it. I have just added the doc type in case that was the issue but not resubmitted it yet. When I try to open it to validate it, this is the message I received:

XML Parsing Error: syntax error
Location: http://www.domainname.com.au/sitemap.xml
Line Number 2, Column 1:- <urlset xmlns="http://www.sitemaps.org/schemas/sitemap/0.9" xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance" xsi:schemaLocation="http://www.sitemaps.org/schemas/sitemap/0.9 http://www.sitemaps.org/schemas/sitemap/0.9/sitemap.xsd">
^

Do you have any idea what the problem is?

Thanks!


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

I have done a new one and re-submitted it - will wait and see what happens.

Is that what it means by "embedding"?


----------



## leroys1000 (Aug 16, 2007)

They mean the map should be in the site or on the server.
I don't think embed is the right term.


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

That is what is puzzling me too! The map IS on the server, uploaded with the other site files. Also uploaded via Google Webmaster Tools as a sitemap. I suspect the SEO company is just trying to make my client feel he is getting value for money by hiring them by making all sorts of suggestions that I have already taken care of in the normal way of things.


----------



## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

Actually, by "embedded" I believe the SEO people are saying they feel the sitemap should be integrated into the website, itself. There should be a "sitemap" link or part of the site where website viewers can access the sitemap, not just the search engines.

Generating the XML sitemap is for search engines to consume, not website viewers.

EDIT: As an example, go to eBay.com and scroll to the very bottom of the home page. In the links along the bottom of the home page, you'll see a "Site Map" link next to the "Help" link. If you click that link, you'll see a HTML sitemap formatted for a website visitor to view and navigate.

Peace...


----------



## DaBeers (Oct 31, 2008)

Agree with tomdkat


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

I already had an HTML sitemap as part of the navigation, the .xml was an additional one. That is why I wondered what the embedding meant as I already had a sitemap on the site.


----------



## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

Perhaps the SEO company didn't realize you had a sitemap already integrated into the site itself.

EDIT: Can you post a link to the site in question?

Peace...


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

Yes - or I could if the server was not down for emergency maintenance. The window is 3 hours though they do not expect it to take that long. Will post the link as soon as the site is operational again. Thanks for the help!


----------



## DaBeers (Oct 31, 2008)

damn... a site-map is just a damn text file that sits on a server.... There are limited reasons it could be wrong. It is either not properly formatted, or not at the end of the path provided.

Beyond this, your looking at XML markups to fit class parameters.


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

Will post link as soon as able - thanks


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

_URL Removed_


----------



## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

Thanks for the link. 

Ok, I see something in your sitemap that could be an issue for SEO. Yes, your site map is part of the site HOWEVER, since the pages are dynamically generated ALL of the URLs point to the same base page (except for the first one):

This basically makes that site map useless since it doesn't provide an accurate "map" into the actual pages on the site, which are dynamically generated.

I would suggest using better URLs in your embedded sitemap or research how to generate sitemaps for dynamically generated pages.

Here is an example of a "better" URL for your sitemap:

Choose Outfit by occasion: http://www.website-name.com.au/home.php?action1=occasion
Accessories: http://www.website-name.com.au/home.php?action1=accessories

Including the "action1" parameter will provide access to the pages in question, which is what the sitemap is supposed to do. Right now, your sitemap indicates all of the pages of the site are the same single page.

Peace...


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

Thank you very much for the data you provided. Most of my sites are simple brochure type sites but some have databases like this one which I think is what you are getting at with the URLs. I never thought of that! Will do some research. 

Thank you very much for the advice.


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

This is getting rather complicated. Have had an HTML sitemap generated and am wondering if all of the pages are necessary. For example, it seems to list every ITEM, not just pages. There are over 30 vests listed and each one seems to have a generated page. However, the visible link on the page when viewed in a browser is not very explanatory. It just says Formal Hire - Western Australia, so each link would need to be changed to reflect what it actually contains.
In fact, ALL the links would need to be changed to what they actually are. So I would change the link for an HTML page:

 - Men's suit hire (formal wear) - Perth, Melbourne and
Brisbane

to:

Testimonials

Is that correct?

Then it gets more complicated for the dynamic pages. They fit into 4 categories of Occasion: Weddings, Corporate, Black Tie and School. I discovered these are represented by links that include "oc=1", "oc=2" and so on so I could change the links to Weddings, Corporate and so on. Then there are the 4 products: suits, shirts, vests and accessories. Each have an id so I can find out which suit is which and bring up a page with the particular suit on it. But I can't see the value in doing that as the page does not show which category the suits fits. It may fit more than one. It would mean changing the database to show categories as well as a description of the suit on each page. Otherwise, if someone looks at a particular suit, they are not going to know which category page to go to to hire it. If you can follow what I mean.

I can see this is going to take a lot of work. The client is prepared to pay for it so I don't suppose I should worry but it seems a lot of work to go to when this HTML sitemap is designed for a customer to find his way around the site, not a search engine. They have the .xml one to use. When you say all the pages point to the home page, isn't that only in relation to search engines because each link does go to the page is says it will go to.

Or have I completely misunderstood everything?

Thanks.


----------



## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

jasnick said:


> Or have I completely misunderstood everything?


Well, I wouldn't go this far but we can take a closer look into what you found and what's on the site now.

First, how did you generate the HTML sitemap you mention above? How did you create the sitemap that was originally part of the site?

Second, I agree that the sitemap shouldn't contain links to every individual item you sell but a sitemap generator won't necessarily "know" what should be part of the map and what shouldn't. So, if you prefer using a tool to generate the initial sitemap, you might have to do some editing to reduce it to something more functional for the site.

Looking at the sitemap on the site right now:

http://www.website-name.com.au/home.php?action1=sitemap

I see the major categories listed and I see text descriptions of those categories. For example, "Choose outfit by occasion". To me, a better sitemap structure for this section would be:


Choose outfit by occasion
Wedding (http://www.website-name.com.au/home.php?action1=hire&oc=1)
Corporate (http://www.website-name.com.au/home.php?action1=hire&oc=2)
School Formal (http://www.website-name.com.au/home.php?action1=hire&oc=3)
Black Tie (http://www.website-name.au/home.php?action1=hire&oc=4)


The other entries in the current sitemap look fine since they don't have any sub-categories, like the "occasion" category.

Is it possible to post a link to the HTML sitemap you generated so we can see how it actually looks?

Also, have you contacted the SEO company your client hired to find out more about their "embedded" recommendation?

As for the links in the generated HTML sitemap all having the same text, it appears the page title is being used for the text of the link. I think it would be a good idea to include the page category in the generated page title (something the script generating the page should be able to do easily). If you changed the page title of the generated pages to reflect the category or kind of page being displayed, that would solve the "all the links have the same text" issue and would make the site pages more "bookmark friendly" as well as help with SEO since the search engine would see the updated page titles for each generated page.

Since your client hired the SEO company (I presume directly), I would get in contact with the SEO company and work with them (if that's possible) to make sure the site is properly tuned for SEO (assuming the company they hired is a good SEO company).

Peace...


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

tomdkat said:


> First, how did you generate the HTML sitemap you mention above? How did you create the sitemap that was originally part of the site?


I used a sitemap generator and for the current sitemap, I wrote it myself. It is part of the CMS as well.



tomdkat said:


> So, if you prefer using a tool to generate the initial sitemap, you might have to do some editing to reduce it to something more functional for the site.


That is what I thought would be needed. Some of it can be used and some discarded.



tomdkat said:


> Looking at the sitemap on the site right now:
> 
> http://www.domain.com.au/home.php?action1=sitemap
> 
> ...


Yes, that is what I was thinking. This is actually the main part of the site - the hire system. The rest is just informational.



tomdkat said:


> Is it possible to post a link to the HTML sitemap you generated so we can see how it actually looks?


Not at this time. I can put it up here though.In my opinion, a lot of it is unnecessary.



tomdkat said:


> Also, have you contacted the SEO company your client hired to find out more about their "embedded" recommendation?
> 
> (assuming the company they hired is a good SEO company).
> 
> Peace...


Well, that is a bit iffy. I consulted my database colleague and he pointed out their own site left a lot to be desired -they use Joomla and have not even added their own meta title! They just left the Joomla one!!!

*Am I correct in thinking that the sitemap that is part of the navigation is for the site users and the .xml version is for the search engines? * If so, I feel that all I need to do is enlarge on the Occasions section in the on-site version to cover all 4 occasions using more specific titles of course.

Thanks!


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

I won't put up the new generated HTML sitemap as all it is is a huge list of the page titles which is the client's name. As you say, the generator does not know what is important and what is not, so they include everything. This is fine for the .xml version but not necessary for the HTML. IMO.


----------



## lordsmurf (Apr 23, 2009)

Sorry, but that "SEO company" is giving moronic advice. You don't need an HTML sitemap. What a site needs is good navigation. People don't click on sitemaps. I bet 90% of people wouldn't have a clue what you're even talking about.

Not to mention the site has almost no actual SEO, aside from meta keyword stuffing. (Completely ineffective in 2010.)

Whatever they paid, it was 200% too much.


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

I do agree. My client has been "got at" by a friend who works for the SEO company.Yes, I had heard that keywords are a bit passe. The client wanted them so I put them in. The list was supplied by the SEO company. I had originally put in a few but they obviously thought that was not enough.


----------



## lordsmurf (Apr 23, 2009)

I never let "friends" do anything for me, and I prefer not to do anything for my friends. More people should heed that age-old wisdom.


----------



## tomdkat (May 6, 2006)

jasnick said:


> *Am I correct in thinking that the sitemap that is part of the navigation is for the site users and the .xml version is for the search engines? * If so, I feel that all I need to do is enlarge on the Occasions section in the on-site version to cover all 4 occasions using more specific titles of course.


Yep, that is my understanding as well.

Good luck!

Peace...


----------



## jasnick (Oct 22, 2003)

Thanks!


----------

